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XD Reply sent, Mumakil.

Okay we actually have 7 people:

Slot 1) Gunrock (Tracker)
Slot 2) Toptomcat (Space Marine)
Slot 3) Ymdar (Space Marine)
Slot 4) Skrittiblak (Inquisitor)
Slot 5) Ltdeathsauce (Space Marine)
Slot 6) Lord__McCragge=ASP= (Space Marine)
Slot 7) Mumakil (Commisar or Space Marine)
Slot 8) OPEN!

I'll open an 8th slot. I'm hoping that the 8th player will be Marine, that way we will have 5 or 6 marines (which is about a squad). So, I have posted the thread up at this URL. Post your character sheets.

The fight for the Emperor's soul:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=403873

M4d n1nj4 3di7z:
Skritti's right. I have effectivly de-railed this thread. All questions about the game, character sheets. Meaningless chatter, etc should be posted in the pregame setup thread.
Right, sorry skritti
Nit-pick: the bonus the Occulobe grants to Spot checks should probably be racial, not innate.
I can't play, but would like the adventure, once you're done writing/playing it-my group (by virtue of living within a block of each other), can manage 8 hour sessions-so writing that ammount of material every week can be a real killer!
Nit-pick #2: the vehicles all have maximum Hit Points for their Hit Dice. Is that intentional?
TopT's nitpicks...

1.) You are probably correct, since its a racial trait... I can change that.

2.) That's intentional. I've altered War Machines to make them functionally more similar to Starships.
dont know if you know this already, but the "other war machines" section is a little funky.

the title for the page is imperial war machines, and the Tetra's make a reference to Khans giving strength boni after their stat block.

cheers


EDIT:
also, the vehicle main page is titled "starships of the dark millenium"
Will there be a "Creatures" section or something similar, covering all kind of nasties like Tyranids, Daemons, etc. ?
I'd really like to see d20 stats for the Lord of Change and Eldar Avatar :D
Yeah. Page-title problems are a problem. Other areas:
The Mutation General Rules and Formats page is titled Hiding Physical Deformities.
I'll edit this to include more when you get your bandwidth back. :D
I love what Skritti has written, but i feel a little lost (i have to wait gamemastering in my group since we´re occupied with playing an other campaign)...i miss the old cash-counting for instance...it may be nostalgia, but keeping track of money was easier for me. And the armor-system is very complicated....my wishes would be that items should have an alternate price in credits/dollars whatever and that the ranged-combat armor system is broken down in a easier manageable way...but maybe i ask to much.
Are you guys having problems with bandwidth?
I have two extra 100 megabytes web space that is basically empty. The PHP/MySQL database is a nazi, but I don't think that matters for you. The URL is like:

http://lonesoldier.freespaces.com/ (This has my name, not as good)
http://worldforge.freecoolsite.com/ (Better)

I do not use these any more. If you want to move in, just ask and I'll clean out my old web page and you can just import your files in.

Worldforge, the second URL, supports FTP!!! I think you need FTP.
Hey Skrittiblak, are you going to make stats for the Tau's armor or the drones that the Tau use? I can post the non d20 stats if you want.
A few comments and questions about Ogryn.

First they seem nearly unplayable. Not because they are over-powered, but because they are severely penalized for very little gain. It looks as though you have based them on Ogres, but have an additional -4 to their Wisdom. They may not be intelligent, nor socially adept, but they are competent warriors. You even have some as bodyguards for hq units (I forget the name of the Ogryn bodyguard and the Catachan Special Character he guards).

As written they gain +0 overall for their stats. Anyone whose played an Ogre and didn't roll six eighteens knows that a -4 to Int and Cha is a huge step to overcome, and adding a -4 to their remaining mental stat almost guarantees that they won't see the light of play.

Another thing is that in modern creatures who are played by PCs receive no Racial HD, they simply use the LA given. You would still receive the BAB and Saves from those Monstrous HD, you would simply gain them as Racial Bonuses. Putting them on Racial HD and the level adjustment gives makes their Stat situation even more apparent. I couldn't justify to myself playing an Ogryn with one level of a class compared to an Imperial Guardsman with his standard issue flashlight and pointy stick.

Also by penalizing their Wisdom you make anyone who thinks of playing one nearly incapable of getting burst fire (Wis 13 needed). As they receive Ripper Gun Proficiency, which only fires on Auto, it would be nice to have Burst Fire as an option. In addition to this you may wish to give them Advanced Firearms Proficiency as a bonus feat. The reasoning behind this is that the Ripper Gun fires only on auto, plus this way Ogryns needn't gain proficiency with all firearms (by taking PFP) in order to utilize their preferred weapon to it's fullest. This will aid them in gaining more melee oriented feats to accentuate their high strength.

I've tried making an Ogryn in a few different ways, all based on a 32 point buy. In order to make one who can tie his own shoes, my Physical Stats suffered horribly. Even in 40k you need a Cha higher than 6, and to make yourself useful you need a usable intelligence and wisdom for making decisions. By removing the penalty to Wisdom this will be mostly cured.

Another thing is their Charisma. It isn't strictly their physical beauty, but their Physical Presence and confidence in themselves. You could remove the negative 4 to Charisma and replace it with penalties to dealing with non-Ogryns in social situations. That way the big powerful Ogryn with his Ripper Gun can still Intimidate the gretchin with a dagger. Ogryn shouldn't be penalized on their Cha for the same reason Orks gain bonuses. It's the Orks confidence in himself and his ability to cow the rest into following him that grants him that bonus to Cha.

You may also wish to consider allowing them the human skill points per level as they are mutations of humans, aren't they? I've never flipped through a Guard codex to check. In all the builds I made for an Ogryn I was trying to get it into the Thrasher Advanced Class (A natural for the Ogryn right?). It took a full SIX levels of Tough in addition to their Racial HD and Level Adjustment just to Qualify for it. I had the 6 ranks in Concentration (Tough ONLY) and Survival. He also had another 4 skill points remaining and spent them on Spot. So at eleventh level he could get his first level in an advanced class? That just seems wrong. Due to their lack of skill points and Intelligence penalty Ogryns will not be able to enter any advanced class before tenth effective level. This, of course, is going on the assumption of most advanced classes requiring 6 skill points in multiple (2+) skills to enter. There are some like Soldier that work off of 3 skill points. Soldier is made for Strong characters to get into as soon as possible and so take into account their pitiful skill points per level so the prerequisite number is lessened to 3.
Characters should be able to gain an advanced class by taking three classes and penalizing all of a races mental stats veritably insures thay won't be able to.


