I Just Got KotS!

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One of the players I DM for just called me saying that the bookstore in our local mall had Keep on the Shadowfell on the shelves. I told him to pick it up for me, and its likely we will begin playing it tonight.

Good times.
...whatever
I Just Got KotS!

...Is that catching?
Color me flattered.

Thank_Dog wrote:

2Chlorobutanal wrote:
I think that if you have to argue to convince others about the clarity of something, it's probably not as objectively clear as you think.

No, what it means is that some people just like to be obtuse.

That was a song by The Soft Boys, wannit? "I Got the KotS For You," off of Underwater Moonlight?
That was a song by The Soft Boys, wannit? "I Got the KotS For You," off of Underwater Moonlight?

No, no, no...it's by Van Halen - "Kots for Teacher".
Color me flattered.

Thank_Dog wrote:

2Chlorobutanal wrote:
I think that if you have to argue to convince others about the clarity of something, it's probably not as objectively clear as you think.

No, what it means is that some people just like to be obtuse.

That was a song by The Soft Boys, wannit? "I Got the KotS For You," off of Underwater Moonlight?

Said the Cleric... to the Barwench...
you mean it's not "KotS through the heart" by Bon Jovi?

also, we need a playtest report asap if you're trying it out.
3rd ed SRD, character sheets, errata & free modules 4th ed test drive - modules, starter rules, premade characters and character builder & character sheet, errata Free maps and portraits, dice, printable graph paper, campaign managing website, image manipulation program + token maker & zone markers

"All right, I've been thinking. When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back. GET MAD! I DON'T WANT YOUR **** LEMONS! WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO DO WITH THESE?! DEMAND TO SEE LIFE'S MANAGER! Make life RUE the day it thought it could give CAVE JOHNSON LEMONS! DO YOU KNOW WHO I AM?! I'M THE MAN WHO'S GONNA BURN YOUR HOUSE DOWN! WITH THE LEMONS! I'm gonna get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that's gonna BURN YOUR HOUSE DOWN!" -Cave Johnson, Portal 2
Hmm it won't post under my right profile...
you mean it's not "KotS through the heart" by Bon Jovi?

DO NOT DEFILE THE D&D BOARDS WITH THAT MANS NAME!
DO NOT DEFILE THE D&D BOARDS WITH THAT MANS NAME!

IMAGE(http://artfiles.art.com/images/-/Jon-Bon-Jovi-Poster-C10050342.jpeg)

A shrieker is a stationary fungus that emits a loud noise to attract prey or when disturbed. Shriekers live in dark, subterranean places, often in the company of violet fungi, whose poison they are immune to.
Color me flattered.

Thank_Dog wrote:

2Chlorobutanal wrote:
I think that if you have to argue to convince others about the clarity of something, it's probably not as objectively clear as you think.

No, what it means is that some people just like to be obtuse.

A shrieker is a stationary fungus that emits a loud noise to attract prey or when disturbed. Shriekers live in dark, subterranean places, often in the company of violet fungi, whose poison they are immune to.

Hmm... knowing the habits of certain "shriekers," I wouldn't think that they'd be immune to the poisons of other fungi... :D
you mean it's not "KotS through the heart" by Bon Jovi?

also, we need a playtest report asap if you're trying it out.

In case you missed it I posted my review of the module on the Adventures forum a week ago.

http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1029558

In the desert
I saw a creature, naked, bestial,
who, squatting upon the ground,
held his heart in his hands, and ate of it.
I said, "is it good, friend?"
"It is bitter – bitter," he answered;
"but I like it,
"beacuase it is bitter,
"and because it is my heart."

what can i say... i'm a blackguard. defiling things is second nature to me :P

also, i am now looking forward even more to KotS, thanks for the link LFK.
3rd ed SRD, character sheets, errata & free modules 4th ed test drive - modules, starter rules, premade characters and character builder & character sheet, errata Free maps and portraits, dice, printable graph paper, campaign managing website, image manipulation program + token maker & zone markers

"All right, I've been thinking. When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back. GET MAD! I DON'T WANT YOUR **** LEMONS! WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO DO WITH THESE?! DEMAND TO SEE LIFE'S MANAGER! Make life RUE the day it thought it could give CAVE JOHNSON LEMONS! DO YOU KNOW WHO I AM?! I'M THE MAN WHO'S GONNA BURN YOUR HOUSE DOWN! WITH THE LEMONS! I'm gonna get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that's gonna BURN YOUR HOUSE DOWN!" -Cave Johnson, Portal 2
One of the players I DM for just called me saying that the bookstore in our local mall had Keep on the Shadowfell on the shelves. I told him to pick it up for me, and its likely we will begin playing it tonight.

Good times.

Okay. This really pisses me off. I'm a Premiere Store retailer who sticks to street date and here I've seen that Barnes & Noble, Borders and now some local mall store are selling KotS four days before the street date!

I'm calling my rep at Wizards.
Okay. This really pisses me off. I'm a Premiere Store retailer who sticks to street date and here I've seen that Barnes & Noble, Borders and now some local mall store are selling KotS four days before the street date!

I'm calling my rep at Wizards.

