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Apr 23, 2012 -- 5:15PM, D34thM45k wrote:

Apr 23, 2012 -- 3:00AM, Kaden_Shadows wrote:

 

My current decklist has not changed from my first post up above, actually. Waiting to order / trade for more allies before I change the deck.

Regarding your suggestions, all of those sound decent to me to remove, save Venser . I have him in there to cycle my allies in and out, raising their counters and triggering their abilities all the faster. Problem is, I have a slow enough manabase to make him difficult to play before turn 5. Any idea on how to fix that?

I'll be honest with you, I'm really against Venser in here.  You can do what you want, but let me at least provide an argument:

1)  He's slow coming out.  There's no doubt about it, Venser is going to come out around the time you're losing your last life or staring down an Emrakul/Karn.  The only way to power him out sooner is with Harabaz Druid, which will be turn three at the earliest.  Coming down that soon will mean bouncing a permanent which won't get any benefit from it.

2)  His bouncing erases the current counters on one of your allies.  The power of allies is being able to power them all up rapidly.  Unless you bounce one of your utility creatures, one of your designated sluggers is taking the hit every turn by losing all of their counters.  The only ally I could see getting bounced every turn is the healer.

3)  The return ability is at the end of turn, not immediately.  Therefore, you'll only see benefits for each of your opponent's turn, not your own.  It'll slow you down immensely if you have to wait each of your opponent's turns to get that extra +1/+1 counter, protection from colors, life, etc.

4)  There are better cards to play than Venser which makes much stronger impacts.   Ghostway can be played at the end of your opponent's turn and even though it removes all of the counters, all of your allies see every other ally come into play at once.  It also costs less, so you can play an ally during your turn and then hit your opponent with Ghostway during their turn.

5)  He's sitting at a one-of, so you're undoubtably drawing him through Sea-Gate, which means he's going to be late game pretty much no matter what.  I hope you aren't mulliganing until you see him.


If you want to play him, be my guest.  He's very flashy and has some interesting effects.  I just don't think he's going to do anything powerful in this format.  He'll be fun in Casual, for sure.

Actually, surprisingly, I never have Sea gated him. But I can see your point. I just really like that 'walker. Perhaps I could build a deck around his concept...

Anyhow, I looked through my green stuff, and found Joraga Bard x4, and Graypelt Hunter x2. Think those are worth adding?

Also, Turntimber Ranger and Xenograft would make an infinite ally making loop, wouldn't it?

Shall I bump this a time or two, or start a new thread, as this is damn near a whole new deck now?