Dazed and Action Points query.

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Hi all,

Please help me with a rules query and tell me if I'm being a jerk.

A character is Dazed.

One of the conditions of being Dazed is;

"You can take either a standard action, a move action, or a minor action on your turn (you can also take free actions). You can’t take immediate actions or opportunity actions."

Which I essentially read as "You get to do one thing per round while dazed".

My question is, if a player who is Dazed uses an action point, can they take a second action?

My first reaction is no, as the specific wording of the Dazed condition says you get to take one action in a round, and specific overrides general.

Is this an incorrect conclusion? Is there wording that says I should be allowing this character to spend and action point and take a second action despite being Dazed?

Many thanks,

WJ.
Don't see why you can't use an action point while dazed. It's a free action and allows you to perform an extra standard action in addition to your normal actions. Which in this case is limited to one action.

If you are stunned, however, I'd say using an action point wouldn't give you a Standard Action.
The explicit language of dazed is that you can only take one action on your turn. I think that would overrule the more general "you can spend an action point to get an extra action".

So my ruling would be no, not while dazed.
Using an action point is a free action. And, according to the dazed condition, there are no restrictions on free actions, so it's allowed to be used.

TBP
RAW is unclear about whether or not the specific language of the Action Point giving you an extra action overrides the specific language of Dazed restricting how many actions you can use. RAI, on the other hand, is IMO very clear. Action Points exist to let your character do awesome heroic things by taking more actions than normally allowed. So, RAI, spending an Action Point while Dazed lets you take a second action.

When RAW is unclear and RAI is clear, and there are no balance issues, I go with RAI.

t~
Using an action point is a free action. And, according to the dazed condition, there are no restrictions on free actions, so it's allowed to be used.

TBP

Hmm. So you're contention is that while dazed specifically limits the # of allowed non-free actions to one, since using an action point is free, and use of the action point explicitly grants 1 more non-free action, that it should be allowed.

*ponders*

You know what? Upon reconsideration, and now having had a modicum of coffee, I agree.
It seems that it is a free action to spend the action point, but the action granted by the action point is still a standard, a move, or a minor.

It even says "You gain an extra action this turn. You decide if the action is a standard action, a move action, or a minor action."

Dazed says "You can take either a standard action, a move action, or a minor action on your turn (you can also take free actions)."

So, to me, it seems you can spend an action point to gain an action, but the dazed condition is still limiting you to one of the main 3 action types.
I was thinking that way as well, but the Dazed does grant use of free actions, and the free action of using the point does grant 1 more non-free action.

Ultimately the net result is the player *loses* 2 non-free actions. If they spend the action point, they still have lost 2 of their 3 or 4 (with AP) actions...
But dazed doesn't say anything about losing actions. All of the actions are there at the start of the turn and all of the actions (minus the one action that you used) are there at the end of the turn. Dazed just limits the number of actions you can take to a single standard, or a single move, or a single minor action.
Looks like this is a bit of a tricky one without a definitive answer - which I guess is good because that way I don't feel as if I was being unfair

I still maintain that the idea of one action only means exactly that, thus negating the benefit of spending an action point.

Maybe the question needs to be - when you spend an action point, is the resulting action counted as a Free Action, regardless of what you use it for (ie: Standard, Move, Minor). I can't think of a rule to support this, but it would get around the restriction of Dazed.
As I read it, you can spend an AP to gain an extra action while dazed. The expenditure is a free action, and that's okay when dazed.

FWIW, there's some debate on whether daze actually causes you to lose actions, or if it just limits how many you can use. That probably doesn't matter here, but if you start your turn dazed and (for ex) save against the condition with a minor power, RAW isn't clear on whether you then get your move and standard actions as well.
As I read it, you can spend an AP to gain an extra action while dazed. The expenditure is a free action, and that's okay when dazed.

FWIW, there's some debate on whether daze actually causes you to lose actions, or if it just limits how many you can use. That probably doesn't matter here, but if you start your turn dazed and (for ex) save against the condition with a minor power, RAW isn't clear on whether you then get your move and standard actions as well.

There shouldn't really be any debate on this (the losing your action part), the RAW specifically states that you can only take one action, not that you lose all actions but one. CS has also stated that if you ended the dazed condition during your turn, you would be able to take your other actions.. I know they're not 100 percent right, but they're all we got..

