The last of the four decks bubbling around in my head ATM... I think I can actually build this one in the next week or so. (The other three are the Grixis Galvanoth deck, the Stalkers with Swords deck, and the Golgari reanimation monstrosity... I need to update each of them shortly!)
Weaknesses? This should play like some sort of weird MP TurboFog variant... stall until you have your wincon. But do we have enough stall here? If not, what do we remove? I can throw more Blunt the Assault s, Constant Mists , Lull s, Holy Day s etc. in here if we really want to go all out on the fogs.
I guess this will depend a lot on what your playgroup is like. In my group, I know I would run into a few more aggro/beatstick decks that cheat fatties out early and then they'll thwack the easiest target. Deadly Recluse is nice for this - but with only four of them, maybe include a couple Basilisk Collar to equip to a stay at home token for safety? Maybe a few Kessig Recluse aswell?
@Slave: Ghostway + tokens is a bombo - the tokens never come back, as they've changed zones. Otherwise, yeah, I'd be all over it. Good catch with Basilisk Collar , though - about to get one in the mail, and it definitely deserves to be in here.
@Tich: My main issue here is going to be dealing with fliers. I'd like to think I have enough ground defense as is, but in my meta, if I don't have decent early defense against flying, I shall be toast. Of all the awesome token generators you've listed, the only ones that can produce flying tokens in a timely manner are Sacred Mesa and Luminarch Ascension . I considered the Mesa, but I've only got a singleton copy. The Ascensions I currently have sitting in another deck, and they do tend to draw early hate moreso than normal, so I'm not sure if that's the optimal solution here. Hence, we have Deadly Recluse , who comes down early and deals with fliers particularly well. About the only other token generator I can find that might be worth its salt in this situation is Twilight Drover , but even that might be too slow. So I'm left with fogs and removal, or early or creatures with flying or reach. The other creatures that have potential...
Dawnglare Invoker . Not a particularly good blocker, but would at least be useful later on in the game.
Lieutenant Kirtar . A good rattlesnake, but double-white CC (which isn't particularly good for this deck).
Fogs still seem like a terrible answers to fliers. You're losing entire cards to stop single combat phases from single opponents. Attacking you every turn would always be the right play because you'd run out of answers long before you ever stabilized enough to play your "big" cards. What about stuff like Raking Canopy , Downdraft , Hurricane , Whirlwind , etc. instead? It would be nice to come up with permanent solutions to the problem.
My guide to Black multiplayer cards and strategies: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75842/18893722?sdb=1&post_num=1#322195706
My guide to Red multiplayer cards and strategies: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75842/28999213/?sdb=1&post_num=1#517562879
My guide to White multiplayer cards and strategies http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75842/29011349/?sdb=1&pg=last#517773211
My guide to Green multiplayer cards and strategies http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75842/29034323/Tichs_Guide_to_Green_Multiplayer_Cards_and_Strategies
I'm surprised nobody has mentioned glare of subdual or nullmage shepherd . True, the shepherd isn't that great if you're already running aura shards , but the glare is a lifesaver. Tich, mentioned most of the other cards in my G/W token deck. I use raise the alarm and scatter the seeds to quickly get a board position, then once I've cleared the board with hour of reckoning or martial coup , that's when I'll attack, unless I draw an overrun first, either way. You might want to take a look at the new spoilers for AVR, there is a certain "crusade" that might give you all of the pump you'll ever need.
HOW TO AUTOCARD! When posting in a text box, type [c]Plains[/c] to make your post showPlains . Are you making a casual mill deck? Please read.Show
Control is the key of a mill deck. You should free up your mana as much as possible so that you can respond to whatever your opponent is doing. Having some way to remove threats, both real and percieved, is necessary to survival. Real threats are those that are already on the field, and are something a simple unsummon or doom blade can remove. Percieved threats are those that aren't on the field, something a simple duress or counterspell can deal with. Controlling the board will allow your mill deck to continuously perform, if you use permanent style mill, that is.
One-Shot Mill spells are something you should avoid. You can toss tome scour s at your opponent until your hand runs out, but that isn't going to be enough to mill them to death. With 1-shot mill spells, like tome scour , you have to treat them like burn spells. Therefore, the only "good" 1-shot mill spells are sanity grinding (in the right deck) and mind funeral . Try to find more permanent styles of milling, like memory erosion , hedron crab , and curse of the bloody tome , so that you don't have to waste your mana each turn doing something that those permanents can do with a single mana/turn investment. Keeping your mana open allows you to respond with control elements.
Traumatize Rant. Traumatize is a terrible card for a multitude of reasons. First, it costs 5 to cast, which is a large investment for a mill deck. Milling half a library sounds neat, but if you do the math, it really isn't that much. An average 60 card deck starts with drawing 7 cards. Then, barring any draw spells on their end, or ramp on yours, 5 turns will go by, where they draw 5 more cards, leaving 48 in the deck. Unless they had a deck with more than 60 cards, or you ramped it out, the most you'll ever mill with a single Traumatize on turn 5 is 24 cards. That's not too shabby, but hang on, there's more! If they drew any additional cards or if they were milled before turn 5, that number will be much lower. In addition, any more Traumatize's you draw will only mill less and less as the game goes on...which is the point of a mill deck. My whole point on Traumatize is the it is NOT worth the 5 mana investment, not even with haunting echoes . You can mill more than 24 before turn 5...which you can then cast the echoes.
