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Switch to Forum Live View 5/26/2010 BoaB: "Surreal Ascension"
3 years ago  ::  Jun 07, 2010 - 11:40AM #41
AH_Colonel_Coo
Date Joined: Jan 17, 2006
Posts: 2,111
So I played the original version and found the same cards to be useless to me.  I also experienced the same troubles over & over again. 

First:  Surreal Memoir is not viable in the deck.  Every game where I had one in my hand or had to play it, I lost. 

Second: The mana base is way too low for games 2 & 3.   24 lands minimum is needed to fight out the deck once your opponent knows what to stop. 

Third: Banefire is useless.  Popping 3 to 5 lightning bolts a turn at your opponent's face is generally enough to kill him.

Fourth: the Bridge Clubbing of the accession.  I've literally had to draw & Peek 40+ cards to SEE my first ascension.  No fetch makes card draw very importantant as well as the ability to lay aside the cards you don't need. 

With only the first point modified, I added in card draw via See Beyond.  I still had 22 lands and the banefires.  This card helped get me through semi good Ponder's and also get to the cards I wanted.  I also had the opportunity to get the needed "two of" the same card to set up the counters on the P.A.   In maind deck game one they work fine.  For game 2 & 3 they ALWAYS come out.  Consequently I think that they are one of the weaker changes.  Play them and see, but personally, I'd rather have more mana to power out the rest of the deck.

Onwards, I tested without any Fog for maindeck. I also took out the Banefire.  Seriously, the BF is not needed.  Bolts are good enough.  With those cards removed, I added in the 4th Time Warp and 2 lands.  Also making the cut from the deck was the Surreal Ascension.

Together this is what my later revisions looked like: 
Out: 2 surreal ascension, IN 2 more lands to total upwards to 24 lands.
Out: Banefire.  IN 4th Time warp.
Out: 4 Fog.  IN 4 Staggershock.


GAMEPLAY.  I took my deck to Canada with me on a business trip.  Unfortunetly, I took it kind of scattered amongst boxes.  Missing were my 4 dual lands to hit the business end of curve, leaving me in fetch mode most of the games.  I also 'left behind' my 4 Naturalize ,  4  Negates , 4 Path to Exile and 3 Day of Judgement s for my sideboard. .  With my Sideboard still in Atlanta, I decided to whip a sb together from cards from other decks.  Needless to say, my sideboard SUCKED. 

But of interest is how the deck played.  There were 4 rounds.  I never won the coin-toss and always played second.  Twice I had to mulligan to 6 due to 1 land hands.  In game 2 & 3 of those four matches (8 more games) I would be forced to mulligan to 5 cards once and twice to 6 cards.  Hitting 5 mulligans in 12 games really sucked.  
Even when mulliganing to 6 cards on game one in two matches, I won EVERY game 1 I played.  After the tourney I would play my deck against others there.  In every instance, this deck won game 1.  
But after sideboarding game 2 & 3 went to my opponents in 3 matches. I won my last match of the evening against a weak designed decks.  

GAME 1 is an auto win against MOST decks. 
But Game 2 and 3 are different.  It is the sideboard and method of play that wrecks game 2 and 3.  Once UW control & WW brings in their enchantment elimination and negates, you've got to modify your play style.  Ideally in game 2 and 3 you'd run creature elimination as they're going to drop BSA and Shroud out as fast as possible.  Hitting a DoJ is key to survival.  At the same time getting your P.A. to stay for longer than a moment is extremely difficult.  Putting a P.A. out without protection is risking it all in hopes your opponent can't exile it via instant removal, counter it via NEgate, naturalize it, or oblivion ring it.  Oblivion Rings ruined most of my P.A. that got through counters.  
I will say this, If I got to untap with a P.A. on the board, I won.  Which really makes me want to get a free turn the same turn I cast out my P.A.   For Time Warp , Pyromancers Ascension and backing up the P.A. with a Negate for game 2 requires that you have 9 mana open and available.  9 mana means I must play 24 or more lands (I am leaning towards 26) and have means to accelerate it out.  The other avenue to get a free turn is give up a card draw to your opponent to use Magosi, the Waterveil only to see it turn to a Island or otherwise be targeted by Tectonic Edge.