Again trying to base Ogryn off Ogres, I think their Con could stand to be +8. Don't all Ogryn have multiple wounds in 40k? 2 or four? I know the special one may be an exception, but I believe he does have 3 or four wounds. That deserves a substantial constitution increase to represent. They should also average out stronger and tougher than any space marine.


Finally their Str should be able to make them simply stronger than any human and space marine. Giving them a +12 to Str will allow them to supercede any human's starting stat on a point buy just b leaving it as an 8 in the str (giving them a 20). That seems a little more appropriate for their Strength. This will also keep their natural Strength above that of Space Marines in their power armor. As it should be. Though they could easily be monstrously powerful, they will then lose out on their other stats by pumping so many points into str. As for rolling their stats up, keep in mind the rest of the players will be rolling their stats too. So SMs with natural 22 strs won't be too uncommon. That's then a 24 in their armor, well the Ogryn is still over powering them at 30 cause he rolled an 18 too.

In short Ogryn are too difficult to make into a playable character that can still take advantage of their High Strength Bonus. STR should not be their dump stat, just so they can make halfway intelligent decisions.


Taking a 32 point buy to make an Ogryn as they are currently:

Str: 25 (8pts)
Dex: 10 (4pts)
Con: 19 (8pts)
Int: 8 (4pts)
Wis: 10 (6pts)
Cha: 6 (2pts)

Boo. He's no Stronger or Tougher than any self-respecting space marine. He's alos horribly inept at carrying himself with any confidence.

Taking a 32 Point Buy to make an Ogryn with the changes I've suggested:

Str: 26 (6pts)
Dex: 10 (4pts)
Con: 23 (8pts)
Int: 8 (4pts)
Wis: 14 (6pts)
Cha: 12 (4 pts)

That looks more respectable. He'll average out stronger than Space Marines in their armor, as they should be yeah? He still won't be as tough as a SM in his armor, but that could be remedied by boosting his con bonus to +10. I'd reccomend keeping it at +8 though, so that players won't focus completely on horrific str values. ;) He hasn't the hand-eye coordination they do, but he can represent a cunning challenge to face by having a high enough Wisdom to be such an adversary to Eldar and Chaos Marines.

So overall they would be gaining the following stat bonuses:
Str +12
Dex -2
Con +8
Int -4
Wis +0
Cha +0

They'd retain their DR of 10 / +2, Large Size, Ripper Gun Proficiency, and gain Advanced Firearms Proficiency. All totaled I could see a +2 Racial to hit and +3 Racial to fortitude saves as being just fine for a level adjustment of 3-4.
+14 overall stat increase, but they take negatives to specific interaction skills with races other than their own.
Racial bonuses to hit and fort and Racial bonus feats.....
I could see a Level Adjustment of Four. Their high str and racial to hit will keep them in the game for making serious combatants, while keeping them from being overly powerful.


Okay...that's my thoughts on Ogryn. Now to branch off, not too far, to the Tough Characters new DR system. I came to a quandry while making so many Tough Ogryn characters. How does a creature's natural DR work with a Tough character's Talent?
I'm a Tough Ogryn and I have Tough's DR 4 / +3, so am I stuck with that over my 10 / +2? Or does the DR 4 stack with my DR 10, and the DRP +3 now replaces my original DRP +2?
That would stand to make the most sense. The DR value stacks with the creatures natural DR value. And once the DRP value from the Tough Talent surpasses the creatures natural DRP value it replaces it.
So Ogryn at with each DR Talent:
DR 2 / +1 would boost the Ogryn's to: DR 12 / +2
DR 4 / +3 would boost the Ogryn's to: DR 14 / +3
DR 6 / +5 would boost the Ogryn's to: DR 16 / +5
It's simplistic and works across the board with any creature's starting DR and DRP values.

I'll comment on other things as I read through them. I'd like to see the Ogryn approach a playable race and be good at what they are supposed to be good at. I. E. they tear through enemies in melee as few others can.
Just read this from xrp3_robot:

Hey Skrittiblak, are you going to make stats for the Tau's armor or the drones that the Tau use? I can post the non d20 stats if you want.

NO!
BAD Robot!
Do not post any stats from Warhammer. Games Workshop gets EXTREMELY angry when people do this. They WILL get involved too. They have shut down many forums for doing such things in the past. Please share these stats with Skritti, or anyone else, over an IM system or through e-mail. Don't tease the hungry bear with a t-bone wrapped around your arm.
NO!
BAD Robot!
Do not post any stats from Warhammer. Games Workshop gets EXTREMELY angry when people do this. They WILL get involved too. They have shut down many forums for doing such things in the past. Please share these stats with Skritti, or anyone else, over an IM system or through e-mail. Don't tease the hungry bear with a t-bone wrapped around your arm.

Alright, you don't have to yell. I was going to post stats only if Skrittiblak didn't have the Tau codex. But it would be better to pass them along in yahoo messenger or in an e-mail.
I'm looking at the weapons and I'm seeing the damage types and I am confused. Ballistic damage no longer exists. Why is that?

Many weapons do "Energy" damage. What type of energy? Is it the type most favorable to the target (i.e. I have acid resistance so it counts as acid energy) or is it a generic type that overcomes all ressitances? If it is the latter, why do you tempt Tough heroes into wasting a talent on a useless ressitance?

Explosive type damage. In the d20 modern Core rulebook all non-shrapnel explosives do Concussion type damage. Did you simply rename the type, or is this an actual change to the rules (i.e. would concussion resistance still apply)?

Also, Atomic energy. Is that because you want nothing to resist those weapons? If so, why not have them do an undescribed type of damage (like the Disruptors from d20 Future)?
Sorry xrp3_robot, didn't mean to sound hostile. I just wanted to make sure you didn't post them. It'd be a shame to lose this board over something like that.


Back to Skritti's Warhammer 40K d20:

Alternate Races; Races of the Imperium.

