G/X Elves

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[size=7]Elves[/size]
IMAGE(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d62/OMFGPIE/GWB_Divider.gif)
IMAGE(http://resources.wizards.com/Magic/Cards/LRW/EN/Card140184.jpg)IMAGE(http://resources.wizards.com/Magic/Cards/LRW/EN/Card139683.jpg)IMAGE(http://resources.wizards.com/Magic/Cards/SHM/EN/Card153962.jpg)
IMAGE(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d62/OMFGPIE/GWB_Divider.gif)

[indent][indent][indent]Author's Note - Despite me handling and explaining a tier 1 deck, I'm not a person who actively net decks or keeps up with any major tournaments. So, if a new tournament sheds new light, please PM me so I can update this. Also feel free to PM me any changes you feel are need in the OP. Thanks - Ivy[/indent][/indent][/indent]

[indent][indent][sblock=Newest Updates: 5/11/08]






[/sblock][/indent][/indent]


[indent][indent][sblock=What is Elves?]

Well...a deck that uses elves to fight and Keebler cookies for mana (let me dream!).

Elves is a thread devoted to competitive elf decks. Currently GB is the most popular, but with Shadowmoor, GW has opened up significantly. Mono G is still played, but only by newer players and budget seekers (not the cheapest deck to build), so it will not be focused upon here in Decks to Beat.

Currently elves revolves around a lord and token nature backed by heavy beaters and removal spells, giving it a nature of a consistent aggro feel that gets stronger the later on. The cards, while self supportive, have an added bonus of tribal and even color synergy that really makes the deck shine.[/sblock][/indent][/indent]

IMAGE(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d62/OMFGPIE/GWB_Divider.gif)

[b][size=5]Cards to Use[/b][/size]

[indent][indent][sblock=Creatures]

Staples

- Llanowar Elves : A staple for all Elf decks. (GW, GB)

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- Wolf-Skull Shaman : A bear that can make bears (wolves) through tribal synergy. (GB)

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- Wren's Run Vanquisher : A 3/3 deathtouch beater for cheap. (GW, GB)

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- Imperious Perfect : The best elf lord available and a great token generator. (GW, GB)

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- Shriekmaw : Good, cheap removal with an evasive body later on. Very good for non-black match ups. (GB)

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()() - Safehold Elite : A bear that can survive to put in extra damage later on, great for stalling till you can take the win and is green and white to take advantage of certain tactics as well. (GW)

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()()() - Wilt-Leaf Cavaliers :A very solid wall/beater that has the benefit of being green and white. Generally good in all builds for it's cheap cost and bulk. (GW)

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()()() - Wilt-Leaf Liege : All GW builds should run this as it gives a huge boost to your army, stands alone as a 4/4 for 4cc, and even has an anti-discard feature built in AND it's an elf! (GW)

Optional

- Birds of Paradise : If you need more mana accel, a few of these can help. Has the benefit of color fixing and flying if pumped but will have limited use to most decks. (GW)

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- Boreal Druid : If you need more mana accel, a few of these can help. Is an elf, but only makes colorless mana which can be unhelpful in heavy color cost builds such as GW. (GB)

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- Bramblewood Paragon : A decent bear that is favorable for warrior-esque builds. (GB)

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- Tarmogoyf : One of the best 2cc cards period, but may not be the best pick for this deck despite since it is not an elf and the P/T can be unreliable. (GB)

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- Chameleon Colossus : 4/4 for 4 elf, problack, and can get HUGE. A great consideration for a lot of decks. (GB)

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- Masked Admirers : A decent 2 of that can help recover from discards, board wipes, and help fight counters. (GB)

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() - Rhys the Redeemed : a decent 1cc for 1/1 that has the advantage of being green and white. Favorable in token builds, but the abilities are a bit costly and may not be tempo friendly enough to validate him. (GW)

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- Saffi Eriksdotter : Not an elf, but has the benefit of being green and white and is not bad as a bear. This can be really handy in saving a lord from removal. (GW)

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()() - Kitchen Finks : Not an elf, but has the benefit of being green and white while also giving you a life and a decent beater/2 time chump blocker. You may not have room for this, but consider it, particularly if you have a heavy RDW meta. (GW)

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()()()()() - Oversoul of Dusk : Can win games simply by hitting the board early, but the heavy mana cost may not be worth the wait and the risk of counter. Has the added benefit of being green and white. (GW)[/sblock][/indent][/indent]


[indent][indent][sblock=Spells]

Staples

- Garruk Wildspeaker : Survives most removal, can create an army on it's own, helps untap mana, and can make a game winning pump to your army the next turn. Card is very effective but may be vulnerable to Faeries and RDW. (GB)

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- Harmonize : Helps feed the hand and ensure you're doing something productive every turn. However be wary of this card also slowing you down if you devote a turn to it and nothing else. (GB)

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- Oblivion Ring : A great general answer to most any permanent, despite being reversable. (GW)

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- Thoughtseize : Effective in disabling control and preventing troublesome 2cc drops from landing turn 2. (GB)

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- Nameless Inversion : Is effective in destroying numerous targets in the meta, particularly tribal ones, and can even on occasion pump a creature for the win. (GB)

