Open discussion: BUILD A CITY 4.0!!!

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PerennialRook and Dougan Axehammer I salute you.

Axehammer, your idea of the child be half-dragon is great and PerennialRook's back story was beautifully written. Its got the devilish plot of a green dragon, an elf maiden with a dark past, and an unknown future of how the 1/2 dragon child and his sire will play out. I give it two thumbs up.

One thing I noticed in PerennialRook's description... you have (adult 1, child 1; 1m, 1f) For easier reference I feel (adult 1, child 1; 1f 1m) would help avoid confusion if a person is just briefly looking it over.

On a side note, being new to these forums and all... how do you do the cool little expand button thingy?

And thank you for working so hard to fit her in.
This pretty much goes along the same lines as my description (though it was done more eloquently than mine.)

That was kind of the point, hence the credit (I think) I gave you.
(One nitpick though, Pk: "...demon's plan"?)

Just a reference to the green dragon. :D

Dracollich, the show/hide button is done by adding "sblock" in brackets at the beginning and end of the text. You can title the block by putting "=" in the beginning set of brackets after sblock.

Like so:

See?
Ha, ha. Made you look!


You can use the "quote" function to see how it works.
REFUGEE BREAKDOWN

HUMANS: Two large groups (six 4-person families), plus two individuals.
Total: 26 humans (16 adults, 8 children, 2 elderly).
Open: 3 adults, 1 child.
Breakdown

Carpenter's Family
Koren (carpenter), plus wife and two sons (2 Adults, 2 Children; 3m, 1f).

Description: Koren grew up in a seaside city, learning his father's trade and becoming an accomplished shipwright. When he lost both of his brothers to the sea, he closed up shop and moved inland, where he as worked as a carpenter in [Old City]. While much work was available in [Old City] after the dragon attack, Moses convinced him that the attack was not over. Since moving to [Old City], he has bowed to the demands of his customers and kept to the prevailing styles of the city, but now he feels a renewal of his youthful ambitions and dreams, and Koren thinks he can make a mark in this new settlement, artistically speaking.
Nan Kya's Orphans
Nan Kya (cook and herbalist), Jessie (stablegirl), Tam (linkboy) and Rat (mudlarker and occasional pickpocket) who currently has a badly sprained leg. (1 elderly, 3 children; 2m, 2f).

Description: Nan Kya is unofficial third granny to many of the children in the slum quarter of [Old City] and when disaster struck and scattered their families, it was Nan Kya that the lost children gravitated to. In the days that followed, most of the children were reclaimed by their parents, older siblings and street gangs, but three remain with nowhere else to go and Kya has taken them under her wing.

Although justifiably renowned for her ability to make even the poorest food taste good, it is in fact the medical side of her herb lore that the local adults revere. Nan Kya, they say, is the person to turn to when you can't go to the temples and the official healers or alchemists - for whatever reason, be it cost, or fear, or simply having a bounty on your head.
Noble Swine
Lyndon Merriweather a noble, his wife Fionna, and two daughters (2 adults, 2 children; 1m, 3f).

Description: Lyndon Merriweather had come from a prestigious, well-to-do family. His family holdings were spread far across the city, with monetary influence in almost every walk of life. Lyn had it all. And he wasted it daily. He was a spoiled, rich brat, never having to work a day in his life for anything. Everything that he wanted he could purchase, from his clothes, to his house, to his "education", to his every whim. Typically, he could be seen at one of the local taverns, frittering away coin on boozing, gambling, and whoring. No one really liked him, not that he cared; with all of his money and power, no one could really do anything about it. This was a life that he was used to.

He had an arranged marriage, and wasn't even old enough to speak up for himself when the deal was made. With his own inheritance and the dowry of his wife, he would have been able to drink away the next fifty years, had he lived that long. Fionna was pretty, though not as stunning as some of the women that he frequented. They had two daughters who barely knew their father.

Lyndon became the unwilling financier of the refugees, when he tactlessly threw himself at Ariana, not realizing that she too was of noble birth. The fact that his money had bought many of the provisions was a fact that he would not soon forget, and would lord over any who questioned his slothfulness.
Wranglers
Jackson and three other cattle wranglers and ranch hands (4 adults; 3m, 1f).

Description: The distant flames seemed to light up his eyes against the canvas of his dark skin in the shadows of the night. His first thoughts were of Ariana. He thought she had said she was coming back to the city today. For once he hoped that she was late.

In the chaos of the aftermath, Jackson could only find three other wranglers. The cattle were so long gone, it would have been futile to try and find them all. Jackson needed to get back to visit the city.
The Farmer's Family
Costran, Farm Family Patriarch, plus wife Dhalitha and sons Dexis and Lorten (1 elderly, 3 adult; 3m, 1f).

Description: Costran has farmed all his life, and is rather successful about it. He oversees large farming plots outside the city, growing crops on rotating years, and even trying his hand at winemaking as a hobby. He has four three strong sons from his first (late) wife, and has remarried Dhalitha , an attractive young foreign-born dancer Costran met in the city, much to the dismay of his sons who think she might be after his land and money. In his youthful days, Costran became a devoted follower of the local religion, converted by the newly-confirmed priestess Moses. When he heard that Moses was having a bit of a crisis of faith, he decided to follow her on her pilgrimage, and make sure these "danged younguns who ain't known a hard days work" didn't get themselves in trouble. He turned his farm over to his eldest son and his wife to take care of while he went on this little trip, and took his two younger sons Dexis and Lorten along with him.
Ariana
Ariana: falconer and prodigal noble (1 adult; 1f).

Description: Born the unexpected fourth child to the noble Aquila family allowed Ariana to be freed of most of the obligations and expectations of her older siblings. Lacking a strong hand to guide her into being a typical noble, Ariana found herself drawn to the wilderness and the freedom to be found there. Though considered uncouth and snubbed by her noble peers, it was this relaxed nature that allows her to interact easily with commoners and has allowed her to stand forward in these times of troubles.
Full Description Found Here
Urchin Bandon
Urchin, once homeless (1 adult; 1m)

Description: Like any street kid, Klein "the Urchin" Bandon had had a hard life, one which nearly doubled his apparent age. Now sixteen, he looked nearly thirty, which had played to his favor. He was uncommonly strong for his age, which could be attributed mostly to his iron will and good cooking. His strength, combined with his older looks, had allowed him to work at the docks since he was only twelve. The wages barely paid for food, so what food he bought was usually in the form of raw ingredients, which Nan Kya, his adopted grandmother, was more than willing to cook up.

The docks were closed for solstice, which left Klein to his other "profession", spending the day collecting on the generosity of others. He was at the temple pavilion when the lighthouse gave birth to the cursewarped terror, and was one of the many ushered inside the safety of the temple walls.

In the aftermath, there were not enough common labor jobs for even those that were recently made homeless, let alone those who had spent a lifetime in poverty. When Moses approached him about going with the small group of refugees, he knew his bargaining chip. Thanks to Nan Kya's kindness, he was an ox. It was no surprise that his agreement came with the condition that Nan Kya be allowed to go as well.

DWARVES: One large group (three 4-person families).
Total: 12 (6 adults, 2 children, 4 elderly).
Open: 2 adults, 1 child, 1 elderly.
Breakdown

Axebreaker Clan
Bobfin Axebreaker cartographer and scholar, and his wife. Also his grandson, a barkeep from the [Old City], and the grandson's wife (2 Elderly, 2 Adults; 2m, 2f).

Description: Bobfin has seen his children succumb to the wandering nature of his youth, and without much success. He has committed too many of his children and grandchildren to the earth long before their time, and except his grandson and his wife, his few living decedents are scattered to the winds.
Dirt Farmers
Darryl One-eye (retired mercenary) with his farmer father, his wife and baby daughter (1 elderly, 2 adults, 1 child; 2m, 2f).

Description: Darryl heard the dragon wings before his remaining eye spotted the fires springing up in its wake. He managed to get down into the cellar with his wife, his baby daughter and his doom-and-gloom father before the dragon reached them - along with a goat that was about to kid. The group huddled at the back of the cellar and waited for the beast to go away.

When they finally emerged again, there were 4 goats to lift out of the cellar and all the grain fields were burnt flat.

HALFLINGS One large group of halflings (three 3-person families).
Total: 9 halflings (6 adults, 3 children).
Breakdown

Garfunkle's Gang
Garfunkel (prospector) and Ginger Rabbitsnare and Garf's tag-along "little" brother Benji (3 adults; 2m, 1f).

Description: What happens when you cross a stream loving halfling and a stream of good luck? A halfling gold prospector! Sifting gold from the very streams he lives on, the young gold-seeking halfling, his newlywed wife, and brother make a fine addition to our group!
Janis and Sons
Janis (woodswoman), and her two twin sons (1 adult, 2 children; 2m, 1f).

Description: Janis and her late husband spent a lot of time in on the rivers and in the nearby forests, but when her husband died when her sons were infants, Janis settled down to care for them. Janis found a friend in Ariana the falconer, and taught her much of what she knows of the forests.
The Lucky Trio
Gillybloom (f), Taffle (m), Tansy (f child) (2 adults, 1 child; 1m, 2f).

Description: It was originally part dare, part coming of age celebration (apart from someone's tag-along kid sister determined to prove she was just as good as the rest of them). They were all going to climb the lighthouse and wave flags from the top. Gillybloom was leading the way when the beast broke out, hurling them all in different directions. Gillybloom and two others were lucky enough to land in the softish mud of the riverbank, but they haven't seen any of their friends since. These three, Gillybloom, Taffle and Tansy, now stick together as a personal reminder not to be so foolish again.

Before the [Old City] was attacked, Gillybloom was learning to scout ahead and around and Taffle is an apprentice sail & rope-maker. Tansy is still a generalist, used to pitching in with any task that needs help.

DRAGONBORN: Two small groups (four 2-person families).
Total: 8 (4 adults, 4 children).
Open: 2 adults, 0 children.
Breakdown

Yorcha and Yishi
Yorcha (mercenary warrior), and Yishi, her 11 yr old squire with dreams of working magic(1 adult, 1 child; 2f)

Description: This was supposed to be an easy hire. Or so the recruiter had claimed. Just standing guard in a city where the threat had already left. No problems, just routine watches from battered walls.

That's why Yorcha had brought her young cousin Yishi as her squire, hoping that the youngling would gain enough experience in the trade that she would actually settle down and work instead of craning her neck after every mage that walked past.

If only she had known that it wasn't over...
Double Dragons
Ghoros, first out of the egg, and Ghent, who followed (2 children; 2m).

Description: A rarity indeed, twin dragonborn are almost unheard of. Born of the same shell, Ghoros is the stronger of the brothers, while Ghent is more clever. The two are in constant competition, and had been in a footrace (Ghoros leading, of course) when the cursewarped dragon shook the world. They never found their father.

While Ghoros leans more towards the martial persuasion, leaning to the hand-and-a-half swords like their father, Ghent keeps his head in books, trying to wrap his intellect around the concepts of the arcane arts. However, without a teacher, it would be a surprise if Ghent ever mastered more than the most basic of cantrips.

The twins soon come of age, a time of power for dragonborn when inherent abilities manifest. Only the gods know the fates of the double dragons.
Deethra, new mother
Deethra, inactive dragonborn mercenary, and her unhatched egg, name undecided. (1 adult, 1 child; 1f, 1 unknown)

Description: Deethra had entered [Old City] a few weeks before solistice. After years of mercenary service, she needed to settle down for a bit. Gestation would soon be over, and she needed a place to rest, lay her egg, and raise her child. She spoke with the elders of the temple near the lighthouse, and they did what they could to accomodate her.

Her labor began on the eve of summer solistice. Feasts and festivities were well under way already, and it seemed to be a glorious day to birth her young. The labor was long, too be sure, but no matter for her; young born on solistice was an auspicious event. She was excited, both for herself and her child. That is, until it happened.

