[Archetype] HellRazer ...Updated Deck Lists!

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HELLRAZER
IMAGE(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f277/Maschina_Lament/Hellrazer.jpg)
IMAGE(http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee215/Hodoku/RGW.gif)



What is Hellrazer?
Hellrazer is in a class of it's own. It is an aggro deck that combo's out a Realm Razer as early as turn 3 for a lock that can usually win the game . This is NOT an LD deck, just as White Weenie with Armageddon was not.

IMAGE(http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee215/Hodoku/RGW.gif)



How do you play Hellrazer?
Turn 1 Figure of Destiny
Turn 2 Bloom Tender
Turn 3 Realm Razer

Arven;17092835 wrote:
Turn 3 doesn't mean 20 damage on turn 3; it means they scoop on turn 3 because you've f***ed their manabase

Alternate Wins include

Turn 1 Birds of Paradise
Turn 2 Woolly Thoctar
also
Turn 1 Figure of Destiny
Turn 2 Bloom Tender
Turn 3 Pump Figure of Destiny to 4/4
Turn 4 Swing with a fully pumped Figure of Destiny
also
Turn 1 Figure of Destiny
Turn 2 Bloom Tender
Turn 3 Woolly Thoctarx2


IMAGE(http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee215/Hodoku/RGW.gif)



Card Choices
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Creatures
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Realm Razer Staple

Bloom Tender Staple

Figure of Destiny Staple

Birds of Paradise - Highly Suggested to maximize explosiveness

Woolly Thoctar - Has potential to win on his own, specially vs control, also allows Bloom Tender to tap for 3

Kitchen Finks - Everyone's favorite, it attacks, it blocks, it gains life, it comes back from the dead, it pumps Bloom Tender.

Fulminator Mage - This guy is better than ever in such a heavy non-basic land meta. Also saccing this guy on turn 2 is sure to have your opponent sweating. Once again, also pumps bloom tender.

Ranger of Eos - Gets Birds of Paradise, Figure of Destiny, and post board Forge tenders

Cloudthresher - Tagonte: "destroy Fae's board and eat Mistbinds, eat almost all QnT win-cons (Nucklavee, Oona, Queen of the Fae, Empyrial Archangel, etc.), eat Demigods, eat Doran, eat Spectral Procession & Bitterblossom tokens, and live to untap through all of that. "

Chameleon Colossus – Amazing finisher, hard to deal kill, and sometimes unblockable!

More coming soon...


Spells
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This part of the deck is the source of most testing.

Planeswalkers - Are they even needed in the final build?
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Ajani Vengeant - Great synergy with Realm Razer after he is in play, you can lock down any new lands they drop. Also slows down control decks with CIPT to a halt. Lightning Helix and One way Armageddon can do amazing things, specially if you drop him on turn 3. Also pumps Bloom Tender to 3 mana...

Ajani Goldmane - Amazing synergy with Kitchen Finks, and he can even give you the opportunity to swing with your Birds of Paradise and Bloom Tender

Sarkhan Vol - He makes the deck even faster with haste and threaten on a stick. I also hear post Razergeddon an army of dragons can win stalemates.

Garruk Wildspeaker – He is one of the best planeswalkers, Mana Accel, 3/3 beast maker, and overrun your team!



Primal Command - This card has so many options, all good in this deck, and amazing on turn 3, you can fetch up that Razer AND Plow Under for one. Also great to get back with Naya charm.

Oblivion Ring - Pretty much your answer to everything, especially Bitterblossom and enemy Planeswalkers

Naya Charm - Another card with many options, and can easily be cast with 1 Bloom Tender (assuming you have a R & W permanent in play). Burn a creature, Tap them out to swing for the win, or Recollect something amazing, like Primal Command or Ranger of Eos, to get amazing card advantage and more gas.

Lashout - Probably one of the best burn spells right now, its cheap, can possible do a total of 6 damage, and it allows you to scry for 1, which could be game changing when in top deck mode.

Incinerate – It’s been good since 1995

Magma Spray – Curb stomping kitchen finks since 2008

Turn to Mist - Tried, and failed
Shield of the Oversoul - Tried, and failed
Gift of the Gargantuan - Tried, and failed

More coming soon....



