Community

NexusNik wrote:

MTG-Fan had said that a lot of people on The Source were talking about the interaction between Cascade and Bond of Agony.

I don't believe it to be true, but this is what was said:

If it is true, I'd like to know. But I sincerely doubt it. This is my theory:

I would venture a guess that the Bond of Agony doesn't work that way. The additional cost is tied to the converted mana cost. First you'd pay the cmc (cascaded into would equal zero), then the additional cost which must be what you paid into the converted mana cost of X (which is zero), then each other player loses that much life (which is zero). I could very well be wrong, but thats how I see the rulings. Because X always equals zero if you don't play it from your hand. Otherwise this card would have been abused forever ago. Pay 1 black and x life to make each player lose 19 life, or what have you.

Whether it actually works or not is actually somewhat up in the air right now. However, your understanding of the situation is off. X does not depend on what you pay. What you pay depends on the value you choose for X. Now, with most cards, if you're not paying the mana cost, there's a rule that would make you choose 0 as the value for X. However, the specific wording of the rule makes it somewhat unclear if it applies or not:[indent]If you're playing a spell that has {X} in its mana cost, the value of X isn't defined by the text of that spell, and an effect lets you play that spell without paying any cost that includes X, then the only legal choice for X is 0.[/indent]Since here, you are still paying a cost that includes X. Anyway, there's nothing more to be said until we get an official ruling.

Edit: Also, Cascade does not affect the CMC. Converted mana cost is always based only on the mana cost, which is always only the symbols in the upper right of the card. Even if you're playing a spell without paying its mana cost, its CMC is still a value equal to the total amount of mana represented by the symbols in its mana cost.

reddaemon wrote:

I just pulled this from the comprehensive rules.  Perhaps it will be of some use:

     If a spell or activated ability has a cost with an “{X}” in it, and the value of X isn’t defined by the text of that spell or ability, the controller of that spell or ability chooses and announces the value of X as part of playing the spell or ability. (See rule 409, “Playing Spells and Activated Abilities.” While the spell or ability is on the stack, the {X} in its mana cost equals the announced value.

But if I play Memory Plunder targeting Banefire I could announce 100 for example. When Memory Plunder resolves X is defined as 0, no need to announce. This is my understanding.

The Rules - General 502]# 502.85.Ruling.9 - When you play a card without paying its mana cost, you any X in its cost must be zero and you cannot use alternate costs (such as with Morph), but you can pay optional additional costs, such as Conspire. [Alara Reborn FAQ 2009/04/30]

What does mean "you any X in"?

Regards,

- Dehu wrote:

Argus Panoptes wrote:

Announce "100" for what?

It is an allusion for "If a spell or activated ability has a cost with an “{X}” in it, and the value of X isn’t defined by the text of that spell or ability, the controller of that spell or ability chooses and announces the value of X as part of playing the spell or ability" as stated above by reddaemon.

Regards,

- Dehumanizer

X
Many cards use the letter X as a placeholder for a number that needs to be determined. All instances of X on an object have the same value.

If a spell or activated ability has a cost with an "{X}" in it, and the value of X isn't defined by the text of that spell or ability, the controller of that spell or ability chooses and announces the value of X as part of playing the spell or ability. (See rule 409, "Playing Spells and Activated Abilities.") While the spell or ability is on the stack, the {X} in its mana cost equals the announced value. If you're playing a spell that has {X} in its mana cost, the value of X isn't defined by the text of that spell, and an effect lets you play that spell without paying any cost* that includes X, then the only legal choice for X is 0. This doesn't apply to effects that only reduce a cost, even if they reduce it to zero. See rule 409, "Playing Spells and Activated Abilities."

The relevant parts are in bold. The phrase "any cost" is singular, meaning any one cost - as in, if there is a cost with X in it that you are not paying, X must equal zero. In order for the combo to work, the phrasing would have to be worded "any costs", with an "s", denoting the plural form of the word.

Since we are not paying one of the costs including X, the condition is satisfied for the rules to restrict X to zero. The presence of the additional cost of X life is not even relevant at this point, since the phrasing of the rules indicates a singular cost. And since all instances of X must be the same, and the X that you are not paying must equal zero, then all instances of X must equal zero.