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1 year ago ::
Feb 22, 2012 - 6:43AM
#11
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What a stupid article and waste of my time. It's like he wrote this 2 weeks before the set came out and then didn't bother checking if his 'budget' cards had actually increased in value. Come on Wizards, at least try to do some research for these!
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1 year ago ::
Feb 22, 2012 - 7:59AM
#12
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Date Joined:
Nov 10, 2011
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What about the glaring omission of Skirsdag High Priest? With all of the morbid being activated in this deck, seeing a turn 3 5/5 flying demon is not out of the question. I'm not sure many decks have a good answer for that, save for a morbid Brimstone Volley or Oblivion Ring. Even then, it's a token demon, and one that could easily be made over and over again in a deck like this.
Then again, you could just go watch the deck tech video from PT DKA and see that exact deck. Splashing red for Kuldotha Rebirth means easily having enough guys to tap/sacrafice again.
This is perfect answer. Swap two Messengers for two High Priests and drop the deck price by $10, make it faster and easier to aquire.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 22, 2012 - 8:21AM
#13
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Date Joined:
Feb 22, 2012
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Now I'm still pretty new to Magic, only about 8months in. I don't have a huge knowledge base as far as older sets go. Wouldn't a card like black sun zenith sync up well with the undying deck concept here? Even if you only plated with one which at most go for around 8 online. Draw it, dump the mana, wipe the bored unafraid of repercussions and go at them next turn. I really liked the article being that I use to run a mono black zombie deck myself. Thought I'd give my two cents on the topic.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 22, 2012 - 8:32AM
#14
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What a stupid article and waste of my time. It's like he wrote this 2 weeks before the set came out and then didn't bother checking if his 'budget' cards had actually increased in value. Come on Wizards, at least try to do some research for these!
Actually, Geralf's Messenger and Gravecrawler have both -FALLEN- from their inital pricepoints. Messenger started at $8 and has fallen to $6 and under, Crawler has similarly gone down from $10 to $7-8.
Nobody is really hanging onto Messengers right now, with a little aggressive trading you can get them without spending a cent. It's what I did, and I got mine at Prerelease weekend. Crawlers are a little harder to get, but they were also a Promo card so they can be acquired with just a little effort.
It's not that bad, guys. Really.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 22, 2012 - 9:32AM
#15
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Date Joined:
Aug 23, 2007
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Highborn Ghoul  is like two invisible stalkers? Are you kidding? That's just a blatant and poor attempt at deception there.
3,000th post: September 5, 2010 4,000th post: March 24, 2012 Winner of the YMTC Ravnica War of the Guilds contest as guild Dimir. Snapcaster Mage  is the best card of all time. How do you deal?
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1 year ago ::
Feb 22, 2012 - 11:03AM
#16
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I don't know what you would replace Gravecrawler with and keep the thing "budget." Really, that's the card that gives Zombies any shot in current standard. Without that, it's just subpar.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 22, 2012 - 12:37PM
#17
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Date Joined:
Nov 11, 2007
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I think a budget zombie deck can be made, but this is JvLs article so instead of budget we'll make an Obvious Tier-2 Deck. The only thing in this pile that is remotely interesting is thinking that a 4 mana mind rot is good enough.
Maybe if you tried to innovate or build on a budget your forum responses wouldn't read like hate mail. No one reads your articles to go onto the gravy train. You can build fun but slightly janky budget decks. They don't need to be uber-consistent. People want fun with potential to win, not can be metagamed to win against the decks that won the last pro-tour.
How bout a red splash for some Bump in the Nights or a blue splash for Diegraf Captain? Those are some budget cards that haven't gotten much play (though the Captain is also really Obvious). This deck just builds istelf unless you do something interesting/innovative. How many people needed to be told:
4 Gravecrawler
4 Diegraf Ghoul
4 Highborn Ghoul
X Cemetary Reaper
X Geralf's Messenger
go well together?
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1 year ago ::
Feb 22, 2012 - 3:07PM
#18
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Date Joined:
Sep 27, 2009
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Nobody is really hanging onto Messengers right now, with a little aggressive trading you can get them without spending a cent. It's what I did, and I got mine at Prerelease weekend. Crawlers are a little harder to get, but they were also a Promo card so they can be acquired with just a little effort.