Lands
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Jungle Shrine - Up for the most debate since it comes in tapped, but its amazing color fixing, combined with reflecting pool, might outweigh the down side.
Reflecting Pool - Best land in standard

Brushland - Pain
Karplusan Forest - Pain
Battlefield Forge - Pain

(These do an amazing job filtering Bloom Tender mana into Figure of destiny mana
Rugged Prairie - Filter
Fire-Lit Thicket - Filter
Wooded Bastion - Filter

Forest - Some people like to play with a few of these to help the chances of first turn Birds of Paradise

Treetop Village – I wouldn’t run 4 of these with 4 Jungle Shrines, pick 1 or the other

Mutavault - A very bad choice for this deck, you need all the colored mana you can get asap

More coming soon...?


Sideboard
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Descriptions and more coming soon.....

Burrenton Forge-Tender (Firespout, RDW)

Fulminator Mage (Fae, Q&T, 5 color)

Guttural Response (Fae, Q&T, 5 color)

Elvish Hexhunter (Fae)

Stillmoon cavalier (Kithkin)

Firespout (Kithkin, Elves)

Realm Razer (4 could be too many MD, 4th should probably be in SB)



IMAGE(http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee215/Hodoku/RGW.gif)



Deck Lists



I am testing at FNM before States

creature [14]
4 Bloom Tender
4 Figure of Destiny
3 Realm Razer
4 Woolly Thoctar

Spells [11]
4 Condemn
3 Firespouts
4 Naya Charm

planeswalker [10]
4 Garruk Wildspeaker
3 Ajani Vengeant
3 Elspeth, Knight-Errant

land [24]

Turn 1 Figure
Turn 2 Bloom
Turn 3 Garruk->Untap 2->Ajani/Elspeth









Tips on playing Hellrazer:
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Only over extend if you think you can get away with it.
You can win the game with only a turn 1 figure and turn 2 bloom, or at least ride it as long as possible
Just because you can play razer on turn 3, doesn’t mean it’s the best idea.
Don’t be afraid to play the razer if only to block with it next turn, trades nicely with colossus, also think of it as a Time Walk.
Don’t forget lands come into play tapped with razer!
Don’t forget to filter that bloom tender mana to work for you!
If you (or they) kill razer before letting his trigger resolve, its an Armageddon
If you have a bloom tender out, always play permanents with your lands first!


IMAGE(http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee215/Hodoku/RGW.gif)



Tested Matchups:


IMAGE(http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee215/Hodoku/RGW.gif)



15 Deck Praises:
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Adoril20;17084916 wrote:
I dont think we are too far off a finalish general build which then can be tuned for your own meta's.

Slow;17085894 wrote:
]
the deck is pretty solid. I enjoyed the games where I got turn 2 Woolly Thoctar or Fulminator Mage.

jaslinger;17082730 wrote:
Hey guys! I've been following the development of this kick ***** deck for the last couple of weeks. Nice to see how it is progressing.

Sherpernurnun;17037546 wrote:
I was in love with Realm Razer when I first heard about it. This deck has a lot of potential in my opinion.

Oven;17037188 wrote:
Just played my first game with the deck. Ridiculous when it goes off. If they have a slow start (vivids etc) this Realm Razer just destroys them.

Axl_Strife;17025037 wrote:
I took this for a whirl on MWS just now... wow. It definitely lives up to its name and it's the stone-cold nuts when it goes off.

chrissimpson;17025516 wrote:
This deck looks sweet, and Turn to Mist is awesome tech. Good work.

THeColdBlackShadow;17027146 wrote:
I'm just really trying to make the most efficient list possible because I like it so much.

Oven;17027183 wrote:
This looks really fun. I think I'll build for it.

Trex97;17027356 wrote:
I just tested this a bit, and it seems killer. it's about time a LD deck was viable in standard again. (This is basically Land Destruction, though it could also be considered Denial.)
Thanks for a very fun list to play.

SGTDfromMA;17027378 wrote:
I just lost to QnT twice today and this deck appeared. Ah bliss.

MTG-Fan;17027451 wrote:
This deck is absolutely nuts if it goes off.

Anomander_Mike;17027459 wrote:
I really like this deck idea -- I love me some Little Kid GW(r) and land destruction so I might have to sleeve this up and take it to GP:KC to test out at a side event.

tonyadpx;17028342 wrote:
I'm convinced this is going to be a new Archetype soon.
I'm subscribing and coming back here often to see what happens next with this deck.

Edje;17028531 wrote:
If/when this deck goes large (I expect that it will and that scares me)

Momo;17029512 wrote:
I just wanted to say that I like this deck idea a lot, but I think it should speed up a bit.

In this sense I think the perfect in-between is Cosmia's list, which I wholeheartedly support.

ix_deadend's signature wrote:
TEAM FAURA

Standard
bant control
hell razer
grixis fae

Condemn should not scare this deck ... they save thier mana for Realm Razor and they lose to Thoctar, they deal with the Thoctar, figure or finks plays clean up. This deck has an extremely nice looking curve with the option to just put the game away with 1 creature.