I like the deck a lot but after being wearing my butt for a hat for all those game 2 and 3's, I feel the more mana approach with GREAT elimination is needed.  Swarms of little creatures die easily enough to Bolts and rebounds, but this deck WANTS TO RUN All Is Dust.  It wants it in the sideboard instead of Fog. It wants it with DoJ.  That takes the deck out of budget range ($15 for the All is Dust and $7 for DoJ adds up quickly).  But if you're trying to make it a winner of a design, consider the cards.  

The other approach I plan on Playtesting in a week or so is to add Recurring Insight along with  treasure hunt.   The deck will be mostly BLUE with 
26 lands
Ponder (4), Treasure hunt(4), Reoccuring Insight (4), Time Warp (3), 
lightning Bolt (4)
staggershock (4)
pyromancer ascension (4)
naya charm (4)
survival cache (3)

With All is Dust, Negate, PTE and DoJ in the sideboard.  

I have a strong suspicion that hitting the land drops to RI or just having the mana to gain life and card draw should get you to your goal of a single turn Pyromancer Ascension, Ponder, Lightning Bolt and Time Warp (two free turns).   

last comment:  Staggershock killing your opponent's vampire or weenie on turn 3 generally will keep him from casting into the Staggershock on his turn 3.  (assuming you are going first).  This gives you a completely free turn Survival cache or Treasure Hunt to draw big cards.  Your turn 5 quickly has you seeing 2 to 4 cards more than you otherwise could have due to the Staggershock slowing them down a complete turn. 

 
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3 years ago  ::  Jul 16, 2010 - 1:50PM #42
AH_Colonel_Coo
Date Joined: Jan 17, 2006
Posts: 2,111

I've had this deck as a pet project for development for some while.  Of my original response, I determined that the culprit of the design failure was color use.  Red was the color to kill the threats and get you to doubling of the spells. 

Too often my game loses came with either too much green or stuck with green.  So I minimized the use of green.

The other problem was never seeing the Pyromancers ascension.  No pyro, no win. 


Through some other discussions on single card use, I determined that shuffling your deck was a really bad idea prior to getting the pryo in hand.  

Consequently, I cut the fetch lands and the harrows.  I added more blue to scrye.  Thanks' M11!

And now the deck runs like melted butter.  Hot and smooth.  

DecK:
Blue Spells: 15
3x time warp .  You only need 3.  You've got lots of cantrips and scrying.
4x  foresee
4x preordain
4x ponder :  Oddly Ponder is the weakest of hte Blue spells and might be better sutied as a negate.  

Red Spells:
4x pyromancer ascension
4x staggershock
4x lightning bolt

Mixed Red with GW:
3x naya charm

Green
4x explore

White
4x survival cache

Lands:
4x exotic orchard   Only deck that doesn't give you the color you need is Vampires.
4x seaside citadel   White & Green with BLUE. (total of 10 W/G sources)
4x jungle shrine   White & green with Red
2x rupture spire   All colors.  Slow turn 2 play.
5x island for a total of 11 Blue sources
5x mountain for a total of 11 red sources. 

The deck runs out pretty well.  It recovered from summoning trapped Terastadon that blasted a powered up Ascension and killed my white and blue sources.  (3 lands left in play). 

The deck takes some driving to make it run at 100%. 

For sideboard, I'd recommend 15 creatures that are game enders. 

If you've not played this in a while, I'd strongly recommend driving it.  My group have now all vowed to build and play one now that they've been handed their buts with it.  Jund included. 

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 02, 2011 - 12:04PM #43
mcandre
Date Joined: Jun 1, 2011
Posts: 2
Amazingly hard to Google:

What the heck is a cantrip? 
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