The egg began to crown at dusk on solstice, and as the sun set the ground began to shake. Everyone stopped what they were doing, and when the sun dropped beneath the horizon, a tremendous explosion shattered the lighthouse. All that could be seen was smoke and flame. And at that moment, the egg was laid, and Deethra collapsed from exhaustion.

When she awoke the following morning, many of the priests were unconscious, if not dead, though her egg seemed healthy. She was still exhausted from her delivery, but was compelled to investigate. It was then she met Moses, as the visibly shaken priest insisted that Deethra lay back down; Deethra was in no condition to do anything at the moment. The priest then presented Deethra’s egg to her, and was directed to care and watch over it.

As the days past, there was much discussion over the events of solistice; the curse-warped gold dragon laid waste to much of the city. Leaders promised that everything would be fine, and that rebuilding is already underway. But there were some who were unconvinced, and after listening to Moses, she had to agree. This place would not be a safe location to raise her child. She would join the refugees; it was time to leave.

ELVES: One small group (two 2-person families).
Total: 4 elves (3 adults, 1 child)
Breakdown

Twin Sisters Pomi and Loti
Sisters Pomi and Loti, wanderers who had most recently been florists in [Old City] (2 adults; 2f).

Description: Pomi and Loti grew up in an elven community built around a small hillock in the woods. Born as twins they were inseparable, often getting into trouble for finding themselves in places they adults feared they were to young to visit. In truth this was as much due to egging each other on as much as their natural curiosity. As they grew their wanders took them farther and farther afield, so it was no surprise when they announced they had decided to see the world beyond their forests. Traveling mostly by foot on the few roads available for over five years they were lucky to pass by most of their potential obstacles, but eventually news of their elder sister's declining health directed their travels to [old city]. Upon arriving in [old city] they found their sister had passed on and a niece, Mililani (half-elf), in need of a family so they agreed to take a short break. Two years later they had their florists business thriving but were starting to feel the need to wander again when the dragon broke free...
Marlola
Marlola and her infant, half-dragon son, Acharis (draconic, meaning emerald hope) or "Chris" (adult 1, child 1; 1f, 1m).

Description: What can be said of mice and men, can also be said of dragons, and few dragons have laid more plans than those jaded devils of the deep sylvan woods.

Marlola was one of the few left alive after the carefully crafted ambush had mowed through the tribe. Having felt the full wrath of the dragon, she now faced the full wrath of her kin. Blame was placed, and she was marked.

Marlola survived in the woods with increasing difficulty as the plans of the dragon came to fruition within her. She understood now why her tribe was gone, why she was alone. An elven tribe would have never let the dragon spawn live.

Marlola gave birth to the child alone in the woods. When she saw the child she knew she could not perform any cruel act against it, and it hurt her deeply to know that even this was a calculation of the verdant beast whose name she did not know, though cursed all the same.

She stumbled upon the traveling refugees, scarred, half-starved, and with a heavily swaddled elven half-dragon in her arms. She hoped in vain that the child's wickedly bright, emerald green eyes would be the only telling feature of its patriarchal heritage, but she could only wait.

Full Description Found Here

HALF ELVES: Two individuals (2 adults).
Total: 2 (2 adults)
Breakdown

Mililani
Mililani the young niece of Pomi and Loti, and barwench from the Dragon's Berth (1 adult; 1f).

Description: Mililani is a young half-elf (16 years old) living with aunts Pomi and Loti while working at the bar her mother worked in, the Dragon's Berth. Though her father is not publicly known Mililani has lived a life of love and joy, surrounded by the friendly patrons of the bar. Forced to live alone when her mother died three years ago, she was eventually reunited with her elven heritage when her aunts arrived a year later. Though independent and somewhat brash, her ready smile and lively wit has allowed Mililani to avoid most of the troubles that could be expected of a young girl in a large city.
Full Description Found Here
Jeffers
Jeffers, retired guard, co-owner of the Dragon's Berth (1 adult; 1m).

Description: During his last patrol as city guard, a group of burglars had shattered his right leg, and he had been forced to retire from service. Taking what savings he had, Jeffers found common cause at the Dragon’s Berth. Owned by Bobfin’s grandson, Boffin (?), the bar had become seedy and run down, typically losing money to drinks unpaid. Now as co-owner and cook/part-time bouncer of the Dragon's Berth, he has helped turn it into a well-established tavern and inn that typically caters to both city-folk and wayward travelers. On occasion, his right leg would courses with pain, and it always foretelling of a bad day to come. He has a gruff, somewhat reserved demeanor, but is always honest and helpful, and loves to recount his days as a guard.

ELADRIN: Two tiny groups (two 3-person families), plus one individual.
Total: 7 (4 adult, 2 children, 1 venerable).
Open: 2 adults, 2 children.
Breakdown

Aust's Entourage
Aust Amakiir (lorekeeper), his "nephew" Tier (escort), and Slyvia (2 adult, 1 venerable; 2m, 1f).

Description: Aust Amakiir lives only half in the world. As his body passes into the ether his soul seems to shine through it like a light. He is not long for the world, which may explain why he seemed as serene as ever while the dragon streaked like a bright golden meteor above the darkened streets of the city.

Amakiir [meaning: beautiful silence of dusk] fancies himself a loremaster, which offers the other explanation as to why he was so calm. He knew. Though it is only speculation, it would explain his timely arrival in the city, the countless hours in the library, and how some books just happened to be in his possession rather than at the library when it burned to the ground.

He arrived in town with two young eladrin, Tier, who he introduced as a nephew, and Sylvia his nephew's bride. Tier has a quick wit, and a quick blade, and never strays far from the company of his uncle. Tier seems to be more of guard and escort than young nephew, though Sylvia seems to genuinely be espoused to Tier.

TIEFLING: One individual.
Total: 1 (1 adult)
Breakdown

Moses
Moses, the tiefling priestess (1 adult; 1f).


Catching up over the past couple of days, I have to say I like the way Marlola turned out.

I will bring up a point I find pertinent. The green dragon's scheme has obviously been in play for years, but not nearly as long as the gold dragon has been imprisoned. As long as the green had no clue when or if the gold would be freed, he would have no fear of territorial conflicts.

In addition, if we assume that the timing of Marlola escaping was the same time as the gold breaking free for the first time (the green going to check out what was happening) we can bring the possibility that the green dragon was not necessarily evil with a capital E. Assuming the dragon kept the elves as his vassals and servants, their sudden assault and theft (as Marlola was his "personal" property) could easily drive him into a rage causing him to decimate the tribe. If Marlola escaped in the initial conflict and the green believes her to be alive, he could be searching for her (perhaps he has some spell that tells him his progeny is alive but not where). There is also the possibility that on some level Marlola wants to be found by the green (Stockholm syndrome).

Now I am not proposing that the dragon is not evil, just not mad scientist cackling crazily evil. I see no reason for the green dragon to have killed the elf village just to be cruel. That seems like a waste of resources and beings that are evil just for the sake of being evil has always seemed pointless to me.

And as a last note, assuming the elves had been around/subservient to the green dragon for some time they would have a name for him even if it was not his own. Marlola who actually lived with him for a time, would definitely have a name she referred to him by.
In addition, if we assume that the timing of Marlola escaping was the same time as the gold breaking free for the first time (the green going to check out what was happening) we can bring the possibility that the green dragon was not necessarily evil with a capital E. Assuming the dragon kept the elves as his vassals and servants, their sudden assault and theft (as Marlola was his "personal" property) could easily drive him into a rage causing him to decimate the tribe. If Marlola escaped in the initial conflict and the green believes her to be alive, he could be searching for her (perhaps he has some spell that tells him his progeny is alive but not where). There is also the possibility that on some level Marlola wants to be found by the green (Stockholm syndrome).

You've made a few assumptions that I have not. Which isn't to say that you're wrong, or I'm right, just that we aren't quite seeing eye to eye.

1) "Marlola escaping" - This event (in my presented history) is a calculated act on the part of the green dragon.
2) Simultaneity - The events with the green dragon happen months before the gold dragon escapes, the two events being completely unrelated.
3) Elves as vassals and servants - I don't see this one. Elves don't seem the type to subject themselves to evil dragons, breaking their bonds no matter the cost.
Now I am not proposing that the dragon is not evil, just not mad scientist cackling crazily evil. I see no reason for the green dragon to have killed the elf village just to be cruel. That seems like a waste of resources and beings that are evil just for the sake of being evil has always seemed pointless to me.

The act is not so cruel as it is calculated, to ensure the survival of his offspring. Also, what would a green dragon care for the lives of one tribe of elves in his woods?
And as a last note, assuming the elves had been around/subservient to the green dragon for some time they would have a name for him even if it was not his own. Marlola who actually lived with him for a time, would definitely have a name she referred to him by.

I'm not sure why a tribe of elves would worship a green dragon. My thoughts were that Marlola was kidnapped against her will, then set free. Destroying the elf tribe ensured that they would not end the life of the abomination born form his plotting.

Marlola could have been wandering for a few months before she stumbled across the refugees, which would make sense. The dragon kidnaps Marlola, ensured that his plotting has... taken root, lets her go free back to her tribe, with near immediate retribution. This would leave Marlola only just with child. If the refugees find her with an infant, we can assume that several months have passed since the events of her history transpired.
I'm not sure why a tribe of elves would worship a green dragon. My thoughts were that Marlola was kidnapped against her will, then set free. Destroying the elf tribe ensured that they would not end the life of the abomination born form his plotting.

Marlola could have been wandering for a few months before she stumbled across the refugees, which would make sense. The dragon kidnaps Marlola, ensured that his plotting has... taken root, lets her go free back to her tribe, with near immediate retribution. This would leave Marlola only just with child. If the refugees find her with an infant, we can assume that several months have passed since the events of her history transpired.

That's the part I am having trouble with...the connection between the elves and the green dragon. I think the character idea is cool; I like it a lot. I'm just trying to figure out how it fits in with everything else. I have a few ideas, but since the original idea isn't mine, I don't want to tamper with the idea too much.


However, my idea is that the young boy is actually the embodiment of the gold dragon's sanity and goodness. Marlola is an old Eladrin who is passing herself off as a normal elf. Perhaps there is some sort of legend or myth that Marlola's tribe believes in which states that the boy must either directly slay the dragon or be somehow involved in the slaying of the dragon in order to completely kill the dragon. Otherwise it dies for a time, but then is resurected every full moon (playing on the moon idea which was popular earlier.) However, if the boy slays the dragon or is involved with slaying the dragon he will burst free from his mortal form and once again return to his full glory...however, as the boy, he is unaware of this. If the boy dies it also kills the dragon. The reason Marlola has left her Eladrin kin feel that the easiest (and best solution) to getting rid of the gold dragon menace is by killing the boy. However, Marlola has developed a motherly instinct for the boy and does everything she can to protect him. The looks and personality of the boy could also somewhat reflect what is inside of him...golden hair and eyes, a penchant for doing good, and a bit of a fascination with fire.
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I'm not sure why a tribe of elves would worship a green dragon. My thoughts were that Marlola was kidnapped against her will, then set free. Destroying the elf tribe ensured that they would not end the life of the abomination born form his plotting.

I did not mean to imply they worshiped the dragon, just that they were subservient to it. Along the lines of peons in old Europe; you knew the lord existed but most likely you never saw him and you never really wanted to be under his direct notice.

I also do not imply that Marlola was not kidnapped, though she could have been given as demanded tribute or perhaps she originally gave herself up as a noble sacrifice.

Last, I do not consider it likely that the elves would consider the half-dragon child an abomination unless the dragon was a being pure evil, along that evil for evil's sake theme. The child was just that, a child; why would the elves consider it an abomination more than a blessing, something/someone they could shape in a way that would be more in tune with nature or atleast just not evil.

Marlola could have been wandering for a few months before she stumbled across the refugees, which would make sense. The dragon kidnaps Marlola, ensured that his plotting has... taken root, lets her go free back to her tribe, with near immediate retribution. This would leave Marlola only just with child. If the refugees find her with an infant, we can assume that several months have passed since the events of her history transpired.