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- Eyeblight's Ending : Can hit a lot of creatures but can backfire in a mirror match. (GB)

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- Profane Command : effective as removal, recovery from grave, hitting the dome, and sending an army with fear in for the win. A very good card for the deck of it's amazing tempo swing, but demands some mana consideration depending on the number you run. (GB)

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() - Mercy Killing : A great card for combating spot removal and generating surprise attacks/blocks. The card is a house if you have any lords or a prepped planeswalker waiting the next turn. The card can be considered situational so running 4 may not be the best idea for all decks. (GW)

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() - Shield of the Oversoul : Can be very tough for some decks to face if it lands and can sometimes spell "gg" right there. It is very synergetic with GW variants, but is vulnerable to bouncing and spot removal in response. You may not want to run too many. (GW)

Optional

- Temporal Isolation : Instant speed, cheap cost. A fairly solid pseudo removal card. A bit weak against decks that can bounce or champion though. (GW)

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- Crib Swap : Solid removal that has the added effect of RFGing the creature to prevent graveyard tactics or even get around regeneration and similar effects. However the 1/1 changeling they net can sometimes hurt your game against tribal decks and such. (GW)

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- Terror : If you feel Shriekmaw is not enough solid removal, a few of these can help but beware of a meta that has black creatures that will render this a dead card. (GB)

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- Loxodon Warhammer : Very effective with the tokens and getting past certain defenses. As good as it is though, th amount of removal in the format could have you wasting your turns attempting to equip it to something that will get to attack with it. (mono G, GW, GB)[/sblock][/indent][/indent]


[indent][indent][sblock=Lands]

Brushland : Reliable color fixing put beware of pinging damage. GW)

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Gilt-Leaf Palace : All GB variants should run 4. (GB)

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Horizon Canopy : Good color fixing, but the guaranteed ping can be dangerous. But, due to the draw ability, GW variants should consider running at least 2. (GW)

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Mutavault : A good man-land that is counted as an elf but may not be favorable for it's colorless mana it produces. It can also help fight merfolk occasionally. (GB)

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Pendelhaven : Running 1 is usually a good idea due to the amount of 1/1's you will control. (GW, GB)

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Terramorphic Exapanse : While not good for tempo, it can help mana fix as well as dig and is good for variants attempting to run basics to avoid Fulminator Mage. (GW, GB)

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Treetop Village : You should run a few man-lands in case of mass removal. Beware of tempo loss however. (GW, GB)

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Wooded Bastion : All GW variants should at least run 2. Usually it's always a welcomed dual, but can be bad if no colored mana sources are drawn early. (GW)[/sblock][/indent][/indent]


[indent][indent][sblock=Sideboard]

- Krosan Grip : The most solid Enchantment/Artifact removal there is right now. (GW, GB)

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- Raking Canopy : Great anti-faerie tech and can pretty much shut down any flying oriented deck. However it is limited use so consider less effective, but more versatile choices as well. (GW, GB)

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- Cloudthresher : Great anti-faerie tech and any deck that may be packing a heavy flyer such as Akroma, Angel of Wrath. (GW, GB)

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- Squall Line : Great anti-faerie tech and can seal the deal by hitting straight to the dome. (GW, GB)

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- Deathmark : helps fight against mirror and many other decks for really cheap. (GB)

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- Extirpate : Anti-Graveyard spell that can hose combo decks and make control think twice before playing certain spells. (GB)

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- Condemn : Cheap anti-attack removal that can hit some of the fat flyers running around and slow down aggro decks. (GW)

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- Gaddock Teeg : Helps protect against heavy board wipes, commands, and a lot of high costed instant/sorceries in control decks. Also sits as a decent 2/2 and is both green and white. (GW)

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()() - Wheel of Sun and Moon : Can stop deck out, graveyard tricks, and persist decks. (GW)

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- Harmonic Sliver : Anti-Enchantment/Artifact spell with legs. Has the downfall of potentially hitting yours however, but has the added benefit of being both green and white. (GW)

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() - Dawnglow Infusion : A few in sb can help fight RDW and many aggro decks. A rather weak spell outside of GW however. (GW)

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- Tormod's Crypt : Anti-Reveillark, Mannequin, Reanimator, and Haakon Inversion. (GW)[/sblock][/indent][/indent]



IMAGE(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d62/OMFGPIE/GWB_Divider.gif)

[size=5][color=Green]Sample Decklists[/color][/size]



[indent][indent][/indent][/indent]
[indent][indent]
IvyFanboy's GB List
[deck=Mainboard]Creatures - 23
4*Imperious Perfect
4*Llanowar Elves
4*Wolf-Skull Shaman
4*Wren's Run Vanquisher
3*Shriekmaw
2*Boreal Druids
2*Masked Admirers

Spells - 14
4*Nameless Inversion
4*Thoughtseize
3*Garruk Wildspeaker
3*Profane Command

