Rules you didn't realize

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One more comment on Arcana, Dungeoneering and trained skill checks.  If one ignores "flavor text" then, of all the checks using these two skills, only Detect Magic requires trained use of the skill.  If one follows the "flavor text," though, Dungeoneering requires trained use for Monster Knowledge Checks.

I have asked WotC to clarify this point, but, at this time, they are unable to do so.  It might eventually become a FAQ entry or a rules update.  For now, you are on your own to decide if the "flavor text" is actually a rule or not.
That magical ammunition is one-use only.
Something which seems to be forgotten at times.
That magical ammunition is one-use only.
Something which seems to be forgotten at times.




Sure... in 3.5. In this new edition, the weapon imparts the magical properties to the ammo, so there is no magical arrows or bolts, it is just the bow/crossbow/sling....
Terms you should know...
Show
Kit Build - A class build that is self sustaining and has mechanical differences than the normal scale. Started in Essentials. Most are call their own terms, though the Base Class should be said in front of their own terms (Like Assassin/Executioner) Power Points - A mechanic that was wedged into the PHB3 classes (with the exception of the Monk) from the previous editions. This time, they are used to augment At Wills to be Encounters, thus eliminating the need to choose powers past 4th level. Mage Builds - Kit builds that are schools of magic for the Wizard. A call back to the previous editions powering up of the wizard. (Wizard/Necromancer, for example) Unlike the previous kit builds, Wizards simply lose their Scribe Rituals feature and most likely still can choose powers from any build, unlike the Kit Builds. Parcel System - A treasure distribution method that keeps adventurers poor while forcing/advising the DM to get wish lists from players. The version 2.0 rolls for treasure instead of making a list, and is incomplete because of the lack of clarity about magic item rarity.
ha ha
56902498 wrote:
They will Essentialize the Essentials classes, otherwise known as Essentials2. The new sub-sub-classes will be: * Magician. A subsubclass of Mage, the magician has two implements, wand and hat, one familiar (rabbit) and series of basic tricks. * Crook. A subsubclass of Thief, the Crook can only use a shiv, which allows him to use his only power... Shank. * Angry Vicar, a subsubclass of warpriest, the angry vicar has two attacks -- Shame and Lecture. * Hitter. A subsubclass of Slayer, the Hitter hits things. * Gatherer. A subsubclass of Hunter, it doesn't actually do anything, but pick up the stuff other players might leave behind. Future Essentials2 classes include the Security Guard (Sentinel2), the Hexknife (Hexblade2), the Webelos (Scout2), the Gallant (Cavalier2) and the Goofus (Knight2). These will all be detailed in the box set called Heroes of the Futile Marketing. (Though what they should really release tomorrow is the Essentialized version of the Witchalok!)
That magical ammunition is one-use only.
Something which seems to be forgotten at times.




Sure... in 3.5. In this new edition, the weapon imparts the magical properties to the ammo, so there is no magical arrows or bolts, it is just the bow/crossbow/sling....



Magical ammunition was introduced in the Adventurer's Vault 2.
And actually, all ammunition is one-use only, magical or non.  Just to be a completist.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
So what... no, wait. I will look in the book.