This just seems to contrived to me. Along the lines of evil for evil's sake. Why would he want her free just to decimate her tribe and leave her alone wandering the woods with the burden of a child. Decimating her tribe this way just seems cruel. And leaving her alone in the woods with a child seems a sure way to ensure the child's death as the mother would likely find it very hard to survive, especially after being held in captivity for so long; the dragon had no way of knowing the refugees were going to be in the right place at the right time for Marlola to find.

Once again I keep coming back to not liking this story as written because it seems the dragon is unnecessarily cruel (i.e. evil for evil's sake). I can see dragons being cruel but not stupid. The actions of the dragon as currently written seem stupid and wasteful.

Last, how far along was Marlola when she escaped. Did she even know she was pregnant when she ran? Did the dragon? If she was early enough along she might not have known, nor might the dragon. Or perhaps the dragon knew but not her (change in body chemistry causing her personal smell to change). If we go with Marlola escaping when the gold dragon first was freed (because the green dragon was away figuring out what was going on) and she was very early in her pregnancy, it is quite possible for the refugees to find her when she is still pregnant and not yet having given birth.
That's the part I am having trouble with...the connection between the elves and the green dragon. I think the character idea is cool; I like it a lot. I'm just trying to figure out how it fits in with everything else. I have a few ideas, but since the original idea isn't mine, I don't want to tamper with the idea too much.


However, my idea is that the young boy is actually the embodiment of the gold dragon's sanity and goodness. Marlola is an old Eladrin who is passing herself off as a normal elf. Perhaps there is some sort of legend or myth that Marlola's tribe believes in which states that the boy must either directly slay the dragon or be somehow involved in the slaying of the dragon in order to completely kill the dragon. Otherwise it dies for a time, but then is resurected every full moon (playing on the moon idea which was popular earlier.) However, if the boy slays the dragon or is involved with slaying the dragon he will burst free from his mortal form and once again return to his full glory...however, as the boy, he is unaware of this. If the boy dies it also kills the dragon. The reason Marlola has left her Eladrin kin feel that the easiest (and best solution) to getting rid of the gold dragon menace is by killing the boy. However, Marlola has developed a motherly instinct for the boy and does everything she can to protect him. The looks and personality of the boy could also somewhat reflect what is inside of him...golden hair and eyes, a penchant for doing good, and a bit of a fascination with fire.

I don't like this idea for several reasons, but I will articulate only a few.

One, if there is as much difference in manerisms and general coloring as I think there will be between eladrin and elves, I find it unlikely that anyone other than a trained actor/rogue could pull off this deception for long. Even with magic to conceal/change your appearance the mannerisms would be all wrong and noticed fairly quickly by the other elves and the people used to associating with elves.

Two, the child of destiny theme is a bit contrived and overdone. It also creates a character that's destiny will always overshadow any players in the local scene. If the characters can never permanently kill the dragon unless the drag along a whining/screaming brat with them, then that brat's more important than them and has a greater destiny.

Last, gold hair/eyes and a good personality for the boy to show off its heritage... We already know the designers have said they are getting away from the "all metallic dragons are good" concept, so this heritage has no basis.
the dreaded double post...
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I don't like this idea for several reasons, but I will articulate only a few.

One, if there is as much difference in manerisms and general coloring as I think there will be between eladrin and elves, I find it unlikely that anyone other than a trained actor/rogue could pull off this deception for long. Even with magic to conceal/change your appearance the mannerisms would be all wrong and noticed fairly quickly by the other elves and the people used to associating with elves.

Two, the child of destiny theme is a bit contrived and overdone. It also creates a character that's destiny will always overshadow any players in the local scene. If the characters can never permanently kill the dragon unless the drag along a whining/screaming brat with them, then that brat's more important than them and has a greater destiny.

Last, gold hair/eyes and a good personality for the boy to show off its heritage... We already know the designers have said they are getting away from the "all metallic dragons are good" concept, so this heritage has no basis.

Fair enough, I was just trying to propose an alternative idea.

As for not all metallics being good...I was under the impression the dragon was a good creature before it went mad. The reason the Devil chose the binding of the dragon for the pact was because having the original villages betray a good and moral creature was required. It also dirtied the hands of the villagers and made them sinners (sorry for the biblical wording, but I wasn't sure what other word to use.)

The characters can permanently kill the dragon without bringing the boy along by simply killing the boy. This presents two different ways to complete the same quest. A party with mostly good intentions will probably frown upon killing a helpless boy; a party with less than good intentions would probably have no problem with it. I feel this presents the most angles for which to enable this plot hook to be used.

As for the child of destiny cliche...yes, I agree. It is cliche, but not anymore cliche than the child with a deep dark secret. It need not even overshadow the rest of the community. Being that Marlola tries to protect him from harm, I could see her as being an overly protective mother, and the boy would scarcely be seen in public.

I do realize that not being able to kill the dragon permanently is a big pain in the arse. There's a way around that though. Limit the distance that the crazed gold dragon is allowed to go from his prison. Perhaps the dragon can only go X amount of miles away from the ord or whatever it is that the dragon was imprisioned in. The site of the original city could be largely abandoned due to the presence of the dragon. This also creates a reason for the dragon to have at least some level of need for lesser minions - they can go where he can't. It creates a great scene for a series of site based adventures. "The Ruined City of The Golden Dragon"


Anyway, that's just my idea. I'll support a better idea if there is one.
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The characters can permanently kill the dragon without bringing the boy along by simply killing the boy. This presents two different ways to complete the same quest. A party with mostly good intentions will probably frown upon killing a helpless boy; a party with less than good intentions would probably have no problem with it. I feel this presents the most angles for which to enable this plot hook to be used.

If we assume a good party, and I think for most gaming groups we can, the killing of the child will never be a viable choice. Even for most neutral groups, if there is any other choice, the idea of killing a child is will not be an acceptable option. If the group is evil, killing the child is an option but then they will have the refugees/citizens of the new city after them for doing something so evil when there was other options. In the end killing the child is never a good solution so I can not really credit it as a viable solution.

I do realize that not being able to kill the dragon permanently is a big pain in the arse. There's a way around that though. Limit the distance that the crazed gold dragon is allowed to go from his prison. Perhaps the dragon can only go X amount of miles away from the ord or whatever it is that the dragon was imprisioned in. The site of the original city could be largely abandoned due to the presence of the dragon. This also creates a reason for the dragon to have at least some level of need for lesser minions - they can go where he can't. It creates a great scene for a series of site based adventures. "The Ruined City of The Golden Dragon"

I have proposed something similar and most everybody seems to be treating the dragon as someone who does not travel all the far from the old city though this has never been voted upon.
Johnny, I understand your concern about the connection between the Green and the elf tribe. How I interpreted PR's story is as follows... may cast a different light on the matter. It also addresses Kage's evil for evil's sake concern.

Marlola's story interpretation

Marlola was captured by the Green. In the days after her capture, she was tormented by the dragon and played with. A cat with a new toy so to speak. She was also taken advantage of while the Green was in humanoid form.

As part of his plan, the Green left, giving her the oppurtunity to escape back to the village and have her hastily raise the elves to arms. The effect of this was that the elves, led by Marlola, came right to the dragon's doorstep... food delivery of the Green's favorite dish. They were devastated, the dragon was fed, and Marlola escaped in the carnage. This easy food delivery was the extent of his plan (not evil for evil sake, just lazy and hungry and knows it's easier to defeat a foe on its terms then attacking the village itself)

The Green may (not know/does not care/will make use of the child decades later if he happens to survive) that Marlola is with his child. He got his meal and is happy. Marlola knows she cannot return to her clan since she is the one to blame. So, she is forced to give birth to the child in the wild and try to make it on her own. Only by pure luck does she encounter the refugees and a chance to survive.


As for your idea about the child's connection to a dragon, I thought of a similar idea earlier but discarded it due to its resemblance to Dragonheart. I do like the notion that the quest with the Gold Dragon has two different ways of completing it. Maybe instead of killing the Gold, finding a cure for its insanity??
Johnny, I understand your concern about the connection between the Green and the elf tribe. How I interpreted PR's story is as follows... may cast a different light on the matter. It also addresses Kage's evil for evil's sake concern.

Marlola's story interpretation

Marlola was captured by the Green. In the days after her capture, she was tormented by the dragon and played with. A cat with a new toy so to speak. She was also taken advantage of while the Green was in humanoid form.

As part of his plan, the Green left, giving her the oppurtunity to escape back to the village and have her hastily raise the elves to arms. The effect of this was that the elves, led by Marlola, came right to the dragon's doorstep... food delivery of the Green's favorite dish. They were devastated, the dragon was fed, and Marlola escaped in the carnage. This easy food delivery was the extent of his plan (not evil for evil sake, just lazy and hungry and knows it's easier to defeat a foe on its terms then attacking the village itself)

The Green may (not know/does not care/will make use of the child decades later if he happens to survive) that Marlola is with his child. He got his meal and is happy. Marlola knows she cannot return to her clan since she is the one to blame. So, she is forced to give birth to the child in the wild and try to make it on her own. Only by pure luck does she encounter the refugees and a chance to survive.


As for your idea about the child's connection to a dragon, I thought of a similar idea earlier but discarded it due to its resemblance to Dragonheart. I do like the notion that the quest with the Gold Dragon has two different ways of completing it. Maybe instead of killing the Gold, finding a cure for its insanity??

I didn't have a huge concern. I think/thought the idea is/was cool. I just wasn't entirely sure how it fit into the rest of the story.

The chance encounter explanation works for me.
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Dracolich, PerennialRook, Johnny_Angel, and I have been going round and round working on the back story of Marlola and her child. Since several different sets of ideas have come up so I thought I would create my own for comparison.

Here is PerennialRook’s original Marlola back story:

Marlola

Marlola and her infant, half-dragon son, Acharis (draconic, meaning emerald hope) or "Chris" (adult 1, child 1; 1m, 1f).

What can be said of mice and men, can also be said of dragons, and few dragons have laid more plans than those jaded devils of the deep sylvan woods.

Marlola could not know the grand design of her captor, only the punishment she bore at his hands. Then suddenly the verdant menace was gone and she was abandoned. With a swiftness only managed by elves, she whisked through the woods back to her tribe, crystal tears following her like a stream.

She was barely coherent, and her cries enraged the tribe to an epic fervor. The hunt was on.

What Marlola could not have understood was that this was part of the demon's plan. The green dragon had played the tribe as beautifully as a wind instrument in the expert hands of a satyr, and she had been the reed. For all the cunning of the elves, in heated passion they had neglected the great planning it required to best a dragon, and they paid in blood.

Marlola was one of the few left alive after the carefully crafted ambush had mowed through the tribe. Having felt the full wrath of the dragon, she now faced the full wrath of her kin. Blame was placed, and she was marked.

Marlola survived in the woods with increasing difficulty as the plans of the dragon came to fruition within her. She understood now why her tribe was gone, why she was alone. An elven tribe would have never let the dragon spawn live.

Marlola gave birth to the child alone in the woods. When she saw the child she knew she could not perform any cruel act against it, and it hurt her deeply to know that even this was a calculation of the verdant beast whose name she did not know, though cursed all the same.

She stumbled upon the traveling refugees, scarred, half-starved, and with a heavily swaddled elven half-dragon in her arms. She hoped in vain that the child's wickedly bright, emerald green eyes would be the only telling feature of its patriarchal heritage, but she could only wait.

Here is Dracolich’s recent version:

Marlola's story interpretation

Marlola was captured by the Green. In the days after her capture, she was tormented by the dragon and played with. A cat with a new toy so to speak. She was also taken advantage of while the Green was in humanoid form.