And tell them what? That you didn't think to put the product out early like so many others did? What do you expect to have happen? B&N having D&D pulled from their stores, never to return? Barnes & Noble, along with their subsidiary Borders, made a judgement call. Also, it's not an unusual one. I have gotten many books, DVDs and such early from them. That's why I shop there. You've basically stated, "They made me mad, now I'm gonna tell on them". Kinda silly, don't you think? Supply and demand, man...supply and demand. Just think, if you had offered it a day before they did, you could have made all that money.
DO NOT DEFILE THE D&D BOARDS WITH THAT MANS NAME!

"Hey, Bon Jovi rocks... on occasion."
Dean, Last Episode of Supernatural.
"If you can't believe in yourself, believe in me who believes in you." and "Go beyond the impossible, and kick reason to the curb" Kamina, from Gurren Lagann
IMAGE(http://artfiles.art.com/images/-/Jon-Bon-Jovi-Poster-C10050342.jpeg)

A shrieker is a stationary fungus that emits a loud noise to attract prey or when disturbed. Shriekers live in dark, subterranean places, often in the company of violet fungi, whose poison they are immune to.

Do you have any idea what you just did to me?

IMAGE(http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh231/trobon/spam_laser.gif)
Wow, there's a lot of Bon Jovi hate on these boards.

I kinda like his work. *hide*
I posted a review of the game we ran with it here:

http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1032814

This thread has a stupid name and needs to die, or else I would have posted it here.
...whatever
And tell them what? That you didn't think to put the product out early like so many others did? What do you expect to have happen? B&N having D&D pulled from their stores, never to return? Barnes & Noble, along with their subsidiary Borders, made a judgement call. Also, it's not an unusual one. I have gotten many books, DVDs and such early from them. That's why I shop there. You've basically stated, "They made me mad, now I'm gonna tell on them". Kinda silly, don't you think? Supply and demand, man...supply and demand. Just think, if you had offered it a day before they did, you could have made all that money.

You're being a tad condescending, don't you think?

He's upset because street date involves agreements with the publisher not to sell before a certain date so that all stores launch the product on the same day. Breaking these street dates results in unfair competition to the retailers who honor the agreement, and are supposed to result in penalties to the retailer that break the agreement.

He has every right to be upset. He is obligated to sit on his inventory, facing repercussions if he sells early, while at the same time losing business to another retailer who is selling early. Reporting the other retailer is really his only recourse of action. If he starts selling them too, then he may be penalized appropriately (or be given permission to break street date as well, but without penalty, which I believe can happen in some situations).
You're being a tad condescending, don't you think?

He's upset because street date involves agreements with the publisher not to sell before a certain date so that all stores launch the product on the same day. Breaking these street dates results in unfair competition to the retailers who honor the agreement, and are supposed to result in penalties to the retailer that break the agreement.

He has every right to be upset. He is obligated to sit on his inventory, facing repercussions if he sells early, while at the same time losing business to another retailer who is selling early. Reporting the other retailer is really his only recourse of action. If he starts selling them too, then he may be penalized appropriately (or be given permission to break street date as well, but without penalty, which I believe can happen in some situations).

I, too, own a business, albeit not a game store. I own a hardware store. When new products become available to me, I make them available to my customers. From a business point of view, honestly, it's about the money. If I can get that product out before my competition does, it puts me in the control seat. I set the local price margin that others now have to contend with. It's just good business sense. Look at it from Barnes & Nobles point of view. They are one of the biggest retail bookstores out there. They know that they can sell KotS a few days early without repercussions from WotC. WotC will not pull their products from B&N's shelves. They will not hit them with huge fines. B&N are making WotC money, and quickly. Yes, he can report the other retailers, but it's a waste of his time. If he owns a small-time game store, WotC will not take a large profit hit if they penalize him, but I seriously doubt they would do it to him, either. The more KotS that sells, the happier WotC can be. Period. They set a date more for the general public to know when to look for it than to tie the hands of the retailers selling their products. I bought my copy of KotS from B&N early. If my local game store had offered it at the same time, I would have still bought it at B&N because of the discount member card. It's all about the retailer offering the product and the buyer acquiring it at the lowest price. Simple economics. He can fly his pity-flag, but in the end what will it amount to? This is one darn good test to see just how loyal his "favorite" customers are. One thing I did learn long ago: if you're good enough, people will wait for you.
You're being a tad condescending, don't you think?

He's upset because street date involves agreements with the publisher not to sell before a certain date so that all stores launch the product on the same day. Breaking these street dates results in unfair competition to the retailers who honor the agreement, and are supposed to result in penalties to the retailer that break the agreement.

He has every right to be upset. He is obligated to sit on his inventory, facing repercussions if he sells early, while at the same time losing business to another retailer who is selling early. Reporting the other retailer is really his only recourse of action. If he starts selling them too, then he may be penalized appropriately (or be given permission to break street date as well, but without penalty, which I believe can happen in some situations).

Seconded. Release dates are supposed to be upheld by retailers. It may be different in other businesses, but retail stores can get in serious crap for ignoring release dates. Some bookstore managers might be on the job hunt very soon.

truth/humor
Ed_Warlord, on what it takes to make a thread work: I think for it to be really constructive, everyone would have to be honest with each other, and with themselves.

