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Nov 17, 2011 -- 2:46PM, Da_Vampire_81 wrote:

First of all really excited about this deck i have been thinking about creating a deck such as this and i have been following this thread very closely so I have to say first Cyrus thanks for posting this up. I also read the Worlds coverage on the magic site and found the first match up to be Grixis control so it is good to see that it looks like this is going to be the deck to face.

Moving along im just asking what you would recommend in replacement to Snapcaster Mage? I only have one and he is jumping inbetween two decks already and im just wondering if there is something that would be recommended to replace him until i get a few more.

I'll just leave this here:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=9R8FLpMTyIc&feat...#!

Patrick Chapin's deck in Worlds:
1 x Inferno Titan
3 x Olivia Voldaren
2 x Precursor Golem
3 x Snapcaster MAge
1 x Wurmcoil Engine
4 x Desperate Ravings
1 x Devil's Play
2 x Doom Blade
4 x Forbidden Alchemy
2 x Galvanic Blast
1 x Go for the Throat
3 x Liliana of the Veil
3 x Mana Leak
1 x Ratchet Bomb
3 x Slagstorm
1 x Island
5 x Mountain
3 x Swamp
4 x Blackcleave Cliffs
1 x Copperline Gorge
4 x Darkslick Shores
1 x Dragonskull Summit
2 x Drowned Catacomb
1 x Shimmering Grotto
4 x Sulfur Falls
-
2 x Ancient Grudge
2 x Curse of Death's Hold
1 x Dissipate
1 x Flashfreeze
1 x Galvanic Blast
1 x Geistflame
1 x Mana Leak
1 x Mimic Vat
1 x Negate
1 x Slagstorm
2 x Surgical Extraction
1 x Wurmcoil Engine

cards.info has Olivia at 7 low now, with SCG "sold out" at 10.  :D  Thank goodness I've got my playset.

Honestly, this looks like a blast to play (just not against).

Chapin's list is a bit like where we were in the UK over a month ago, but we started cutting threats and playing more control, since it gave you control of the game, which was pretty key. Chapin is more of a tap out build, and he's stretched to four colours(one of us in the UK is also running 4 colours with Garruk R instead of Olivia), but he's lost the power of Stensia Bloodhall, which is a big mistake in not running.


Desperate Ravings: I've had this discussion a lot, there are a number of issues with the card. Firstly, yes, it can dig you deeper and put more stuff in the yard, but it does the opposite of Forbidden Alchemy, which is all about finding the right cards and digging for important pieces, Ravings does the opposite by effectively undoing your hand sculpting to a degree. Having to bin one of your fewer win cons or a snapcaster etc can be a big deal. With Think Twice and Alchemy, you can make use of the turns where your opponent's turn doesn't require any action from you, allowing you to tap out at their end of turn and sneak some card selection/advantage. Ravings is a card you don't always want to cast, so it doesn't fit very well into a permission build, especially when you are running things like singletons that can dig to. Randomly discarding your Tribute to Hunger agaisnt a wolf run deck is a massive pain. What this permission build of the deck does, is dig for specific cards and answers, allowing it to play much more reactively.

Chapin's list is basically tapping out most turns, basically hoping his plays are better than the opponent's, but he does have a little bit of stuff to do on his opponent's turn, but not that much, making his counterspells etc incredibly obvious and easy to play around. That's not to say his build is wrong, but his is quite different to the true permission list, we originally had a more tap out build, but preffered to dictate the board state in the opponent's turn, which yielded better numbers in our testing.

Nov 18, 2011 -- 5:25AM, Hexar wrote:

I really don't like the 2 Pre-Cursor golems..... I think I'd rather more inferno titans, wurmcoils, a grave titan....anything really

We tested Pre-Cursor Golems in the beta list and for the same reasons Chapin is playing them... however they turned out to be too unreliable and as you've quite rightly stated, I'd rather just have a Titan or Wurmcoil instead every time.

Here is the current testing build...

4 Snapcaster Mage

4 Mana Leak
4 Dissipate

4 Think Twice
4 Forbidden Alchemy
1 Blue Sun's Zenith

2 Grim Lavamancer
2 Geistflame
2 Doom Blade
1 Go for the Throat
2 Brimstone Volley
1 Tribute to Hunger
1 Black Sun's Zenith

2 Olivia Voldaren
1 Wurmcoil Engine

4 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Sulfur Falls
4 Darkslick Shores
6 Island
2 Mountain
2 Stensia Bloodhall
4 Drowned Catacomb

SB: 2 Negate
SB: 1 Stensia Bloodhall
SB: 2 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 4 Spellskite
SB: 1 Olivia Voldaren
SB: 3 Wurmcoil Engine
SB: 1 Grim Lavamancer
SB: 1 Black Sun's Zennith

We test on Cockatrice a lot (all the time). Please feel free to PM me if you want to test Standard

Nov 18, 2011 -- 6:44AM, Hexar wrote:

Who is we? I'm assuming ManaLeak.com is a group of reasonably strong players?


Anyways, I like the Grim Lavamancer there, my only problem is that is sort of anti-synergizes with the snapcaster. The cards you'd be throwing out would lose flashback wouldn't  they??

Although I guess it lets you change your matchup depending what you're playing against.

Against control decks, you can exile your doom blade and other spells like that and keep mana leaks.

Or against full out aggro decks, you can exile the mana leaks (maybe?) and keep your burn to snipe off Mirran Crusaders :o

Re: Testing Group - We have a testing group on mtgUK with a bunch of strong players, and where everyone can contribute too as we're always open to discussion and ideas.

Re: Grim Lavamancer - You got it spot on

The play with Lavamancers (GL) normally goes like this...

T1. Make GL
T2. Leak their threat if it can not be dealt with once it has resolved. Else Think Twice.
T3. Leak/Dissipate their threat or cast Forbidden Alchemy (FA), find answer and fill up graveyard for GL. Else flashback Think Twice. You'll probably take 2 at this point from one of their random critters becuase sculpting you hand is more important and you can afford to ignore it for a few turns. You always have access to a billion removal spells anyway.

Or make GL mid-late game (he only costs 1 red so wont interupt you much) and use him as a recurring source of removal... and possibly distract removal from Olivia which you'll cast turn 7+.

You exile different cards to GL depending on your matchup. The interaction between FA and GL is really strong (efficient!).

Interestingly, he was originally put in their to allow you to race Drownyards better. He's so much better now with the field shifting over to weenies (and Mirrand Cusaders).

You sideboard more of him, Olivias and Spellskites in vs Aggro (taking our counters and card draw) and vs Control (taking out certain removals and Wurmcoils).