Special Thanks
Hodoku, for the fantastic post blueprint.
Banner Credits go to Synthestruct
and
To everyone testing, without you, this deck idea would never be good
I like it generally. I feel like bloom tender might actually be a little underpowered in this deck. Everything is super efficient and then he's a 2 mana 1/1 idk. I'm not much of a fan
THIS is how every OP in this subforum should look. I applaud you sir.

I took this for a whirl on MWS just now... wow. It definitely lives up to its name and it's the stone-cold nuts when it goes off. I'd rather you go 4 Ajani/0 Gift or 4 Gift/0 Ajani. The deck definitely has enough beaters to go the distance.

Primal Command SB would be nice since you can drop it turn 3 against control, bounce a Vivid and fetch a beatstick, then follow-up with teh nutz.
firespout seems really good in the SB at least improve kithkin/fae matchup

i think you need some form of MD removal unmake, incinerate lash out or tweak the manabase and play flame javelin

gift seems bad here because there only 16 creature you really want to have past turn 3
firespout seems really good in the SB at least improve kithkin/fae matchup

i think you need some form of MD removal unmake, incinerate lash out or tweak the manabase and play flame javelin

gift seems bad here because there only 16 creature you really want to have past turn 3

Qouted for Truth.


And are you in love with figure of destiny? Does anyone else feel Boggart Ram-Gang might fit in a little better. Ram-Gang works really nice with shield. Figure not so much.

In either case, a budget deck will almost certainly opt for the Ram-Gang. Here's my budget version:



4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Llanowar+Elves" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Llanowar+Elves">Llanowar Elves</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Bloom+Tender" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Bloom+Tender">Bloom Tender</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Boggart+Ram-Gang" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Boggart+Ram-Gang">Boggart Ram-Gang</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Kitchen+Finks" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Kitchen+Finks">Kitchen Finks</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Woolly+Thoctar" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Woolly+Thoctar">Woolly Thoctar</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Realm+Razer" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Realm+Razer">Realm Razer</a>


4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Shield+of+the+Oversoul" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Shield+of+the+Oversoul">Shield of the Oversoul</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Turn+to+Mist" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Turn+to+Mist">Turn to Mist</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Incinerate" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Incinerate">Incinerate</a>




Anyway, I really like the deck dude.
Qouted for Truth.


And are you in love with figure of destiny? Does anyone else feel Boggart Ram-Gang might fit in a little better. Ram-Gang works really nice with shield. Figure not so much.

In either case, a budget deck will almost certainly opt for the Ram-Gang.

figure is rediculous with bloom tender though and the deck already has 12 spectacular sheild targets

loxodon warhammer seems really good here
no don't drop figures for ramgang no no no tisk tisk
Gift of the Gargantuan is amazing, people need to stop hating that card and actually play it. 16 targets means 1-in-4, so 1 Gift should find one, statistically, every time.

This deck looks sweet, and Turn to Mist is awesome tech. Good work.
@OP: IMO, Ajani Vengeant isn't doing anything in this list, save it's ultimate which will *never* happen. I suggest bumping Gift of the Gargantuan to 4. Also, turn to mist is bad.
---The Killers--- ()
Gift of the Gargantuan is amazing, people need to stop hating that card and actually play it. 16 targets means 1-in-4, so 1 Gift should find one, statistically, every time.

This deck looks sweet, and Turn to Mist is awesome tech. Good work.

very good card but i dislike it here

oversoul of dusk seems really good here though
very good card but i dislike it here

Why? It filters your draws, and it helps ensure you hit land drops and/or get realm razer.
oversoul of dusk seems really good here though

Yep. Turn before Real Mr. Azer seems good, basically ends the game.
EDIT: Must make decklist!
---The Killers--- ()
This is my take on "HellRazer"


4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Reflecting+Pool" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Reflecting+Pool">Reflecting Pool</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Jungle+Shrine" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Jungle+Shrine">Jungle Shrine</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wooded+Bastion" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Wooded+Bastion">Wooded Bastion</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Fire-Lit+Thicket" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Fire-Lit+Thicket">Fire-Lit Thicket</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Rugged+Prairie" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Rugged+Prairie">Rugged Prairie</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Brushland" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Brushland">Brushland</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Karplusan+Forest" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Karplusan+Forest">Karplusan Forest</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Battlefield+Forge" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Battlefield+Forge">Battlefield Forge</a>

