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2 years ago ::
Oct 18, 2011 - 7:47AM
#31
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Date Joined:
Oct 14, 2007
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@Indigo: Bob sees MASSIVE play in Vintage. Stoneforge does not. The problem with Stoneforge as opposed to Confidant is that Stoneforge doesn't scale... so the fact that a Legacy-level set of cards existed simultaneously in Standard resulted in a problem. Bob scales with power level (much like Snapcaster), so he becomes stronger as the format does. Stoneforge remains a threshold level based on printed equipment. It just so happens that that threshold was too high for Standard.
It is certainly NOT objectively obvious that SFM is better than Bob.
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2 years ago ::
Oct 18, 2011 - 1:47PM
#32
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Date Joined:
Mar 27, 2003
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That would be true/relevant if we were asking what the best two drop creature in Vintage was. When you look across all constructed formats instead of restricting yourself to one to engineer a desired result, Stoneforge was considered too powerful for three of the five biggest, including one where all the others are available. It is not possible to objectively argue that Bob or Goyf is stronger overall even though they see more play in one of those formats. Snapcaster is less certain, since he hasn't been around as long and may shake things up some.
It's really not even about giving niche cards to black.
It should be about giving black cards to Niche.
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2 years ago ::
Oct 19, 2011 - 5:31AM
#33
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Date Joined:
Aug 30, 2007
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Indigo is right. On the whole Stoneforge is the best 2 drop creature ever printed, it's been banned more than any other and it has seen marginal vintage play. Dark Confidant is going to fall out of vintage even more(He doesn't see that much play, he's pretty much used in just one version of one deck) now we have snappy and Fact or Fiction is unrestricted.
I think snappy will become one of the best 2 drops though, joining the ranks of Goyf, Bob, Stoneforge and Qasali Pridemage.
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2 years ago ::
Oct 19, 2011 - 9:12AM
#34
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Date Joined:
Oct 13, 2009
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@Indigo: Bob sees MASSIVE play in Vintage. Stoneforge does not. The problem with Stoneforge as opposed to Confidant is that Stoneforge doesn't scale... so the fact that a Legacy-level set of cards existed simultaneously in Standard resulted in a problem. Bob scales with power level (much like Snapcaster), so he becomes stronger as the format does. Stoneforge remains a threshold level based on printed equipment. It just so happens that that threshold was too high for Standard.
It is certainly NOT objectively obvious that SFM is better than Bob.
That isn't actually correct. stoneforger scales with card pool too, it just so happens some of the best equipments was in standard with stoneforger (except of course; jitte and sword of fire and ice).
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2 years ago ::
Oct 19, 2011 - 9:14AM
#35
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Date Joined:
Oct 11, 2005
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I'd quantify that. Stoneforge Mystic isn't the best 2 Drop Creature. What it is is the best Tutor ever made. The fact that the tutor will give you your card and put in play for the same cost as a Diabolic Tutor is just icing on the cake.
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2 years ago ::
Oct 19, 2011 - 12:41PM
#36
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who cares what's better? honestly, who gives a ****? what difference does it make?
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2 years ago ::
Oct 19, 2011 - 2:19PM
#37
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Date Joined:
Apr 16, 2005
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who cares what's better? honestly, who gives a ****? what difference does it make?
This made me laugh hard.
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