I had not realized that it had been re-introduced.
Terms you should know...
Show
Kit Build - A class build that is self sustaining and has mechanical differences than the normal scale. Started in Essentials. Most are call their own terms, though the Base Class should be said in front of their own terms (Like Assassin/Executioner) Power Points - A mechanic that was wedged into the PHB3 classes (with the exception of the Monk) from the previous editions. This time, they are used to augment At Wills to be Encounters, thus eliminating the need to choose powers past 4th level. Mage Builds - Kit builds that are schools of magic for the Wizard. A call back to the previous editions powering up of the wizard. (Wizard/Necromancer, for example) Unlike the previous kit builds, Wizards simply lose their Scribe Rituals feature and most likely still can choose powers from any build, unlike the Kit Builds. Parcel System - A treasure distribution method that keeps adventurers poor while forcing/advising the DM to get wish lists from players. The version 2.0 rolls for treasure instead of making a list, and is incomplete because of the lack of clarity about magic item rarity.
ha ha
56902498 wrote:
They will Essentialize the Essentials classes, otherwise known as Essentials2. The new sub-sub-classes will be: * Magician. A subsubclass of Mage, the magician has two implements, wand and hat, one familiar (rabbit) and series of basic tricks. * Crook. A subsubclass of Thief, the Crook can only use a shiv, which allows him to use his only power... Shank. * Angry Vicar, a subsubclass of warpriest, the angry vicar has two attacks -- Shame and Lecture. * Hitter. A subsubclass of Slayer, the Hitter hits things. * Gatherer. A subsubclass of Hunter, it doesn't actually do anything, but pick up the stuff other players might leave behind. Future Essentials2 classes include the Security Guard (Sentinel2), the Hexknife (Hexblade2), the Webelos (Scout2), the Gallant (Cavalier2) and the Goofus (Knight2). These will all be detailed in the box set called Heroes of the Futile Marketing. (Though what they should really release tomorrow is the Essentialized version of the Witchalok!)
Actually, it seems you need Training to know anything at all about the Far Realm (see Arcana).

So three skills need Training.  This will be good to know for my Bard that will take Jack-of-all-Trades.  I only need to take Dungeoneering and Acrobatics to always get a skill check (Arcana is automatic)!



Doesn't Religion, Nature, Healing, etc... need to be trained to use specific rituals in Ritual Casting? In order to be able to learn ANY rituals you need either Arcane or Religion to be trained and (i believe) to do "restorative" rituals you need Healing to be trained, Speak with Dead would require trained Religion Enchant Item-Arcane, ect...

In addition Trained skills are prerequisites of various powers and feats.

It would be interesting to know which, if any, skills provide no benifitial options (beyond the +5 or a GM required trained skill check)



Doesn't Religion, Nature, Healing, etc... need to be trained to use specific rituals in Ritual Casting?



No.

In order to be able to learn ANY rituals you need either Arcane or Religion to be trained



Actually, that's the prerequisite for the Ritual Caster feat.  There are several other ways to get rituals - Druids, for example, have Ritual Casting as a class feature but aren't *required* to train Religion or Arcana.  And several Dragonmarks from Eberron give a number of rituals without prerequisites - Mark Of Scribing even gives the full Ritual Caster without any prerequisites at all.

and (i believe) to do "restorative" rituals you need Healing to be trained, Speak with Dead would require trained Religion Enchant Item-Arcane, ect...



Nope.

It would be interesting to know which, if any, skills provide no benifitial options (beyond the +5 or a GM required trained skill check)



I can't think of one, even if ones like Intimidate ("Lets you use powers with the Rattling keyword to their full effect") aren't necessarily useful for many characters.
Confused about Stealth? Think "invisibility" means "take the mini off the board to make people guess?" You need to check out The Rules Of Hidden Club.
Damage types and resistances: A working house rule.
A side note regarding trained skills: you have to have the training in order to get Skill Powers, which look like an intriguing option now that you can pick 'em up for a feat instead of needing to use a utility power slot.
The world is a mess, I just need to... rule it.
according to "#60 - () Only three things draw an OA: A non-shift move out of a threatened square, using a Ranged or Area power in a threatened square, or when it specifically created by way of a power."

Now does teleporting away from an enemy when your adjacent provoke an OA? Also, is the justification behind "getting up from prone does provoke" the fact that under the standing up rules it does not mention oppertunity attacks?

the verbage on this is something close to "if you leave a square adjacent to an enemy or within an enemy's threatening reach, you provoke an opportunity attack. Teleporting, shifting, and forced movement (such as a pull, push, or slide) do NOT provoke opportunity attacks even if you are in range"