4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Realm+Razer" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Realm+Razer">Realm Razer</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Bloom+Tender" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Bloom+Tender">Bloom Tender</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Birds+of+Paradise" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Birds+of+Paradise">Birds of Paradise</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Llanowar+Elves" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Llanowar+Elves">Llanowar Elves</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Figure+of+Destiny" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Figure+of+Destiny">Figure of Destiny</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Kitchen+Finks" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Kitchen+Finks">Kitchen Finks</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Oversoul+of+Dusk" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Oversoul+of+Dusk">Oversoul of Dusk</a>

4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Gift+of+the+Gargantuan" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Gift+of+the+Gargantuan">Gift of the Gargantuan</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Naya+Charm" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Naya+Charm">Naya Charm</a>
1 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Primal+Command" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Primal+Command">Primal Command</a>

3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Primal+Command" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Primal+Command">Primal Command</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Oblivion+Ring" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Oblivion+Ring">Oblivion Ring</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Flame+Javelin" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Flame+Javelin">Flame Javelin</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Runed+Halo" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Runed+Halo">Runed Halo</a>

Naya Charm is good. Try it.
EDIT: Double Post! Hooray.
---The Killers--- ()
Matchups
RDW - Woolly's trade with gougers nicely, post board -4 Birds +4 Forge tenders, also can easily out race with finks, they have NO answer for a woolly/razer with a shield swinging

Quick and Toast / 5 color By far the easiest match up, even w/o fulminator mages post board.

Quill Spike If razer dosent see play, figure's on thier own will win, and bloom tender with a shield can hold off a chameleon colossus all night long

Kithkin Hardest matchup so far, due to unmakes/O rings hitting things with shields. Turn to mist is great for fizzling mirror weave targets though.

Fae Coming Soon

Elves Coming Soon

So are your current matchups based on the experience at the FNM? How about indirect kill, i.e., going after your lifetotal directly? Most of your discussions are dealing with creatures versus creatures, and while that's nice, QnT and Ramp decks tend to be light on creatures, heavy on removal/countermagic. This should hurt you if a Razer never resolves and they just deathtouch Woolly to death. This deck looks very funky, very tricky, and rather fun to play, but I am wondering about its resilience to decks that are designed to take on midrange like this.
Why? It filters your draws, and it helps ensure you hit land drops and/or get realm razer.

it just seems like i would rather play threats

for some reason i feel compelled to make a vesion of this deck with a black splash for thoughtseize doran and perhaps mannequin
This is my take on "HellRazer"


4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Reflecting+Pool" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Reflecting+Pool">Reflecting Pool</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Jungle+Shrine" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Jungle+Shrine">Jungle Shrine</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wooded+Bastion" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Wooded+Bastion">Wooded Bastion</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Fire-Lit+Thicket" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Fire-Lit+Thicket">Fire-Lit Thicket</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Rugged+Prairie" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Rugged+Prairie">Rugged Prairie</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Brushland" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Brushland">Brushland</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Karplusan+Forest" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Karplusan+Forest">Karplusan Forest</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Battlefield+Forge" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Battlefield+Forge">Battlefield Forge</a>

4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Realm+Razer" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Realm+Razer">Realm Razer</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Bloom+Tender" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Bloom+Tender">Bloom Tender</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Birds+of+Paradise" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Birds+of+Paradise">Birds of Paradise</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Llanowar+Elves" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Llanowar+Elves">Llanowar Elves</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Figure+of+Destiny" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Figure+of+Destiny">Figure of Destiny</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Kitchen+Finks" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Kitchen+Finks">Kitchen Finks</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Oversoul+of+Dusk" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Oversoul+of+Dusk">Oversoul of Dusk</a>

4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Gift+of+the+Gargantuan" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Gift+of+the+Gargantuan">Gift of the Gargantuan</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Naya+Charm" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Naya+Charm">Naya Charm</a>
1 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Primal+Command" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Primal+Command">Primal Command</a>

3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Primal+Command" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Primal+Command">Primal Command</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Oblivion+Ring" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Oblivion+Ring">Oblivion Ring</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Flame+Javelin" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Flame+Javelin">Flame Javelin</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Runed+Halo" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Runed+Halo">Runed Halo</a>

Naya Charm is good. Try it.
EDIT: Double Post! Hooray.

I think it needs Ajani personally. Ajani is removal post Razer and land tapdown. Even Garruk would work here. Planeswalkers are kinda good with Razer I hear.
I think it needs Ajani personally. Ajani is removal post Razer and land tapdown. Even Garruk would work here. Planeswalkers are kinda good with Razer I hear.

