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2 years ago  ::  Aug 18, 2011 - 11:01AM #11
XIII13Thirteen
Date Joined: Aug 14, 2009
Posts: 1,487
I thought the post was well done and I feel much of that is my agreement with your opinions. I'm excited about Modern because ...

Its more accessible and not subject to the reprint policy
Its less subject to early design flaws like in legacy

Magic has come a long way from the early days where clearly overpowered and broken cards were printed and the few that we did have got banned immediately. While I do think cards like Jace TMS shouldn't be banned in the context of a huge card pool, they still wanted to nix the possibility.

I've said to my friends many times that I will not get into legacy. It is because despite the argument "they never rotate," I see no future in the format. It seems the amount of competitive legacy will always be restricted by the number of dual lands available /4. 
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 19, 2011 - 8:18AM #12
Touraant
Date Joined: Jun 14, 2011
Posts: 4
I think you guys need to look up the definition of Eternal Format 

Nonrotational and Eternal are not the same thing Legacy and Vintage are the only Eternal Formats


Eternal


Eternal formats follow the basic Constructed format rules for deck construction, but expands the available cards to include virtually all published Magic sets. The ratings are kept separate from other Constructed formats because of the barrier to the participation of new players. While ratings and rankings are maintained for this category, only Limited and Constructed format rankings are used for invitations to major tournaments, like Pro Tours or World Championships.

  • Vintage (formerly Type 1) allows every published Magic set with the exception of the silver-bordered Unglued and Unhinged sets. All cards from the remaining sets are allowed except cards involving ante, any card that is "flipped" on the table, and Shahrazad, which involves playing a "subgame", as the DCI considers such cards inappropriate for tournament competition. The Vintage format is the only format to have a restricted list in addition to a banned list. Each card on the restricted list is limited to one per deck. This is the only format that allows the "Power Nine".
  • Legacy (formerly Type 1.5) uses the same sets as Vintage, but has no restricted list and a separate banned list[3].

Vintage and Legacy were very closely related until September 1, 2004, when R&D decided that splitting the formats was a good idea. Certain cards formerly banned in Legacy were unbanned and the format was allowed to develop on its own. Legacy once had a reputation for being the "poor man's Vintage" but today has developed into a format very distinct from Vintage.



en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DCI_(Wizards_of_the_Coast)#Eternal


Eternal formats are DCI tournament formats which allow cards from all Magic: The Gathering sets with the standard card back and black or white borders. (Unglued and Unhinged have silver borders and are therefore not included.)


The two eternal formats are Vintage and Legacy.

wiki.mtgsalvation.com/article/Eternal_(format) 




 


 
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 19, 2011 - 1:01PM #13
Razorgore
Date Joined: Sep 30, 2009
Posts: 3,998
Tourrant, you need to take a look at your own DCI page, and review what the old Extended (pre-chop) events fell under. I'll give you a hint, it wasn't Constructed rating. The old extended was an eternal format, precisely because "non-rotational" isn't a recognized format from the DCI.

There's been no announcement regarding which format Modern events will fall under, but given the previous extended formatting, my guess would be Eternal rating. Otherwise, the definition of Eternal formats becomes a bit arbitrary.

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2 years ago  ::  Aug 19, 2011 - 1:43PM #14
zammm
Date Joined: Jul 3, 2003
Posts: 27,218
[O]fficial word is that Modern events will fall under the Constructed rating category, not the Eternal category.
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 19, 2011 - 5:05PM #15
Razorgore
Date Joined: Sep 30, 2009
Posts: 3,998

Aug 19, 2011 -- 1:43PM, zammm wrote:

[O]fficial word is that Modern events will fall under the Constructed rating category, not the Eternal category.




link?

EDIT- it still doesn't make sense why old extended would be eternal rating, and Modern would be constructed.


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2 years ago  ::  Aug 20, 2011 - 8:37AM #16
quadibloc
Date Joined: Aug 20, 2008
Posts: 4,182

Aug 19, 2011 -- 8:18AM, Touraant wrote:

I think you guys need to look up the definition of Eternal Format 

Nonrotational and Eternal are not the same thing Legacy and Vintage are the only Eternal Formats


Modern is a new format. Before Modern came along, the only Constructed formats that didn't rotate were Vintage and Legacy.

