What gives Wizards? Please manage your forums

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Hi everyone,

This is my first post here, and I must apologize that it's to complain. I have very mixed feelings about 4e, which I'll blather about a bit later — criticisms and praises that have been well documented by more eloquent folks.

But my real complaint is: Why are you taking your sweet time with useful Dragon content? And why is your forum staff not responding to posted concerns and feedback, in a customer-friendly fashion?

I really appreciate the core mechanics of 4e, especially breaking powers down by at will/encounter/daily. Overall, combat has a lot more punch, and everyone feels a lot more consistently useful at the gaming table. Tools for DMs seem much more concrete and coherent. Grappling is no longer a game breaker. You've incorporated the best ideas from Tome of Battle, and I really like the new Warlord and Warlock.

At the same time, Wizards has left out key classes and provided extremely few options. Granted, as players we have some ability to add our own flavor to class abilities. There's a lot of potential for creating house rules to fill in some gaps.

Based on my conversations, though, we still need a LOT more material before 3.5e users will want to adopt 4e. We're hungry for material NOW, especially since Wizards has opted to provide only skeletal options and remove much-loved classes.

Instead, you're releasing the most useful content at an extremely low rate. Why isn't the illusionist article up already? Why haven't you already slated articles for the classic core classes? You all seem to be really out of touch with long-time customers, and need to get on the ball.

Instead you're publishing fluff like Penny Arcade — loved by some, but of absolutely no use in addressing the many holes in your admittedly young new edition. Please prioritize game content that fills in the gaps you've left, and sideline the fluff.

Also instead, there's been virtual silence from staff on GleeMax over the past week. No doubt you're waiting for Marketing to roll out a plan for patching things up with angry customers, but come on! My entire group is now considering going with Paizo's version 3.5b. I can't disagree with them, but I really LIKE the core mechanics that you've introduced.

Come back to the forums! Tell us what's going on! You're an online operation now, and need to focus on highest-quality customer service.

Bernie, aka Melf's Acid Arrow
"missing options" implies that you are missing something that you need to play the game.

Old classes are not needed to play the game. Do you know how many base classes there were in 3.x? It will take time to get to them all. Many of them will not be released until later PHBs.
fo diggity Twitter: www.twitter.com/fodigg Comic Books You Should Have Read: http://tinyurl.com/ycxe9l7
The core books do provide complete options for playing *a* game. And there are many good things about that game. By 'missing options', I mean the options that existing D&D players might expect, in order to consider adopting the new game as their standard, as it were, operating system.

I'm not going to give 4th edition 12 months to add the classes and range of ability options (enchantment, summoning) that are an essential part of many players' D&D experience. I'm glad you feel content with the situation, fodigg, but most of my group will be postponing adoption indefinitely, because they don't see the, yes, options that they expect in the game.

If I were Bill S., I would have frontloaded a LOT more material into the initial release, to make sure folks feel taken care of. Having failed that, I suggest that Wizards make a priority of rolling out PHBII content as quickly as possible, through Dragon or whatever other route they choose. And like I said, put aside the fluff.
Bullocks. Wizards put out a GREAT new edition with enough for any group to run a game. You are correct in that it doesnt have as much content as it did with 3.5, but it would have been foolish on wizards part to rush out with too much at once. By putting out a small bit it lets the fans give feedback to what they do/don't like about the system and what specifically they want next. Imagine if they had done all the work to put in all the classes and extras you are asking for and it was a broken system that didnt work and no one liked. They would then have to revamp the entire system.
Really all I am saying is have a bit of patience, if there is not enough content for you are your group stay with 3.5. But remember all those books did not come out in a single day either, it was over the whole course of the 3.5 lifetime.
As a customer talking to customers here, I'm a bit perplexed by the quick rush to defend a company that's providing us products. Of course, this is also a tight-knit community in many ways. I get that.

I'm happy to be patient, but also am providing the very customer feedback you suggested they might want, Zerk. I don't agree that they needed a year after go-live to test classes that have been with D&D since it's beginnings, but I don't disagree with your point that doing everything all at once would be bad business.

My feedback: don't ask us to wait 12 months for the traditional core classes and abilities (e.g., enchantment, summoning) that many of us expect in a new edition. Start rolling them out immediately. I don't mean this very second. This is not a temper tantrum. But within the next few months.

Finally, I'm requesting that Wizards observe strict deadlines for releasing Dragon material, and be transparent if they're behind deadline (these things happen, of course). Give us meat, not fluff, three times a week, on a schedule, as promised (well except the meat part).
I've said it once before and I guess I need to say it again.

4e is a different edition.

3.5 was a retool of 3.0

4e is not 3.0

Many of the things that were in 3.x aren't there anymore or have been drastically changed because it is a different edition. So don't expect to find the same amount of stuff. Traditional changes from edition to edition. Some stuff will make an appearance but some stuff won't.

With that said... They're releasing new content with every printed version of the PHB, DMG, and MM. What I hear is that the Barbarian, Druid, Monk, and potentially Psionics will be appearing in the next PHB.
I understand what you mean. I also didnt mean to come off with a 'calm down you ninny' kind of attitude even though I know I did. We all want more content and of course we want it now. We all have a new toy and we want it to be bigger and shinier then it is already. But, alas, Wizards is the money grubbing company it is so it will slowly put out content in the way they will and we will set by thankful for our table scraps and the occasional fallen steak ;)
But also I can see why content is creeping along for right now because the new rules just came out. Poking at them like you are doing is all well and good so hopefully it will get some results.
I cant say i exected more because i new the options were limited. The careful release of key popular elements of the game at key times to get you to buy more books. Period. I think it is cute how people try to justify and/or poo poo on this idea.
Skeletal system is skeletal. And the online thing was a complete debacle.
(e.g., enchantment, summoning)

Could you please elaborate on what you mean by 'enchantment'? Do you mean long term buffs? Those are gone. Utility powers are the replacement. Short therm things you apply in combat and last for one encounter before you re-apply them. This is a good change in my opinion, less bookkeeping.

Could you clarify what you mean by 'summoning'? There are several conjuration powers, mostly in the cleric power list, that create objects to attack or block movement. There's a few in the Wizard list as well.

If you mean full out summoning on the level of Summon Monster or Summon Nature's Ally, then I'm pretty sure you're out of luck. It's likely that they removed these from the game as it bogged the game down for one player to control so many creatures and was not fun for the rest of the table. (My roomate is an extremely tactical player and likes to analyze all of his options before moving. When he played a druid he had himself AND his Animal companion AND two elementals out and his turns took FOREVER.)

I know you want all the options that 3.5 had, however the changes they made were to speed up gameplay, reduce bookkeeping and allow everyone to have more fun overall. I'm happy that 'enchantment and summoning' are no longer part of the game.
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