It's only removal for things that razer can handle himself. Garruk is something to consider, however.
---The Killers--- ()
IMO, you probably dont want Razer to die...
I was hoping somebody was going to get something with realm razer going. Also, great job on the OP. This is EXACTLY what I think the requirements for this forum should be.

I'm nervous that this deck relies a little to heavily on realm razer though. I see instant speed removal really screwing your game-plan. Float mana, terror, your turns over and your mana's tapped out. I'd really like to see -2 Turn to Mist, +2 Chameleon Colossus or something to give that extra threat density in case the razer doesn't end up working out.

I like it generally. I feel like bloom tender might actually be a little underpowered in this deck. Everything is super efficient and then he's a 2 mana 1/1 idk. I'm not much of a fan

Agreed. I'd much rather see a Steward of Valeron in this spot. You'll still hit razer as fast in most cases (actually nearly every case), but you'll be gaining an increase in threat density and aggressive potential.
I was hoping somebody was going to get something with realm razer going. Also, great job on the OP. This is EXACTLY what I think the requirements for this forum should be.

I'm nervous that this deck relies a little to heavily on realm razer though. I see instant speed removal really screwing your game-plan. Float mana, terror, your turns over and your mana's tapped out. I'd really like to see -2 Turn to Mist, +2 Chameleon Colossus or something to give that extra threat density in case the razer doesn't end up working out.

Exactly. In my list I'm running 4 Oversoul of Dusk in that spot.

Agreed. I'd much rather see a Steward of Valeron in this spot. You'll still hit razer as fast in most cases (actually nearly every case), but you'll be gaining an increase in threat density and aggressive potential.

Steward of Valeron ≠ threat. The deck doesn't need more "threat density", with Razer and another finisher, the deck is fine. Bloom tender is better because it has the POTENTIAL of getting 2-3 mana. Turn 3 Realm Razer seems good.
---The Killers--- ()
Exactly. In my list I'm running 4 Oversoul of Dusk in that spot.


Steward of Valeron ≠ threat. The deck doesn't need more "threat density", with Razer and another finisher, the deck is fine. Bloom tender is better because it has the POTENTIAL of getting 2-3 mana. Turn 3 Realm Razer seems good.

It is not a threat persay, but it undeniably clogs up the board more than bloom tender does, and can hit some damage unlike bloom tender. hitting Razer t3 seems rather unlikely. You would need to go t1: land, FoD t2: land bloomtender t3: land, razer. I dunno, seems fairly shaky to me.

This underlies my previous argument that you agreed with. Bloom tender infers reliance on Realm Razer. It should not be. If it is, control oriented decks will have a fairly easy time picking through your strategy. Instead, it should focus on efficient beaters (steward is definately an efficient beater) with a bomb in the form of razer.
It is not a threat persay, but it undeniably clogs up the board more than bloom tender does, and can hit some damage unlike bloom tender. hitting Razer t3 seems rather unlikely. You would need to go t1: land, FoD t2: land bloomtender t3: land, razer. I dunno, seems fairly shaky to me.

This underlies my previous argument that you agreed with. Bloom tender infers reliance on Realm Razer. It should not be. If it is, control oriented decks will have a fairly easy time picking through your strategy. Instead, it should focus on efficient beaters (steward is definately an efficient beater) with a bomb in the form of razer.

bloom tender enables other crazy stuff like two three drops on turn three or razer on turn four after thoctar (win)
I guess we're arguing about consistency vs. explosiveness. I'll try to playtest both options and see how it goes.
THIS is how every OP in this subforum should look. I applaud you sir.

I took this for a whirl on MWS just now... wow. It definitely lives up to its name and it's the stone-cold nuts when it goes off..

Thank you thank you, and yes, I think this is how everyone will fall in love with the deck idea, you really got to play it to see how insane it is.

This deck does revolve around the synergy of Figure + Bloom into Razer or Woolly, followed by a Shield.

A lot of people also forget that bloom does a great job of taping for 3 after razer resolves, so you can still cast things while no one has lands.

So are your current matchups based on the experience at the FNM? How about indirect kill, i.e., going after your lifetotal directly? Most of your discussions are dealing with creatures versus creatures, and while that's nice, QnT and Ramp decks tend to be light on creatures, heavy on removal/countermagic. This should hurt you if a Razer never resolves and they just deathtouch Woolly to death. This deck looks very funky, very tricky, and rather fun to play, but I am wondering about its resilience to decks that are designed to take on midrange like this.