Anyway,. that's another topic.. Going strictly by the RAW, you would not get the additional action granted by the action point IMO.. The act of spending an action point is a free action that gives you another action (and sometimes other things apart from that), spending an action point does not allow you to take another action as a free action.. So if I spent an action point I would get my action, but if I took it in addition to an action I already took, I would taking more than just one standard, move, or minor.. RAI might be that you should be able to, but RAW you wouldn't..
I agree with Suiotidure and Witchslasher. It doesn't matter how you acquire an extra action, you're only allowed to spend one of the main three on your turn regardless. There's very little reason to believe in the stricter definition of dazing (denies giving you actions at start of turn), and the condition specifically says you can only take one of the main three actions while dazed. Otherwise, what's to stop other action granting abilities? If a dazed barbarian uses his single standard action to kill an adjacent enemy, then uses level 16 utility Spur the Cycle (free action after killing enemy, effect: you take a standard action), should he get a second action?

That said, action points and similar are rare enough that it shouldn't make much of a difference if they wanted to houserule it the other way.
I agree with Suiotidure and Witchslasher. It doesn't matter how you acquire an extra action, you're only allowed to spend one of the main three on your turn regardless. There's very little reason to believe in the stricter definition of dazing (denies giving you actions at start of turn), and the condition specifically says you can only take one of the main three actions while dazed. Otherwise, what's to stop other action granting abilities? If a dazed barbarian uses his single standard action to kill an adjacent enemy, then uses level 16 utility Spur the Cycle (free action after killing enemy, effect: you take a standard action), should he get a second action?

That said, action points and similar are rare enough that it shouldn't make much of a difference if they wanted to houserule it the other way.

I wouldn't think you would.. It says "take a standard action". Dazed only allows you to take a standard, move, or minor.. To once you've taken one of those action, you can no longer take a standard..

Agreed on that last part, houseruling action points to allow you take take actions outside of your normal actions seems perfectly fine..
No where in the dazed condition does it say cannot gain an additional action by spending an action point. The only thing the dazed condition say you cannot do is take immediate or opportunity actions. The way I read it, if you are dazed, you normally only can take a standard, move or minor action instead of all 3. If you spend an action point (which is a free action and nothing in the dazed condition prevents this), you gain an additional action

In my previous game, most of the party was hit with a dazed effect as they lost initiative to a mage. When it is the PC's turn, many of them spent an action point to take an extra action. The interaction between dazed and action points seem to work out as intended. PC's are dazed and they used an AP to dig deep to overcome the dazed conditions restrictions a bit. I think it would have been to severe a penalty if the PC's were not allowed to gain an extra action by spending an AP.

The dazed condition had its intended effect. It limited the PC's actions. It forced the PC's to use an AP to overcome the effect in an important time of this battle. Had the PC's not used the AP, it would have made things more difficult for them as they would have been pinned down. The dazed condition presented a problem for the PC's and their solution was to use an AP.
<\ \>tuntman
I wouldn't think you would.. It says "take a standard action". Dazed only allows you to take a standard, move, or minor..

False : Dazed allows you to take Free Actions.

  • Dazed limits your turn to 1 non-free action.
  • Spending an Action Point is a Free Action.
  • Free Action grants the use of one more non-free action.

Since dazed allows the taking of the action which grants the extra action, and does not explicitly negate the ability to spend action points, dazed doesn't restrict the use of action points.

Further, this interpretation is consistent with:
  • On your turn you can take 3 non-free actions.
  • Spending an Action Point is a Free Action.
  • Free Action grants the use of one more non-free action.


Action point usage increases your available non-free actions per turn by 1 in both cases.

Note - I started the "net result, the party member still lose 2 non-free actions" comment. My intent was *NOT* to suggest that dazed TAKES AWAY actions - only that the outcome of Dazed + Action Point ends up being the same as Dazed w/o Action Point - that two non free actions don't get taken either way.
I guess this depends on what you consider the general rule, and what you consider the specific.

Personally i think action points are more specific then daze. "daze = one action" is general, and "AP = +1 Action" is specific, so yes you can.

I would certainly allow it, but your not being a jerk.

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F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

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I guess this depends on what you consider the general rule, and what you consider the specific.

Personally i think action points are more specific then daze. "daze = one action" is general, and "AP = +1 Action" is specific, so yes you can.

