MUD

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So, It wouldn't be the DtB thread with out some Shop Decks and I think we need decent lists/primers for these decks. Now, I don't claim to be a shop expert, but the decks are generally pretty straight-forward, and the real challenge is mulliganing properly and maximizing the synergies in deck-building and through playing the deck. I'll start by posting a solid MUD list and then I'll later try to explain Card Choices/SB plans and matchup analysis. I could really use some testing results though from those of you who play Metalworker MUD a decent amount. Thanks!

MUD

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Lands (17):
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City Of Traitors
2 Mishra&#8217;s Factory
4 Mishra&#8217;s Workshop
1 Strip Mine
3 Wasteland
1 Tolarian Academy

Artifacts (31):

1 Black Lotus
4 Chalice Of The Void
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Memory Jar
1 Sol Ring
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
4 Sphere Of Resistance
4 Sword Of Fire And Ice
4 Tangle Wire
4 Thorn Of Amethyst
1 Trinisphere

Artifact Creatures (12):

4 Juggernaut
4 Metalworker
4 Triskelion

SB
4 Leyline Of The Void
3 Duplicant
3 Spawning Pit
2 Crucible Of Worlds
3 Staff Of Domination



This is essentially Menendian's List from Starcitygames a while back with a change to the SB in adding in the Staff Combo. I feel the Staff Combo helps you win through a stalemate against Controlling decks and I expect a lot of Tyrant Blue matchups to be like that. What you don't want to give a deck like that is time. They'll run all over you with Time. Staff takes that away IMO. Staff is still untested however, so I'm not 100% sure of its effectiveness. Spawning Pit is another change I've made to try and answer Oath. Not sure if it'll do the job, but that is what it's designed to do.
Solid list, if it were me, I'd probably run +1 Wasteland MD, +1 Spawning Pit in the board, and cut the Staff combo (I think it's too slow to be good).
Solid list, if it were me, I'd probably run +1 Wasteland MD, +1 Spawning Pit in the board, and cut the Staff combo (I think it's too slow to be good).

But Staff of Domination is good on its own. I usually maindeck the combo.

Infinite mana, cards & life is good.
Yeah, Staff combo is fun... I just don't think it is necessarily practical. It just isn't a necessity for the deck.
So I've been toying around with MUD for a while now (mostly trying to play it against my ichorid list) and have come to enjoy the deck. In regards to the worker/staff combo, the infinite life is certianly less than optimal now-a-days, however you must remember that when you pass the turn you will have a lethal army out, have all of your sphere effects out, and have a hand of whatever you want. In my opinion this is worth running it, especially since I can get it turn 2-3 a good portion of the time with the list I run. When I get one piece or the other it is often still useful, so I still run it.

The list I run (taken from this thread)

MAD MUD
Creatures: 18
4 Metalworkers
4 Arcbound Ravager
4 Myr Retriever
3 Junk Diver
3 Triskelion

Metal: 17
4 Skullclamp
4 Thorn of Amethyst
4 Sword of Fire and Ice
3 Staff of Domination
1 Trinisphere
1 Memory Jar

Lands/Acceleration: 25
4 Mishras Workshop
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Wasteland
2 City of Traitors
1 Stripmine
1 Tolarian Academy

1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Emerald
1 Black Lotus
1 Mana Crypt
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Vault

So far I have played this against ichorid (favorable), tyrant oath (unfavorable, but not by a huge margin), drain tendrils (unfavorable), GAT (favorable, even the 8 duress version), turbo gush (unfavorable), uw fish (wildly swingy, overall even). While I don't think I will be switching my favorite deck just yet this is on my list of considerations to play (especially since I can play it within 10 proxies).
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this decks good.
NO LOTUS MUTHA ****IN' SHOPS BURN'T DOWN THE MUTHA ****IN' GENCON
Back when I played MUD, I MD'd staff combo and loved it. Usually, if Metalworker lives to tap, you *probably* win. If you run staff, and Worker lives to tap, you *do* win. Period.

@decklist to decklist - I never found myself liking Ravager versions more than your typical Juggie/trisk/random beats. They're just bigger for no permanent loss, which is usually already a concern due to Smokestacks, which are still awesome.

In any meta though, especially once with Gush, MUD aggro benefits greatly from Sundering Titans. Worse comes to worse, they Gush, in which case with any kind of sphere effects they probably just gave you Time Walk x2. Even against other shop decks it's bigger than all their dudes, equipped swords on them or not. I was just curious as to why they weren't mentioned anywhere?
The list I posted has a pretty decent game against smokestack because of the seven myr retrievers and the skull clamps. The deck can draw cards like a mad man to the point that it feels like playing a blue aggro deck at times. I enjoy this list over other common themes, such as the general 5/3 or 7/10 builds of workshop aggro largely because of the insane draw power (which happens to get you to the worker staff combo pretty quick).