Now I've been trying to search for something that will explain "standing up from prone provokes an opportunity attack if adjacent to an enemy or within its threatening reach", but I can't. As far as I can tell somebody once said "players provoke opportunity attacks when standing up from prone but monsters don't" and everyone's accepted it. Based on the fact that I wouldn't be "leaving a square," just switching off granting-combat-advantage, I'd say it shouldn't. However I can see the other side of the argument: have someone stand in front of you and have them try and hit you (dodge or block of course, this isn't a Stupid Test). Now lay down on the ground. As you're getting up, have them try and hit you again (not necessarily just punching, have them choose what they wanna do) and see how hard it is to stop it. I imagine most of the time your opponent will catch you off your guard. However I don't approve of this only applying to the players. It should be the same way for monsters. And I'm not saying it should be one way or the other, I can see both sides of this argument. I just think players and monsters should be effected the same. Since you're getting a response 6 months later, did you ever happen to find anything concrete? 

Now does teleporting away from an enemy when your adjacent provoke an OA?



No.


Now I've been trying to search for something that will explain "standing up from prone provokes an opportunity attack if adjacent to an enemy or within its threatening reach", but I can't.



That's because there isn't one.  Standing up *does not provoke*, because nothing says it does.


 As far as I can tell somebody once said "players provoke opportunity attacks when standing up from prone but monsters don't" and everyone's accepted it.



This person was wrong.


However I don't approve of this only applying to the players. It should be the same way for monsters.



It is the same for PCs and for NPCs:  Standing up *does not* provoke Opportunity Attacks.
Confused about Stealth? Think "invisibility" means "take the mini off the board to make people guess?" You need to check out The Rules Of Hidden Club.
Damage types and resistances: A working house rule.
Now I've been trying to search for something that will explain "standing up from prone provokes an opportunity attack if adjacent to an enemy or within its threatening reach", but I can't.

Pointing out the nonexistence of any such thing, and therefore that standing up does not draw opportunity attacks, is possibly the single most common point made in the rules Q&A FAQ thread.

"The world does not work the way you have been taught it does. We are not real as such; we exist within The Story. Unfortunately for you, you have inherited a condition from your mother known as Primary Protagonist Syndrome, which means The Story is interested in you. It will find you, and if you are not ready for the narrative strands it will throw at you..." - from Footloose
True. Right along with explaining that monsters (and PCs) still threaten adjacent squares when they are prone, unlike previous versions of the game. About once a month (even now) someone at my LFR tables will forget and get swatted by a prone monster when they attempt to move away without shifting.
The Halfling's Second Chance racial power and other instant powers are not usable on your own turn.  So, if you provoke an opportunity attack and get hit, you have to take it.



I have a notebook that I put things like this into, as a reminder. It's called "Rules That Kill", and the title is a reference to my old Starfleet Battles gaming days, where knowing, or not knowing, a certain rule could easily lose a game for you.

Our resident halfling rogue player was unaware of this rule until last night, and is now wiser, but much sadder. If you feel sudden, unexplained sharp pains today, its because he is sticking pins in a voodoo doll with your screen name on it. Laughing
Right along with explaining that monsters (and PCs) still threaten adjacent squares when they are prone, unlike previous versions of the game.

They could still threaten from prone in 3.5, too. I don't know about in 3 (though if not that would explain why this misconception was so common). And earlier versions of the game did not, to my knowledge involve the concepts of "threatening" and "opportunity attacks".

If I have to ask the GM for it, then I don't want it.

Now I've been trying to search for something that will explain "standing up from prone provokes an opportunity attack if adjacent to an enemy or within its threatening reach", but I can't.

Pointing out the nonexistence of any such thing, and therefore that standing up does not draw opportunity attacks, is possibly the single most common point made in the rules Q&A FAQ thread.




This is a rule change from 3.*

In previous versions of D&D, standing up provoked opportunity strikes.  Seasoned players sometimes assume old rules still apply in 4e.  It is easy to understand why they thought this.  It is just incorrect.

In other words, "standing up from prone does not provoke opportunity attacks in 4e".


Now I've been trying to search for something that will explain "standing up from prone provokes an opportunity attack if adjacent to an enemy or within its threatening reach", but I can't.

Pointing out the nonexistence of any such thing, and therefore that standing up does not draw opportunity attacks, is possibly the single most common point made in the rules Q&A FAQ thread.