I'll reply to everyone else as I get a chance, probably tomorrow, and yes the match ups I posted are only from last nights experience. Woolly flies, so I don't know how they are going to death touch him :P
This deck wins the same way no matter what deck it is playing against, I don't know of any deck that can not fear a t3-4 Armageddon.

It is not a threat persay, but it undeniably clogs up the board more than bloom tender does, and can hit some damage unlike bloom tender. hitting Razer t3 seems rather unlikely. You would need to go t1: land, FoD t2: land bloomtender t3: land, razer. I dunno, seems fairly shaky to me.

Also T1 figure, T2 Bloom, T3 razer, isn't shaky, any game that happened, no matter what deck they were playing, they scoop right away. This deck does not rely on getting in 1-2 points of damage at a time, it's all or nothing, very quick. Honestly this deck would not even be possibly w/o bloom tender, its by far the MVP of the deck. W/O Realm razer, you could probably go just as solid with Jund, running Thoughtseize, Sprouting over Woolly, and HKO over Razer, but a HKO build is much weaker than an Armageddon in a body.
I guess we're arguing about consistency vs. explosiveness. I'll try to playtest both options and see how it goes.

It was very consistently explosive, if I wasn't winning with a t3/4 razer, I was winning with a t2/3 woolly, and worst case figure just got fully pumped by like turn 4 and won on his own. (For the figure pumping I mean bloom taps for 3, and you can just filter the green in one of the lands to be RR or WW)
The really only flexible part of this list IMO is the 4 slot of Gift and Ajani, they both worked nicely but could be anything, the rest of the deck though I feel is set in stone. Birds got switched out for forge tenders a lot against RDWs though
I didn't mean "shaky" in terms of "they might answer it" (which a smart player will be able to do g2 + 3). I meant, how often will that play actually occur as described? First of all you would need all those cards. Never expect to always draw a certain card. or three for that matter. Also, a player with an incinerate/broken ambitions/terror/grixis charm/jund charm/naya charm/bant charm/shock/nameless inversion/agony warp etc. etc. that has seen g1, and you have the set pieces out, will sit back to react to your 6mana potential turn. And when you don't hit that play, i.e. when razer is either answered, or you don't draw him, you're relying on a woolly thoctar (possibly) to get you the game.

Instead, I urge you to go with consistency. Steward of Valeron will still get you the Razer t4, and will provide you with an efficient beater if something should go wrong. This is the tournament center. If you're serious about playing the deck, expect to play against smart players.

Also, Mogg fanatic, played in RDW and token variants, really makes your bloomtender hurt if they know what you're up to. Steward on the other hand....

Again though, I very much like the idea, and will be playtesting.
I'll reply to everyone else as I get a chance, probably tomorrow, and yes the match ups I posted are only from last nights experience. Woolly flies, so I don't know how they are going to death touch him :P
This deck wins the same way no matter what deck it is playing against, I don't know of any deck that can not fear a t3-4 Armageddon.

I beat a RDW with my WW using one Plains for virtually all of the game and three Forge-Tenders. Why would such a deck fear Armageddon? Not that I am syaing my deck can beat yours, but some decks are designed to consider not only continuous Wrath, but continuous kill and removal. The decks of today like Elves or Ramp that use nonland resource creation like mana creatures depend less on the loss of their lands, as you yourself exploit (since your deck runs a base similar to Ramp). But decks like WW are designed to run on few creatures, constant threats for cheap, and there is no way you can stop them from floating three mana to Unmake Razer when it comes into play. I am not saying your deck is bad, but I would LOVE to see more tried and true testing methods, since that could prove this deck strongly. It's already the best use of Razer I've seen yet, and it will likely show up more in this style of deck than anything else. I also have nothing but praise for the new Ajani in such a deck as it makes it a sort of midrange/aggro-control, and I consider that the best strategy alongside resource inequality arguments that can be found also with Stoic + vigilance, etc.
it just seems that the advantages of steward is outweiged by the potential of tapping for 3 mana a turn

steward does not let you play t4 razer unless you have birds

tender is alot easier to cast

the only match-up were steward seems marginally better is Demigod Red
it just seems that the advantages of steward is outweiged by the potential of tapping for 3 mana a turn

steward does not let you play t4 razer unless you have birds

tender is alot easier to cast

the only match-up were steward seems marginally better is Demigod Red

Yea, Birds is just as fragile as bloom tender, yet birds have been a staple $10+ card since it was printed
I didn't mean "shaky" in terms of "they might answer it" (which a smart player will be able to do g2 + 3). I meant, how often will that play actually occur as described? First of all you would need all those cards. Never expect to always draw a certain card. or three for that matter. Also, a player with an incinerate/broken ambitions/terror/grixis charm/jund charm/naya charm/bant charm/shock/nameless inversion/agony warp etc. etc. that has seen g1, and you have the set pieces out, will sit back to react to your 6mana potential turn. And when you don't hit that play, i.e. when razer is either answered, or you don't draw him, you're relying on a woolly thoctar (possibly) to get you the game.

