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1 year ago ::
Feb 21, 2012 - 10:36AM
#191
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Date Joined:
Oct 16, 2010
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I was aware of Loxodon Warhammer  and the reason it got an exception for "lifelink", and maybe I should have mentioned it for the completeness of my post. There's something else I should also have added, and I'm surprised I left it out: though I do realize the templating at the time was pretty dodgy, part of my reasoning is from the present interpretation of "for each damage" on other cards, describing a scaling factor for an effect, not representing multiple individual applications of the effect.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 21, 2012 - 1:32PM
#192
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1 year ago ::
Feb 21, 2012 - 1:57PM
#193
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- Celestial Teapots are broken!
Date Joined:
Feb 24, 2007
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Caller of the Hunt  had "as you play" text, and that actually did get reverted to such functionality (before, it had it as enters-the-battlefield replacement effect). I'm really not a fan of that change, but it does mean there's some precedent for interpreting those things as additional costs.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 21, 2012 - 2:00PM
#194
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Date Joined:
Sep 22, 2010
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While checking to see if any older "spirit link" creatures were updated to have the lifelink ability, I found that none of them were. This makes sense, considering their abilities are all written to be triggered, which isn't how lifelink works. However, while conducting my search I found that though both Warrior Angel  and Zebra Unicorn  are printed in a way that suggests a static ability like the present functionality of lifelink, their current Oracle texts are written as a triggered ability. Because no printings of these cards with the triggered functionality exist, I suggest they be edited to use lifelink instead.
I disagree. As printed, those were triggered abilities. Old templating technology was just really bad, so we didn't have the "something is a triggered ability iff it says 'when', 'whenever', or 'at'" rule. They don't look like triggered abilities now, but they look even less like the keyword "lifelink". If someone looked at that card, they'd probably either think it's a triggered ability or just be confused about what the ability is supposed to be; they wouldn't think it's actually lifelink.
Agreed. In addition, consider all the cards printed with a similar template that do something other than gaining life -- well, OK, most of them are not actually precisely analogous. But one of them is: Emberwilde Caliph  . Should Emberwilde Caliph get a new form of damage ability, too?
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1 year ago ::
Feb 21, 2012 - 2:23PM
#195
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Date Joined:
Oct 16, 2010
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You've all convinced me about the lifelink point I raised. Since Gatherer does have the printed wording of the cards in the database, I wish there was a way to search based on that text, because then I would have been able to find other examples like emberwilde caliph  , and it would have given me more to think about before posting. The Mirage printing of Quirion Elves  , the Fifth Edition printing of Shapeshifter  , and the Fifth Edition printing of Primal Clay  all had the text "when you play."
The issue with those examples is that their most recent printing (and I'm counting Masters Edition) has the current Oracle wording, so reverting them wouldn't be appropriate. However, minion of the wastes  and dracoplasm  have never been printed that way. Likewise here, I would have had more easily available examples to think about if printed text was searchable. I still stand by my suggestion for the Minion, but I won't be disappointed (or surprised) if it isn't taken.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 21, 2012 - 2:37PM
#196
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- Celestial Teapots are broken!
Date Joined:
Feb 24, 2007
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The MagicCards.info card database does allow you to search printed text.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 21, 2012 - 2:44PM
#197
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Date Joined:
Sep 19, 2008
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The problem with Minion of the wastes and Dracoplasm is that as printed they wouldn't work if you put them onto the battlefield without casting them. In ancient times this was not the case because everything that put things directly onto the battlefield into play did so as though they were just summoned (see Necromancy  , for example). So when necromancy targeted the minion you actually got a chance to pay life. Caller of the hunt was probably a templating mistake. It received errata one month after its release date. In my opinion it should get the errata back.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 21, 2012 - 3:47PM
#198
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Date Joined:
Oct 16, 2010
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I guess I'll just chalk this discussion up to the running trend I have of my first posts on any forum being ill-thought-out and kind of embarassing. Thanks for the constructive responses, everyone. It really helped my understanding of the issues.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 21, 2012 - 4:40PM
#199
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The issue with those examples is that their most recent printing (and I'm counting Masters Edition) has the current Oracle wording, so reverting them wouldn't be appropriate. However, minion of the wastes and dracoplasm have never been printed that way. Likewise here, I would have had more easily available examples to think about if printed text was searchable. I still stand by my suggestion for the Minion, but I won't be disappointed (or surprised) if it isn't taken.
Soul Echo  is a good example. Its printed text said "when you play", but they must have meant for it to happen after it entered the battlefield, because you cannot put counters on it if it has not entered the battlefield yet. Caller of the Hunt should also say "enters the battlefield." There are a bunch of permanents that used to say "when you play" for choosing, like Volrath's Laboratory  and Mangara's Equity  , but now say "enters the battlefield", because it makes more sense.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 21, 2012 - 10:23PM
#200
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Date Joined:
Oct 11, 2007
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Caller of the hunt was probably a templating mistake. It received errata one month after its release date. In my opinion it should get the errata back.
Speaking of three-drops for Mercadian Masques with weird templates, I figure enough time has passed to point out Strongarm Thug  (and its buddy Sylvan Hierophant  ) again. Neither of them should target.
blah blah metal lyrics
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