As part of his plan, the Green left, giving her the oppurtunity to escape back to the village and have her hastily raise the elves to arms. The effect of this was that the elves, led by Marlola, came right to the dragon's doorstep... food delivery of the Green's favorite dish. They were devastated, the dragon was fed, and Marlola escaped in the carnage. This easy food delivery was the extent of his plan (not evil for evil sake, just lazy and hungry and knows it's easier to defeat a foe on its terms then attacking the village itself)

The Green may (not know/does not care/will make use of the child decades later if he happens to survive) that Marlola is with his child. He got his meal and is happy. Marlola knows she cannot return to her clan since she is the one to blame. So, she is forced to give birth to the child in the wild and try to make it on her own. Only by pure luck does she encounter the refugees and a chance to survive.

------------------------

And here is mine:

Marlola
The elves of village Erdoseg had long lived under a dark shadow; the shadow that of the green dragon they called Smaragdzold. Smaragdzold was cruel and capricious, treating Erdoseg and its inhabitants as just another coffer in his hoard. Sadly for the village, Smaragdzold had killed all those strong enough to resist him when he first conquered the area and over time the village had slowly grown complacent under his harsh dominance. When Smaragdzold asked for the beautiful girl child Marlola, the citizens of Erdoseg found it just another in the long line of harsh demands their new master had made of them. Though reluctant, they had long lost the will to resist and so gave her up in the end; their one comfort was that the dragon could not require her to serve as some male lords might require.

In this they were mistaken, as Marlola found out almost two years into her captivity when she found not the dragon she had come to expect in the lair but what appeared to be an elf. Smaragozold had long had the ability to assume the form of one of the lesser races but had not felt the need in some time; returning from a trip to a local city he had not heard his servant approaching and so was unprepared for her to see him. So revealed, he decided to press Marlola for service in his other form, something he had never done previously. Long inured to his demands and grown used to his company, Marlola eventually succumbed.

For years this continued; sometimes Marlola would serve as the dragon’s handmaiden, sometimes as her cruel elf lord’s mistress. Eventually as such things will, Marlola found herself pregnant. Frightened and emotionally alone she felt more trapped than ever before and for once she contemplated escape as more than just a death wish. She found her opportunity one night when her lord suddenly jerked up saying “Impossible, she’s free…” before transforming into his scaled form and racing from the lair. Seeing no other opportunity forthcoming Marlola fled, running to her home village hoping to find solace. Though surprised to see her the villagers quickly took her in, but instead of finding the solace she needed she found the villagers becoming enraged when she explained that the dragon could not only transform into the form of an elf, but had been treating her as a mistress while doing so. The stress of long servitude had finally found a focus in the mistreatment of Marlola and so the village gathered together to assault the dragon’s lair.

Smaradgzold had spent several days watching over the release of [gold dragon] from her prison inside [old city] and having determined she was still confined to the area around the city returned to his lair. Returning he found Marlola missing and the elves gathering to assault his home with her in their midst. Infuriated by the elves affront of gathering arms against him and stealing his property Smaradgzold began to assault the village before the elves could prepare. Several quick passes laying his breath weapon over the largest gatherings of elves devastated the warriors and ended all resistance, but so angered was the dragon that he landed in the village and began slaughtering any elves he saw. Marlola, long forgotten in the growing mob's need to fight back against Smaradgzold, had found herself at the outskirts of the village when he attacked and began fleeing without thought beyond escape for herself and her child.

Coming to her senses several days later, Marlola could not overcome her guilt and return to her village knowing she had brought devastation upon her once home. Traveling through the woods and mountains she barely scrapped by, growing more and more emancipated as she fought for the survival of her child. Several months later, having cowered and hidden anytime a possible shadow appeared in the sky, Marlola was found by Ariana as she scouted for the refugees under her care. Finding her nearly incoherent, Ariana eventually coaxed Marlola to return with her to the other refugees where she could find care and the solace she needed among others who had suffered such loss. The refugees quickly realized Marlola was pregnant, but had no idea until the child was born after reaching the redoubt that its parentage was not wholly elven.
Dracolich, PerennialRook, Johnny_Angel, and I have been going round and round working on the back story of Marlola and her child. Since several different sets of ideas have come up so I thought I would create my own for comparison.

And here is mine:

Kage_no_Neko's Marlola
Marlola
The elves of village Erdoseg had long lived under a dark shadow; the shadow that of the green dragon they called Smaragdzold. Smaragdzold was cruel and capricious, treating Erdoseg and its inhabitants as just another coffer in his hoard. Sadly for the village, Smaragdzold had killed all those strong enough to resist him when he first conquered the area and over time the village had slowly grown complacent under his harsh dominance. When Smaragdzold asked for the beautiful girl child Marlola, the citizens of Erdoseg found it just another in the long line of harsh demands their new master had made of them. Though reluctant, they had long lost the will to resist and so gave her up in the end; their one comfort was that the dragon could not require her to serve as some male lords might require.

In this they were mistaken, as Marlola found out almost two years into her captivity when she found not the dragon she had come to expect in the lair but what appeared to be an elf. Smaragozold had long had the ability to assume the form of one of the lesser races but had not felt the need in some time; returning from a trip to a local city he had not heard his servant approaching and so was unprepared for her to see him. So revealed, he decided to press Marlola for service in his other form, something he had never done previously. Long inured to his demands and grown used to his company, Marlola eventually succumbed.

For years this continued; sometimes Marlola would serve as the dragon’s handmaiden, sometimes as her cruel elf lord’s mistress. Eventually as such things will, Marlola found herself pregnant. Frightened and emotionally alone she felt more trapped than ever before and for once she contemplated escape as more than just a death wish. She found her opportunity one night when her lord suddenly jerked up saying “Impossible, she’s free…” before transforming into his scaled form and racing from the lair. Seeing no other opportunity forthcoming Marlola fled, running to her home village hoping to find solace. Though surprised to see her the villagers quickly took her in, but instead of finding the solace she needed she found the villagers becoming enraged when she explained that the dragon could not only transform into the form of an elf, but had been treating her as a mistress while doing so. The stress of long servitude had finally found a focus in the mistreatment of Marlola and so the village gathered together to assault the dragon’s lair.

Smaradgzold had spent several days watching over the release of [gold dragon] from her prison inside [old city] and having determined she was still confined to the area around the city returned to his lair. Returning he found Marlola missing and the elves gathering to assault his home with her in their midst. Infuriated by the elves affront of gathering arms against him and stealing his property Smaradgzold began to assault the village before the elves could prepare. Several quick passes laying his breath weapon over the largest gatherings of elves devastated the warriors and ended all resistance, but so angered was the dragon that he landed in the village and began slaughtering any elves he saw. Marlola, long forgotten in the growing mob's need to fight back against Smaradgzold, had found herself at the outskirts of the village when he attacked and began fleeing without thought beyond escape for herself and her child.

Coming to her senses several days later, Marlola could not overcome her guilt and return to her village knowing she had brought devastation upon her once home. Traveling through the woods and mountains she barely scrapped by, growing more and more emancipated as she fought for the survival of her child. Several months later, having cowered and hidden anytime a possible shadow appeared in the sky, Marlola was found by Ariana as she scouted for the refugees under her care. Finding her nearly incoherent, Ariana eventually coaxed Marlola to return with her to the other refugees where she could find care and the solace she needed among others who had suffered such loss. The refugees quickly realized Marlola was pregnant, but had no idea until the child was born after reaching the redoubt that its parentage was not wholly elven.

My problem with this version is that all of the characters are weakened. Marlola becomes a "hot subserviant slavegirl" and the green dragon becomes a reactive evil menace.

I imagine Marlola as an elf chosen to bear the child of the green dragon for her strength and virility. The green dragon would have to think that she could survive on her own burdened greatly with child.

I imagine the green dragon, not as a reactive brute, but a keen mastermind, with his actions thought out several decades into the future. He does not rule with overt power, but manipulates and pulls stings like a master puppeteer. Only when he must destroy the entire tribe of elves does he show his hand, and he is unrelenting in his slaughter. He let's Marlola go because that is part of the plan. Her trials ensure that she will bond with the child and protect the child with a vengeance unmeasured. To say that she escaped on her own accord is to reduce the green dragon to a stooge.

One backstory has a strong protagonist and a cunning antagonist, the other has a protagonist who is lucky at best (who could not survive the wild, IMO) and a brutal antagonist.

I guess the question is whether we want her to be a strong empowered female character or... a slavegirl? And do we imagine green dragons as lording brutes or cunning masterminds?
First, let me apologize to everyone for what seems to me a has having side tracked this thread a little with Marlola's tale.

Kage, very well written back story, most enjoyable. At this point I can see either yours or PR/Mine back story's working.

Kage, your interpretations of the Green has having a more humanistic is a nice twist upon the usual evil dragon story. Lot of little nuances in its character. The story tie with the Gold dragon can be removed/reworked if people feel it is inappropriate for the two to have encountered each other. The only issue I have... why didn't she run away during the prior instances of the Green leaving its lair? Maybe in its haste forgot to lock her up?

It will be interesting to hear which tale everyone else likes best. My vote is with PR/Mine only for the fact I like to think of Greens as having a sweet tooth for elven flesh.
First, let me apologize to everyone for what seems to me a has having side tracked this thread a little with Marlola's tale.

Kage, very well written back story, most enjoyable. At this point I can see either yours or PR/Mine back story's working.

Kage, your interpretations of the Green has having a more humanistic is a nice twist upon the usual evil dragon story. Lot of little nuances in its character. The story tie with the Gold dragon can be removed/reworked if people feel it is inappropriate for the two to have encountered each other. The only issue I have... why didn't she run away during the prior instances of the Green leaving its lair? Maybe in its haste forgot to lock her up?

It will be interesting to hear which tale everyone else likes best. My vote is with PR/Mine only for the fact I like to think of Greens as having a sweet tooth for elven flesh.

Upon further thought, I support Draco's story. I like the idea of a big fat lazy green dragon. That's how I envision the dragon. It also gives a possible source for our aforementioned hostile humanoids. Perhaps they were servants of the green dragon.

Either way, my vote sides with Draco.
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First, let me apologize to everyone for what seems to me a has having side tracked this thread a little with Marlola's tale.

It is a fun sidetrack. We have to do something for the next few months. :D

Kage, your interpretations of the Green has having a more humanistic is a nice twist upon the usual evil dragon story. Lot of little nuances in its character. The story tie with the Gold dragon can be removed/reworked if people feel it is inappropriate for the two to have encountered each other. The only issue I have... why didn't she run away during the prior instances of the Green leaving its lair? Maybe in its haste forgot to lock her up?

I always try to play down the human side of the... less compassionate dragons. Even good dragons (in my world) are inhuman in their ideals.

I think that whatever transpires between the gold dragon and the green dragon is up to DM's that run with this city/world, as it has no impact on our new city.

Also, a green dragon should never act in haste and doesn't have to lock up single captives, they can dominate them, or whatever 4E ability/ritual the green dragons end up with to retain this flavor.

It will be interesting to hear which tale everyone else likes best. My vote is with PR/Mine only for the fact I like to think of Greens as having a sweet tooth for elven flesh.

Hurray for elven flesh!
Upon further thought, I support Draco's story. I like the idea of a big fat lazy green dragon. That's how I envision the dragon. It also gives a possible source for our aforementioned hostile humanoids. Perhaps they were servants of the green dragon.

Either way, my vote sides with Draco.

As for hostile humanoids, with the recent releases of 4E info, I vote for Gnolls! Man do I love gnolls...
The more I think about it, the more I like Draco's idea of the lazy green dragon. I can envision an encounter in which the PCs come across him laying lazily in the sun like a big fat crocodile sunning himself. For some reason I have this odd idea that his personality would be a strange cross between a lazy crocodile (or possibly lion might be a better analogy) and the Cheshire Cat from Alice In Wonderland. The reflect this idea you could adjust his stats by treating him as one size category larger for effects such as grappling and to calculate the damage dice for his tail slap and crush damage (if 4E still has crush damage,) but the drawback would be that his speed would be slightly less and his flying ability would be one category worse.
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As for hostile humanoids, with the recent releases of 4E info, I vote for Gnolls! Man do I love gnolls...