From my experience running the deck I don't think titan fits in the deck, he certianly is excellent but you have more important things to do. I think he is best as a delay tactic, but you already have dedicated space in the deck for that with thorns and strips. The 18 creature in the list I copied to here all serve a crucial purpose (in this case ravagers are better than juggs thanks to skull clamp), and the slots not dedicated to disruption or creatures are also needed as they provide speed for the deck.

You never really fear a dedicated aggro deck unless they can keep worker off the table (which is hard when you run 7 regrowth effects in addition to 4 workers), I have grown a trike to 11/11 with ravager before (this means a lethal swing if unblocked) on multiple occasions, we can race fatties with ease (remember that tyrant can't block if trike is holding a sword). Weenie rush is quickly handled by a ravager fed trike. Combo is raced by your combo (often other combo decks are 1-2 turns faster, that is where you bring spheres in from the side) and control doesn't have enough control for your threat dense deck (though mana drains into combo suck ... a lot).
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a few questions

this looks really fun, and I've been playing it

what do you do for sideboarding? Like, what do you do agains't gush, and what about the other types?


Why are there Duplicants in the deck? They seem really weak, and what would you want to sideboard them in against anyway?


What do you do about enchantments and other artifacts that **** you over?
Like, what do you do about a second turn Energy Flux?

Also, what do you normally set chalice to? zero, 1 or 2?
Duplicants are there for things like platinum angel and darksteel colossus. You basically want them when you know your opponent has a creature based win condition/stall tactic.

The only thing to do against flux is pay the mana, you can often do this enough times to win. In general thought these cards are like leyline to ichorid, really really effecient at what they do.

What to set chalice to can depend on the deck. Often though the first one should be set to 1, since that would often cut off up to 1/3 of the opponent's deck.
Vintage Deckbuilding-Your First Vintage Tournament
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Shop decks are the little kid who won't stay down. I am sorry that Trinisphere was restricted. This deck was so fantastic with 4 Spheres.
how about someone running blue, for tinker, etc. and thoughtcast (maybe). oh, and force of will.
Ok...I'm a type 2 player and a little slow...but I don't understand, short of quick beats, how this deck wins...I mean, you accelerate fast into Juggernaut and stuff, but what happens if the other deck just wraths?

Also, if someone could explain how the staff combo works, that would be great, cause I don't get it from the lists.
Wrath is not played in Vintage because it is typically far too slow, and does nothing against the only creature-based decks:
Ichorid wins with hasty zombies or a recurring ichorid.
Goblins just recovers.
This deck makes it impossible to cast.
Fish counters it or makes you discard it or meddling mage/pithing needles it.

And the first two (three?) win before turn 4 (typically) anyway, along with just about every combo deck (which don't care about wrath anyway), while the control decks don't care and can counter/discard it if would actually be relevant.

Staff combo:
For 4 mana you can untap a creature and staff. Metalworker can produce more than that very easily in this deck, allowing you to generate lots of mana and then get as much life/as many cards that you want.
Lodestone Golem from Worldwake seems really legit in this deck.
Lodestone Golem from Worldwake seems really legit in this deck.


If by legit you mean everyone has already gone -4Juggs +4Golem, then yes. I don't think there was much of a debate on that change.
Level 2 Magic Judge Lite a man a fire, warm him for a day. Light a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.




Obv that is the consensus. No one had pointed it out on this thread yet. No need to be a d-bag.
lodestone is the only really substantial change to the 'shop deck since the mirroden block

A friend who has been playing pretty much since the beginning of the game said "well, juggernaut's dead now" automatically as soon as I described lodestone to him the day after spoilage...there wasn't even an internal debate for most of us, let alone an external one.
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I understand this I to have been playing since Legends. Still someone needed to say something on the WotC forums, if no one is going too. You can't just assume 'cause your group obv. knows it that every reder is going to too.
If it's obvious, it doesn't need to be pointed out... especially on the wizards forums... no one posts here.

edit: most of the lists here are out of date. they are just here for a "guideline".
whaterver man not everyone uses other sites. You seem to be checking in often for no one ever posting here. Dying format and all. Just admit the fact that his reaction was un-needed, you all could have said something like of 'course, not duh...
Yeah, I check here just because it takes a few seconds to load a webpage. So I throw it in my rotation, especially when I am bored at work.

You should try not to get so mad over the internet. Who cares if we said "duh". It isn't like I told you to go **** yourself? So, chill out. You should probably also check other sites for updated deck lists as well. You will also get better feedback elsewhere.