This is a rule change from 3.*

In previous versions of D&D, standing up provoked opportunity strikes.  Seasoned players sometimes assume old rules still apply in 4e.  It is easy to understand why they thought this.  It is just incorrect.

In other words, "standing up from prone does not provoke opportunity attacks in 4e".



I like your answer because it is not formated in the "You're a moron for thinking otherwise" method.

Action Points - Tips and ideas for 4e D&D DMs and players. Extended Rest - The unpublished stories of heroism.
Q) Are hybrids allowed to retrain dailies and encounters to one from their other class without restriction, provided they still have 1 of each from each class after the swap?

They are supposed to be able to do that.

But, as you noticed, the character builder is having trouble with the concept.

I actually think this rule needs revisited and clarified anyway. It was drafted before skill powers were released, so maybe it never occurred to the designers that a character might not have any utility powers at all from either class. And how do multiclass powerswaps fit in?

"The world does not work the way you have been taught it does. We are not real as such; we exist within The Story. Unfortunately for you, you have inherited a condition from your mother known as Primary Protagonist Syndrome, which means The Story is interested in you. It will find you, and if you are not ready for the narrative strands it will throw at you..." - from Footloose
They should just remove the restriction IMO and let you be as much of one class or the other as you want. Hybrids should be more versatile in terms of power selection than regular multiclassing, because you give up the ability to have more than one class feature from *either* of your classes. Regular characters get a bunch of features from one class, and as many from the other as they spend feats acquiring through multiclass feats. Maybe force the at-wills to be balanced, but not the encounters or dailies or utilies. It just doesn't gel well with the rest of the rules.

I disagree, I think it makes a lot of sense flavor-wise to require some degree of balance - and not just in the at-wills. You aren't just dabbling in a second class, you're putting considerable effort into it and sacrificing a big chunk of your first class to do so.

However, I do think it needs restated to cover the greater number of possibilities.

How about (a) you can't have two chosen powers of a certain type from one hybrid class, unless you also have at least one chosen power of that type that is not from that hybrid class, and (b) from each of your hybrid classes, the minimum number of chosen encounter, daily, and utility powers (combined) will be 1 at level 6, 2 at level 10, and 3 at level 16. (Goes up each time you gain a second or later chosen utility power.)

(I specify "chosen" to exclude powers that are a side effect of choosing something else.)

"The world does not work the way you have been taught it does. We are not real as such; we exist within The Story. Unfortunately for you, you have inherited a condition from your mother known as Primary Protagonist Syndrome, which means The Story is interested in you. It will find you, and if you are not ready for the narrative strands it will throw at you..." - from Footloose
They should just remove the restriction IMO and let you be as much of one class or the other as you want. Hybrids should be more versatile in terms of power selection than regular multiclassing, because you give up the ability to have more than one class feature from *either* of your classes. Regular characters get a bunch of features from one class, and as many from the other as they spend feats acquiring through multiclass feats. Maybe force the at-wills to be balanced, but not the encounters or dailies or utilies. It just doesn't gel well with the rest of the rules.

I just don't see how it's possible / fair for an Eternal Seeker Hybrid to pick powers they want without Monty Python-esque silliness. When I pick something from Barbarian at level 23 it goes into an infinite loop, houruling level 13 powers as I select the 23 one from another class. When I re-fix the one from 13, I can't use retraining later on, and it houserules me. There is no solution at this point, it's a catch-22 broken circle. It's like the algorithm only checks the balance of powers from all levels *previous* to that level, not currently possessing.

I realize code is buggy but PH3 is out and they need to fix hybrid power selection in the builder ASAP. There is no way I am making out new characters with other classes just to print out a character sheet for that power and then literally cut and paste it using glue onto my sheet.



I agree. Hybrids is trading some strenght for versatility. The current Hybrid keeps your hands tied. You already loose enought not to cut on the versatility. The previous installement was okay.