Gnolls work for me. I always want to use gnolls in my games, but I can never think of an interesting way to tie them into a story.
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My problem with this version is that all of the characters are weakened. Marlola becomes a "hot subserviant slavegirl" and the green dragon becomes a reactive evil menace.

I said she was pretty, but I was not really thinking along the lines of "hot subservient slave girl". I also do not consider the dragon a reactive evil menace, it is quite possible for it to have several on going plots and actions that it was involved in. For example, perhaps it is the leader that inspired the gnolls to attack [old city], and when the gold dragon was released and the gnolls suddenly started to revere the dragon leader that would appear when they attacked (and it was the wrong dragon) his plans went awry and he is currently having to work around that issue. Perhaps by turning his attention to the refugees and his wayward property.

I imagine Marlola as an elf chosen to bear the child of the green dragon for her strength and virility. The green dragon would have to think that she could survive on her own burdened greatly with child.

I imagine the green dragon, not as a reactive brute, but a keen mastermind, with his actions thought out several decades into the future. He does not rule with overt power, but manipulates and pulls stings like a master puppeteer. Only when he must destroy the entire tribe of elves does he show his hand, and he is unrelenting in his slaughter. He let's Marlola go because that is part of the plan. Her trials ensure that she will bond with the child and protect the child with a vengeance unmeasured. To say that she escaped on her own accord is to reduce the green dragon to a stooge.

Several people seem to support your idea for the lazy yet cunning dragon, but it just does not make sense to me. Here is this great and cunning dragon that comes up with a plan to sire a half-dragon/half-elf child; fine why? After he creates the child he releases his mother only to immediately slaughter the village she travels to; what's the point? This is not cunning, it is just cruel. How is this action in any way supporting the dragon's long term goals? A thriving town/village he can demand continued tribute from makes more sense for a lazy creature than a risky proposal creating a child for some obscure goal does not mesh with the personality as people keep describing him.

Let's not forget that a person put into extreme abuse and peril has many ways out. Perhaps instead of allowing the child to be born she aborts him. Or the stress of watching her village be slaughtered, or the continuing harrasment causes her to spontaneously abort her pregnancy. Or even later the stress might cause her to commit suicide, perhaps taking the child or leaving it to the elements. Sometimes it is the people we think are the strongest which crack the quickest or the worst under pressure. A truly cunning individual who has spent centuries watching over humanoids would realize this. Would such a dragon be willing to risk a long term, decades long plan to such a simple thing as a personal breakdown due to stress.

And to call the dragon a stooge in the way I have written him hardly does him justice. As I wrote it I considered him someone who broke Marlola early on, and it was only the need to save her child that gave her the courage to fight back and run away. Why would he fear his broken slave running away, he has had business elsewhere before and she has always been there when he got back. And reactionary? It is only when the peons which exist only to serve him become uppity, stealing his property and taking up arms does he become enraged; and name any dragon which would not become enraged in such a situation.

One backstory has a strong protagonist and a cunning antagonist, the other has a protagonist who is lucky at best (who could not survive the wild, IMO) and a brutal antagonist.

I guess the question is whether we want her to be a strong empowered female character or... a slavegirl? And do we imagine green dragons as lording brutes or cunning masterminds?

See, I read your story and I see a weak female character and a brute, not a mastermind. Your female is chosen, kidnapped, raped, set free through no abilities of her own, and when she turns for help the dragon destroys anyone who does help her. Sure she may be physically tough, but how does that make her a strong character emotionally. To me it just seems like she is a broken doll constantly running at the dragons prod, and the dragon seems like a brute who does not care about the girl or child just causing misery.

In my story, I make no mention of the dragon's other plans (though I wrote one above) but it obviously had some as his being caught unaware in elf guise showed. In addition while Marlola starts out broken, the discovery of her unborn child reawakens her sense of self and need to survive outside the bounds of her cruel master. She is rediscovering her true self after years of abuse and with the help of the refugees can become a stronger person and a good mother for her child. Eventually she may even be strong enough to confront her captor.
For example, perhaps it is the leader that inspired the gnolls to attack [old city], and when the gold dragon was released and the gnolls suddenly started to revere the dragon leader that would appear when they attacked (and it was the wrong dragon) his plans went awry and he is currently having to work around that issue. Perhaps by turning his attention to the refugees and his wayward property.

I love the idea of the gnolls thinking the Gold is their choosen leader, when it was in fact the Green's idea to use middle men to instigate the Gnolls to attack in the first place.


Several people seem to support your idea for the lazy yet cunning dragon, but it just does not make sense to me. Here is this great and cunning dragon that comes up with a plan to sire a half-dragon/half-elf child; fine why?

I was thinking more along the lines of an accidental pregnancy. He was having a little extra fun with his bait... when oops, he's now a father. As for the village slaughter... I saw it as a band of elves rising up in arms, heading out to the lair of the Green, and becoming the dragon's meal for the next week or so. The Green cunningly had his meal delivered.


Why would he fear his broken slave running away, he has had business elsewhere before and she has always been there when he got back.

Very good explanation on why she hadn't run away earlier. Although PR does make a good point as well, that Green's are known to have influential magic. Either explanation would work for either story.

I have to agree with you Kage about the characterization of the Green and Marlola in your story. More dynamic then the characters in PR/Mine back story.

As for your description Johnny, lazy croc crossed with the cheshire.... that's just too funny

Dang... now I'm torn between the two ideas
Kage, your dragon strikes me as a red dragon, ruling by brute force and treasuring his hoard above all else. You describe the dragon as, "cruel and capricious" and say that he treats the elven tribe as "just another coffer in his hoard." The dragon deals with his biggest threats by outright killing them, rather than manipulation and mental domination.

Then you describe the type of tribe that Marlola is raised in as complacient and lacking the will to resist, mentioning that she is demanded because of her beauty. The elves give into his demands out of fear of their "master," who rules like a lord.

Then Marlola surprises a dragon in his humanoid form (apparently she is epically stealthy), at which point it just decides to have its way with her?

Then after years of captivity, she manages to escape, which seems out of character (apparently she is a high level adventurer, most likely rogue). If she was so "long inured to his demands" and "used to his company," why would she randomly try and escape? "I'm pregnant, so I might as well die..."???

The general attitude of most of the posters seem to indicate that we don't want to tie the green dragon to the gold dragon, and it seems strange that he would somehow "know" that it was free.

Then she returns to her tribe and they suddenly find the will to fight? The mistreatment of one child, not the methodical slaughter of their leaders, enrages them?

On top of that, the green dragon loses his temper because... why again? Why can't he just take her back? If all the threats are gone and he does not fear the elves, and they pay tribute to him, why does he suddenly turn into a brute and begin to destroy them in a fit of rage?

Also, you mention that the elves prepare, then contradict yourself when the dragon preys on them unawares... just sayin'.

Then she takes the coward's way out, even though she escaped, risking death, to return to her tribe, and is barely able to scrape by in the wilderness until she is saved by Ariana and the rest of the refugees, becoming a burden rather than a boon.

In all, Marlola seems very weak, and the dragon seems brutish, impetuous, and wrathful.
my official vote is that I am supporting Draco's story
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Kage, your dragon strikes me as a red dragon, ruling by brute force and treasuring his hoard above all else. You describe the dragon as, "cruel and capricious" and say that he treats the elven tribe as "just another coffer in his hoard." The dragon deals with his biggest threats by outright killing them, rather than manipulation and mental domination.

What dragon doesn't treasure his hoard. The tribe is not a threat, more an annoyance that got out of hand. I said before that when the dragon first arrived he destroyed those who could offer strong resistance and then broke the will of the community so they could be good little serfs.

Then you describe the type of tribe that Marlola is raised in as complacient and lacking the will to resist, mentioning that she is demanded because of her beauty. The elves give into his demands out of fear of their "master," who rules like a lord.

So what? She is just the next piece of tribute he demanded. He has been ruling over the tribe for years/decades(/centuries?); what is one more abuse?

Then Marlola surprises a dragon in his humanoid form (apparently she is epically stealthy), at which point it just decides to have its way with her?

She surprises the dragon because it was distracted and he was not expecting her as he had been away. Perhaps his senses were also somewhat dulled in this form? Or maybe he was thinking about something else and it slipped his mind to consider her seeing him? There are many reasons and none of them require Marlola to be acting particularly stealthy.

After his ability to change form, something he had not bothered to show her before (either because he did not want her to know or he just did not really think about it) why not have his way with her? Obviously as a dragon if he wants kids he would go to another dragon. All the stories generally say dragons seem to go forever between matings (preferring princesses as snacks rather than playthings), why should this green be any different. And perhaps Marlola finding him in elf form dredged up some new fear in her, a fear the dragon recognizes and starts to play upon. This seems perfectly reasonable for a cruel and capricious beast. Sex might not have come to mind because it was to much of a hassle changing forms before just for that purpose, but like a cat shown a new toy once it is in front of him he stalks and pounces.


Then after years of captivity, she manages to escape, which seems out of character (apparently she is a high level adventurer, most likely rogue). If she was so "long inured to his demands" and "used to his company," why would she randomly try and escape? "I'm pregnant, so I might as well die..."???

Two things, I in no way indicate that she is any sort of "adventurer". She is a broken woman who has now found a reason to see beyond her belief that trying to escape is a death wish; that reason is her unborn child. The dragon flew off to discover what had suddenly drawn his interest, the gold dragon escaping, something that would throw off the plans of any major power in the region; especially if those long term plans involve setting up an attack on the city where the gold is now rampaging.

This is a major change, many if not most of his plans are having to go into contingency mode. He is troubled, not because he is not prepared, but because he does not have a contingency plan for just this sort of situation. Who really expects a mythical trapped [some large size] gold dragon, probably trapped long before the green was even born, to suddenly start rampaging over the countryside or atleast the (reasonably) local major city? So stressed as he is having to adjust he comes home to find his property stolen and the rabble rising. Perhaps he snapped, this is a minor thing to him, but by taking his aggression out on these upstart elves he can calm down and begin making the adjustments necessary to bring his plans back into line.

The general attitude of most of the posters seem to indicate that we don't want to tie the green dragon to the gold dragon, and it seems strange that he would somehow "know" that it was free.

In what way is the green dragon tied to the gold. His plans involve the local area and the goings on there in. The gold dragon breaking loose and running rampage is going to affect everyones' plans if they are concerned about the area. Just because he is having to adjust his plans does not mean the green dragon is directly tied to the gold. Even in my story, the green observed the gold for a few days (not interacted with) before deciding to return and make plans.

As for knowing how, perhaps he kept magical watchers in the city. Or had used some sort of mind magic to keep track of the thoughts of key individuals in the city. Perhaps there was just a magical pulse of some sort with the flavor(?) of gold dragon and he knew, unlike most of the citizens of the city, of her old imprisonment. Any of these are viable explanations that do not explicitly tie the green to the gold.

Then she returns to her tribe and they suddenly find the will to fight? The mistreatment of one child, not the methodical slaughter of their leaders, enrages them?

The slaughter of their leaders was long ago (by my story). The town has been under the dragons thumb for a long time. Resentments breed and grow, but irrational unfocused anger generally needs a trigger or focus. Marlola's return acts as that trigger causing the youth and those who have forgotten or have chosen to forget the past, to rise up.

On top of that, the green dragon loses his temper because... why again? Why can't he just take her back? If all the threats are gone and he does not fear the elves, and they pay tribute to him, why does he suddenly turn into a brute and begin to destroy them in a fit of rage?

I mentioned this above. The elves are not an issue in the long run. They are just the obvious thorn in his side after suddenly having all of his plans thrown for a lurch. An easy target and an outlet for his anger. Everyone snaps, he is just doing it in a methodical way by destroying the minor issue so he can have a calm head when he needs to think about the bigger issues.

Also, you mention that the elves prepare, then contradict yourself when the dragon preys on them unawares... just sayin'.