I like how the Sisters of Battle have been done, but you may consider a +3 Level Adjustment to them. They are receiving all the bonus feats that Space Marines do, and so have quite an advantage over regular characters. At Eighth level (been building most of these things at the same level our game will run at) a SOB whose Occupation grants her a Feat will have 14 Feats . Even Space Marines end up with Eleven. If not for the bonus feats then for the Monk AC bonus, that applies in all armors (As the Sister's Faith should). I really like this idea, but it does help to make a SOB that much more survivable than your average joe (Especially under an Armor = DR system).


Ratlings:

These would work best if setup mechanically as Halflings are. Small, +2 Dex -2 Str.
+2 on Climb and Move Silently makes sense, but to make those permanent class skills is too much. Just give them the bonus because they are inherently good at these two skills.
Give them a +2 to fortitude saves versus Poisons and Diseases (No Luck bonus to saves like Halflings).
Keep em small.
This would make them a playable race. As it is the Con Penalty, more than the Str, makes their Damage Threshold FAR too low to be played seriously with any kind of combat.


Squats:

Ah Squats.
+2 Str , -2 Dex , +2 Con , -2 Charisma
They are shorter than humans and walk around with Heavy Weaponry like it's nothing, they deserve a Str Boost of some kind.
They should also get Stability.


Officio Assassinorum Operatives:

They're cool, but not that cool.
They're about as strong as a SM in his power armor, so +6 Str.
They're as coordinated as a SM as well, but they're extra dodgy. So a +6 Dex, along with that +4 Dodge Bonus (whenever not flat-footed or helpless) and the bonus to Initiative of +4 would be fine.
They do have multiple wounds, mostly to keep from seeing grown men cry as their beloved 100+ pt model is layed low by a single lasgun butt to the face from an IG mook. +6 Con here will be fine.
Intelligence is about a +4.
Wisdom should be at a +4. This more than their Intelligence aids the Assassins in their fights.
Charisma should be a +4.
Give each Temple a further Stat bonuses appropriate to their temple.
They should not receive proficiency with all weapons. They should receive Personal Firearms, Advanced Melee Weapons, Light Armor, Oathbound and Iron Will.
They Must select an appropriate Allegiance with Oathbound.
Starting Feats: 2


Level Adjustment: Assassins should have a Level Adjustment between 6 and 8. I'll come back to this later after more thought, and reading through the appropriate books about determining LAs.
They all recevie +30-34 for stat adjustments (The Culexus may be different), gain 5 bonus feats, and each has a number of abilities that are taught to them by their temples.


Temples:

Callidus:
Cha +4 as the masters of Infiltration and Deception that is justified.
Racial Bonus to Disguise, Bluff, Gather Information, Jump and Tumble of +4.
Can always take ten on Tumble, Disguise and Bluff checks even when under duress, or otherwise not allowed to.

Receives Proficiency with C'Tan Phaseblades (This should certainly be a restricted Weapon Feat, much the way Power Fist weapons are).

C'Tan Phaseblade: Purchase DC: 40 Requisition ONLY (And only one at a time)
Light Melee Weapon
Deals 4d8 DRP +5 Critical of (19-20) 2
Ignores 5 points of Hardness.


Proficiency with Neural Shredder Special Weapon: Purchase DC: 35

Size: Medium
Single Shot
Range: 20' cone
Damage: 6d6 Will Save (DC 18) for Half.
Has enough chrages Per Fuel Cell to fire Five shots.

Poison Blades: Purchase DC: 25
Advanced Melee Weapon, no further Proficiencies needed.
Light Melee Weapon.
Deals 2d10 Damage DPR +1
Critical of (19-20) 2.
Each hit that damages an opponent forces a DC 16 Fortitude Save. Initial Damage of 1d10 Str; Secondary Damage of 1d10 Con.
The blade requires re-coating after Three Successful Hits, whether they damage the opponent or not. These blades are typically wielded in addition to a C'Tan Phaseblade, though not necessarily at the same time.
This way they'll get three hits to make the poison work it's magic and can't reapply it very readily in a fight (unless you're crafty ;) ).

Eversor:
No further Stat Mods
Gains an Ability Boost special ability, due to the system that pumps all those drugs and such into his body making him the flailing circle of death.
Useable a number of times per day equal to his ECL + Con Modifier. So it is useable a fair number of times per day.
Ability Surge Gains the Following Stat Increases:
+4 Str, +4 Dex, +4 Con
The Eversor also gains a bonus to Speed of 10'
Lasts for a number of rounds equal to 4 + New Con Modifier.
At the end of each use the Eversor Assassin is Fatigued.
May Use One Ability Surge per encounter. Eversor Assassins may Use another ability surge when Fatigued but become Exhausted when the surge ends.
If used when they are Exhausted they must pass a Fortitude Save (DC: 25 + 2 per consecutive use while still exhausted ) or immediately drop to Zero Hit Points as the drugs overhwelm their system.
Once an Eversor Assassin's HP drop to -10 or lower their body immediately explodes (for whatever reason; I've never known exactly why).
Immediately upon reaching -10 HP or lower, the Eversor's Body explodes in a Fifteen Foot Radius. This explosion deals X d10 Damage to all in the burst where X is equal to the Eversor's Level (not ECL) (DRP of Zero).
All Eversor Assassins have Two-Weapon Fighting as a bnous feat (They must still meet the prereqs on this one though).
Eversor Assassins receive an Exotic Melee Proficiency with the Neuro Gauntlet.
This is a One-Handed weapon that can be used with Weapon Finesse. It operates as a Power Weapon with DRP of 5. It deals 5d6 points of damage and ignores Ten Points of Hardness. And has a critical threat range of (19-20) 2.



Vindicare: The quintessential Sniper.
Dex +4
Vindicare Assassin's Gain access to the Exitus Rifle and Pistol, as well as specialized ammunitions.
Whenver the Vindicare uses a ranged weapon with which he is proficient he treats the weapon as having a threat range of 1pt more (20 becomes 19-20, 19-20 would become 18-20) and the multiplier increases by one.

Spy Mask: (Couldn't they have thought of a better name for this?)
Optics in the suit reduce the cover bonus to AC of anything the Vindicare targets by 2. This does NOT work if the target has Full Cover.
Contains a HUD.
The Spymask also incorporates Targeting Software of +2, a rangefinding and electro-optical binoculars (Which count as Rangefinding and EO scopes for both the Exitus Rifle and Exitus Pistol.

Stealth Suit:
This Chameleonic Suit grants the following benefits to a Vindicare Assassin at all times.
+8 on Hide Checks.
1/4 Cover to AC only (not Reflex Saves). If the Vindicare is already behind cover the suit improves his cover bonus to AC by +2.