Lands -23
7*Forest
4*Gilt-Leaf Palace
4*Llanowar Wastes
4*Swamp
3*Treetop Village
1*Pendelhaven[/deck]
[deck=Sideboard]4*Cloudthresher
4*Krosan Grip
4*Deathmark
3*Extirpate[/deck]
[/indent][/indent]
[indent][indent]
Star City Games 5k Top 4 (mono G/GW-esque)
[deck=Mainboard]Creatures - 31
4*Imperious Perfect
4*Kitchen Finks
4*Llanowar Elves
4*Safehold Elite
4*Wilt-leaf Cavaliers
4*Wilt-leaf Liege
4*Wren's Run Vanquisher
3*Heartmender

Spells - 7
4*Shield Of The Oversoul
3*Overrun

Land - 22
21*Forest
1*Pendelhaven[/deck]
[deck=Sideboard]3*Cloudthresher
3*Oversoul Of Dusk
3*Wheel Of Sun And Moon
3*Krosan Grip
3*Squall Line[/deck]
[/indent][/indent]
[indent][indent]
Star City Games 5k Top 8 (GB)
[deck=Mainboard]Creatures - 22
4*Imperious Perfect
4*Llanowar Elves
4*Tarmogoyf
4*Wren's Run Vanquisher
2*Chameleon Colossus
2*Civic Wayfinder
2*Shriekmaw

Spells - 14
4*Nameless Inversion
4*Profane Command
4*Thoughtseize
2*Garruk Wildspeaker


Lands - 24
5*Snow-covered Forest
4*Gilt-leaf Palace
4*Llanowar Wastes
4*Treetop Village
3*Snow-covered Swamp
2*Mutavault
1*Pendelhaven
1*Urborg, Tomb Of Yawgmoth[/deck]
[deck=Sideboard]4*Cloudthresher
3*Kitchen Finks
3*Primal Command
3*Squall Line
2*Shriekmaw[/deck]
[/indent][/indent]
[indent][indent]
Star City Games 5k Top 8 (GB)
[deck=Mainboard]Creatures - 20
4*Imperious Perfect
4*Llanowar Elves
4*Tarmogoyf
4*Wren's Run Vanquisher
2*Chameleon Colossus
1*Boreal Druid
1*Civic Wayfinder

Spells - 16
4*Thoughtseize
4*Nameless Inversion
3*Garruk Wildspeaker
3*Profane Command
2*Terror

Lands - 24
4*Forest
4*Gilt-leaf Palace
4*Llanowar Wastes
4*Treetop Village
3*Mutavault
3*Swamp
1*Pendelhaven
1*Urborg, Tomb Of Yawgmoth[/deck]
[deck=Sideboard]4*Cloudthresher
4*Riftsweeper
2*Squall Line
2*Primal Command
1*Kitchen Finks
1*Profane Command
1*Shriekmaw[/deck]
[/indent][/indent]
[indent][indent]
Past Versions

1st Michigan States - Dan Cato's GB List
[deck=Mainboard]Creatures - 26
4*Boreal Druid
4*Elvish Champion
4*Imperious Perfect
4*Llanowar Elves
4*Tarmogoyf
4*Wren's Run Vanquisher
2*Masked Admirers


Spells - 13
4*Eyeblight's Ending
4*Thoughtseize
3*Garruk Wildspeaker
2*Terror

Lands -21
6*Forest
4*Gilt-Leaf Palace
4*Llanowar Wastes
4*Treetop Village
2*Swamp
1*Pendelhaven[/deck]
[deck=Sideboard]4*Prowess of the Fair
3*Krosan Grip
3*Extirpate
3*Pithing Needle
2*Terror[/deck]

1st Texas States - Carl Hendrix's GB List
[deck=Mainboard]Creatures - 29
4*Elvish Champion
4*Imperious Perfect
4*Llanowar Elves
4*Thornweald Archer
4*Wren's Run Vanquisher
3*Boreal Druid
3*Masked Admirers
3*Wren's Run Packmaster

Spells - 8
4*Eyeblight's Ending
3*Garruk Wildspeaker
1*Loxodon Warhammer

Lands -23
13*Forest
4*Gilt-Leaf Palace
4*Llanowar Wastes
2*Swamp[/deck]
[deck=Sideboard]4*Deathmark
4*Prowess of the Fair
3*Essence Warden
3*Krosan Grip
1*Loxodon Warhammer[/deck]

1st Utah States - Collin McClintock's Mono G List
[deck=Mainboard]Creatures - 32
4*Boreal Druid
4*Elvish Champion
4*Imperious Perfect
4*Llanowar Elves
4*Thornweald Archer
4*Troll Ascetic
4*Wren's Run Vanquisher
2*Masked Admirers
2*Wren's Run Packmaster

Spells - 6
3*Garruk Wildspeaker
3*Loxodon Warhammer

Lands -22
19*Forest
2*Treetop Village
1*Pendelhaven[/deck]
[deck=Sideboard]4*Dodecapod
4*Pithing Needle
3*Eyes of the Wisent
3*Krosan Grip
1*Treetop Village[/deck]

1st Florida States - Conrad Jackson's GW List
[deck=Mainboard]Creatures - 30
4*Elvish Champion
4*Imperious Perfect
4*Llanowar Elves
4*Masked Admirers
4*Riftsweeper
4*Wren's Run Vanquisher
3*Boreal Druid
3*Saffi Eriksdotter