It's not that bad, guys. Really.
QFT.
When I picked up Magic and started going to FNM tournaments back around the time when Worldwake came out, I definately considered myself a budget player. I didn't have a lot of money, and wasn't even really interested in investing too much money in the game if I did have the money at the time. However, I could still crack open or draft one or two rare cards like the ones mentioned in this article, or end up trading for them with relative ease (and persistence).
My experience was that the more competitive (non-budget) players were trying to obtain and use cards that were in top decks. If I ever opened a highly competitve (and frequently valuable) card, like a planeswalker, I knew I'd never be able to afford to get enough of them to play with. So, I traded them to the players that were invested enough in the game to obtain a playset of said card. In return I'd get cards I needed that fall into the price range of Gravecrawler and Geralf's Messenger.
Sometimes it would take me 1-3 weeks to obtain all the cards I needed for the deck I was working on. It wasn't always easy, and sometimes I'd have to wait even longer for a fourth copy of that one card I really needed. I currently see other players who are like how I was, and have to trade aggressively to get the cards they need. But, they still manage to do it. It's really not that hard...
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1 year ago ::
Feb 22, 2012 - 5:04PM
#19
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Date Joined:
Sep 19, 2010
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This is not original, it is not a budget deck, and Gruesome Discovery? Are you joking? Still, this gave me ideas, and I am building a mono-black Zombies list, but I haven't been a budget player since 2009 and I'm packing Obliterators and BSZ.
I still find it impossible you forgot about Skirsdag High Priest and Geth's Verdict, so I give this article a 35%.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 22, 2012 - 5:17PM
#20
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Date Joined:
Dec 31, 2003
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Nobody is really hanging onto Messengers right now, with a little aggressive trading you can get them without spending a cent. It's what I did, and I got mine at Prerelease weekend. Crawlers are a little harder to get, but they were also a Promo card so they can be acquired with just a little effort.
It's not that bad, guys. Really.
QFT.
When I picked up Magic and started going to FNM tournaments back around the time when Worldwake came out, I definately considered myself a budget player. I didn't have a lot of money, and wasn't even really interested in investing too much money in the game if I did have the money at the time. However, I could still crack open or draft one or two rare cards like the ones mentioned in this article, or end up trading for them with relative ease (and persistence).
My experience was that the more competitive (non-budget) players were trying to obtain and use cards that were in top decks. If I ever opened a highly competitve (and frequently valuable) card, like a planeswalker, I knew I'd never be able to afford to get enough of them to play with. So, I traded them to the players that were invested enough in the game to obtain a playset of said card. In return I'd get cards I needed that fall into the price range of Gravecrawler and Geralf's Messenger.
Sometimes it would take me 1-3 weeks to obtain all the cards I needed for the deck I was working on. It wasn't always easy, and sometimes I'd have to wait even longer for a fourth copy of that one card I really needed. I currently see other players who are like how I was, and have to trade aggressively to get the cards they need. But, they still manage to do it. It's really not that hard...
Your arguement assumes that A) There are people in everyone's play group who have the cards and are willing to trade for them; and B) That people actually have the time or cards to trade.
Trading never worked for me. People in all the groups I've played in have tended to hord cards. (and having been playing on and off for over a decade, thats a lot of groups.) Sometimes its because they think the cards will be valuable or good. Others simply because your interested in it.
Anyway, the article isn't Building from Trades; its Building on a Budget.
I'm typically the one that says that he has gone over budget. I feel he went high on this one. However, JVL has been doing fairly good on the prices lately. And this one isn't extremely bad (save for the high cost). So, I'm fine with overlooking it.
I would like him to keep up with the adding money parts. This article lacked it. Sometimes the picks are obvious. Other times, the cheaper versions may be very different then you'd expect.
As a final note, I also think that more originality is in order. Last week was basically a Part 2 (and not of the Godfather persuasion). I won't knock him for Zombie's that much, though. After all, any tribal deck isn't going to be very original.
I suggest that those who are complaining about originality send JVL some deck ideas. It can't be easy trying to come up with an original idea every week. My suggestion: Essence of the Wild  ! I enjoy the Legacy version I built for my wife. Be interesting to see where JVL would go with that.
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