Marksmen:
May make a knowledge Tactics check to determine targets of value. The Assassin may take a Full-Round action to use the optics in his mask to view and identify all potential targets and their worth (i.e. who is in charge, who is using the Lascannon sitting on the table, etc.).

Assassin:
Any massive damage save forced by a Vindicare with a ranged weapon (excluding explosives like Krak Missiles and Frag Missiles and such) has a DC equal to the 5 + Damage Dealt.

Exitus Rifle: Purchase DC: 45
Ten Round Box, Single Shot ONLY.
Range Increment (prior to scopes) of 120'
Damage: 4d10 DRP +5
Critical Threat of x2 (In the Vindicare's hands it is 19-20 x3)
Size: Large
This Weapon has Adjustable Fittings and a Scope Mount. Any scope mounted must link up to the Spy Mask HUD. Comes with a Video Scope that links to the Spy Mask HUD.
Also contains a Variation on the Voice Recognition System. Each Exitus rifle is fitted to it's user. It IDs the person attempting to use it by their genes and will only operate with it's intended user.

Specialized Ammunition:
May Requisition these from the Temple Armory.
***WARNING*** GMs should not dole these out to Vindicares, be they PCs or NPCs.
These Rounds are available only to Vindicare Assassins through their temple and will only work when fired from an Exitus Rifle. They may not be further modified.


Shield Breaker:
This Round Deals 4d10
It ignores All Cover Bonuses to AC (Target may still have concealment from Total Cover).
It also ignores any and all AC and DR from Psychic Shielding, Force Fields, and What have you.
Basically the target receives his Class Bonus and other appropriate modifiers such as Dex, or Con for Thrashers, or Dex plus Wis for Sisters of Battle, and so on.


Turbo-Penetrator:
This Round Deals 8d10 But CANNOT Crit.
If this round is used to target a vehicle it ignores an amount of hardness equal to the damage rolled.


Hellfire:
This round is treated as being a Mater Work Round of +3 To Hit / +3 To DMG
It therefore deals 4d10+3 DRP +5
If the Vindicare succeeds on the attack roll with this round the target will take another 2d10 DRP +5 on the next round.


Exitus Pistol: Purchase DC: 30
Twelve Round Box, Semi-Automatic
Range Increment (prior to scopes) of 50'
Damage: 2d12 DRP +5
Critical Threat of x2 (In the Vindicare's hands it is 19-20 x3)
Size: Medium
This Weapon has a scope mount. Any scope mounted must link up to the Spy Mask HUD.


The Assassins NEED to be differentiated more to reflect their different purposes.



I'll have to comment on the Eversor when I have fully read the Psychic Sections. Again let me know what your thoughts are.
Ikkaan
d20 Future has a Purchase DC to $ conversion system you can use. I believe it is in the SRD. If it isn't I can PM you a copy of this table.

lonesoldier
I am in fact having terrible bandwidth difficulties with my new website. I went from being hosted by McGill Uni when I was a student to quickly scrapping together a Geocities site since they stopped hosting me without warning. I need to redesign the site for navigability. I would be very interested in some alternate hosting plans. You have my email address so you can email me with any advice.

xrp3_robot
I have the Tau codex (and every other except the new Chaos one) and the Tau section including their various armours, gun drones, equipment, sample NPCs and history is all done. Its not uploaded yet because I don't have the space and because I need to modify some things as the Tau section was written in Uni for Edition 1 of d20-40k and a couple of things have changed.

The same goes for the following sections: Necrons, Orks, Assassins, Tyranids, Eldar, Animals & Monsters. Animals & Monsters is being based largely on the 'creature-feature' section of the new 40k website. Some of those critters are quite cool. Also old classics like the Ambull and Necromunda Ripperjack are there.

I apologize for not having added these sections yet. Its been nearly a month since I last did a major update, but I'm finding it more difficult to find time these days.

Lord__McCragge=ASP=
Ogryns.... I hadn't realized how harsh the Wisdom penalty was. I'll certainly reconsider it. There is currently a character playing an Ogryn in the game Dark Millenium being run on Real Adventures, and he seems to have been able to play him without any significant difficulties.

Natural Armour (and I thought I wrote this in the guide to DR/DRT system but perhaps not) stacks by taking upper DRT values and aggregate DR values. That means 3/+2 stacks with 4/+3 by becoming 7/+3. You guessed correctly when you noted:
DR 2 / +1 would boost the Ogryn's to: DR 12 / +2
DR 4 / +3 would boost the Ogryn's to: DR 14 / +3
DR 6 / +5 would boost the Ogryn's to: DR 16 / +5

As I noted above, I have actually worked on some Assassin gear and rules myself; most of which are near identical to yours. The Alternate Races section, while having mostly accurate stats was never really going to be the end point. I had planned mini-codexes for most races with related feats and gears.

Time and bandwidth constraints have prevented me from doing so thus far. I'll see about getting the popular Tau section up sometime this coming week.
Could you pop a link in to that game for me Skritti? I'm new to these boards and rather horrible at navigating them at the moment.

I just don't see how Ogryns could be played (with any sense of awareness) as they are. Their stats balance out to plus zero. They have nice DR, but don't have the extra feats and skill points needed to progress into advanced classes.

In one part of your site it is instructed that characters be built using the 25 point buy (elite array). So on a 15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8 an Ogryn will have a terrible time keeping himself useful without having to sacrifice his higher scores, that should go to Str and Con, and using them to retain half-way useful mental stats.
There's no problem with playing characters with 8s in all their mentals...in D&D. In the D&D setting you can get away with being a dumb brick that simply smashes everything that looks at him funny. In modern though social interaction and technology are forced onto you. Yeah you can RP with it, but typically that will just lead to your Ogryn's death.
I was making suggestions toward making Ogryns more useful, more survivable, and more capable of maintaining their self-awareness and self-confidence.
The weakest Ogryn should still be stronger than any human at first level. Their Toughness follows directly behind.
They aren't the most coordinated, so the -2 Dex is appropriate. They are pretty dumb as far as smarts, so -4 Int. They, however, are perceptive, cunning, and don't deserve a Wisdom Penalty. Very few things do. Like Space Wolf Blood Claws or Khornate Berserkers, cause well...they do.
Ogryn really do deserve a Con that keeps them above pretty much everything else. +8 does that. It seems like a lot, but it really is appropriate.
If you gave all Ogryn a penalty to social interaction skills (i.e. all charisma based checks, excluding Intimidate) of -2 then they must still overcome the same penalty of a -4 to Charisma. This way they will retain their confidence in that they're bigger and a heck of a lot stronger than you and so can smash you into paste, and they will actually be able to convey that effectively.
Not mush is sadder than watching a hulking Ogryn pointing his Ripper Gun at some Chaos cultist and the wets himself from laughter instead of fear.