Spells - 8
4*Garruk Wildspeaker
4*Oblivion Ring

Lands -22
11*Forest
4*Arctic Flats
4*Brushland
2*Plains
1*Pendelhaven[/deck]
[deck=Sideboard]4*Naturalize
3*Eyes of the Wisent
3*Scryb Ranger
3*Pollen Lullaby
2*Dodecapod[/deck]

1st Indiana States - Josh Guibault's GB List
[deck=Mainboard]Creatures - 27
4*Imperious Perfect
4*Llanowar Elves
4*Thornweald Archer
4*Wren's Run Vanquisher
3*Boreal Druid
3*Elvish Champion
3*Masked Admirers
2*Wren's Run Packmaster

Spells - 11
4*Prowess of the Fair
3*Eyeblight's Ending
2*Garruk Wildspeaker
2*Profane Command

Lands -22
8*Forest
4*Gilt-Leaf Palace
4*Llanowar Wastes
3*Treetop Village
2*Swamp
1*Pendelhaven[/deck]
[deck=Sideboard]4*Naturalize
4*Deathmark
3*Extirpate
2*Profane Command
2*Loxodon Warhammer[/deck]

Top 8 Win a Car qualifier at GP Daytona - "Obv's" GB List
[deck=Mainboard]Creatures - 26
4*Imperious Perfect
4*Llanowar Elves
4*Thornweald Archer
4*Wren's Run Vanquisher
3*Boreal Druid
3*Masked Admirers
2*Elvish Champion
2*Wren's Run Packmaster

Spells - 11
4*Eyeblight's Ending
4*Thoughtseize
3*Garruk Wildspeaker

Lands -23
8*Forest
4*Gilt-Leaf Palace
4*Llanowar Wastes
4*Treetop Village
3*Swamp[/deck]
[deck=Sideboard]4*Eyes of the Wisent
4*Prowess of the Fair
3*Extirpate
2*Cloudthresher
2*Krosan Grip[/deck]

[/indent][/indent]

IMAGE(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d62/OMFGPIE/GWB_Divider.gif)

[b][size=5]The Variants[/b][/size]

[indent][indent][indent]Author's Note - Elves has a huge array of different paths to take and you'll find your own preferences, but for now there are certain strategies each color combination tends to follow by the general public.[/indent][/indent][/indent]


[indent][indent]
GW
Green/White takes advantage of Shadowmoor's hybrid cards as they sit conveniently well in the deck and have the amazing lord, Wilt-Leaf Liege, to help stomp opponents to the ground at alarming speeds. This variant has the fattest creatures and utilizes a few anti-death strategies such as persist, indestructible, and a few creatures to save the others to ensure you have an overwhelming army come mid-game.

When you play this build, you're often going to attempt to over extend as your deck thrives on having the biggest guys for the cheapest cost before your opponent can set up a proper defense. So, the key is to figure out some strategies to help combat strategies aimed at over extended boards and dependence on certain creatures. Have enough anti-death effects but keep in mind you still need enough creatures to work with them while still keeping a healthy mana curve. This build generally doesn't like to wait for draw to be an option, it wants to establish solid threats and keep the opponent occupied. So figure out a way to not only fight spot removal and board wipes, but also keep the flow going or even make them waste the cards and still benefit from the counter strategy despite (EX: Mercy Killing a creature targeted for death while having a lord out, making your army even bigger and having them waste a card. This results in not just trading, but you actually doubled or tripled the attack power of that one unit, thus keeping the flow going in your favor without slowing down).

The deck is pretty intense on having colored mana, so make sure your lands and mana sources all produce at least green mana to avoid missing turns waiting for a 3rd one to come by.



Author's Note - In my build you'll notice I put in Kitchen Finks. Some regard this as more of a sideboard card, but I wanted it in for the simple fact that it had persist and was gold; the fact that it netted me life was just an extra bonus. GW tends to have to fight early removal in order to still have troops around when you get to finally dropping the lords, so persist as an awesome way to make your opponent waste answers furiously before you can.
[/indent][/indent]
[indent][indent]
GB
Green/Black has been the best variant pre-Shadowmoor and unfortunately did not net much, if anything, from the new set. However it's still effective and could rise to what it was pre-Morning Tide in the meta shift.

This variant plays the typical array of green elves and taps into black for its powerful removal to remove any unwanted blockers or future attackers. Like all the elf decks, you're tying to amass an army of cheap fatties while dodging removal. The trick here is to not over extend too much and attempt to win the game off of token makers with a few beaters inbetween. Always predict the Wrath of God and have a back up plan for next turn such as Profane Command or another token generator. Masked Admirers can also help a lot with enduring counters and removal.

The deck takes on a theme of 2 (or more) for 1 cards. In other words, almost every card will do more than just trade, you'll be producing more bodies or removing enemies at the same time while also getting a body on the field. This constant tempo is the reason this deck is very hard to stop and puts a lot of decks on defense very quickly. The deck also forces opponents to deploy multiple strategies to fight you, as your threats exist as planeswalkers, beaters, token makers, and life reducing sorceries.