I would certainly allow it, but your not being a jerk.

This. The biggest difference between thw two camps is what is the general rule, and what is the exception.

I agree that Dazed is the general rule, while action points are the exception. I believe this because all dazed creatures act the same. Action points are exceptions to the economy of actions.

ymmv.

TBP
This. The biggest difference between thw two camps is what is the general rule, and what is the exception.

I agree that Dazed is the general rule, while action points are the exception. I believe this because all dazed creatures act the same. Action points are exceptions to the economy of actions.

ymmv.

TBP

Exactly - if the # of actions allowed per turn is the "specific" rule, then an action point can't allow you to go above 3 non-free actions in your turn.

ACTIONS ON YOUR TURN
✦ Your Actions: You get the following three actions
on your turn:
[INDENT]
  • Standard action
  • Move action
  • Minor action
[/INDENT]

DAZED
✦ You can take either a standard action, a move action,
or a minor action on your turn (you can also take
free actions). You can’t take immediate actions or
opportunity actions.

SPEND AN ACTION POINT: FREE ACTION
✦ Gain an Extra Action: You gain an extra action this
turn. You decide if the action is a standard action, a
move action, or a minor action.

Both normal turn descriptions and Dazed explicitly give a # of actions that can be taken. Action Points specifically state you gain an extra action. Gain an extra, to be consistent, must apply to dazed's limits as it does to standard limits.
Exactly - if the # of actions allowed per turn is the "specific" rule, then an action point can't allow you to go above 3 non-free actions in your turn.

ACTIONS ON YOUR TURN
✦ Your Actions: You get the following three actions
on your turn:
[INDENT]
  • Standard action
  • Move action
  • Minor action
[/INDENT]

DAZED
✦ You can take either a standard action, a move action,
or a minor action on your turn (you can also take
free actions). You can’t take immediate actions or
opportunity actions.

SPEND AN ACTION POINT: FREE ACTION
✦ Gain an Extra Action: You gain an extra action this
turn. You decide if the action is a standard action, a
move action, or a minor action.

Both normal turn descriptions and Dazed explicitly give a # of actions that can be taken. Action Points specifically state you gain an extra action. Gain an extra, to be consistent, must apply to dazed's limits as it does to standard limits.

So my normal turn I have a standard, a move, and a minor action.. If I spend an action point I have a standard, a move, and aminor action and another standard, move, or minor action.. Doesn't change the fact that dazed allows me to either take a standard, move, or minor action.. It doesn't say I can only take ONE action, it says I can take either a standard, move, or minor action..

I spend my action point to gain a standard action.. I have a standard, standard, move, and minor action.. I can still take either a standard, move, or minor.. Nothing more than that..
You do indeed gain an extra action from spending an action point.

However, nothing about gaining that extra action changes the limit imposed by the dazed condition.

In a normal turn, you start with a standard, a move, and a minor. There is no limit on the number of these you can take, there is only a number of actions you are given at the start of your turn. Spending an AP to gain an extra action does not go against a normal turn, because no limit is imposed.

In a dazed turn, it specifically says that you can take only one of the following: a standard action, a move action, and a minor action. It does not take away any actions granted to you at the start of the turn. It only imposes a limit on them. Spending an action point to take an extra action does not say it overrides this limit.
So my normal turn I have a standard, a move, and a minor action.. If I spend an action point I have a standard, move, or minor action and another standard move or minor actions.. Doesn't change the fact that dazed allows me to either take a standard, move, or minor action.. It doesn't say I can only take ONE action, it says I can take either a standard, move, or minor action..

I spend my action point to gain a standard action.. I have a standard, standard, move, and minor action.. I can still take either a standard, move, or minor.. Nothing more than that..

That's ignoring the explicit language of spending an action point: You gain an extra action.

Starting with 1 action and allowing an additional IF the AP is spent ignores neither.
Further, saying you can't spend an action point imposes a condition on dazed that doesn't apply. Dazed EXPLICITLY ALLOWS the use of free actions. To say one cannot spend an action point is to say Dazed allows the use of free actions *except spending action points*, which it does not say.
Further, saying you can't spend an action point imposes a condition on dazed that doesn't apply. Dazed EXPLICITLY ALLOWS the use of free actions. To say one cannot spend an action point is to say Dazed allows the use of free actions *except spending action points*, which it does not say.