If you look at a mill deck like a burn deck, you'll notice that it takes longer to win with mill than with burn. For example, lightning bolt costs 1 and does 3 out of the 20 damage needed to win (barring any lifegain or damage prevention). For mill, that same investment of 1 would have to mill 9 cards out of an average 60 card deck to be the equivilent of lightning bolt . The problem is that there is no mill card that can do that...except hedron crab , over a period of time. The initial investment of 1 will pay off in 3 more land drops to make the crab equal to a bolt. However, the crab nets you more mill beyond those 3 land drops, making it better as the game draws on. Other cards, like curse of the bloody tome , are excellent ways of milling an opponent because the initial investment of is all you have to pay in order to put your opponent on a clock. All you have to do is stay alive, which is the true goal of a mill strategy.
There are other ideas for mill decks that are specific to certain types of strategies. Combo mill decks can mill an entire player's library out from under them. Secondary mill strategies are usually tied to another strategy, like drowner of secrets in a merfolk deck, or halimar excavator in an ally deck. Milling can be done in certain decks that are able to ramp out enough mana to make use of the higher costing mill spells, like using 16 x post to pay for X on sands of delirium or for ambassador laquatus . Multiplayer mill decks are even tougher to build, but can be done. Being a slower environment[/c], it is easier to ramp in multiplayer, allowing for big X spells, like mind grind , to be useful. Consuming aberration is another star player. The more straightforward strategy is to use mesmeric orb and dreamborn muse while being the only deck at the table that can deal with it . There are always new strategies coming out with each new set, so check gatherer for any new mill cards that you find to be the most fun for you!
Now you can say that you haven't fallen into the trap that most new players fall into when they build their first mill deck!
: Order, Law, Faith. : Knowledge, Artifice, Control. : Corruption, Death, Self-Interest. : Freedom, Destruction, Victory. : Nature, Growth, Life. : Progressive, but too controlling. : Focused, but short sighted. : Skilled, but hypocritical. : Unified, but without a sense of self. : Cunning, but devious. : Inquisitive, but incautious. : Rational, but impulsive. : Powerful, but spiteful. : Instinctive, but selfish. : Fearless, but reckless.
I'm not saying you should use any of these specifically, but the lists above didn't have all of these, and you might like some of these cards for consideration. Saprolings and soldiers in particular really have some amazing development. Cheers.
Three-on-three team game, with a starting life total of 60 (essentially 3HG). The deck goes Turn 1 Clamp , Turn 2 Deadly Recluse , Turn 3 Raking Canopy , Turn 4 Awakening Zone - a good setup in many aspects, as there's a Thieving Magpie across the table that our blue player was banking on. Then the world goes bananas. One of the guys across the table is playing a group-hug red burn deck - drop Mana Flare and Font of Mythos , then get Warstorm Surge on the table and burn people to death with Elemental Appeal , Ball Lightning , Thunderblust ... ... so he drops Font of Mythos . My card advantage goes through the roof. Other than this, not much is happening - the blue player is trying to steal things with Dominating Licid , but can't get through with anything he can steal. Turn 5, I sac my new spawn token from Awakening Zone to resolve Mana Reflection . Blue player freaks out and destroys it in his turn. Little does he know I've got another in hand. Turn 6, I play another one. We get swung at with an Ulamog's Crusher the Licid stole, and I lose the Clamp and a land, but the Reflection is staying out, so I don't stress. Turn 7, two of my three cards are the other two Mana Reflections. And the third is a Mine Excavation to get the first one back! I manage to get all four Reflections on the table by the end of the turn. My teammates are looking at me admiringly, wondering what I'm going to do next. My opponents are resigned to the fact I have massive gobs of mana next turn. Turn 8, I drop two Parallel Lives and Garruk Wildspeaker , and then resolve Sprout Swarm 68 times. My opponents freak out and DoJ . Alas, Sprout Swarm is still in my hand. The next turn, I resolve it 96 times, and activate Oran-Rief, the Vastwood for good measure. My opponents can do nothing to stop it (they're relying on single creature removal and theft... removing 96 in a single turn was something they could only handle once). Turn 9, I untap, activate Gavony Township and Garruk Wildspeaker 's ultimate, giving myself 96 6/6 tramplers. My teammate resolves Gisela, Blade of Goldnight for kicks, and we swing for 1152 trampling damage on Turn 9. GG!
So my new line of thinking is that Sprout Swarm and Gelatinous Genesis are perhaps more effective options here than Orochi Hatchery and Snake Basket (which are both obviously more prone to removal, though the Hatchery moreso). I'm wondering if I should be running two each of the four options for variety and good measure. Either way, the first run was an epic and very, very promising one (even if it was partially fuelled by gas from Font of Mythos ).