Author's Note - You'll notice in mine I have an extra 2 Boreal Druid. Not a huge difference, but I find having a little extra accel can really pay off for getting an early Garruk Wildspeaker and other such key cards, but can also help Profane Command.
[/indent][/indent]

IMAGE(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d62/OMFGPIE/GWB_Divider.gif)

[b][size=5]Common Debates[/b][/size]



[indent][indent]
Masked Admirers vs. Harmonize
A lot of people question the power of Masked Admirers and often suggest Harmonize in place. While both can be used, typically Admirers will always be the better option.

At first glance you count card advantage...the general purpose of using these cards. Card advantage is key to GB's survival as they don't have a recovery system as direct as GW does. Harmonize nets you 3 cards for 1 and Masked Admirers nets you 2 cards for 1; I say this because Admirers also stays as a 3/2 body as well as gives you a draw. However, Admirers can reoccur later on. A single reoccursion and successful play nets 4 cards for 2 and so on and so forth. So eventually Masked Admirers can out shine Harmonize...but still speed matters.

The next aspect is deck tempo. Elves is an aggro deck, so playing a body each turn is generally what you NEED to do to win. Harmonize generally sets you back a turn as you tap out to cast, while Admirers pulls a cantrip and gives you a 3/2 attacker/blocker to keep your speed going.

Casting success is also key. What if the card gets countered or discarded early on? Harmonize instantly becomes useless, but Masked Admirers hardly gets disabled and in fact can help fight those very strategies by forcing them to waste valuable answers to prevent you from gaining card advantage.

A small factor also to consider is what does your deck try to do? A few people will attempt to run a more "Rock"-like build and maybe have a play set of Profane Command or even Damnation; cases like these can sometimes benefit more from Harmonize.

For the most part though, Masked Admirers is better for tempo, reliability, consistency, etc...
[/indent][/indent]
[indent][indent]
Using the "Goyf"
Tarmogoyf is easily the most argued card in the entire card list. Some swear by it and others pledge to their bias against how overrated it is.

Should this card be used in all elf decks?

No, but that doesn't mean some shouldn't! While Goyf CAN be a powerhouse for a mere 2 mana, it is dependent on the graveyard being filled. The usual tactic is to run a deck like TarmoRack or RDW w/ Goyf Splash to help fill your own grave quickly while still accomplishing something.

Elves however is a bit more limited. GW has hardly any spells that go straight to grave and is completely dependent on the opponent doing it for them...I highly suggest never running Tarmogoyf in a GW build...period! However GB is open to removal and even discard. If your running a build with lots of removal and a full set of Thoughtseize, you could easily validate the card, but there's another factor to consider... what are you playing against?

Say you have a lovely Tarmogoyf and a couple of removal spells in hand opening turn. You'd probably be pretty happy...but what if this opponent is playing a control deck or using a tactic that can minimize what you can fill the grave with? You're suddenly in a place where your Goyf is a mere 1/2 or 2/3 for a long time, hardly validating him. A lot of times you'll find even normal matches will sometimes never get you past the 3/4 slump for awhile and you probably won't be dropping it turn 2 as that size. Consider you meta!

So use Tarmogoyf if you want, but always try to find a way to rule him out of the deck. If you can't find enough reasoning, keep him in there.
[/indent][/indent]
[indent][indent]
Is "Paragon" worth it?
Bramblewood Paragon sits in an odd place for competing for the 2cc slot of G/B. Her competition is Tarmogoyf, Wren's Run Vanquisher, and Wolf-Skull Shaman; making it a tough call at times. Generally what validates him being played is the amount of warriors you main. This in consequence produces a bad deck building habit, sacrificing solid cards to meet tribal synergy for a small boost. While Paragon is helpful, its ability is not so devastating that it demands a full focus around warriors.

People who run Paragon often alter their entire deck to mirror GR warriors with black as removal over red. However, the success of warriors is in the fact that the creatures are more aggressive and deal damage quickly, then red removal suddenly turns into direct damage for the win. You now have a suboptimal build running black when red does it better. The deck is now floating between two different decks. So try not to build a warrior deck to validate it, try just building G/B elves and then evaluate what you got and then see if it qualifies.

Usually it won't though. You'll usually run Vanquisher and then decide between Goyf or Wolf-Skull. But, Paragon does have one perk the others don't, it enables trample. If you happen to be running a build with more fatties than normal AND they coincidentally happen to be warriors, like Chameleon Colossus, you can then consider Paragon.

As usual, meta is a call too. If you're facing lots of burn, it may suddenly become a decision between Goyf and Paragon instead of Wolf-Skull. Wolf-Skull suffers a low P/T and is reliant on luck and time to become effective while Paragon can at least up the P/T on the next creature played (which is more than likely already in hand and gives you a reliable chance you'll at least see the ability go off unlike Wolf-Skull). You can also consider if the opponent uses chump blockers and token generators to keep you at bay. At this point, trampling may prove more efficient than trying to compete with numbers and heavier beaters.

So while it's not advised, there are exceptions.
[/indent][/indent]
Welcome to the new Decks to Beat elves thread. Enjoy.

it will take a lil while to be reupdated to Decks to Beat
I don't know if speculation will be allowed in this new thread, so I'll put my deck in a spoiler.

It looks great. Nice job, Ivy.

Is Masket Admirer's really used as much? I'd think the card images should be something like Llanowar Elves, Wren's Run Vanquisher, and Imperious Perfect. All the same, nice work.
speculation is fine, please post your lists of possible GW is you want.