No. I said the elves were preparing to assault his lair, not that they were prepared for his attack. He returns, finds his lair empty, tracks Marlola down and finds her in the middle of the village and them gathering arms. He goes, "I do not have time for this ... I have more important things to deal with and these scum, who I have taken care of, demanding so little of in the past, are now stealing from me and planning on attacking me. Enough is enough. This ends now, I will destroy them so I can work on the bigger problems." Simple enough even for a being who does not think in human terms to want to end the minor annoyance so he can work on the important topics.

Then she takes the coward's way out, even though she escaped, risking death, to return to her tribe, and is barely able to scrape by in the wilderness until she is saved by Ariana and the rest of the refugees, becoming a burden rather than a boon.

Of course she takes the cowards way out. She has been a slave for years, broken mentally and emotionally. It is only with the threat to her child that she even begins to recover. She has been on the run for days when the dragon attacks again after having been its slave for years, she is going to keep running.

Your version does the same thing without having been mentally broken apparently; she runs back and rallies the troops, then when they are decimated she begins running and keeps doing so at the prodding of her dragon brute. How is your version any different at this point?

And it is the fact that my version of Marlola first arrives as a burden, someone who is broken yet trying to heal, that makes her an interesting character. She may start out a burden, but she has shared history with the refugees and with time can grow, possibly becoming a major figure in the new city. It will not be immediate, and she may never be as big as Ariana and the others (though I would like her too) but the fact the she does recover and stand tall with the help of the refugees that allows them some hope. Obviously, having been held captive, mentally broken, and raped for years (in addition to having her home destroyed) makes her worse off than most of the other refugees; through her growth and recovery at their hands they can find a light to guide them through their own individual darknesses.

In all, Marlola seems very weak, and the dragon seems brutish, impetuous, and wrathful.

Once again, in this I see your version of the dragon and not mine. Your dragon appears to me to be the mad scientist/terrorists in all the old movies (or Dr. Evil in Austin Powers). He is so focused on his one specific goal that is not thought out well that he has lost sight of anything else. Any person is fragile, letting his captive that he raped go free immediately means she has too many choices to choose from. She could decide she is defiled and instead of going back to town kills herself (does she even know she is pregnant at this point?). She may have been to ashamed to return to town and run in the opposite direction. Even running back to town, what is the point of slaughtering everyone? Supposedly this is all part of a plan but it seems silly; it is easy enough for her to get caught in the cross fire when protecting her is his supposed goal. Then prodding her along without her knowing till she joins up with the refugees? Basically you are saying that the green dragon is going to be (figuratively) breathing down the necks of the refugees from the get go. And it does not seem like your green is in any way affected by the gold's escape.

My version does indeed have Marlola start out as both weak and amazingly strong. She has suffered years of mental, physical, emotional, and sexual abuse, but now finding herself pregnant she has rediscovered a reason to struggle and persevere as an individual rather than just an automaton. After realizing she is pregnant, she takes the biggest risk of her life at the first opportunity that presents itself to flee, a strong action for a broken person.

The dragon is also a strong character but in a different way than you imply yours is. My dragon has some nebulous goals far above the machinations of any one individual or a lonely tribe of elves. They are beneath his notice in the long run (at this time, they may have had a more important part in the past). Suddenly when faced with the big issues he is working on going awry he is also faced with a minor annoyance trying to spring up; why waste the resources treating it as a big deal when more important things are happening? Squash it like a bug quickly and easily now so he can worry about more important things. Marlola and the child are incidental, they may become important to him in the future but they are not at that point yet in comparison to all his other plans which have some concrete basis in "reality" :P . This has the added benefit of making the green dragon a possible long term foe/political adversary/potential ally against the gold dragon without making him an immediate threat to the refugees.

---------------------------

At this point I have to say I do not think we can agree or talk each other out of our points. You say my dragon is a laggard and a brute, and I say the same about yours. You say my Marlola is weak (and I agree that she is, but she is also strong) and I say yours is. I have to say, with your characters as written I would never have your Marlola as more than scenery in any story I wrote, the boy might play a stronger roll but she just seems like a puppet to be controlled by those around her. Mine I could see brought in first by the other refugees until she becomes strong enough to bring herself to the fore. Perhaps for you my Marlola would never grow and she would be the scenery.

I think at this point it is time to put it up to a vote on the forum. You and I obviously do not count as our opinions are to entrenched, and I would like to say Dracolich and Johnny_Angel should not vote since they are so tied into our recent discussions (but that is not true, they just have supported you so far so I don't want them to count :D ). How about we say a week's time for votes for either your or my proposal?

EDIT: Added sblock containing relevant posts of discussion for those interested. If we keep this up to date and include any further posts for this discussion in it can bring anyone new to the discussion up to speed rather quickly.

I actually didn't support the idea at first (which I believe I alluded to in my first post about the subject.) However, Draco's idea grew on me. The way I envision the dragon is similar to the Cheshire Cat's personality, but twisted to be evil. I also mentioned that in a previous post.


Since my vote is being deemed unworthy, out of spite I am voting a second time :P

My second vote still supports Draco :P
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I actually didn't support the idea at first (which I believe I alluded to in my first post about the subject.) However, Draco's idea grew on me. The way I envision the dragon is similar to the Cheshire Cat's personality, but twisted to be evil. I also mentioned that in a previous post.


Since my vote is being deemed unworthy, out of spite I am voting a second time :P

My second vote still supports Draco :P

Sorry, your vote should never be discounted. You did not propose anything, hence you are entitled to vote. In fact, Darcollich already voted as well. He sided with my version of the story, and what Kage considers "Dracollich's version" is only Draco's clarification/understanding of my post.

As this isn't a major issues, it should only take three votes to carry. Only two ideas have been proposed (links provided), and the votes stand as follows:

[u]PerennialRook's Marlola Story[/u] (Link to original and Dracollich's interpretation)
Support (2): Dracollich, Johnny_Angel

[u]Kage_no_Neko's Marlola Story[/u] (Link)
Support (0):

Which doesn't mean that no one else can propose further backgrounds, only that voting has begun. I think that I have made my points, and I am starting to fall into old habits, so I won't be participating much on this particular topic.

~Pk
I knew I wasn't really discounted. I was just being silly


To be clear, my vote supports Draco's story as detailed in this idea:

Marlola was captured by the Green. In the days after her capture, she was tormented by the dragon and played with. A cat with a new toy so to speak. She was also taken advantage of while the Green was in humanoid form.

As part of his plan, the Green left, giving her the oppurtunity to escape back to the village and have her hastily raise the elves to arms. The effect of this was that the elves, led by Marlola, came right to the dragon's doorstep... food delivery of the Green's favorite dish. They were devastated, the dragon was fed, and Marlola escaped in the carnage. This easy food delivery was the extent of his plan (not evil for evil sake, just lazy and hungry and knows it's easier to defeat a foe on its terms then attacking the village itself)

The Green may (not know/does not care/will make use of the child decades later if he happens to survive) that Marlola is with his child. He got his meal and is happy. Marlola knows she cannot return to her clan since she is the one to blame. So, she is forced to give birth to the child in the wild and try to make it on her own. Only by pure luck does she encounter the refugees and a chance to survive.




I wasn't aware that PR's idea and Draco's idea had been combined.
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I have been thinking about Kage's points about the green dragon and the city, note that this post has nothing to do with Marlola's background as I am avoiding that landmine right now :D.

Gnolls seem to have gained a little support, so in this post and future posts I will be refering to gnolls in place of my previous [instert monstrous humanoid here]'s.

I have been considering the two dragons, while both can now be considered evil (though neither are "evil for evil's sake"), what separates the two? I know we are losing the law vs. chaos alignments, but these ideas seem fitting here. The new cursewarped gold dragon seems the embodiment of chaos, lost in madness and thirsting for destruction (for the sake of destruction).

The green dragon is counter point to the gold. He is calculating and masterful, (according to all versions) pulling many strings in the local area.

With so many gnolls prepared for war so soon after the decimation of [Old City], Kage's idea of an attack already in the works, and masterminded by the green dragon, has grown on me.

The green dragon finds out about the gold dragon, though most likely through non-magical means, since 4E is playing down the magic side of dragons. If his plans were set in motion to have the gnolls attack the city, what would change? I think nothing would, they now have a different purpose, to weaken the gold dragon. It is a gambit on the part of the green dragon, but if it can weaken/distract the gold dragon enough with the gnolls, he can swoop in for the kill.

This new plan backfires, the gnolls are little match for the gold cursewarped dragon, and the green dragon's fighting prowess isn't quite up to snuff. The green dragon is chased away with his tail between his legs, beaten and sore.

All is not lost. The gold dragon can now lord over the gnolls as his new servants, which he will need, since he is tied to the city for the time being. This gives the green dragon an inside, since he would still have connections with the gnolls, but it will be some time before he can make a move on the gold dragon again.

Perhaps if he could convince the right adventurers...
I wasn't aware that PR's idea and Draco's idea had been combined.

That was my understanding, that Draco's post was only a layman clarification of my own, but Draco will have to elaborate on this point. Though Draco does explicitly state that his post is merely an interpretation of my own post

As it stands, our two posts are not mutually exclusive (they are both the same story), and it wouldn't make much sense to split votes (an discount Draco's vote) on the same idea [spiteful comment against Kage deleted].

To clarify, the only discrepancy between our posts is that I explicitly state that the offspring was intentional, and the green dragon is a bit more calculating, while Draco leaves it up in the air (to DM's discression), which is fine as well. In my version, contrary to Kage's beliefs, the green dragon does not hound/herd Marlola to the refugees (a twist of fate) but has merely instilled in her the will to survive and protect the child.
PR, I agree that the Gold would be an excellent example of Chaotic Evil if 4E still used those terms; I also agree that the Green would be a good example of Lawful Evil, but he wouldn't embody the lawful side as much as the evil side.

I like the idea that the pregnancy be accidental; I like Draco's idea that it's a result of the Green just wanting to play with his "new toy."


PR, I like your idea of Gnolls. I like how they were originally servants of the green and now they serve the gold. This also creates a reason for the green to have animosity toward the gold.
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I added the last dwarven family under the Axebreaker Clan, and reverted Bofbin's name to what it was in the origional post (not Bobfin):

The Axebreaker Clan has a long and distinguished heritage, and many of its elders claim to be direct descendants of Thorim Axebreaker, one of the founding Thanguard. Unfortunately, the legendary dwarven Hall of Records is lost to the ages, and thus oral tradition carries forth the history of the clans.

According to oral tradition, all Axebreaker sons are required to serve in the military, no matter their nationality. Axebreakers travel wide to fulfill their service, most to the remnants of the dwarven homelands, though many consider service in the local guard to be satisfactory.

Bofbin (dwarven, meaning ancient warden) Axebreaker followed the old ways, and traveled to the old home in service to god and king. His adventures were many, though perhaps not grand, and when he had fulfilled his service, he settled in the town of [Old City]. That was centuries ago.

Bofbin was an accomplished cartographer from his time in the service, and found that his skills also lent to scholarly practices. He is one of few who can claim to have searched the entirety of the records of [Old City], mostly to improved his maps. One of his earliest discoveries was a system of tunnels in one section of the city, presumably built by dwarves in days forgotten, and it was there that he bought the Dragon's Berth.

Bofbin's roots grew thick in the community, and soon he had taken a bride. the lovely Darea (dwarven, meaning burning hearth) of the Runescribe Clan. In a few short years they had their first son, Helthal (dwarven, meaning mattock of the titans). Many children followed.

Over the years, Bofbin has seen his children succumb to the wandering nature of his youth, and without much success. He has committed too many of his children and grandchildren to the earth long before their time, and, barring a few, his living decedents are scattered to the winds.

Helthal was the only son to return to [Old City], dragging his nubile young bride with him. His favorite daughter, Duerana (dwarven, meaning dark eyes, had found love in the arms of a young farmer, the rest found homes elsewhere.