Simply requiring 1 Power of each Classes is enought to me. Out of 3 you get 1 of each and 1 of eighter Class. But currently, the Hybrid in the CB requires you to have the two first Powers be from each Class and then the last one of your choice. But where it gets funky is when you start swaping at higher level. You versatility then become reduced since you're constantly forced to take powers from one Class or another.

WoTC should return to the previous installement for how the powers were handled.



I am not sure if this has been mentioned, and I appologize if it has (don't want to look through 27 pages of posts).  With opportunity attacks, you could make up to 8 in a round, since it says you can make one per combatant (under opportunity actions) and there is no other limit given.  Am I reading this right?

An example: Say a fighter is surrounded by adjacent artillery monsters, and they all chose to shoot at him point blank (ie not shift away then shoot). Could he make a melee basic attack against each of them?

Ramius
58074418 wrote:
I strive for the freedom from expectations so many enjoy here; I fear I have a long journey to that level of spiritual creaminess.
I am not sure if this has been mentioned, and I appologize if it has (don't want to look through 27 pages of posts).  With opportunity attacks, you could make up to 8 in a round, since it says you can make one per combatant (under opportunity actions) and there is no other limit given.  Am I reading this right?

An example: Say a fighter is surrounded by adjacent artillery monsters, and they all chose to shoot at him point blank (ie not shift away then shoot). Could he make a melee basic attack against each of them?

Ramius



Yes. a creature standing next to a door could take as many OA's as the number of people that can pass through that door in 6 seconds all reasonably. 8, 12 even 20. 1 per creature's Turn.

The key for them is to Ready An Action on the first one shooting and all shoot as well to reduce OA's to 1.
Same for the door passing. Ready when the first is moving throught the door to all follow in.

A tactic not all Monsters should outsmart think though.

The key for them is to Ready An Action on the first one shooting and all shoot as well to reduce OA's to 1.
Same for the door passing. Ready when the first is moving throught the door to all follow in.

A tactic not all Monsters should outsmart think though.



And, for the record, this tactic is *not* ideal - when running through the door, all the monsters are giving up their Standard Actions and losing their attacks to avoid that OA.  The artillery monsters are giving up their Immediates *and* their ability to move away if the Fighter goes down.

So they're making a tradeoff to avoid the OAs.  It's a fair trick.
Confused about Stealth? Think "invisibility" means "take the mini off the board to make people guess?" You need to check out The Rules Of Hidden Club.
Damage types and resistances: A working house rule.
I have no idea if your still looking for rules with different understandings, ie you think they mean one thing but mean another. There are 100 plus pages so i am sure you have covered this and argued against it, but everyone keeps telling me Second wind only allows you to regain hp equal to one healing surge. Even though the power says one healing surge AND regain (surge value) hit points.

The logic they tell me is that using a healing surge alone does not always regain hit points, but all powers that tell you to use a healing surge for another reason other than hit points specifically say so. So the wording on the second wind power indicates that it uses one surge but you regain two surges worth of healing.

EDIT: Another reason i believe this is the 2nd level Warlord power Healers Gift says use a healing surge, not use a healing surge and regain (surge value) hit points. So if Second Wind was really just the one surge value then would not Healers Gift and Second Wind have the same description?

Also rule #48 is confirmed as while i don't have a book page number, it is considered extra damage and extra damage dice do not max on a critical. Same as Ranger Quarry, Warlocks Curse or Assassins Shrouds.
I have no idea if your still looking for rules with different understandings, ie you think they mean one thing but mean another. There are 100 plus pages so i am sure you have covered this and argued against it, but everyone keeps telling me Second wind only allows you to regain hp equal to one healing surge. Even though the power says one healing surge AND regain (surge value) hit points.

The logic they tell me is that using a healing surge alone does not always regain hit points, but all powers that tell you to use a healing surge for another reason other than hit points specifically say so. So the wording on the second wind power indicates that it uses one surge but you regain two surges worth of healing.



Nope, you're misreading it, it doesn't say that at all.  Second Wind lets you spend *one* surge and regain *one surge's worth* of hitpoints, total. 

Check it out, PHB pg 291, Second Wind:  "SECOND WIND: STANDARD ACTION: Spend a Healing Surge: Spend a healing surge to regain hit points (see “Healing,” page 293)."