No one has said you can't spend an action point.. Spend them all day, they're free actions.. The result of what spending that action point is is to give you another action.. It increases the number of actions you have by 1.. So at the start of your turn you have 3 actions, spending an action point gives you a fourth.. Doesn't change the number of actions you can take, which is 1 according to dazed..

Think of it like a CCG (since this is WotC).. I draw 3 cards a turn and can play any number of cards on a normal turn, however someone threw out an enchantment that said I can play 1 card a turn.. I play a monster effect that allows me to draw 1 card, so I have 4 now.. The enchantment still says I can only play 1 card, so I can only play 1 card..
Further, saying you can't spend an action point imposes a condition on dazed that doesn't apply. Dazed EXPLICITLY ALLOWS the use of free actions. To say one cannot spend an action point is to say Dazed allows the use of free actions *except spending action points*, which it does not say.

We have not been saying that you cannot spend an action point. We are only saying that the action gained does not override the dazed condition limiting you to one action.

Spend an action point all you want (it could even be beneficial depending on your paragon path, feats, whatnot to get a bonus to your one standard for the turn). After spending an using your action point action you will be left with a standard, a move, and a minor that you cannot use (unless you get rid of the dazed condition).
No one has said you can't spend an action point.. Spend them all day, they're free actions.. The result of what spending that action point is is to give you another action.. It increases the number of actions you have by 1.. So at the start of your turn you have 3 actions, spending an action point gives you a fourth.. Doesn't change the number of actions you can take, which is 1 according to dazed..

Don't you see how internally inconsistent this arugment is? In normal play you're saying you get 3 + 1, but in dazed you're saying you get 1, period. You're applying the AP inconsistently.

Spending an AP doesn't give you "a fourth", it gives you "an extra" - "an extra" applies to any number.



Think of it like a CCG (since this is WotC).. I draw 3 cards a turn and can play any number of cards on a normal turn, however someone threw out an enchantment that said I can play 1 card a turn.. I play a monster effect that allows me to draw 1 card, so I have 4 now.. The enchantment still says I can only play 1 card, so I can only play 1 card..

Incorrect analogy. You cannot play any number of cards on a normal turn, you can normally play 3.

Correct analogy:
You have a fixed hand. You can play 3 cards per turn. You can play AP which doesn't count against those 3. If you play AP, you get to play *one extra* (literal text) card.

"An extra action" is equivalent to "your number of actions +1" - where your number of actions = 1 for dazed, 3 for normal.
We have not been saying that you cannot spend an action point. We are only saying that the action gained does not override the dazed condition limiting you to one action.

Spend an action point all you want (it could even be beneficial depending on your paragon path, feats, whatnot to get a bonus to your one standard for the turn). After spending an using your action point action you will be left with a standard, a move, and a minor that you cannot use (unless you get rid of the dazed condition).

See previous reply. You're both applying action points inconsistently and ignoring the explicit language that an AP grants "an extra action", a description that applies to 1 and 3 in the same way: +1.
See previous reply. You're both applying action points inconsistently and ignoring the explicit language that an AP grants "an extra action", a description that applies to 1 and 3 in the same way: +1.

Yes. It grants an extra action. It doesn't say you can take that action.

"You can take either a standard action, a move action, or a minor action on your turn"

Just because you have it does not mean you can use it.
See previous reply. You're both applying action points inconsistently and ignoring the explicit language that an AP grants "an extra action", a description that applies to 1 and 3 in the same way: +1.

We aren't ignoring what the action point does.. You're misinterpreting what dazed does.. Daze does not take away the actions HAVE or reduce the number actions you HAVE to one.. Daze limits the number of actions you can TAKE.. Spending an action points increases the number of actions you HAVE, not the number of actions you can take...

Normal: You HAVE three actions, you can TAKE any number of actions you have

Dazed: You HAVE three actions, you can TAKE one action.

Normal + AP: You HAVE four actions, you can TAKE any number of actions you have

Dazed + AP: You HAVE four actions, you can TAKE one action
Good god, Suoitidure I'm stepping all over you in this thread
Yes. It grants an extra action. It doesn't say you can take that action.

"You can take either a standard action, a move action, or a minor action on your turn"

Just because you have it does not mean you can use it.

✦ Your Actions: You get the following three actions on your turn

Is the same thing as saying "You can take the following three actions on your turn".

That's explicitly three.