Bofbin blessed the gods when his grandson moved back to [Old City]. The child of one of Bofbin's more adventuresome sons, named Orion (dwarven, meaning gem raider) after the exploits of his father. Bofbin had considered selling the Dragon's Berth, as he had never been much of a business man, but decided to entice his grandson to stay by transferring ownership to Orion.

When Orion couldn't turn the financial state of the tavern around he sold half the ownership to Jeffers, who proved a great boon to the tavern's success.

When the gold dragon broke free of its bonds, those in the Dragon's Berth discovered why Bofbin had held onto the old building for so long. Bofbin's years melted away as he shouted orders, commanding all to get down into the cellar. Beyond the cellar were the ancient dwarven tunnels, and while this wasn't the only entrance, it was very close to a vault that Bofbin had prepared for such an emergency.

REFUGEE BREAKDOWN

HUMANS: Two large groups (six 4-person families), plus two individuals.
Total: 26 humans (16 adults, 8 children, 2 elderly).
Open: 3 adults, 1 child.
Breakdown

Carpenter's Family
Koren (carpenter), plus wife and two sons (2 Adults, 2 Children; 3m, 1f).

Description: Koren grew up in a seaside city, learning his father's trade and becoming an accomplished shipwright. When he lost both of his brothers to the sea, he closed up shop and moved inland, where he as worked as a carpenter in [Old City]. While much work was available in [Old City] after the dragon attack, Moses convinced him that the attack was not over. Since moving to [Old City], he has bowed to the demands of his customers and kept to the prevailing styles of the city, but now he feels a renewal of his youthful ambitions and dreams, and Koren thinks he can make a mark in this new settlement, artistically speaking.
Nan Kya's Orphans
Nan Kya (cook and herbalist), Jessie (stablegirl), Tam (linkboy) and Rat (mudlarker and occasional pickpocket) who currently has a badly sprained leg. (1 elderly, 3 children; 2m, 2f).

Description: Nan Kya is unofficial third granny to many of the children in the slum quarter of [Old City] and when disaster struck and scattered their families, it was Nan Kya that the lost children gravitated to. In the days that followed, most of the children were reclaimed by their parents, older siblings and street gangs, but three remain with nowhere else to go and Kya has taken them under her wing.

Although justifiably renowned for her ability to make even the poorest food taste good, it is in fact the medical side of her herb lore that the local adults revere. Nan Kya, they say, is the person to turn to when you can't go to the temples and the official healers or alchemists - for whatever reason, be it cost, or fear, or simply having a bounty on your head.
Noble Swine
Lyndon Merriweather a noble, his wife Fionna, and two daughters (2 adults, 2 children; 1m, 3f).

Description: Lyndon Merriweather had come from a prestigious, well-to-do family. His family holdings were spread far across the city, with monetary influence in almost every walk of life. Lyn had it all. And he wasted it daily. He was a spoiled, rich brat, never having to work a day in his life for anything. Everything that he wanted he could purchase, from his clothes, to his house, to his "education", to his every whim. Typically, he could be seen at one of the local taverns, frittering away coin on boozing, gambling, and whoring. No one really liked him, not that he cared; with all of his money and power, no one could really do anything about it. This was a life that he was used to.

He had an arranged marriage, and wasn't even old enough to speak up for himself when the deal was made. With his own inheritance and the dowry of his wife, he would have been able to drink away the next fifty years, had he lived that long. Fionna was pretty, though not as stunning as some of the women that he frequented. They had two daughters who barely knew their father.

Lyndon became the unwilling financier of the refugees, when he tactlessly threw himself at Ariana, not realizing that she too was of noble birth. The fact that his money had bought many of the provisions was a fact that he would not soon forget, and would lord over any who questioned his slothfulness.
Wranglers
Jackson and three other cattle wranglers and ranch hands (4 adults; 3m, 1f).

Description: The distant flames seemed to light up his eyes against the canvas of his dark skin in the shadows of the night. His first thoughts were of Ariana. He thought she had said she was coming back to the city today. For once he hoped that she was late.

In the chaos of the aftermath, Jackson could only find three other wranglers. The cattle were so long gone, it would have been futile to try and find them all. Jackson needed to get back to visit the city.
The Farmer's Family
Costran, Farm Family Patriarch, plus wife Dhalitha and sons Dexis and Lorten (1 elderly, 3 adult; 3m, 1f).

Description: Costran has farmed all his life, and is rather successful about it. He oversees large farming plots outside the city, growing crops on rotating years, and even trying his hand at winemaking as a hobby. He has four three strong sons from his first (late) wife, and has remarried Dhalitha , an attractive young foreign-born dancer Costran met in the city, much to the dismay of his sons who think she might be after his land and money. In his youthful days, Costran became a devoted follower of the local religion, converted by the newly-confirmed priestess Moses. When he heard that Moses was having a bit of a crisis of faith, he decided to follow her on her pilgrimage, and make sure these "danged younguns who ain't known a hard days work" didn't get themselves in trouble. He turned his farm over to his eldest son and his wife to take care of while he went on this little trip, and took his two younger sons Dexis and Lorten along with him.
Ariana the Falconer
Ariana: falconer and prodigal noble (1 adult; 1f).

Description: Born the unexpected fourth child to the noble Aquila family allowed Ariana to be freed of most of the obligations and expectations of her older siblings. Lacking a strong hand to guide her into being a typical noble, Ariana found herself drawn to the wilderness and the freedom to be found there. Though considered uncouth and snubbed by her noble peers, it was this relaxed nature that allows her to interact easily with commoners and has allowed her to stand forward in these times of troubles.
Full Description Found Here
Urchin Bandon
Urchin, once homeless (1 adult; 1m)

Description: Like any street kid, Klein "the Urchin" Bandon had had a hard life, one which nearly doubled his apparent age. Now sixteen, he looked nearly thirty, which had played to his favor. He was uncommonly strong for his age, which could be attributed mostly to his iron will and good cooking. His strength, combined with his older looks, had allowed him to work at the docks since he was only twelve. The wages barely paid for food, so what food he bought was usually in the form of raw ingredients, which Nan Kya, his adopted grandmother, was more than willing to cook up.

The docks were closed for solstice, which left Klein to his other "profession", spending the day collecting on the generosity of others. He was at the temple pavilion when the lighthouse gave birth to the cursewarped terror, and was one of the many ushered inside the safety of the temple walls.

In the aftermath, there were not enough common labor jobs for even those that were recently made homeless, let alone those who had spent a lifetime in poverty. When Moses approached him about going with the small group of refugees, he knew his bargaining chip. Thanks to Nan Kya's kindness, he was an ox. It was no surprise that his agreement came with the condition that Nan Kya be allowed to go as well.

DWARVES: One large group (three 4-person families).
Total: 12 (6 adults, 2 children, 4 elderly).
Breakdown

Axebreaker Clan
Bofbin Axebreaker (cartographer and scholar) and his wife Darea (2 elderly; 1m, 1f).
Helthal (soldier), Bofbin's son, and his wife and children (1 elderly, 2 adults, 1 child; 2m, 2f).
Orion (barkeep), Bofbin's grandson, and his wife (2 Adults; 2m, 2f).

Description: Bobfin has seen his children succumb to the wandering nature of his youth, and without much success. He has committed too many of his children and grandchildren to the earth long before their time, and except one son, a daughter, and his grandson, his few living decedents are scattered to the winds.

Full Description Found Here
Dirt Farmers
Darryl One-eye (retired mercenary) with his farmer father, his wife Deurana and baby daughter (1 elderly, 2 adults, 1 child; 2m, 2f).

Description: Darryl heard the dragon wings before his remaining eye spotted the fires springing up in its wake. He managed to get down into the cellar with his wife, his baby daughter and his doom-and-gloom father before the dragon reached them - along with a goat that was about to kid. The group huddled at the back of the cellar and waited for the beast to go away.

When they finally emerged again, there were 4 goats to lift out of the cellar and all the grain fields were burnt flat.

HALFLINGS One large group of halflings (three 3-person families).
Total: 9 halflings (6 adults, 3 children).
Breakdown

Garfunkle's Gang
Garfunkel (prospector) and Ginger Rabbitsnare and Garf's tag-along "little" brother Benji (3 adults; 2m, 1f).

Description: What happens when you cross a stream loving halfling and a stream of good luck? A halfling gold prospector! Sifting gold from the very streams he lives on, the young gold-seeking halfling, his newlywed wife, and brother make a fine addition to our group!
Janis and Sons
Janis (woodswoman), and her two twin sons (1 adult, 2 children; 2m, 1f).

Description: Janis and her late husband spent a lot of time in on the rivers and in the nearby forests, but when her husband died when her sons were infants, Janis settled down to care for them. Janis found a friend in Ariana the falconer, and taught her much of what she knows of the forests.
The Lucky Trio
Gillybloom (f), Taffle (m), Tansy (f child) (2 adults, 1 child; 1m, 2f).

Description: It was originally part dare, part coming of age celebration (apart from someone's tag-along kid sister determined to prove she was just as good as the rest of them). They were all going to climb the lighthouse and wave flags from the top. Gillybloom was leading the way when the beast broke out, hurling them all in different directions. Gillybloom and two others were lucky enough to land in the softish mud of the riverbank, but they haven't seen any of their friends since. These three, Gillybloom, Taffle and Tansy, now stick together as a personal reminder not to be so foolish again.

Before the [Old City] was attacked, Gillybloom was learning to scout ahead and around and Taffle is an apprentice sail & rope-maker. Tansy is still a generalist, used to pitching in with any task that needs help.

DRAGONBORN: Two small groups (four 2-person families).
Total: 8 (4 adults, 4 children).
Open: 2 adults, 0 children.
Breakdown

Yorcha and Yishi
Yorcha (mercenary warrior), and Yishi, her 11 yr old squire with dreams of working magic(1 adult, 1 child; 2f)

Description: This was supposed to be an easy hire. Or so the recruiter had claimed. Just standing guard in a city where the threat had already left. No problems, just routine watches from battered walls.

That's why Yorcha had brought her young cousin Yishi as her squire, hoping that the youngling would gain enough experience in the trade that she would actually settle down and work instead of craning her neck after every mage that walked past.

If only she had known that it wasn't over...
Double Dragons
Ghoros, first out of the egg, and Ghent, who followed (2 children; 2m).

Description: A rarity indeed, twin dragonborn are almost unheard of. Born of the same shell, Ghoros is the stronger of the brothers, while Ghent is more clever. The two are in constant competition, and had been in a footrace (Ghoros leading, of course) when the cursewarped dragon shook the world. They never found their father.

While Ghoros leans more towards the martial persuasion, leaning to the hand-and-a-half swords like their father, Ghent keeps his head in books, trying to wrap his intellect around the concepts of the arcane arts. However, without a teacher, it would be a surprise if Ghent ever mastered more than the most basic of cantrips.

The twins soon come of age, a time of power for dragonborn when inherent abilities manifest. Only the gods know the fates of the double dragons.
Deethra, new mother
Deethra, inactive dragonborn mercenary, and her unhatched egg, name undecided. (1 adult, 1 child; 1f, 1 unknown)

Description: Deethra had entered [Old City] a few weeks before solistice. After years of mercenary service, she needed to settle down for a bit. Gestation would soon be over, and she needed a place to rest, lay her egg, and raise her child. She spoke with the elders of the temple near the lighthouse, and they did what they could to accomodate her.

Her labor began on the eve of summer solistice. Feasts and festivities were well under way already, and it seemed to be a glorious day to birth her young. The labor was long, too be sure, but no matter for her; young born on solistice was an auspicious event. She was excited, both for herself and her child. That is, until it happened.

The egg began to crown at dusk on solstice, and as the sun set the ground began to shake. Everyone stopped what they were doing, and when the sun dropped beneath the horizon, a tremendous explosion shattered the lighthouse. All that could be seen was smoke and flame. And at that moment, the egg was laid, and Deethra collapsed from exhaustion.