As for the pic, my goal this week is to make a custom graphic to replace that...which shoulda been done half a year ago as the thread has been around for awhile and I AM a graphic designer...so yeah, go laziness!
ix_deadend's GW elves

4 reflecting pool
4 wooded bastion
4 brushland
4 treetop village
3 plains
4 forest

4 llanowar elves
4 tarmogoyf
4 safehold elite
4 imperious perfect
4 wilt-leaf cavalier
4 wilt-leaf liege
2 oversoul of dusk

4 oblivion ring
4 shield of the oversoul
3 mercy killing

sideboard
3 gaddock teeg
4 kitchen finks
3 tormod's crypt
2 krosan grip
3 squall line


ix_deadend's GB elves

4 reflecting pool
4 gilt-leaf palace
4 llanowar wastes
4 treetop village
2 swamp
5 forest

2 garruk wildspeaker

4 llanowar elves
4 wren's run vanquisher
4 wolf-skull shaman
4 imperious perfect
2 drove of elves
2 chameleon colossus
2 masked admirers
1 mirri, the cursed

3 profane command
4 thoughtseize
2 eyeblight's ending
3 nameless inversion

sideboard
4 kitchen finks
2 tormod's crypt
2 krosan grip
3 squall line
4 deathmark
well, don't worry bout that, I kinda got elves handled for everyone and this will be in DtB soon, so the best ideas will flow here as well as activity.
Here's my list:

Show


4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Gilt-Leaf+Palace" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Gilt-Leaf+Palace">Gilt-Leaf Palace</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Llanowar+Wastes" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Llanowar+Wastes">Llanowar Wastes</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Treetop+Village" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Treetop+Village">Treetop Village</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Llanowar+wastes" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Llanowar+wastes">Llanowar wastes</a>
5 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Swamp" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Swamp">Swamp</a>
6 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Forest" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Forest">Forest</a>



4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Llanowar+Elves" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Llanowar+Elves">Llanowar Elves</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wolf-Skull+Shaman" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Wolf-Skull+Shaman">Wolf-Skull Shaman</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wren%27s+Run+Vanquisher" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Wren%27s+Run+Vanquisher">Wren's Run Vanquisher</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Imperious+Perfect" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Imperious+Perfect">Imperious Perfect</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Chameleon+Colossus" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Chameleon+Colossus">Chameleon Colossus</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wilt-leaf+Liege" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Wilt-leaf+Liege">Wilt-leaf Liege</a>



4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Thoughtseize" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Thoughtseize">Thoughtseize</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Eyeblight%27s+Ending" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Eyeblight%27s+Ending">Eyeblight's Ending</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Profane+Command" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Profane+Command">Profane Command</a>



2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Loxodon+Warhammer" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Loxodon+Warhammer">Loxodon Warhammer</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Garruk%2C+Wildspeaker" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Garruk%2C+Wildspeaker">Garruk, Wildspeaker</a>

[deck=Sideboard]3 x Damnation
3 x Extirpate
3 x Cloudthresher
3 x Krosan Grip
3 x Deathmark[/deck]
why you guys don't use paragons??is it unneccesary in elves deck anymore?
Yes, it's unnecessary.
i know masked admirers has the draw and the bring back to hand ability but it costs 4 mana and thats alot for just 1 card, and harmoinize can be countered its a bit slow in my opinion both cards. Ohran Viper on the other hand is a 1/3 creature for 3 mana and has a draw ability when damage is done and has deathtouch! i mean its a draw/kinda monster removal and with 3 toughness not alot can take that down and if it can i assure you its goin with the viper =]. just a thought i like viper alot and saw it did awesome in doran so why not in elvs? mayby try to mainboard like 3? this may be good to debate.
i can consider it, but keep in mind, ohran is vunerable to a LOT of removal, incinerate, inversion, shriekmaw, etc... ohran is dependent and landing a hit to generate CA. So unlikely...


Now...with my tests of GW I'm likeing the deck, but I'm noticing some inconsistency. Mercy Killing tends to feel like a win more card, so I'm leaning to throw it in the optional list and drop it from my deck, in place I think my build will aqquire 4 vanquishers and I've been pushin the idea around to take a page from GB and run 2 admirers and see how they work out. IF I like it I'll update.
yeh that is true the viper is a target but still could be a good change. im gunna order some online and try them out. I just love the deathtouch part =].
Ugh, I'm sooo torn on what to do with mercy killing. It isn't always great, but I've won a LOT of games using this card.

With GW its generally good, but a quick removal system can stop it before my anti-death tactics really go online. So...I'm opting to simply remove the 2 birds for 2 admirers. I'm hoping the mana curve will be fine this way as I REALLY like admirers.
2 Killings at the most IMO.
My recent failure at playing GW correctly is sad. This build may seem silly, but I'm gonna give it a try.

Why is the Wilt-Leaf Cavaliers in the pic?