The language: Extra Action: You can take an extra action by spending an action point (page 286)

Is explicitly one extra action.

DAZED
✦ You grant combat advantage.
✦ You can take either a standard action, a move action,
or a minor action on your turn (you can also take
free actions). You can’t take immediate actions or
opportunity actions.
✦ You can’t flank an enemy.

Does explicitly reduce the # of actions from 3 to 1
Does NOT explicitly cancel out the extra action

You cannot convince me that your application of Dazed isn't putting extra language on dazed that *isn't* there, or that your interpretation of Dazed is consistent with how AP's apply to normal turns.

Both normal turns and dazed turns give an explicit # of actions that can be taken.

AP adds to the available # of actions by one. (an extra, not "a fourth")

We'll have to agree to disagree at this point until someone emails CS and gets a reply.
We aren't ignoring what the action point does.. You're misinterpreting what dazed does.. Daze does not take away the actions HAVE or reduce the number actions you HAVE to one.. Daze limits the number of actions you can TAKE.. Spending an action points increases the number of actions you HAVE, not the number of actions you can take...

Normal: You HAVE three actions, you can TAKE any number of actions you have

Dazed: You HAVE three actions, you can TAKE one action.

Normal + AP: You HAVE four actions, you can TAKE any number of actions you have

Dazed + AP: You HAVE four actions, you can TAKE one action

Fine, if you want to go the pedantically semantic route, then explain why dazed explicitly allows the use of free actions, and does not then explicitly exclude the use of action points which explicitly lets you take an extra action?
Yes. It grants an extra action. It doesn't say you can take that action.

Honestly this might be the funniest argument I have ever seen on these forums. I assume then when not dazed your extra actions granted by AP's are not usable either, as the wording on them hasn't changed.
✦ Your Actions: You get the following three actions on your turn

Is the same thing as saying "You can take the following three actions on your turn".

That's explicitly three.

The language: Extra Action: You can take an extra action by spending an action point (page 286)

Is explicitly one extra action.

DAZED
✦ You grant combat advantage.
✦ You can take either a standard action, a move action,
or a minor action on your turn (you can also take
free actions). You can’t take immediate actions or
opportunity actions.
✦ You can’t flank an enemy.

Does explicitly reduce the # of actions from 3 to 1
Does NOT explicitly cancel out the extra action

That last statement is incorrect.. It does not explicitly reduce your number of actions from 3 to 1, it says that of the actions you have available, you can take either a standard, a move, or a minor.. After you've taken a standard, a move, or a minor, you still have all your remaining actions, you just can't use them because you are dazed.
Honestly this might be the funniest argument I have ever seen on these forums. I assume then when not dazed your extra actions granted by AP's are not usable either, as the wording on them hasn't changed.

The rules forums are awesome entertainment.. I love debating rules, wakes me up in the morning.. In the end we all walk away better because of it..:P

I don't really get what that last sentence means.. There is no limit to the number of actions you can take during your turn when you're not dazed.. You're only limited by the number of actions you have.. So if you have 3 actions, you can take 3, if you have 3 actions + 1 action from AP, you can take four actions..
That last statement is incorrect.. It does not explicitly reduce your number of actions from 3 to 1, it says that of the actions you have available, you can take either a standard, a move, or a minor.. After you've taken a standard, a move, or a minor, you still have all your remaining actions, you just can't use them because you are dazed.

I'm sorry but I think its perfectly clear that the language in the PHB is Not intended to convey different meanings to "have" and "can take".

They are using the two terms interchangeably:

Look:
Your Actions: You get the following three actions
on your turn:
Standard action
Move action
Minor action

This clearly means you have *and can take* three actions.

✦ Free Actions: You can take any number of free
actions on your turn.

Effectively you have an unlimited number of free actions. You have them, you can take them.

✦ Any Order: You can take your actions in any order
you wish, and you can skip any of them.

This block is not about how many you can take, it's about the order in which you take them. If it said "Your actions can execute in any order you like" it would mean the same thing. The ability to TAKE the actions comes from the possession of the actions.

Without this block the implication would be that you have to take them in the order listed: standard, move, minor - not that you couldn't take them at all.

✦ Substitute Actions: You can take a move action or
a minor action instead of a standard action, and you
can take a minor action instead of a move action.