When she awoke the following morning, many of the priests were unconscious, if not dead, though her egg seemed healthy. She was still exhausted from her delivery, but was compelled to investigate. It was then she met Moses, as the visibly shaken priest insisted that Deethra lay back down; Deethra was in no condition to do anything at the moment. The priest then presented Deethra’s egg to her, and was directed to care and watch over it.

As the days past, there was much discussion over the events of solistice; the curse-warped gold dragon laid waste to much of the city. Leaders promised that everything would be fine, and that rebuilding is already underway. But there were some who were unconvinced, and after listening to Moses, she had to agree. This place would not be a safe location to raise her child. She would join the refugees; it was time to leave.

ELVES: One small group (two 2-person families).
Total: 4 elves (3 adults, 1 child)
Breakdown

Twin Sisters Pomi and Loti
Sisters Pomi and Loti, wanderers who had most recently been florists in [Old City] (2 adults; 2f).

Description: Pomi and Loti grew up in an elven community built around a small hillock in the woods. Born as twins they were inseparable, often getting into trouble for finding themselves in places they adults feared they were to young to visit. In truth this was as much due to egging each other on as much as their natural curiosity. As they grew their wanders took them farther and farther afield, so it was no surprise when they announced they had decided to see the world beyond their forests. Traveling mostly by foot on the few roads available for over five years they were lucky to pass by most of their potential obstacles, but eventually news of their elder sister's declining health directed their travels to [old city]. Upon arriving in [old city] they found their sister had passed on and a niece, Mililani (half-elf), in need of a family so they agreed to take a short break. Two years later they had their florists business thriving but were starting to feel the need to wander again when the dragon broke free...
Marlola
Marlola and her infant, half-dragon son, Acharis (draconic, meaning emerald hope) or "Chris" (adult 1, child 1; 1f, 1m).

Description: (In Debate)

HALF ELVES: Two individuals (2 adults).
Total: 2 (2 adults)
Breakdown

Mililani
Mililani the young niece of Pomi and Loti, and barwench from the Dragon's Berth (1 adult; 1f).

Description: Mililani is a young half-elf (16 years old) living with aunts Pomi and Loti while working at the bar her mother worked in, the Dragon's Berth. Though her father is not publicly known Mililani has lived a life of love and joy, surrounded by the friendly patrons of the bar. Forced to live alone when her mother died three years ago, she was eventually reunited with her elven heritage when her aunts arrived a year later. Though independent and somewhat brash, her ready smile and lively wit has allowed Mililani to avoid most of the troubles that could be expected of a young girl in a large city.
Full Description Found Here
Jeffers
Jeffers, retired guard, co-owner of the Dragon's Berth (1 adult; 1m).

Description: During his last patrol as city guard, a group of burglars had shattered his right leg, and he had been forced to retire from service. Taking what savings he had, Jeffers found common cause at the Dragon’s Berth. Owned by Bobfin’s grandson, Boffin (?), the bar had become seedy and run down, typically losing money to drinks unpaid. Now as co-owner and cook/part-time bouncer of the Dragon's Berth, he has helped turn it into a well-established tavern and inn that typically caters to both city-folk and wayward travelers. On occasion, his right leg would courses with pain, and it always foretelling of a bad day to come. He has a gruff, somewhat reserved demeanor, but is always honest and helpful, and loves to recount his days as a guard.

ELADRIN: Two tiny groups (two 3-person families), plus one individual.
Total: 7 (4 adult, 2 children, 1 venerable).
Open: 2 adults, 2 children.
Breakdown

Aust's Entourage
Aust Amakiir (lorekeeper), his "nephew" Tier (escort), and Slyvia (2 adult, 1 venerable; 2m, 1f).

Description: Aust Amakiir lives only half in the world. As his body passes into the ether his soul seems to shine through it like a light. He is not long for the world, which may explain why he seemed as serene as ever while the dragon streaked like a bright golden meteor above the darkened streets of the city.

Amakiir [meaning: beautiful silence of dusk] fancies himself a loremaster, which offers the other explanation as to why he was so calm. He knew. Though it is only speculation, it would explain his timely arrival in the city, the countless hours in the library, and how some books just happened to be in his possession rather than at the library when it burned to the ground.

He arrived in town with two young eladrin, Tier, who he introduced as a nephew, and Sylvia his nephew's bride. Tier has a quick wit, and a quick blade, and never strays far from the company of his uncle. Tier seems to be more of guard and escort than young nephew, though Sylvia seems to genuinely be espoused to Tier.

TIEFLING: One individual.
Total: 1 (1 adult)
Breakdown

Moses
Moses, the tiefling priestess (1 adult; 1f).


As this isn't a major issues, it should only take three votes to carry. Only two ideas have been proposed (links provided), and the votes stand as follows:

*snip*

Which doesn't mean that no one else can propose further backgrounds, only that voting has begun. I think that I have made my points, and I am starting to fall into old habits, so I won't be participating much on this particular topic.

I do not necessarily agree. I do not think that after many back and forth posts over three pages that this is so simple that a three pass vote is correct for this decision (but that may be because on some level I have become emotionally involved in this discussion). Your and my position differ in nearly every fundamental way beyond Marlola, the child, and the green dragon; and Dracolich's version is relevant and separate because it differs from yours in that the green dragon is no longer a calculating creature with long term theoretical goals for half-dragon child to one who only calculates to get a meal to come to him (completely different mindsets).

The yeah/nay voting scheme proposed by Dougan Axehammer applies to a vote for a single choice for the city; this is not that situation. Instead here, we have three (or two) possible choices and no vocal opposition to those collective choices so far. Therefore once again I state that the vote stands as...

---------------------

Votes on Marlola Back Story







---------------------------------

For all those interested at this point, here is a list of the relevant posts so far in this discussion:

I do not necessarily agree. I do not think that after many back and forth posts over three pages that this is so simple that a three pass vote is correct for this decision (but that may be because on some level I have become emotionally involved in this discussion). Your and my position differ in nearly every fundamental way beyond Marlola, the child, and the green dragon; and Dracolich's version is relevant and separate because it differs from yours in that the green dragon is no longer a calculating creature with long term theoretical goals for half-dragon child to one who only calculates to get a meal to come to him (completely different mindsets).

The yeah/nay voting scheme proposed by Dougan Axehammer applies to a vote for a single choice for the city; this is not that situation. Instead here, we have three (or two) possible choices and no vocal opposition to those collective choices so far. Therefore once again I state that the vote stands as...

The three vote decision applies in this situation, just like any other vote. Rather than Yay/Nay, it is a vote between two positions. Two? Yes two. Saying that there are three separate stories denies Dracollich a chance to vote on the fate of his own idea, which is wrong on a very basic level. To quote Dracollich:
Axehammer, your idea of the child be half-dragon is great and PerennialRook's back story was beautifully written. Its got the devilish plot of a green dragon, an elf maiden with a dark past, and an unknown future of how the 1/2 dragon child and his sire will play out. I give it two thumbs up.

Johnny, I understand your concern about the connection between the Green and the elf tribe. How I interpreted PR's story is as follows... may cast a different light on the matter. It also addresses Kage's evil for evil's sake concern.

Emphasis mine, but you can easily see that Dracollich's intent is just to interpret my own story, not to throw his own story into the hat.

So then, where do we stand? Unless Dougan Axehammer (the OP) or Dracollich fundamentally change their stances, it takes three votes to carry and there are two options. Which means the voting still stands:

[u]PerennialRook's Marlola Story[/u] (Link to original and Dracollich's interpretation)
Support (2): Dracollich, Johnny_Angel

[u]Kage_no_Neko's Marlola Story[/u] (Link)
Support (0):

Kage, I got into a lot of trouble in TBACT2 when I got too attached to some of my ideas and couldn't let go of them. This is why we vote (fairly), to let the community make a joint decision. You've contributed some great fluff to this thread, and I have said so, but if this one point is going to make bad blood in between us I will retract my proposal.
The three vote decision applies in this situation, just like any other vote. Rather than Yay/Nay, it is a vote between two positions. Two? Yes two. Saying that there are three separate stories denies Dracollich a chance to vote on the fate of his own idea, which is wrong on a very basic level. To quote Dracollich:

...

Emphasis mine, but you can easily see that Dracollich's intent is just to interpret my own story, not to throw his own story into the hat.

I do not see this, but my interpretation of his post is he took your story and changed it into something new which is why I treated it as different. Instead of saying you are right or I am right, let's ask Dracollich.

Dracollich, do you consider your version separate from PR's version or the same?

------------

I see no bad blood, it is just that I read your story fundamentally different than the concept you apparently had when you wrote it. At this point I think our only point of contention is whether we are voting on two stories or three; and that is not our choice, it is Dracollich's.

EDIT: When I mentioned getting emotionally attached to the discussion, that is because I have gotten attached to my version of the Marlola, but I do that with any character I spend a reasonable amount of time upon. This does not mean that I can not put her aside if the board decides upon it. So no worries.
If Dracollich considers his story separate from mine, then I will retract my own proposal and vote for his. This is because they are fundamentally the same story. Which means no matter what, the votes still stand the same, whether I am voting for Dracollich or Dracollich for mine. :D

I guess the fundamental difference that I have a problem with is that I see your (Kage's) version of the dragon as a monster, and little more, though your story seems to evolve a little more with each retelling. My vision of the green dragon is as a villain, not so much a monster. Also, with our one wild elf, I would rather she embody the spirit of a free elf, rather than have lived a life of servitude under an oppressive lord.

Those are the two fundamental differences, and it is what I have been so adamant about. Monsters are a dime a dozen, but a good villain, with ties to our community and also the old city, is very important to me.
See, I thought Draco's was slightly different as well. I think it is mainly similar to PR; however, there are a few differences. Personally, I don't see the green dragon being the type of villain who would plan for the child and have some sort of far reaching goal. I view him as an intelligent villain; however, I view him as an intelligent villain who mainly uses his smarts for very selfish and somewhat short term goals (i.e. making other people get his food for him so he doesn't have to go through the trouble of doing it himself.)


I vote for Draco's version if it is considered a different version.

If PR's version is considered the same as Draco's version I will then vote for PR's version on the condition that Draco's ideals and ideas behind how the child came to be are used.

If neither of those options are available, I will then as a last resort propose that my idea be added as another option; however, in that case I will vote for Kage's version even though I will be adding mine as an option.
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See, I thought Draco's was slightly different as well. I think it is mainly similar to PR; however, there are a few differences. Personally, I don't see the green dragon being the type of villain who would plan for the child and have some sort of far reaching goal. I view him as an intelligent villain; however, I view him as an intelligent villain who mainly uses his smarts for very selfish and somewhat short term goals (i.e. making other people get his food for him so he doesn't have to go through the trouble of doing it himself.)


I vote for Draco's version if it is considered a different version.

If PR's version is considered the same as Draco's version I will then vote for PR's version on the condition that Draco's ideals and ideas behind how the child came to be are used.

If neither of those options are available, I will then as a last resort propose that my idea be added as another option; however, in that case I will vote for Kage's version even though I will be adding mine as an option.

...

Okay, so I think I get what you're getting at...

A tribe of elves lived in the woods not too distant from the old city. In the same woods was a vile, selfish, though rather cunning green dragon.

Marlola, one of the tribal elves, was out in a small hunting party, that was suddenly attacked, unprovoked, by our green dragon. Now elves are a favorite treat of this dragon, but the beautiful Marlola stirs another hunger in the villain.

Rather than killing and eating Marlola, he takes her back to his lair and... has his way with her. This went on until the green dragon grew tired of his captive, and formulated a plot to get a free lunch.

Suddenly Marlola, who has been dominated for much of her stay, finds herself free and rushes back to her tribe, unaware that this is part of the green dragon's plot. Her cries rally the elves into a frenzy, so much so that they forget themselves and walk into the waiting ambush of the green dragon.

Marlola is among those that survive the death trap, though her kin turn on her as well, blaming her for the loss of their tribe. Marlola is marked and forced to leave, while the dragon dines at his pleasure on the flesh of her kin, both unaware of their bond growing within her.
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