"Black Lotus x4, Time Walk x4. and Mox Sapphire x4?, Maybe he is running the budget version"

[center]---Standard---[/center]

Eldrazi Green

:R: Red Deck Wins :R:

:G::W: Naya :W::G::R:

---Extended---

Red Deck Wins

It's hat is sweet.
This is my version of Elves that I plan to run once SHM is legal T2

G/B Elves:

Lands:
3 Mutavault
4 Llanowar Wastes
4 Treetop Villages
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
6 Forest
4 Swamp
1 Gilt-Leaf Palace

Creatures:
2 Boreal Druids
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Wren's Run Vanquisher
3 Wolf-Skull Shaman
4 Impervious Perfect
4 Chameleon Colossus
3 Shriekmaw

Spells:
3 Garruk Wildspeaker
1 Overrun
3 Profane Command
3 Nameless Inversion
3 Eyeblight's Ending

SB:
3 Cloudthresher
3 Prowess of the Fair
3 Extirpate
3 Vexing Shusher
3 Krosan Grip



Any Comments or Suggestions would be appreciated
I'm not sure you need that much removal. Your deck seems to be inconsistent in two places, 1 Gilt-Leaf Palace and 1 Overrun? You already have 3 Garruks and having 3 more gilt-leaf's is better than a combination of 3 forests and swamps.

"Black Lotus x4, Time Walk x4. and Mox Sapphire x4?, Maybe he is running the budget version"

[center]---Standard---[/center]

Eldrazi Green

:R: Red Deck Wins :R:

:G::W: Naya :W::G::R:

---Extended---

Red Deck Wins

i never get why people play 3 garruk wildspeaker* [one of my fav cards] in 3's and 1 random overrun? newsflash people Garruk can be Overrun after its been out for 1 turn. play 4 garruks, makes tokens, untaps lands, and of course Overun... my favorite card from lowryn
Do you know that if two Garruks are on the board, they destroy each other as a State-Based Effect?

That's why we play 3.
Lol.

"Black Lotus x4, Time Walk x4. and Mox Sapphire x4?, Maybe he is running the budget version"

[center]---Standard---[/center]

Eldrazi Green

:R: Red Deck Wins :R:

:G::W: Naya :W::G::R:

---Extended---

Red Deck Wins

if you use garruk to overrun and kill garruk u have 3 more ready in ur mainboard.
It's still not a good thing to draw into several of them, especially in your opening hand.
i suppose you are right. but overrun costs 5 even if u have garruk use overrun and then play another then ur set. i mean even if u have an extra in ur hand its good to have a backup since ur opponent probably doest want you to have garruk on the field
Oh, I'm not advocating playing Overrun in this deck, I'm just against playing 4 Garruks. I think Overrun is a bad card because it can be a terrible topdeck in many situations.
i agree.
Here's my list:

Show


4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Gilt-Leaf+Palace" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Gilt-Leaf+Palace">Gilt-Leaf Palace</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Llanowar+Wastes" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Llanowar+Wastes">Llanowar Wastes</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Treetop+Village" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Treetop+Village">Treetop Village</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Llanowar+wastes" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Llanowar+wastes">Llanowar wastes</a>
5 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Swamp" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Swamp">Swamp</a>
6 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Forest" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Forest">Forest</a>



4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Llanowar+Elves" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Llanowar+Elves">Llanowar Elves</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wolf-Skull+Shaman" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Wolf-Skull+Shaman">Wolf-Skull Shaman</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wren%27s+Run+Vanquisher" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Wren%27s+Run+Vanquisher">Wren's Run Vanquisher</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Imperious+Perfect" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Imperious+Perfect">Imperious Perfect</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Chameleon+Colossus" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Chameleon+Colossus">Chameleon Colossus</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wilt-leaf+Liege" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Wilt-leaf+Liege">Wilt-leaf Liege</a>



4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Thoughtseize" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Thoughtseize">Thoughtseize</a>
4 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Eyeblight%27s+Ending" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Eyeblight%27s+Ending">Eyeblight's Ending</a>
2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Profane+Command" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Profane+Command">Profane Command</a>



2 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Loxodon+Warhammer" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Loxodon+Warhammer">Loxodon Warhammer</a>
3 x <a href="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Garruk%2C+Wildspeaker" class="autocard-link" data-image-url="http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&amp;name=Garruk%2C+Wildspeaker">Garruk, Wildspeaker</a>

[deck=Sideboard]3 x Damnation
3 x Extirpate
3 x Cloudthresher
3 x Krosan Grip
3 x Deathmark[/deck]

I find it odd that you're using 4x Liege in a / build...I mean, it's still good, but...Also, I'm not sure about the 3x Garruk...I've tested him in Elves before, and I'm just not sure I like him all that much.
Yeah, don't know why you have Leige's... They're meant for G/W; G/B doesn't get his full ability. Maybe replace him (Bramblewood Paragon, Masked Admirers, Wren's Run Packmaster, Boreal Druid even, Shriekmaw).