Since the normal English meaning of the word "eternal" is something that continues to exist forever into the future, without stating how far it went into the past, and, in any case, Magic: the Gathering only came into existence in 1992, not at the dawn of time... there was no obvious reason why the word "eternal" wouldn't apply to Modern.

Apparently, Wizards is going to choose to distinguish Modern from Vintage and Legacy, and not officially class it among the Eternal formats, as Zammm has noted. But there was no real reason for people to have known that ahead of time, which is why Modern has been referred to as a new Eternal format - rather than coining the new term "non-rotational format". Which, apparently, we will now need to do.

Coming up with weird ideas to make everyone happy since 2008!

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2 years ago  ::  Aug 20, 2011 - 4:48PM #17
Sidneyious
Date Joined: Nov 26, 2008
Posts: 631

Aug 17, 2011 -- 9:07PM, richeyz wrote:

Yeah, I kind of like Modern too. Now I just need to replace my five circle of protections from unlimited, and one from ice age, for the ones from 8th edtion...

Anyone want cards worth $3-5 For ones worth less from 8th? XD




I thought you could use them sense they were reprinted.

Learn about autocard here ==> [*c]Lightning Bolt[/*c] Remove "*" and you get Lightning Bolt .



Keep extended alive for future generations so they dont have to sell out for modern.
"If there is such a thing as too much power, I have not discovered it." —Volrath
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 21, 2011 - 11:44AM #18
quadibloc
Date Joined: Aug 20, 2008
Posts: 4,182

Aug 17, 2011 -- 9:07PM, richeyz wrote:

Yeah, I kind of like Modern too. Now I just need to replace my five circle of protections from unlimited, and one from ice age, for the ones from 8th edtion..


No, no. Don't bother, because you don't need to. It's in the Tournament Rules. A Circle of Protection: Black can be played in a format in which cards with that name are legal, regardless of the set it came from. So you can play with a Beta Giant Spider in Standard, even though cards aren't legal in Standard because they were in Beta. A card that is legal because it was in Magic: 2011 is legal by its name, not by where it actually came from.

That's true in Modern too, even if the sets included were chosen by card frame.

Coming up with weird ideas to make everyone happy since 2008!

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2 years ago  ::  Aug 23, 2011 - 12:48PM #19
zammm
Date Joined: Jul 3, 2003
Posts: 27,218

Aug 19, 2011 -- 5:05PM, Razorgore wrote:

link?


Someone asked about it on the judge list.

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Knowledge knows no bounds.
Magic Area FAQ & Index | Magic General FAQ | Card Comparisons | The Wording Clinic
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| My Trade Binder

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And so people say to me, "How do I know if a word is real?" You know, anyone who's read a children's book knows that love makes things real. If you love a word, use it! That makes it real. Being in the dictionary is an artificial distinction; it doesn't make the word any more real than any other word. If you love a word, it becomes real.
--Erin McKean, Redefining the Dictionary
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 29, 2011 - 11:04AM #20
Wynzerman
Date Joined: Oct 23, 2010
Posts: 3,486

Sort-of... By design Modern is the better format. Why? Because the "power" is marginalized, and the "power level" is streamlined to the modern Magic standards of post 7th Ed. The reason that this is important is that even though "staples" exist within the context of the format, each card has a limit to it's true utility (even intentionally powerful cards such as the Titan cycle), making the difference so marginal that subjectivity rules (ultimately a format where players can "use their cards") as opposed to being stuck on a few archetypes. Legacy had several older cards which were just plain crazy designs because they honestly didn't think Magic would live to see 7 years of age. But for as much as design and R&D learned about card design and appropriate amounts of utility Wizard's was violated in business practice too, which is the real reason for this format.


The problem this format will have though is a very simple one and the reason why certain rivaling games have been on the decline for years: people don't want to play an expensive TCG. I remember when I was younger one of the appeals to Magic was that the cards were sold on their subjective cost, but that usually meant that wicked good cards went for more than $1, and a $10 card was unheard of. Today, within a years time, in two different formats we have seen 2 cards break the $100 mark without even being on the reserved list, and every special product released that is specfically for brick and mortar shops has a jacked up price in reality because why charge MSRP when people want to play bad enough? Honestly, Wizards needs to find a way to force Brick and Mortars (as well as online retailers) to play nice with their customers or the customers are going to start disappearing, and probably take their friends as well.



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