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1 year ago ::
Apr 09, 2012 - 7:50PM
#31
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Date Joined:
Sep 17, 2004
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This is the relevant rule from earlier in the thread:
702.91a Miracle is a static ability linked to a triggered ability (see rule 603.10). "Miracle [cost]" means "You may reveal this card from your hand as you draw it if it's the first card you've drawn this turn. When you reveal this card this way, you may cast it by paying [cost] rather than its mana cost."
This is not the relevant rule:
Miracle is a static ability linked to a triggered ability (see rule 603.10). "Miracle [cost]" means "You may reveal this card from your hand sometime after you draw it if it's the first card you've drawn this turn. When you reveal this card this way, you may cast it by paying [cost] rather than its mana cost."
No, I am not a judge. That's why I like to quote sources such as the rules that trump judges.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 09, 2012 - 7:55PM
#32
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Date Joined:
Feb 12, 2010
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Okay, I have a question. So the Miracle ability is obviously a replacement effect that modifies the way a card is drawn and gives you a choice. The second sentence, though, reads like a triggered ability. But there's not a triggered ability baked in there, is there?
It's like they took the implementation of madness and crammed it into one ability. Can it work as just one ability?
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1 year ago ::
Apr 09, 2012 - 8:43PM
#33
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Date Joined:
Sep 17, 2005
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Okay, I have a question. So the Miracle ability is obviously a replacement effect that modifies the way a card is drawn and gives you a choice. The second sentence, though, reads like a triggered ability. But there's not a triggered ability baked in there, is there?
It's like they took the implementation of madness and crammed it into one ability. Can it work as just one ability?
From the earlier post by WotC_dlaugel:
702.91a Miracle is a static ability linked to a triggered ability
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So, yes, there is a triggered ability baked in there.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 10, 2012 - 2:01AM
#34
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Date Joined:
Mar 22, 2009
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So does that mean you can wait for your opponent to reveal their Miracle, put it's trigger on the stack, and then you can mill them for 1 (e.g. Goulcaller's Bell  ), and they wont get to cast it since the trigger that allows them to cast it hasnt resolved yet? ~ Tim
 Reached DCI Rating 1800 on 28/10/11. :D Sig
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That makes no sense to me.
If they spelled the ability out on the card in full then it would not be allowed in a mono-black Commander deck, but because they used a keyword to save space it is allowed?
~ Tim
Yup, just like you can have Birds of paradise  in a mono green deck but not Noble Hierarch  . YAY COLOR IDENTITY 
Is algebra really that difficult?
Survey says yes.
You want to make a milky drink. You squeeze a cow.
I love this description. Like the cows are sponges filled with milk. I can see it all Nick Parks claymation-style with the cow's eyes bugging out momentarily as a giant farmer squeezes it like a squeaky dog toy, and milk shoots out of it.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 10, 2012 - 2:41AM
#35
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So does that mean you can wait for your opponent to reveal their Miracle, put it's trigger on the stack, and then you can mill them for 1 (e.g. Goulcaller's Bell ), and they wont get to cast it since the trigger that allows them to cast it hasnt resolved yet?
~ Tim
No. They will reveal it at the same time they draw it so you would have to discard it from their hand.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 10, 2012 - 2:55AM
#36
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Date Joined:
Jul 28, 2010
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by the time you get priority they either have already cast it as a miracle or put it in their hand
proud member of the 2011 community team
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1 year ago ::
Apr 10, 2012 - 3:05AM
#37
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Date Joined:
Mar 11, 2008
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by the time you get priority they either have already cast it as a miracle or put it in their hand
There is a trigger, at which point you can respond before they cast the spell. But the trigger is dependant on them revealing the card. If they don't reveal it, there's no trigger and it just goes in their hand.
Rules Advisor as of 8-26-09 Joined the crowd and got an Avatar from zammm's Avatar Workshop on 5-6-2012 Currently Working on:
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nothing in particular Recent Plays:
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none That "Dual Colors" personality test thing
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I am Black/Green
Take The Magic Dual Colour Test - Beta today!
Created with Rum and Monkey's Personality Test Generator.I am both selfish and instinctive. I value growth and community, as long as they favour my own objectives; I enjoy nature, and I particularly enjoy watching parts of nature die. At best, I am resilient and tenacious; at worst, I'm uncontrollable and destructive.
Oh, but wait, there were multiple answers that fit my thoughts to some questions. What colors did they say I was?
I am Blue/Green
I am both rational and instinctive. I value self-knowledge and understanding of the world; my ultimate goal is self-improvement and improvement of the world around me. At best, I am focused and methodical; at worst, I am obsessive and amoral.
Some RPG Personality Test I saw
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1 year ago ::
Apr 10, 2012 - 3:05AM
#38
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by the time you get priority they either have already cast it as a miracle or put it in their hand
Not quite accurate.
By the time you get priority the card is in their hand. If they revealed it, the cast-it trigger will be on the stack--the card itself is still in their hand and revealed at that point. You can respond before they cast it (by responding to the cast-it trigger)--you just can't respond in between learning what the card is and it being in their hand, since the two happen simultaneously.
And so people say to me, "How do I know if a word is real?" You know, anyone who's read a children's book knows that love makes things real. If you love a word, use it! That makes it real. Being in the dictionary is an artificial distinction; it doesn't make the word any more real than any other word. If you love a word, it becomes real.
--Erin McKean, Redefining the Dictionary
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1 year ago ::
Apr 10, 2012 - 4:25AM
#39
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Date Joined:
Jul 28, 2010
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I've been away from this forum too long 
proud member of the 2011 community team
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1 year ago ::
Apr 10, 2012 - 7:44AM
#40
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Date Joined:
Mar 22, 2009
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So does this mean you can respond to the trigger by making them discard the card, before the trigger that allows them to cast it resolves?
(of course, if it is an Instant, they could respond to the discard spell/ability by casting it for it's normal cost)
~ Tim
Reached DCI Rating 1800 on 28/10/11. :D Sig
Show
That makes no sense to me.
If they spelled the ability out on the card in full then it would not be allowed in a mono-black Commander deck, but because they used a keyword to save space it is allowed?
~ Tim
Yup, just like you can have Birds of paradise in a mono green deck but not Noble Hierarch . YAY COLOR IDENTITY
Is algebra really that difficult?
Survey says yes.
You want to make a milky drink. You squeeze a cow.
I love this description. Like the cows are sponges filled with milk. I can see it all Nick Parks claymation-style with the cow's eyes bugging out momentarily as a giant farmer squeezes it like a squeaky dog toy, and milk shoots out of it.
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~ 
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~ 