The suggestion of the Bonus Feat for Advanced Firearms Proficiency is so that Ogryn can ACTUALLY use their gun the way it's made. You may as well give them Adv PFP if you're going to give them Ripper Gun Prof, because otherwise they'll have to take PFP to get Adv PFP in order to use their gun. Seems a bit silly.

As far as the DR stacking, you may well have written it in somewhere else. It'd help to have it in the Tough Talent as a note though.

One other thing that struck me as curious:
Why are Power Fists Light melee weapons? And why are Thunder Hammers 2-handed?
If PFs were made light for finessing then that's not very good . If you want the more dexterous races who may actually finesse a weapon that acts like a PF, make theirs Light. PFs should really be One-Handed.
Also, you may with to include the "Armed to the Teeth" feat from Ultra Modern Firearms. Prereq: Two-Weapon Fighting
Benefit:
Allows you to fight with a ranged and melee weapon with your two-weapon fighting feat. Otherwise you can't. They'd have to be both melee or both ranged.
This would be fun to see Gunslinger Space Marines with Bolt Pistols and Power Fists using Close Combat shot with their off-hand, and slapping some Orks around with the PF

Thunder Hammers are one handed weapons though. They are intended to be utilized with another close combat weapon (bolt pistol) or a Storm Shield.

Let me know what you think.
Thunder Hammers are one handed weapons though. They are intended to be utilized with another close combat weapon (bolt pistol) or a Storm Shield.

This is partially correct though not quite. Terminators can wield them in one hand with the storm shield in the other however everyone else has to use them with two hands. I think maybe power armoured people can use them one handed also not sure on that. Plus the thunderhammer is listed as a two handed weapon in the codexs.
I didn't mean to sound whiney or demeaning, I'm just honestly curious as to why the damages were set the way they have been.

I mean, I didn't even mention the "energy always ignores Damage Reduction" issues because in Warhammer it's easiest if you make it work the way you've chosen. I'm just curious as to why the (in my view) unneccessary changes to damage types were made. Otherwise, if I ever run one of these, I'll have to change them all back to normal types and that's a lot of typing that I'd rather not do. ;)
Considered making rank a repurchasable feat? You may be an exceptional soldier, but get passed on promotion for personal reasons and/or have no desire to take rank and responsibility.
This is partially correct though not quite. Terminators can wield them in one hand with the storm shield in the other however everyone else has to use them with two hands. I think maybe power armoured people can use them one handed also not sure on that. Plus the thunderhammer is listed as a two handed weapon in the codexs.

Codex Space Marines (New and Old), Daemon Hunters, and Space Wolves:
Thunder Hammers are One-Handed Weapons.
Please tell me what codex THs are listed as two-handed weapons.

As for Terminators being able to wield them one-handed:
The "T" or "*" or whatever each codex uses as the symbol is to specify which items can be used in Terminator Armor. It does NOT specify items that MUST be wileded by someone in Terminator Armor.
Skritti's site states nothing about who can wield Thunder Hammers depending on what armor they are in. This is why I asked, as Thunder Hammers should be one-handed weapons.
I just read Xenos and Malleus of the Eisenhorn series and was inspired to build a Daemonhost 'race'. I kind of used the Space Marines as loose guidance for it. If anyone sees any flaws, particularly in the LA, please say so, every comment is appreciated .

The Daemonhost

Level Adjustment: +5
Size: Medium.
Ability Score Adjustments: +4 Strength, +4 Dexterity, +4 Constitution, +4 Intelligence, +4 Wisdom, +4 Charisma.
Skill Adjustments: None
Starting Feats: 2
Extra Starting Hit Dice: A Daemonhost gains 2 Hit Dice (2d8 hit points). The Daemonhost’s Constitution modifier applies to each Hit Die when determining hit points.
Bonus Feats: Iron Will, Great Fortitude, Lightning Reflexes

Frightful Presence: When the Daemonhost uses this ability, all opponents within 10 feet who have fewer levels than the Daemonhost must make a Will saving throw (DC 10 + ½ the character’s level + the character’s Charisma modifier). An opponent who fails his or her save is shaken, taking a –2 penalty on attack rolls, saves, and skill checks for a number of rounds equal to 1d6 + the Daemonhost’s Charisma modifier. The Daemonhost can use the ability once per round as a free action.
A successful save indicates that the opponent is immune to the Daemonhost’s use of this ability for 24 hours. This ability does not affect creatures with an Intelligence of 3 or lower.

Regeneration: This ability makes the Daemonhost impervious to most types of damage. Any damage dealt to the Daemonhost that falls below its massive damage threshold doesn’t reduce its hit points, unless that damage is of a type it is specifically vulnerable to, like psychics, blessed weapons and silver weapons. Massive damage that doesn’t match the Daemonhost’s vulnerability reduces its hit points, but such damage automatically heals at 2 hit points per round. When the Daemonhost takes massive damage from an attack type it isn’t vulnerable to, a failed save renders it dazed for 1 round (instead of reducing it to –1 hit points).
Damage the Daemonhost is vulnerable to deals damage with every successful attack. Such damage can’t be regenerated, and massive damage from such an attack follows the normal massive damage rules.
Regeneration doesn’t provide any benefit against attack forms that don’t deal hit point damage. Regeneration also doesn’t restore hit points lost by suffocation.
Regenerating Daemonhosts can regrow and reattach severed body parts. Severed parts that aren’t reattached wither and die normally. Regeneration continues to work no matter how low the Daemonhost’s hit points drop, restoring lost hit points from any damage other than from attack forms the Daemonhost is specially vulnerable to

Psyker: A Daemonhost draws energies directly from the warp. For this reason a Daemonhost has the Innate Gift and Innate Mastery feats. A Daemonhost counts as a level 2 character for determining the amount of psyker levels he can have.