For comparison:  Cloak Of The Walking Wounded, a magic item, says: "Property: If you use your second wind while bloodied, you can expend two healing surges instead of one (gaining hit points from both)."

What would the point of this (extremely powerful) item if you normally got two surges for the price of one?  Even assuming Second Wind said what you think it does, which it doesn't?
Confused about Stealth? Think "invisibility" means "take the mini off the board to make people guess?" You need to check out The Rules Of Hidden Club.
Damage types and resistances: A working house rule.

EDIT: Another reason i believe this is the 2nd level Warlord power Healers Gift says use a healing surge, not use a healing surge and regain (surge value) hit points. So if Second Wind was really just the one surge value then would not Healers Gift and Second Wind have the same description? 



Funny, but no.  Many, but not all, powers say "spend a Healing Surge" with no modifiers, relying on PHB1 pg 293 to explain what that means.  Some say "spend a Healing Surge to regain HP" - it's not consistent.

The ones you need to worry about are "spend a Healing Surge and $whatever_happens instead of regaining HP"
Confused about Stealth? Think "invisibility" means "take the mini off the board to make people guess?" You need to check out The Rules Of Hidden Club.
Damage types and resistances: A working house rule.

Also rule #48 is confirmed as while i don't have a book page number, it is considered extra damage and extra damage dice do not max on a critical. Same as Ranger Quarry, Warlocks Curse or Assassins Shrouds.



Wow, you just keep editing in wrong things.  use new posts, man!

Extra damage *is* maxed on a critical hit.  Everything that you would roll on a non-crit, including Class Feature damage, rolled item damage, bonus damage from Feats, etc, is maxed on a crit.

The only things that are *not* maxed on a crit are things that you are only rolling because it is a crit.
Confused about Stealth? Think "invisibility" means "take the mini off the board to make people guess?" You need to check out The Rules Of Hidden Club.
Damage types and resistances: A working house rule.
It does say that, no question, i have the power card in front of me. As for what you said, i do understand that point of view, but then why would it extend the description like that when in the level 2 Utility power it simply says "Target can spend a Healing Surge"

Oh and the power is Aid the Injured not Healers Gift. My mistake on that one.

EDIT: It is my understanding that only damage from the power that rolled the Critical is Maxed, any other dice rolls are consider "extra damage" and are not part of the main attack. It comes back to the one source rule, Sneak Attack damage is a second damage source and so does not stack with the Critical (In regards to max die roll damage). Item Bonus Rolled Die on critical is specially stated as only working on a critical and is not maxed either. As again it is an extra source of damage.
It does say that, no question, i have the power card in front of me.



The power card is a summary.  It is not the rule, just like the short description of a Feat in the Feats list on the sheet is not the defining rule of the Feat.

Second Wind is covered on page 291 of PHB1.  Second wind lets you spend a Surge to regain HP, as per pg 293.  Page 293 says that when you spend a Surge, you gain Surge Value HP unless something specifically says otherwise.

As for what you said, i do understand that point of view, but then why would it extend the description like that when in the level 2 Utility power it simply says "Target can spend a Healing Surge"

Oh and the power is Aid the Injured not Healers Gift. My mistake on that one.



Because it was written at a different time, by a different author, and despite the diferent wording the powers work the same way in practice.  One is explicit right there, the other calls out the standard rules.

EDIT: It is my understanding that only damage from the power that rolled the Critical is Maxed, any other dice rolls are consider "extra damage" and are not part of the main attack.



They're "extra damage", but "extra damage" just means "not a separate damage roll", because a second damage roll would involve a second application of static bonuses.  It's extra damage, not from the original power but included in the original damage roll.

Everything you roll on a non-crit, including Sneak Attack, Shroud, Qaurry, Horned Helm, Flaming Weapon's Daily, Thundergod's Property, etc, is maxed on a crit.

