|
5 years ago ::
Apr 25, 2008 - 2:47PM
#1
|
Date Joined:
Aug 30, 2007
|
Currently, the DCI Penalty Guide and the Magic: the Gathering DCI Floor Rules appear to contradict one another about events with no decklist. From the Penalty Guide: Players in Limited tournaments that do not feature decklists may change the configuration of their deck between matches.
From the Floor Rules:
The deck must be returned to its original composition before the first game of each match.
(Exception: Players participating in Prerelease or Release events may be allowed to freely change the composition of their decks between games by exchanging cards from their decks for cards in their sideboards without being required to return their deck to its original composition before their next match. The tournament organizer or judge will announce if this option is available. This option in not available at any other type of event except Prerelease and Release events.)
(note that this does NOT refer to the decklist, which would make the problem go away, since the decklist is defined by the PG to be the deck and does not appear to be defined in the Floor Rules).
So which rule set wins? The Magic floor rules are presumably more specific, but the Penalty Guide is more recently updated, and this was explicitly changed in the most recent update; is there a general rule to determine which ruleset wins where they contradict each other?
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Apr 25, 2008 - 10:29PM
#2
|
Date Joined:
Sep 19, 2003
|
The Penalty Guide is referring to an exception in the Floor Rules.
Floor Rules, section 132:
(Exception: Players participating in Prerelease or Release events may be allowed to freely change the composition of their decks between games by exchanging cards from their decks for cards in their sideboards without being required to return their deck to its original composition before their next match. The tournament organizer or judge will announce if this option is available. This option in not available at any other type of event except Prerelease and Release events.)
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Apr 26, 2008 - 2:02AM
#3
|
|
|
That doesn't really clear it up to me. If it's referring to that rule, why does it say something as generic as "Limited tournaments that do not feature decklists" ? I play limited tournaments that don't feature decklists all the time, but I was under the impression that the Floor Rules that state you can't modify your deck before a match applied...
If the Penalty Guidelines, however, say that you can change your deck before matches as long as there's no decklists... that does sound like a contradiction to me.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Apr 26, 2008 - 3:11AM
#4
|
Date Joined:
Sep 21, 2006
|
The section quoted by Earth Jim clarifies this.
Simply put, if the event is a Release or a Prerelease, and if there are no deck lists, and if the tournament organizer decides to, then you may alter the composition of your deck freely without having to reset it.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Apr 26, 2008 - 4:27AM
#5
|
Date Joined:
Feb 26, 2006
|
Actually, I believe the Floor Rules are just outdated. As of March 20th, any limited event not requiring a decklist will let you change your deck between matches.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Apr 26, 2008 - 6:29AM
#6
|
- Mogic Puzzle Master
- Plays Well With Others
|
I think I agree with useless_kodama. Either which way, they just flat out contradict each other, so one of them has to be changed.
DCI Level 2 Judge
"That's what's so stupid about the whole magic thing, you know," Rincewind said. "You spend twenty years learning the spell that makes nude virgins appear in your bedroom, and then you're so poisoned by quicksilver fumes and half-blind from reading old grimoires that you can't remember what happens next."
- Terry Pratchett, The Colour Of Magic
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Apr 26, 2008 - 6:32AM
#7
|
Date Joined:
Apr 18, 2006
|
Actually, I believe the Floor Rules are just outdated. As of March 20th, any limited event not requiring a decklist will let you change your deck between matches.
useless_kodama is correct. From the DCI Judge Mail List:
Christopher Nguyen wrote:
> According to the March MFR 132, players may only sideboard between matches
> at Prerelease and Release events (both of which are limited):
>...
>
> Whereas the March PG 112 for DWE:DDLM says that at all non-decklist limited
> events players may sideboard in between matches:
> ...
>
> Which of these is current policy?
>
> I would assume the PG as that section is more recent and the only thing in
> the MFR that changed was the format set legality information for Eventide
> and Shadowmoor. However, I would like to hear an [O]fficial response to this.
You are correct - the PG is more recent, and any limited event without decklists allow what I like to call "continuous construction". If your players don't like that for your store events, use decklists.
Keep in mind that, lacking decklists, it's impractical (at best) to enforce the "return to original configuration" policy.
--
Thanks! -- Scott Marshall
DCIJUDGE-L NetRep, L4, Denver
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Apr 28, 2008 - 9:59AM
#8
|
Date Joined:
Aug 30, 2007
|
Thanks, luxgladius. I suspected that this issue would have been discussed there, but there's no way I know of for a non-judge to check.
|
|
|
|
5 years ago ::
Apr 28, 2008 - 10:54AM
#9
|
|
|
Interesting. I wonder if they have any intention of coding this into MTGO. Or if they consider those events to be decklisted. I could see an argument either way, and since calling them non-decklisted would involve coding in the ability to modify your deck between matches, I doubt they'll do it. Still, it would be a nice feature.
I'm just a Pigment of your imagination.
|
|
|