Warp sensitivity: A Daemonhost is tapped into the warp and can feel psychic disturbances very easy. He has a +4 innate bonus on Psychic Sense, which is a permanent class skill. Also, if the Daemonhost has 5 or more ranks in Psychic Sense, it gets a +2 synergy bonus on spot and listen checks. They also get 60ft. Darkvision.

Talons: A Daemonhost’s hands end in razor sharp claws or nails. These are counted as natural weapons that deal 1D12 slashing damage with x3 multiplier and a DRP of 1.

Warp spawn: Daemons are creatures from the warp, sustaining themselves on the flow of the Immaterium. Therefore, they have no need to eat, sleep or otherwise sustain itself, except it has to be able to breathe. It still needs to rest for spells.

Telepathic: A Daemonhost can send messages via the Warp, much like astropaths can. This has a range of 100 miles.
It looks cool, but I want Skrittiblak's okay. Is it balanced for it's LA?
I really wouldn't know. I wanted to add in some restrictions on Wargear and such, but I didn't really know how to put that. I also don't know how many Daemonhust actually use wargear..I think I read about Cherubael disguised in armour, but I don't know if that was an illusion or not.
Koppain, don't forget to determine the Damage Reduction Penetration value for the Daemonhost's claw attacks. Zero or one would be appropriate.

I'll go through and tell you my ideas and concerns about the template and it's use in our current game.

Ability Score Adjustments:

Str: +12 They're a heck of a lot stronger than Space Marines.
Dex: +4 They're just as dextrous though.
Con: +6 They have multiple wounds, but are just as tough as a SM otherwise.
Int: +0 They aren't much smarter than the average bear.
Wis: +4 Insights gained from having a Daemon inside your mind.
Cha: +2 You're scary, but not terribly so.

Type: Outsider (Warp, Humanoid)

Skill adjustments: These fit more under abberation. They should not receive the bonus skill point that all the classes have worked into their descriptions.

Starting Feats: One. They shouldn't receive a Human Bonus Feat.

Size: Medium

Bonus Feats: Iron Will is good. Their Racial bonuses to all saves are enough to keep you from needing the other two feats though.
Innate Gift is good, but they don't need the Innate Mastery.

Bonus HD: Bonus HD in Modern severely penalizes that character. If you want them to have specific HD for when they are encountered as monstrous NPCs, go for it. Otherwise those extra HD are best left in a bag somewhere else.
They'd be more appropriate on 3 HD (Outsider), and therefore have the following "Racial" Bonus:

HD: 3d8 Outsider Hit Die (Constitution Modifier Applies) [These HD Do NOT count toward overall Character Level]
To Hit: +3

Racial Abilities:

Darkvision: 60'

Frightful Presence: As per the Feat.

Regeneration:
Has a Regeneration of 2.
All damage dealt to the Daemonhost is treated as subdual unless the damage type is of the following:
Any Psionics, Silvered Weaponry, Properly Blessed Weaponry.
Subdual Massive Damage is worked out as per the d20 Modern rules for such an event.
Massive Damage that does lethal damage to the Daemonhost, forces a Massive Damage Save as per the d20 Modern rules. If it fails it immediately falls to -1 HP, and is unconscious.

Psyker: Has the Innate Gift Feat. Daemonhosts also receive a racial +4 to Psychic Sense. (Which btw is not a Permanent Class Skill; use an appropriate starting background for that)

Warp Sensitivity:
While the Daemon Host has at least one power for the day reamining he gains the following:
+2 to Listen and Spot.
+4 Dodge Bonus to AC. This is gained from using the Warp to Deflect Incoming Attacks.

Warp Spawn:
As outsiders from the Warp they need only breathe. They have no need for sleeping, eating, or drinking.

Telepathic: Can send messages through the Warp as astropaths (involving all necessary checks, which there should be).

Natural Attacks:
Two Claws that deal 1d12 damage (19-20) 2; and have DRP 1.

Ability Surge:
The Daemonhost may spend an action point to activate this ability once per day, per two character levels.
When activated the Daemonhost gains a bonus of +4 to both Strength and Constitution for a number of rounds equal to it's newly modified Constitution Modifier.
While using an ability surge the Daemonhost has a -2 to it's AC. When the Surge ends (The Daemonhost may end the surge prior to when it would normally end) the Daemonhost is Fatigued.

Host requirements:
Daemonhosts may have ABSOLUTELY NO Cybernetics, Gene Therapy, or Bionic Limbs.
The Cybernetics interfere with their connection to the Warp, the Gene Therapy makes the body too unstable to remain in, and the Bionic Limbs shouldn't be a choice as they can reattach or regrow their limb due to Regenration.

Level Adjustment: +6
It has +28 to it's stats, Racial Bonus to Hit of +3 and the additional 3d8 HP. Gains two Bonus Feats, has natural weapons, special abilities, doesn't have to eat drink or sleep...
I'd say a +6 would be in keeping with that.


As to playing one:
VERY FEW Space Marines would ever fight alongside a Daemon. That's why no Grey Knights are allowed with them, and as the Knights Templar seem to be the Ordo Hereticus' version of the Frey Knights, so you'd need to get Lonesoldier's okay on that.
The Commissar and my character would probably feel the same way as most anyone who serves the Emperor's cause and would seek to purge any Daemons, let alone work alongside one. This can be circumvented by an Inquisitor Ordering him to work with it, though the Commissar may yet protest it.
Just things to keep in mind. Our group is becoming more and more diverse, so as long as everyone agrees on working to allow this mechanically, we can RP how we feel about having to work with a Daemon

Let me know what you feel about the changes and we'll discuss any issues you may have with them. After all we're here to help.
Alrighty, trying to make a d20 Death Cult Assassin:

Size: Medium
Type: Human
Level Adjustment: +2 (Maybe +3)
Ability Adjustments:

Str: +4 As Strong as a SM out of his armor.
Dex: +4 As Dextrous as a SM.
Con: +2 As tough as most Sisters of Battle
Int: +0 No need for a boost here; their intelligences vary with each assassin and cult.
Wis: +2 They are perceptive and cunning.
Cha: +2 They are very deadly and are aware of this fact.

Skill Adjustments: None needed, they are Humans.
Starting Feats: 2, they are Humans.
Bonus Feats:
Proficiency with all Needle Weaponry and Advanced Melee Weapons.
Proficiency with Light Armor.