The ONLY things you don't max are things that you are rolling *because the hit is a crit*, that you would not roll for a non-crit.
Confused about Stealth? Think "invisibility" means "take the mini off the board to make people guess?" You need to check out The Rules Of Hidden Club.
Damage types and resistances: A working house rule.
Yeah you were right on the crit, i just read in the Q&A FAQ that same thing.

As for Second Wind, i will continue to believe what i did before, as i have seen no Official ruling giving an indication that it doesn't do that, and the Direction wording of the power (IE individual descriptive rules trump general rules) definitely says AND, as the word "and" is a synonym for plus and additional. I cannot see it another way... though i will admit it could be a typo of sorts.

As for Second Wind, i will continue to believe what i did before, as i have seen no Official ruling giving an indication that it doesn't do that, and the Direction wording of the power (IE individual descriptive rules trump general rules) definitely says AND, as the word "and" is a synonym for plus and additional. I cannot see it another way... though i will admit it could be a typo of sorts.



You can keep believing that, but you'll keep being wrong.  Second Wind *does not do what you think it does*.

There are two versions of Second Wind.  There's the one in the book, that says one surge, one surge value, and that is the official and correct version, and there's the one on the non-official not-a-rule card, that says  "Spend a surge and regain X HP" - which is a summary that happens to include your character's specific surge value.

For bonus points, it doesn't even say "X additional HP", so you're wrong *there*, too.

Second Wind is one surge, one surge value.  When you see an unofficial source (the CB card) that says otherwise, you compare with the official source (the PHB) and discover that either you're misreading the card (which you are), or that the card is wrong and should be ignored (which would be the case if you *weren't* misreading the card.  Which you are.)
Confused about Stealth? Think "invisibility" means "take the mini off the board to make people guess?" You need to check out The Rules Of Hidden Club.
Damage types and resistances: A working house rule.
Yeah you were right on the crit, i just read in the Q&A FAQ that same thing.

As for Second Wind, i will continue to believe what i did before, as i have seen no Official ruling giving an indication that it doesn't do that, and the Direction wording of the power (IE individual descriptive rules trump general rules) definitely says AND, as the word "and" is a synonym for plus and additional. I cannot see it another way... though i will admit it could be a typo of sorts.



Here is the clear rule language for the compendium:

SECOND WIND: STANDARD ACTION

Spend a Healing Surge: Spend a healing surge to regain hit pointsfavicon.icofavicon.icowiki-favicon-sharpened.pngoneriot-favicon.ico.favicon.icofavicon.icowiki-favicon-sharpened.pngoneriot-favicon.ico

+2 Bonus to All Defenses: You gain a +2 bonus to all defenses until the start of your next turn.


Healing Surge Value: When you spend a healing surge, you regain one-quarter of your maximum hit points (rounded down). This number is called your healing surge value. You use it often, so note it on your character sheet.


I see what you are saying about the power card but it is clear form the above text that the proper way to read the power card is that you spend a healing surge to get your healing surge value in hit points.
I have no idea if your still looking for rules with different understandings, ie you think they mean one thing but mean another. There are 100 plus pages so i am sure you have covered this and argued against it, but everyone keeps telling me Second wind only allows you to regain hp equal to one healing surge. Even though the power says one healing surge AND regain (surge value) hit points.

The logic they tell me is that using a healing surge alone does not always regain hit points, but all powers that tell you to use a healing surge for another reason other than hit points specifically say so. So the wording on the second wind power indicates that it uses one surge but you regain two surges worth of healing.



You are being overly nitpicky, Ziggy.

The word "and" is not always used as a logical operator.

Take for instance PHB 293 "Healing Surges"
It says that you can "spend a healing surge and heal yourself"

What they meant is "spend a healing surge to heal yourself"

If you need another very specific example, check the following:

PHB 294 "Damage and Healing in Action"
"Rieta has 96 maximum hit points [...] she uses her second wind, which restores 24 hit points" which equal one quarter of her maximum hit points AKA her healing surge value.

Note that the Second Wind action of some monsters in the MM like Death Knights also use the wording "spend a healing surge and regain x HP". This is just a matter of convenience to relieve the DM of the burden of calculating a monster's surge value since it's not given in the statistics block. For the same reason your power card uses that format so that you have all the necessary information at hand without referring to your character sheet.