 

iserith: The game doesn't profess to be "just like our world." What it is just like is the world of Dungeons & Dragons. Any semblance to reality is purely coincidental.

 

Areleth: How does this help the problems we have with Fighters? Do you think that every time I thought I was playing D&D what I was actually doing was slamming my head in a car door and that if you just explain how to play without doing that then I'll finally enjoy the game?

 

TD: That's why they put me on the front of every book. This is the dungeon, and I am the dragon. A word of warning though: I'm totally not a level appropriate encounter.

WotC Associate: I hear you're selling our products a few days early. How DARE you! Do you know what this will do to your business? We'll shut you down! You'll all be on the breadlines within a week!

B&N Associate: I'm so sorry! We only sold a few hundred copies! No big deal, right?

WotC: A few hundred copies?! Do you realize that made WotC $9000.00 just from your store alone? Wait........well...don't do it again...
WotC Associate: I hear you're selling our products a few days early. How DARE you! Do you know what this will do to your business? We'll shut you down! You'll all be on the breadlines within a week!

B&N Associate: I'm so sorry! We only sold a few hundred copies! No big deal, right?

WotC: A few hundred copies?! Do you realize that made WotC $9000.00 just from your store alone? Wait........well...don't do it again...

The problem comes in when one considers reputation.

Barnes and Nobles makes a habit of doing this, they likely won't have WotC coming down on them... but the next publisher with a Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows will be a tad hesitant to send them copies, I'd say.
The problem comes in when one considers reputation.

Barnes and Nobles makes a habit of doing this, they likely won't have WotC coming down on them... but the next publisher with a Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows will be a tad hesitant to send them copies, I'd say.

Heh, Bob forbid somebody opens that Harry Potter box early. According to certain contracts, Rowling gets to burn down the store with the employees' families locked inside if that ever happens.

truth/humor
Ed_Warlord, on what it takes to make a thread work: I think for it to be really constructive, everyone would have to be honest with each other, and with themselves.

 

iserith: The game doesn't profess to be "just like our world." What it is just like is the world of Dungeons & Dragons. Any semblance to reality is purely coincidental.

 

Areleth: How does this help the problems we have with Fighters? Do you think that every time I thought I was playing D&D what I was actually doing was slamming my head in a car door and that if you just explain how to play without doing that then I'll finally enjoy the game?

 

TD: That's why they put me on the front of every book. This is the dungeon, and I am the dragon. A word of warning though: I'm totally not a level appropriate encounter.

Heh, Bob forbid somebody opens that Harry Potter box early. According to certain contracts, Rowling gets to burn down the store with the employees' families locked inside if that ever happens.

That's pretty much it. In terms of dealing with WotC, Barnes and Nobles has an advantageous position... but that's not true in every circumstance, and might not even be true with WotC forever. It's a good thing to build a reputation for dealing fairly with the companies you can afford not to deal fairly with, so that the companes you can't afford to cheat have reason to trust you.
IMAGE(http://artfiles.art.com/images/-/Jon-Bon-Jovi-Poster-C10050342.jpeg)

A shrieker is a stationary fungus that emits a loud noise to attract prey or when disturbed. Shriekers live in dark, subterranean places, often in the company of violet fungi, whose poison they are immune to.

That shrieker is HAWT!

I bet he drives a sweet car!
BTW we do take our release dates seriously and we will be addressing this.
That's pretty much it. In terms of dealing with WotC, Barnes and Nobles has an advantageous position... but that's not true in every circumstance, and might not even be true with WotC forever. It's a good thing to build a reputation for dealing fairly with the companies you can afford not to deal fairly with, so that the companes you can't afford to cheat have reason to trust you.

I think the worst of it is is that WotC can destroy a small business owner but not really do anything to a big box company. If WotC really wanted to come down on a small, locally owned gaming store for releasing a product early, they could hit them with a hefty fine (if it was written into a contract) or tell the store that they would not ship books to them in time for the release which means they would be ones stuck without books on the day when most people are looking for them. That would send customers to other stores.

But, if WotC tried either tactic with Borders or Barnes and Noble, it would fail. B&N has enough lawyers to fight any contractual dispute and enough money to just pay whatever silly fine WotC wants to hit them with. And, if B&N knows that WotC won't really keep books from them because they're a national chain and it would probably hurt WotC more than it would B&N because B&N makes most of their money selling things completely unrelated to gaming. In fact, they could take every gaming product off their shelves and not see a blip on their bottom line.

That's why it's unfair. It hurts small business owners who are loyal to the hobby and only benefits big corps that don't give a crap.
I'm sticking to my loyalties to my local game store. I preordered the book from him, he's giving me a great discount at 30%, and I am sticking to my agreement. I do think it was in bad taste to release the book early, but it's too late now to do anything about it. But I would definitely make my displeasure known to WotC about the bigger stores releasing early.

Besides, I can wait. It's not like our group is planning on playing this until next week anyway. I don't even think the store is getting their copies of it until tomorrow anyway when their shipment from Diamond comes in.