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2 years ago ::
May 09, 2008 - 5:37PM
#1
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This thread is for discussion of magicthegathering.com's "Shadowmoor - The Hole Story" feature, which goes live Monday morning on magicthegathering.com.
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2 years ago ::
May 11, 2008 - 9:23PM
#2
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- YMtC Champion
- Ceci n'est pas une porte
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Very interesting. :> Couldn't you have just made the "Quake-icane" cycle work by making the abilities relatively underpowered? Off the top of my head, a UB version with "tap target creature" and "target creature gains fear until EOT" would've been interesting for combat. Do you tap their largest blockers, to let your army through, or do you just give three of your guys fear until EOT? Obviously you tried "draw a card" / "discard a card", which is a bit too good. \:> I'm not a huge fan of Mercy Killing. I think it breaks the pie just a little bit too much. Were the one-mana cantrips, like Aphotic Wisps specifically designed as counters to the colour-based auras?
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2 years ago ::
May 11, 2008 - 9:36PM
#3
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Gosh darn it, that Xbox 360 ad again. Please get rid of it WoTC. If I see it one more time after tonight I am allocating ten dollars away from WoTC products in my monthly budget for each time I see it. That almost covers the tylenol I need for the headache that ensues.
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2 years ago ::
May 11, 2008 - 9:36PM
#4
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"But wait," you say. "Hole request e-mail? Tell me more!"
Actually I say "But wait, the e-mail specifically said,"
Shouldn't cost one mana.
"So how did Strip bare come about?" I went through the whole article expecting an answer and was disappointed.
Oh well, overall a good article, if a little short.
P.S.
Gosh darn it, that Xbox 360 ad again. Please get rid of it WoTC. If I see it one more time after tonight I am allocating ten dollars away from WoTC products in my monthly budget for each time I see it. That almost covers the tylenol I need for the headache that ensues.[/quote]
Get Firefox and AdBlock plus. Those incredibly annoying ads were what finally drove me to get what was previously a completely unneeded luxury.
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2 years ago ::
May 11, 2008 - 10:15PM
#5
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How does "Enchantment removal of some sort. Shouldn't cost one mana . . . something I wouldn't be embarrassed to maindeck once in a while" result in Strip Bare ? Not only does it cost one mana, it's Menger sponge fodder. If I ever shuffle up for Game 1 with one of those in my deck, something went wrong. Other than that, a fine look into the cardmaking process. I also like Mercy Killing , and support efforts to find funky green removal. Utopia Vow and Lignify were both very interesting cards; I think the latter even had a bit of a tournament showing.
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2 years ago ::
May 11, 2008 - 10:38PM
#6
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Couldn't you have just made the "Quake-icane" cycle work by making the abilities relatively underpowered?
Yes, but who really wants a cycle of one exciting card and four underpowered cards? Cycles like that are better off as single exciting cards.
How does "Enchantment removal of some sort. Shouldn't cost one mana . . . something I wouldn't be embarrassed to maindeck once in a while" result in Strip Bare? Not only does it cost one mana, it's Menger sponge fodder. If I ever shuffle up for Game 1 with one of those in my deck, something went wrong.
I don't remember if it cost two at the time, or if it got put in at one and other costs got cycled around. The point of the "shouldn't cost one mana" request was mainly because we had a ton of white instants that cost one mana at the time. It wasn't really inherent to the card being designed.
We ended up with enough other maindeckable answers to the auras that this slot didn't end up getting pushed as well. If we'd determined we really needed it, it would've gotten tweaked or pushed in some sense.
Just goes to prove another point I've learned from hole filling: A lot of times, the request doesn't end up matching what gets picked from the submissions, let alone the final card. They're more like guidelines, anyways.
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2 years ago ::
May 11, 2008 - 11:09PM
#7
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While card designers don't normally worry about templates, there are a number of standard card templates that we try to avoid because they are confusing or nonintuitive, or because they tend to lead to rules-lawyery situations where one player insists some subtle timing trick works in their favor and the other player has never even heard of the appropriate rules.[/quote]
I'm glad this has been pointed out. I have had several experiences where I know some subtle timing trick, but I feel the need to suppress it since whomever I am playing with is unaware of how it works. It's an awkward situation, and although preventing cards from creating these scenarios does censor the overall breadth of printable effects, I am glad that Design does have a policy on this.
(And printing reminder text helps too. I like it when rules are made clear through the use of cards. I specifically traded for a turn order card from 10th so I could have definitive proof of the turn order whenever it was necessary.)
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2 years ago ::
May 11, 2008 - 11:32PM
#8
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- YMtC Champion
- Ceci n'est pas une porte
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Yes, but who really wants a cycle of one exciting card and four underpowered cards? Cycles like that are better off as single exciting cards.
When you come up with a cool new idea, do you generally try to converge it with high power, for a double-whammy of coolness?
(That seems to have been the case to the extreme with planeswalkers.)
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2 years ago ::
May 12, 2008 - 12:59AM
#9
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When you come up with a cool new idea, do you generally try to converge it with high power, for a double-whammy of coolness?
(That seems to have been the case to the extreme with planeswalkers.)
As far as I remember Devin Low had a articel about the rules they tried to follow then creating the first set of planeswalkers: here
Ecspecially:
Principle 13) They must each be powerful in Limited.
Principle 14) They should all be decent in Constructed, and some of them should be awesome in Constructed.
Principle 17) They must appeal to Spike.
which suggest, atleast to me, that they will be undercosted for their effect.
Btw. I tought you were talking about Elvish Hexhunter , a white one mana card I wouldnt be totally ageinst maindecking (because it deals with the rather powerfull enchantments and it itself can fly around with the GW aura) and it does deal with enchantments...
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2 years ago ::
May 12, 2008 - 3:45AM
#10
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While card designers don't normally worry about templates, there are a number of standard card templates that we try to avoid because they are confusing or nonintuitive, or because they tend to lead to rules-lawyery situations where one player insists some subtle timing trick works in their favor and the other player has never even heard of the appropriate rules.
This doesn't apply at rare, does it? I understand the reasoning behind it at common and uncommon... but if you can have rare lands, which Jim over there who only buys two packs a set hates, you can have complicated rares, right?
It's just that reading this didn't give me that idea, which in turn gave me the idea that somebody's holding out all the really cool and complicated rares on me.
Which I'm sure is untrue. But still, I'm asking.
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