Instead, I urge you to go with consistency. Steward of Valeron will still get you the Razer t4, and will provide you with an efficient beater if something should go wrong. This is the tournament center. If you're serious about playing the deck, expect to play against smart players.

Also, Mogg fanatic, played in RDW and token variants, really makes your bloomtender hurt if they know what you're up to. Steward on the other hand....

Again though, I very much like the idea, and will be playtesting.

Short answer: Woolly, Razer, and Figure all won games on their own, most combo decks only rely on 1 or 2 cards to win, I don't see why relying on 3 amazing creatures is a bad way to go, specially when all 3 creatures get rushed and pumped out as quick possible.

The actual 3rd turn Razer only happend once, but 3rd turn swinging with shielded woolly happened a lot. Turn 4 Razer happened a ton though, so I was very happy with the turn 3/4 win consistence. Like I said, my matches all ended in like a few mins.

Not too worried about the mogg fanatics, like I said, I always boarded in 4 forge tenders over the birds if they were playing RDW. At worst they kill the bloom tender, and I just cast woolly on third turn. I played RDW twice last night, and they were actually much easier matches than kithkin.

Also not once was Razer killed last night, it never happened, even if they knew it was coming second game. Maybe it was just luck, but yea, specially on the play, they only have 2-3 mana, by the time I cast Razer, and most people don't want to not play anything on their turn 2 & 3 just to wait and see if I have a single card they fear in hand.

Sure it might be easy for the opponent to play around razer, but that would mean not tapping out for like the first handful of turns, which is such a huge tempo loss for most decks, that it would just make me win, even w/o the razer that they are holding back for
The problem I see with your deck is this, and of course your going to argue with me but other people share my point of view.

When you accelerate this fast in an aggro deck you are inviting yourself up to get totally destroyed late game. Right now you seem quite dependant on razor. And please don't give mr the thoctar argument I've heard it already. Thoctar is easy to broken ambition/terror/Removed. Your blowng out your hand and inviting them to do All the things I just listed. I strongly suggest running cards like valeron it makes your deck more consistant and stronger in the long run.
I don't wish to sound over-critical of this list. It is already very good. And in no way am I saying Not to play razer. It's an awesome card, and a house in this deck. I definitely see the advantages of bloom tender, don't get me wrong. I also think that it's a powerful card in this deck.

One thing I forgot to mention about steward, was that it's an AWESOME Shield target. I would even say a better target than finks due to the vigilance.

There may also be a middle-road between our ideas. I believe that it might be good to take out the mists and place the stewards in its stead. This way, you will ALWAYS have significant mana outside of lands, negating the need for mists in the first place. Mists also causes you to lose a turn of attacking with razer. Mana from steward and tender would allow you to play what you want without the need of removing razer. Then you also have efficient beats, resilient mana production, and the explosiveness of tender.

I see mists as very dependent on razer to be potent enough to play in this deck. I also see hairy situations, like a shielded razer can't get "mistified". Steward, on the other hand, is awesomely consistent (I've already won games because of him in testing), and explosive in its own right (shield).

With this you will be able to cast razer by t4 almost every single game.
a bit difficult to play but quite the powerhouse.

4 reflecting pool
4 brushland
4 karplusan forest
4 fire-lit thicket
4 wooded bastion
4 forest

4 birds of paradise
4 figure of destiny
4 bloom tender
4 kitchen finks
4 woolly thoctar
4 real razer

2 elspeth, knight errant
2 naya charm
4 puncture blast
4 crib swap

sideboard
3 gaddock teeg
4 vexing shusher
4 fulminator mage
2 cloudthresher
2 primal command
I also didn't want go sound overly critical. I'm just really trying to make the most efficient list possible because I like it so much. Btw very good points cosmia. Couldn't have said it better myself
Yea, Birds is just as fragile as bloom tender, yet birds have been a staple $10+ card since it was printed

And that reason is because it's a first turn play, tapping for any color. Tender is dependant on having creatures with multiple colors available, otherwise it's an expensive lawnmower. That the deck follows tender with multicolor is what helps enable it, but otherwise, dropping tender turn 2 with one mana to spare leaves you needing something for that position. The alternate is that you follow your turn 2 three drop with a Tender, but that sets you back more turns to swing with something bigger earlier, and isnt that the point? You want to get to 3-4 drop followed by Shield + "morestuff" faster, and while a Tender requires more stuff by the time it's online, things like Devoted Druid CAN get you 5 mana turn 3, but nearly all of it is green unless you're using duals.