The key for them is to Ready An Action on the first one shooting and all shoot as well to reduce OA's to 1.
Same for the door passing. Ready when the first is moving throught the door to all follow in.

A tactic not all Monsters should outsmart think though.



And, for the record, this tactic is *not* ideal - when running through the door, all the monsters are giving up their Standard Actions and losing their attacks to avoid that OA.  The artillery monsters are giving up their Immediates *and* their ability to move away if the Fighter goes down.

So they're making a tradeoff to avoid the OAs.  It's a fair trick.



Sorry, kinda off here with my understanding, how does readying an action prevents OAs? I'm just curious but I would like to use it when im DMing.



A given creature may make one OA per turn.  If the readied actions all go off on the same turn then the provoked creature may only make one OA against the multiple provoking creature because they are all provoking on the same turn.

For example, a barbarian is surrounded by a group of archers:
A a a
a B a
a a a

If each archer shot the barbarian on their turn, the barbarian would get eight OAs.  On the other hand, if each archer (a) readied to shoot the barbarian until archer (A) shoots the barbarian then all eight attacks happen in archer (A)'s turn.  The barbarian only gets one OA.



A given creature may make one OA per turn.  If the readied actions all go off on the same turn then the provoked creature may only make one OA against the multiple provoking creature because they are all provoking on the same turn.

For example, a barbarian is surrounded by a group of archers:
A a a
a B a
a a a

If each archer shot the barbarian on their turn, the barbarian would get eight OAs.  On the other hand, if each archer (a) readied to shoot the barbarian until archer (A) shoots the barbarian then all eight attacks happen in archer (A)'s turn.  The barbarian only gets one OA.

A little more clarification. You can make one oportunity attack per combatant's turn. Since the archers are using a readied action on their turn to wait for the Archer to shoot, they won't provoke the Opportunity Attacks since their readied action is an immediate reaction, and thus can't take place on their turn.

I hope I have talked myself into confusion.

Ramius
58074418 wrote:
I strive for the freedom from expectations so many enjoy here; I fear I have a long journey to that level of spiritual creaminess.
I just learned this:

If you roll a 20 it's an auto hit, however if 20+ your attack modifier would not normally hit the target, it's not a critical, just a normal hit.
A little more clarification. You can make one oportunity attack per combatant's turn. Since the archers are using a readied action on their turn to wait for the Archer to shoot, they won't provoke the Opportunity Attacks since their readied action is an immediate reaction, and thus can't take place on their turn. I hope I have talked myself into confusion. Ramius



All the archers are shooting on the same turn, specifically on A's turn. Because of this, the barbarian only gets 1 OA.
For risk bonus points, the archers could ready the action to occur on the barbarian's turn (assuming they guess what he'd do, like "when the barbarian attacks" or "when the barbarian moves") then the barbarian wouldn't get any OA...since it's his turn.

He also couldn't use immediate reactions either. Though they risk all being killed (readied actions happen as reactions) or losing their readied actions if the barbarian didn't do the trigger.
Sorry, kinda off here with my understanding, how does readying an action prevents OAs?

You cannot make an opportunity attack on your own turn. So if I ready my action pending you taking an action during your turn, my action happens during your turn and you won't get an OA on me.

"The world does not work the way you have been taught it does. We are not real as such; we exist within The Story. Unfortunately for you, you have inherited a condition from your mother known as Primary Protagonist Syndrome, which means The Story is interested in you. It will find you, and if you are not ready for the narrative strands it will throw at you..." - from Footloose
Player's Handbook page 280: When determining cover, "A line isn’t blocked if it runs along the edge of an obstacle’s or an enemy’s square." 

I played in a game where the DM didn't believe me, and clearly didn't realize this rule.  He even went as far as trying to "explain the rules" to me by drawing two figures separated by a pillar and pointing out that the parallel line running along the pillar was blocked.

I post this mostly to calm the nerd rage boiling in my veins.
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