If "Can take" does not mean "have" then you don't "have" the substituted action to replace the action you do have. You "have" (from to get or to have) 1 standard 1 move 1 minor, if you move, you don't have the move anymore, so you couldn't do a double move.

✦ Extra Action: You can take an extra action by
spending an action point (page 286).

If Have <> Can Take then you don't HAVE the extra action to take, something else has to give it to you.

Dazed says you can take 1 action. If "can take" is not the same as "have" in that context, then it's not the same in the entire context of taking your turn, in which case the rules are utterly non playable.
I don't really get what that last sentence means.. There is no limit to the number of actions you can take during your turn when you're not dazed.. You're only limited by the number of actions you have.. So if you have 3 actions, you can take 3, if you have 3 actions + 1 action from AP, you can take four actions..

See prior post - if "have" <> "can take" then "actions on your turn" is completely unplayable as written.
I'm willing to hear out CS on this since both sides of the argument are fairly consistent with the rules even though one eventually must trump the other.

If I HAD to rule it I would end up ruling in favor of the action point because if the rules on action point expenditures. The action point rules clearly state that you can take the extra action granted by the action point. The bullet points are NOT the only rules in the action point section. Two separate times it is referenced to as "taking an action" because of the action point use, not merely gaining it. I don't even have to dip into the language based argument.

Before anyone says that the rules presented outside of the bullet points is somehow only flavor text, A) flavor text rules are presented in the reading the powers section to let people know they can change how their power looks as long as they follow the mechanics, and B) the entire section on Phasing ( coincidentally on the same page action point use ) doesn't have any bearing on how phasing works because it lack bullet points, despite it being the complete definition of how phasing works within the rules.
RAI, on the other hand, is IMO very clear. Action Points exist to let your character do awesome heroic things by taking more actions than normally allowed. So, RAI, spending an Action Point while Dazed lets you take a second action.

Agreed.
PH1 p. 269 describes the actions on your turn as follows:

ACTIONS ON YOUR TURN
✦ Your Actions: You get the following three actions
on your turn:
Standard action
Move action
Minor action
✦ Free Actions: You can take any number of free
actions on your turn.
✦ Any Order: You can take your actions in any order
you wish, and you can skip any of them.
✦ Substitute Actions: You can take a move action or
a minor action instead of a standard action, and you
can take a minor action instead of a move action.
✦ Extra Action: You can take an extra action by
spending an action point (page 286).
✦ Other Combatants’ Actions: Other combatants
can take free actions on your turn, and you might
take actions that trigger immediate actions or opportunity
actions from other combatants.

PH1 p.277 describes the dazed condition as follows:

DAZED
✦ You grant combat advantage.
✦ You can take either a standard action, a move action,
or a minor action on your turn (you can also take
free actions). You can’t take immediate actions or
opportunity actions.
✦ You can’t flank an enemy.

The combat advantage and cannot flank items in dazed take effect, but does not affeact anything else under your normal actions. The issue is the second item under Dazed.

The way I interpret it, it replaces the first two items under Actions on Your Turn. You can take either a standard, move or minor action and free actions. You cannot take immediate or opportunity actions. No where does Daze override the Any Order. No where does Daze override Substitution Action. No where does Daze override Extra Action. No where does it override Other Combattants' Actions. As far as I can tell, other than the first two items under Actions on Your Turn, all of the other 4 items are still allowed which includes gaining an extra action by spending an action point.
<\ \>tuntman
Ok. Here is a comparable example.

Lets say I have the Divine Oracle Paragon path.

It says:
Prophetic Action (11th level): When you spend an action point to take an extra action, you also gain an extra move action that you can use during another turn later in this encounter.

I have spent an action point this encounter on a previous turn, but have yet to use my extra move action.

Now, before my turn, an enemy gives me stunned (save ends).

Now my turn comes around again.
If the extra action gained from an action point trumps the dazed effect of limiting actions, then the move action granted by my PP should trump the "you cannot take actions" from the stunned condition.

I use my extra move action and substitute it into a minor action. I have quick draw and I quick draw and quaff a potion of vitality (spending a healing surge, regaining 25 hp) and make a saving throw vs the stunned condition. I succeed on the saving throw and can now take my turn as normal.

----------------------

Using the specific beats general rules. A paragon path is much more specific than spending an action point, as everyone can spend an action point to gain an action, but only those few who take this particular paragon path gain this benefit.