One other major consideration: Mr Azer costs SIX, but is a 4/2. His vulnerability requires that you be able to protect him early, or use his as a blinker. In the latter, suiting him up with a Shield is counter productive to Armageddoning, in which case you no longer need to worry about swinging with it to take out their creatures, since there is no draw back to it dying (unless tou blink it again to keep taking their lands out). Suiting him up means your devoted protection to a creature that probably doesn't deserve it, since for that cost you have better things to throw a Shield on, and some of those better things survive better, and win the game faster.

Herein, the synergy should be finding way to get Razer down fast, then blinking him that turn in order to acheive the goal of wiping their game, using Ajani Vengeant for lock down and removal, and swinging through with your best [evasive] beater. Razer is a poor beast to swing with UNLESS he's suited, and that may not be good enough.
When you accelerate this fast in an aggro deck you are inviting yourself up to get totally destroyed late game. Right now you seem quite dependant on razor. And please don't give mr the thoctar argument I've heard it already. Thoctar is easy to broken ambition/terror/Removed. Your blowng out your hand and inviting them to do All the things I just listed. I strongly suggest running cards like valeron it makes your deck more consistant and stronger in the long run.

this is why i splashed black for targeted discard which is amazing against any deck with a better late game than this deck not to metion seeing their hand allows me to play around what they have, which is huge with this deck
This looks really fun. I think I'll build for it.

A couple questions / possibly suggestions:

- maybe burn in the place of Gift. Incinerate or Lash Out? Might give the deck a little more protection.

- I love Wooly Thoctar - he is awesome. But I can't help but think that Chameleon Colossus might still be better (although less good with a Shield attached). I don't know, maybe you're right though.

One reason I love this deck is that it doesn't run blue or black! I basically have all the cards (except for some of the mana base) and the rest are fairly easy to get. Seems like it could be a really effective budget deck without the FoD and Reflecting Pools.
I love this deck, I think it works great. Just yea mass removal for the sideboard and get a back up incase you lose the land remover, other than that wow. LOVE IT!!
I want to play this deck, just because the banner is awesome. :D (What did you do to get the effect on the left side behind the font?)

That was an impulsive post, I'll edit it once I've thought on the deck more. :P
The list I'd run:

Consistent yet extremely explosive

// Lands
4 [SHM] Wooded Bastion
1 [SHM] Fire-Lit Thicket
2 [EVE] Rugged Prairie
2 [9E] Battlefield Forge
3 [5E] Karplusan Forest
4 [AT] Brushland
4 [TE] Reflecting Pool
4 [ALA] Jungle Shrine

// Creatures
3 [EVE] Bloom Tender
4 [ALA] Realm Razer
2 [SHM] Oversoul of Dusk
4 [EVE] Figure of Destiny
4 [ALA] Steward of Valeron
4 [ALA] Woolly Thoctar
4 [R] Birds of Paradise
4 [SHM] Kitchen Finks

// Spells
4 [LRW] Oblivion Ring
3 [SHM] Shield of the Oversoul


The deck runs 3 bloom tenders. The reason for this is I really want to avoid drawing too many of them. Drawing multiple Stewards is fine, as its efficiency in terms of board position leaves it to be a card desired. Once you can produce 6 mana though, how many bloom tenders do you really want out there? Therefore we still have extremely explosive stuff going on here, with a decreased risk of bad draws.

The deck obviously runs 4 stewards.

Mists and Ajani have been taken out as they require Razor in order to be of much potency. Even with Razer, they're not all that great. I'd rather pull a woolly thoctar than either of them. I also took out 1 shield, as I want consistency in drawing creatures to shield, over the shield itself. Nothing is more frustrating than drawing an aura with nothing good to aurafy.

In their stead, I have placed in here 2 oversouls, and 4 O-rings. The oversouls will win you the game if you're facing anything that doesn't run white. the O-rings are for decks that Have more explosive creatures than you or planeswalkers that don't need mana to function, or anything generally.

What we have here is a deck that has essentially the same amount of explosiveness, with a VASTLY decreased chance of bad draws and inconsistency. Nothing in this deck relies on anything else. Everything is independently solid, and the numbers of each card decrease dead draws.

I'm very confident that this is the correct direction to take with this deck.