"Black Lotus x4, Time Walk x4. and Mox Sapphire x4?, Maybe he is running the budget version"

[center]---Standard---[/center]

Eldrazi Green

:R: Red Deck Wins :R:

:G::W: Naya :W::G::R:

---Extended---

Red Deck Wins

Critique



[deck=Sideboard]
4* Naturalize
3* Raking Canopy
3* Extirpate
3* Cloudthresher
2* Damnation
15 Sideboard Cards
[/deck]

"Black Lotus x4, Time Walk x4. and Mox Sapphire x4?, Maybe he is running the budget version"

[center]---Standard---[/center]

Eldrazi Green

:R: Red Deck Wins :R:

:G::W: Naya :W::G::R:

---Extended---

Red Deck Wins

Why do you need thoughtseize in the mainboard?
cause thoughtseize=broken. lol
-------------------------------
this deck is a lil off topic but its elf and its g/b so here we go

G/b Elf Aggro/Hand Control



my new decklist inspired by my love of hand control
the point of the deck is simple and straightforward
Discard their WHOLE hand. keep them top decking
and beatem up terribly with no options.
Tarmogoyf is a beast because u will be discarding so many different types of cards right off the bat!
boreal druid can be replaced with masked admirers or harmonize or ohran viper
i was mayby thinkin about stupor.
hypnotic is good against blockin/killin faeries.
4x hypnotic 4x mind shatter 4x thoughtseize = NO HAND EVER!
Garruk = overrun finisher / untap for mind shatter and to help pay
for high creature costs.
boreal and llanowar makes mind shatter fast and very deadly early game.
after i get rid of their hand (their creatures ) i use lilianas -8 to play all creatures into my control! 60 card deck rate/fix


Creatures
---------
4x Hypnotic Spector
4x Imperous Perfect
4x Tarmogoyf
4x Wren's Run Vanquisher
4x Boreal Druid
4x Llanowar Elf


Other Spells
------------
3x Garruk Wildspeaker
4x Thoughtseize
4x Mind Shatter
1x Liliana Vess

Mana
-----
9x Swamp
4x Treetop Village
4x Llanowar Wastes
4x Gilt Leaf Palace
2x Urborg, Tomb Of Yawgmoth
1x Pendlehaven



workin on amazing sideboard with 4x extripate to really put an end to my opponents threats!
I find it odd that you're using 4x Liege in a / build...I mean, it's still good, but...Also, I'm not sure about the 3x Garruk...I've tested him in Elves before, and I'm just not sure I like him all that much.

Actually I'm only running 3x Liege. He's a 4/4 for 4 with a sometimes devastating ability that's also a Glorious Anthem. I don't get why the Liege gets the hate in GB builds, obviously +2/+2 is better than +1/+1, but it's not like GB runs Black creatures so the Liege will still give a pump 100% of the time. There's a good argument for why Colossus>Liege in GB, but I run both so w/e.

Also, Garruk is a house. Many, many Elf players can attest to that.
I'm not convinced that Liege is better than Colossus or Packmaster for GB, and those are what he is directly competing with
I'm not convinced that Liege is better than Colossus or Packmaster for GB, and those are what he is directly competing with

Packmaster is out of contest since he really is worse than both. That said, I have no idea of why one would run Liege over Colossus in a BG build.
Packmaster is out of contest since he really is worse than both. That said, I have no idea of why one would run Liege over Colossus in a BG build.

Yeah, I agree. I think the spot that Liege really competes for is Masked Admirers'.
Uhh... Packmaster is good...

"Black Lotus x4, Time Walk x4. and Mox Sapphire x4?, Maybe he is running the budget version"

[center]---Standard---[/center]

Eldrazi Green

:R: Red Deck Wins :R:

:G::W: Naya :W::G::R:

---Extended---

Red Deck Wins

cause thoughtseize=broken. lol
-------------------------------
this deck is a lil off topic but its elf and its g/b so here we go

G/b Elf Aggro/Hand Control



my new decklist inspired by my love of hand control
the point of the deck is simple and straightforward
Discard their WHOLE hand. keep them top decking
and beatem up terribly with no options.
Tarmogoyf is a beast because u will be discarding so many different types of cards right off the bat!
boreal druid can be replaced with masked admirers or harmonize or ohran viper
i was mayby thinkin about stupor.
hypnotic is good against blockin/killin faeries.
4x hypnotic 4x mind shatter 4x thoughtseize = NO HAND EVER!
Garruk = overrun finisher / untap for mind shatter and to help pay
for high creature costs.
boreal and llanowar makes mind shatter fast and very deadly early game.
after i get rid of their hand (their creatures ) i use lilianas -8 to play all creatures into my control! 60 card deck rate/fix


Creatures
---------
4x Hypnotic Spector
4x Imperous Perfect
4x Tarmogoyf
4x Wren's Run Vanquisher
4x Boreal Druid
4x Llanowar Elf


Other Spells
------------
3x Garruk Wildspeaker
4x Thoughtseize
4x Mind Shatter
1x Liliana Vess

Mana
-----
9x Swamp
4x Treetop Village
4x Llanowar Wastes
4x Gilt Leaf Palace
2x Urborg, Tomb Of Yawgmoth
1x Pendlehaven



workin on amazing sideboard with 4x extripate to really put an end to my opponents threats!

Yes, run Stupor, It's very good.

"Black Lotus x4, Time Walk x4. and Mox Sapphire x4?, Maybe he is running the budget version"

[center]---Standard---[/center]

Eldrazi Green

:R: Red Deck Wins :R:

:G::W: Naya :W::G::R:

---Extended---

Red Deck Wins

im thinkin about maining the extirpates.