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Switch to Forum Live View [UnCon] Stump the Judge
5 years ago  ::  Oct 07, 2008 - 4:30PM #51
Shining_Demon
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Date Joined: Mar 24, 2007
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Leftconsin wrote:

GAH! You're right! Editing now!


So do I get the point? :P

Also, answer the question. I want to see if you know.

Edit: That's actually incorrect. Being revealed does count as coming into play, so it gets the loyalty counters. http://magiccards.info/uh/en/91.html for reference since this is the best source for Un-rulings.

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5 years ago  ::  Oct 07, 2008 - 4:37PM #52
Gardevior
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ShiningDemon gets a point.
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5 years ago  ::  Oct 07, 2008 - 4:38PM #53
Leftconsin
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Date Joined: Sep 27, 2005
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Gardevior wrote:

ShiningDemon gets a point.


Whats the answer?!

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5 years ago  ::  Oct 07, 2008 - 4:39PM #54
NightWolf720
Date Joined: Apr 16, 2004
Posts: 128

Leftconsin wrote:

Ten.


Hopefully, that's not right.

Once things get played, the stack looks something like this: Omnibian 's activation, Dovescape 's trigger to Cancel , Cancel itself, Dovescape 's trigger to Fracturing Gust on top of Nullstone Gargoyle 's (thanks to APNAP order), Fracturing Gust itself.

Omnibian 's ability resolves, making Guile a 3/3 Frog instead of a 6/6 Elemental Incarnation, but letting him keep all his abilities. Next, Cancel is countered by Dovescape and three birds are put into play under my control.

At this point, since Cancel was countered by an ability I control, I can remove it from the game with Guile. Because it's an instant, I can play it, targeting Fracturing Gust . It will get countered, give me three more birds, then I can remove it from the game again. I can do this as many times as I want.

Once I decide to end that cycle, Fracturing Gust gets countered by an ability I control, so I can do the same thing, only this time getting five birds each time.

So, I can make 8 + (3x + 5y) birds, where x is the number of times I play Cancel with Guile and y is the number of times I play FG with Guile. Of course, I can also sac Guile and the Thrinax to Mycoloth , but not the Thrinax's tokens, and the counters are double the number of creatures I control. So the final max would be 2*(10 + (3x +5y)) counters

...if I'm not mistaken.

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5 years ago  ::  Oct 07, 2008 - 4:40PM #55
Shining_Demon
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Leftconsin wrote:

Whats the answer?!


I just editted it in because I didn't notice your edit.

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5 years ago  ::  Oct 07, 2008 - 4:45PM #56
Leftconsin
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Shining_Demon wrote:

I just editted it in because I didn't notice your edit.


OK, you get a point.

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5 years ago  ::  Oct 07, 2008 - 4:48PM #57
Leftconsin
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NightWolf720 wrote:

Hopefully, that's not right.

Once things get played, the stack looks something like this: Omnibian 's activation, Dovescape 's trigger to Cancel , Cancel itself, Dovescape 's trigger to Fracturing Gust on top of Nullstone Gargoyle 's (thanks to APNAP order), Fracturing Gust itself.

Omnibian 's ability resolves, making Guile a 3/3 Frog instead of a 6/6 Elemental Incarnation, but letting him keep all his abilities. Next, Cancel is countered by Dovescape and three birds are put into play under my control.

At this point, since Cancel was countered by an ability I control, I can remove it from the game with Guile. Because it's an instant, I can play it, targeting Fracturing Gust . It will get countered, give me three more birds, then I can remove it from the game again. I can do this as many times as I want.

Once I decide to end that cycle, Fracturing Gust gets countered by an ability I control, so I can do the same thing, only this time getting five birds each time.

So, I can make 8 + (3x + 5y) birds, where x is the number of times I play Cancel with Guile and y is the number of times I play FG with Guile. Of course, I can also sac Guile and the Thrinax to Mycoloth , but not the Thrinax's tokens, and the counters are double the number of creatures I control. So the final max would be 2*(10 + (3x +5y)) counters

...if I'm not mistaken.


OK, Point for you.

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5 years ago  ::  Oct 07, 2008 - 4:51PM #58
Leftconsin
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Rules change!

Because I am getting more questions than I thought I could reasonably handle (I do other stuff you know!) I will be setting up times in which I will be taking questions. I dont want to wake up tomorrow and have 50 questions stacked up. Today's submissions end in 40 minutes, and will resume tomorrow afternoon.
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5 years ago  ::  Oct 07, 2008 - 4:51PM #59
CarstenHaese
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Date Joined: Oct 18, 2007
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Leftconsin wrote:

Could you please get some comprules to back you up?


It comes down to the following rules:

419.1. Replacement and prevention effects are continuous effects that watch for a particular event to happen and then completely or partially replace that event. These effects act like "shields" around whatever they're affecting.

419.9a If two or more replacement or prevention effects are attempting to modify the way an event affects an object or player, the affected object's controller (or its owner if it has no controller) or the affected player chooses one to apply. [...] Once the chosen effect has been applied, this process is repeated (taking into account only replacement or prevention effects that would now be applicable) until there are no more left to apply.


The event in this case is "TTE comes into play." There are three replacement effects that are applicable. Let's say we apply BP first. This changes the event to "TTE comes into play with an additional +1/+1 counter." This leaves us with two remaining replacement effects that are applicable. Applying the second BP changes the event to "TTE comes into play with two additional +1/+1 counters."

Now we apply Devour's replacement effect which changes the event to "Player A may sacrifice any number of creatures. TTE comes into play with 3 +1/+1 counters for each creature sacrificed this way and two additional +1/+1 counters."

Now no more replacement effects are applicable, and the event happens. Now the player actually performs the sacrifices that Devour calls for, as TTE is coming into play.

Note that the order of applying the replacement effects doesn't matter, because the sacrifice doesn't happen until the event resolves, which isn't until after all applicable replacement effects have been applied.

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5 years ago  ::  Oct 07, 2008 - 4:52PM #60
Dr_Kraid
Date Joined: Apr 22, 2007
Posts: 3,740
This thread is like playing Mind Shatter targeting myself.
I just proved beyong any doubt that your wording was wrong yet you insist to keep your flawed wording? You are by far the most horrible designer on this forum. Even Bankai would admit he's wrong when faced with such beyond-doubt proof. And that's saying something. You will have cards in your set. That are worded wrong. And you know they're worded wrong. Just because you won't admit you were wrong even though you and everyone else know you are wrong. Wow, just wow. Unbelievable.
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