"Racial" Features:
+2 Dodge Bonus to AC. Death-Cult Assassins are adept at dodging attacks from their oppoenents.

Fearless: Death-Cult Assassins are immune to Fear Effects.

Infiltrator: Death-Cult Assassins have a racial +2 to Hide and Move Silently. They also have a racial +2 to Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Sense Motive.

Fanaticism: Death-Cult Assassin's are fanatically devoted to their cause. When reduced to negative hit points they are not unconscious and may move and act normally. Each round they continue to lose one hp as normal. They may take a full-round action to try and stabilize as normal. If they do stabilize they may move normally, but cannot run, and any physical exertion (such as attacking something, jumping around, etc) will tear open their wounds and the Death-Cult Assassin will resume bleeding out one hp per turn.

Death-Cult Assassin Weapons:

Death-Cultist Power Sword:
Damage: 3d6
Critical: 19-20 x2
DRP: 5
Type: Slashing
Size: One-Handed
Special: May use Weapon Finesse with this weapon.
Purchase DC: 30


Death-Cultist Whip-Scythe:
Damage: 3d4
Critical: 20 x4
DRP: 2
Type: Slashing and Piercing
Size: One-Handed
Special:
Has a reach of 15'.
May use Weapon Finesse. May make Disarm and Trip attempts, and gains a +2 on either. If tripped during a failed trip attempt the wielder may drop the weapon to avoid being tripped.
Purchase DC: 25

Death-Cult Armor:

Death-Cultist Mesh:
Type: Light
DR: 14 / +2
Non-Proficiency DR: 2 / +2 (If you don't know how to use the wrist guards to deflect incoming blows you don't get nearly the amount of protection)
Max Dex: +8
Speed: 30'
Armor Check Penalty: -0
Weight: 8 lbs
Purchase DC: 30


Input and advice welcome.
Death cult,
+4 LA, according to Savage species, and some mock fights I conducted.

Daemonhost,
way way way to good!
two great axes for Natural attacks?
Regeneration (which is even better in modern)?
also, Psychic powers are more akin to 3.5 magic then psionics.
Id give'em a +8 grand total LA. if you keep the racial hit dice, then its not as a appealing, so change the LA to +7, but then they have Hitdice, so ECL of 10. Id rather be a Dark Eldar.
The thread with the Ogryn player is Dark Millenium here which might also be fun to read the back story of too.

Powerfists are 'light' weapons because they always form part of a powered-arm unit. They cover the targets entire armour and like powered armour are wired into the arm so they don't conflict with the arm's movement. Effectively they weigh nothing for the character.

Thunderhammers on the other hand are very heavy and can be TWF only be very strong Space Marines.

Gunrock

Begads! I missed your post completely. I wasn't avoiding you. Promise!

Okay so why did I change damage.

I want a minimum amount of damage 'types' so we can handle things like resistances in a fairly generic way. 40k incorporates a number of different weapons and it would be silly to have a unique damage type ('flaying disinitigration' for necron weapons 'spinning shurikens' for Eldar catapults etc...) for each gun.

So here we go all firearms are:

PIERCING (weapons primary damage form is piercing - Stubgun, Autogun)
SLASHING (weapons fire slashing discs - Shuriken Catapult)
BLUDGEONING (weapons hammers you - Squat Thudd Gun)
ENERGY (weapon is laser based - Lasgun, Pulse Rifle, Hellgun, Needle Rifle)
ATOMIC (weapon is an advanced sci-fi energy type - Plasma Gun, Meltagun, Gauss Rifle, Dark Matter Gun)
EXPLOSIVE (weapons bullets explode - Boltgun, Missile Launcher)

Characters do not get Concussion resistance against Explosive damage type weapons.

Characters get Damage Reduction as normal against all of the above damage types.

They even get damage resistance against the following special 'elemental' damage types in this game since all DR is some kind of armour.

Cold, Fire, Electricity, Sonic.

Hope that helps.

Level Adjustment: +7
It has +28 to it's stats, Racial Bonus to Hit of +3 and Saves of +3 each. Gains two Bonus Feats, has natural weapons, special abilities, don't have to eat drink or sleep...
I'd say a +7 would be in keeping with that. MAYBE a +6, but then I'm not familiar with the rules of assigning level adjustments so I'll leave it up to Gunrock to do that for me.

That seems about right to me too. Maybe +6.
Okay had a talk with Gunrock, and he pointed out to me that these critters aren't suppose to get their bonuses to saves from racial HD. And that they ARE supposed to get their HP from the Racial HD, they just don't count toward overall level. So with this new found knowledge I will edit the Daemonhosts then return here to reply to Deathsauce.
I love yours way more than mine, and not only because it's better. To be honest, I didn't know much of creating races (I still don't) and most of the special rules (especially racial hit dice) slipped my grasp.

As for the two axes for natural attacks: Perhaps include some severe penalties for using weapons/armour, I don't see them using those much.

Some questions: The rules you give below Regeneration, do they replace it or are they in addition to Regeneration?
When are you psionically focused?
When you look at Psionic levels, what level is it? Are they level 3, or does the gift only kick in at level LA + 1?
Telepathy, I don't think Astropaths need a check to make it and a Daemonhost would 'know' the Warp better than them, why does he need to check?

As to playing one:
I didn't intend on letting it show really well he is a Daemonhost, especially not in the beginning. Using a robe/cloak or something other eerie 40k-style. For the rest, lonesoldier will have to give the OK, but it would require some hefty role-playing. OR all the characters should be a bit 'radical' themselves too, or perhaps be on really, really good terms with gladius...
Powerfists are 'light' weapons because they always form part of a powered-arm unit. They cover the targets entire armour and like powered armour are wired into the arm so they don't conflict with the arm's movement. Effectively they weigh nothing for the character.

True as that may be, for purposes of game balance they should really be one-handed.
Gunrock

Begads! I missed your post completely. I wasn't avoiding you. Promise!

Okay so why did I change damage.

I want a minimum amount of damage 'types' so we can handle things like resistances in a fairly generic way.

Which is a fine goal, but you seem to have gone in the opposite direction by adding 3 new types (Atomic, Energy, and Explosive).
40k incorporates a number of different weapons and it would be silly to have a unique damage type ('flaying disinitigration' for necron weapons 'spinning shurikens' for Eldar catapults etc...) for each gun.

Again, you will find me in total agreement.
So here we go all firearms are:

PIERCING (weapons primary damage form is piercing - Stubgun, Autogun)
SLASHING (weapons fire slashing discs - Shuriken Catapult)
BLUDGEONING (weapons hammers you - Squat Thudd Gun)
ENERGY (weapon is laser based - Lasgun, Pulse Rifle, Hellgun, Needle Rifle)
ATOMIC (weapon is an advanced sci-fi energy type - Plasma Gun, Meltagun, Gauss Rifle, Dark Matter Gun)
EXPLOSIVE (weapons bullets explode - Boltgun, Missile Launcher)

I would suggest the following changes:
Ballistic All non-explosive slug weapons do this type (stubguns, autoguns)
Slashing Edged weapons, shrapnel based explosives (example: frag grenades) and shuriken guns (and others as appropriate).
Bludgeoning Hammers, fists, etc.
Piercing All weapons that work by stabbing into a person's fleshy parts (rapiers, bows, needle guns, etc.)
Fire Flamers, plasma weapons, lasers, melta-guns, hell guns, and all other guns whose damage is based purely on heating something to dangerous temperatures.
Concussion All explosive non-shrapnel weapons (bolters, krak grenades, etc.)
Energy A generic type of damage that ignores all energy resistances (GAUSS weapons, Dark Matter weapons).

This way you add one type of damage (one that already existed in D20 Future) and keep the Tough Hero's Energy resistance talents at least mildly useful.

Once again, this is Gunrock using a borrowed PC and account.
True as that may be, for purposes of game balance they should really be one-handed.

Perhaps do something similar as with Bastard Swords, apply a minimun Strength score for it the be wielded one handed. That way, most Power Armoured characters could wield a Thunderhammer and Stormshield without a problem.
But.... that's identical in number to what I had....

But you've added Ballistic and dropped Atomic.

I felt it important to distinguish between low-power energy (Energy) and stuff like plasma and melta weapons (Atomic) because most Atomic weapons have special effect regarding Hardness and some aliens might be laser resistant but not say 'meltagun-resistant'.

And there is no way I'm making the standard weapon of the Imperial Space Marine (Boltgun) deal a damage type that can be ignored with an appropriate Tough Hero Talent. :D

I also really don't like putting meltaguns and lasguns in the same damage type.

So I'll probably (uh, definitely) leave the damage types as is on the website; not least of all because I spent a long, long time deliberating before I settled on the ones I did.

6 impact types + 6 elemental types
Impact: Piercing, Slashing, Bludgeoning, Energy, Atomic, Explosive
Elemental: Acid, Fire, Cold, Electrical, Sonic, Concussion

Anyway its a d20 homebrew, so if you don't like the damage types I've selected its really easy to change. :P

EDIT: I'm also sticking to the philosophy that my firearms (being the standard sort of weapon) never deal elemental damage. This also helped me decide how to allineate.

Concussion therefore occurs from 'nonlethal' type attacks as well as from special 'concussion' grenades or as a partial damage from other kinds of regular explosive grenades.

Fire can be dealt by a flamer and flame grenade as well as natural fire sources.

There is no cryogenic rifle; but if a race used it as a standard instead of specialty weapon I'd have it deal Atomic not Cold damage. For a rare weapon I might consider cold.

Basically where weapons are basic firearms I picked from among these:

Piercing, Slashing, Bludgeoning, Energy, Atomic, Explosive

Since ballistic firearms are going out of fashion I've dropped ballistic finding it easier to uses piercing (which I had to include anyway, by merit of the fact that piercing melee weapons exist). 6 seemed like a small number of non-elemental damage types and this array lets me cover all the 40k weapons I came across.

Moreover since I've been using them for several years I've grown fond of these 6. In all honesty this is one of those things thats unlikely to change in future editions of d20-40k, so I hope I've done a decent job of justifying these damage types.

EDIT: Begads! I forgot! One of the central reasons for the creation of the 'Atomic' energy type was as an easy way to delineate which weapons would require the Special Weapons Proficiency (High Energy Weapons) feat! Obviously if you have a choice between a 2d6 damage laspistol and 2d12 - 3d12 damage plasma pistol you better have a pretty clear distinction between what the plasgun deals and what the lasgun deals. If you see 'Atomic' you know that at least two extra feats are required (Advanced Firearms (prereq) and Special Weapons). This way those beardy munchkins that want to deal mega damage from a pea-sized weapon have to put an investment in first.

Atomic was an important addition. And again. Laser = Fire damage is a bad idea; because it makes an Ogryn tough hero immune to it. If I wanted that I would have added "Resistant to Firearms" as a talent. Remember that laser weapons are as common place as ballistic weapons today in 40k and I don't see a Ballistic Resistance in the Energy Resistant talent tree.

No, no, the 6 impact damage types are good, solid and tested damage types I've come to know and love.
True as that may be, for purposes of game balance they should really be one-handed.

This on the other hand is a very true statement and is something I am liable to change. I hadn't really considered how much it would hurt game balanced to put one of the highest damage weapons in the 'light' category - I somehow had just considered the practical difficulties associated with lifted such a weapon. But one-handed seems to make much more sense to me now.

Thanks.
Moreover since I've been using them for several years I've grown fond of these 6. In all honesty this is one of those things thats unlikely to change in future editions of d20-40k, so I hope I've done a decent job of justifying these damage types.

I have at least two replies to everything else you've said. This is the one arguement you've made in which I agree that your premise is true and that the form of your arguement is valid. As such I shall drop the discussion of damage types.

However, if you are interested in the responses I am willing to share them. If you are not, that's fine too.
Just out of curiosity, what section of the rules is next?
The Xeno Sections is next! Probably going to put up Tyranids and Necrons first as they are clearly useful evil baddies.

Followed by the Tau and special Imperial units like Assassins.

Followed by Genestealers and Animals. Then finally Orks and Eldar.
I have at least two replies to everything else you've said. This is the one arguement you've made in which I agree that your premise is true and that the form of your arguement is valid. As such I shall drop the discussion of damage types.

However, if you are interested in the responses I am willing to share them. If you are not, that's fine too.

No please! I am very open to arguments! I just thought I'd forewarn you, before we get too deep, that this was one of the 'bases' I covered early on, so its one of the least likely things to change. If you're aware and want to argue anyway in the hopes of persuading me, by all means!