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Apr 4, 2013 -- 10:07AM, Awesomeocalypse wrote:

Yet again a problem arises. I don't fully disagree with you in the concept that the QB is a trigger/pivot of the whole offense (he is kinda the one who can say okay now the encounter starts).  He calls audibles that change the root play in reaction to the motion of the defense, and its on him to read his recievers and backs to see where he can put the ball. However at no point does he ever tell a lineman exactly who to hit and how (the coach did that long before this game in fact the linemen likely learned how to hit them in pop warner through highschool play).  At best he audibles and changes the play to another preplaned pattern.  He doesn't tell the linemen who to ht, and create openings for them to do so.  He audibles and the linemen and backers already know their blocking assignments because the coach told them so (actually they taught themselves by reading the play book).  

Basically I can agree somewhat in concept, but not in capability.  At no point is he giving his allies bonuses to attacks, and defenses (that they didn't already have from looking in front of themselves as they lined up).  At no point is he handing out off turn attacks, at no point is he creating openings that the allies can use to better attack their enemies.

When Peyton Manning came to the Denver Broncos, they ended up completely redesigning their entire playbook to conform to the plays Peyton wants to run, ultimately producing an offense that is a near carbon copy of the offense Peyton ran in Indianapolis. The notion that the QB is simply running the plays the OC comes up with simply doesn't apply--the OC instituted the plays the QB told him to institute. The offense they are running is the Peyton Manning Colts offense.

That offense is the simplest in the league in terms of number of plays--what makes it work is that it gives Peyton an incredible, unprecedented amount of freedom to change the play at the line of scrimmage. Moreso than any other player in NFL history, Peyton is an offensive coordinator on the field, and his team's success can absolutely be credited to his ability to read defenses and adjust accordingly.

So, in fact, Peyton is absolutely creating openings that better enable this teammates to succeed. That is the core of his success. He's not the dominant QB he is because his arm is just that much stronger (especially not post injury), its because he is insanely good at diagnosing the defence at the line of scrimmage, then giving real-time, split second instructions that enable his teammates to take advantage of the defence.

Like I said I'm not in full disagreement on it, and some QB's such as peyton are able to do that/force the team he is on to do that, but that's not every QB.  However even on that line he's likely not the only one calling out observations about the defence and what's going on, and if he is I can kinda see why I hear a bunch of people dump on him...cause he kinda doesn't sound like a team player he kinda sounds like a guy that says do what I tell you when I tell you (which inadvertantly is my only major problem with the warlord as a concept as you guys point him out because its basically a concept based around I tell everyone else on the table what to do all the time).  What about that teams backup QB?  What about that guy that runs the same plays when Peyton gets injured, or they take him out to keep him from getting injured in game they are already winning?  Is that guy a warlord as well?  He isn't making plays, or calling out where people are going, he's just following the script peyton left him.  He isn't building plays and telling people where to go.  Also who developed those original plays for the colts.  Is it possible peyton came in and said, 'yeah I don't want to learn new plays here is the colt offensive book we will run those plays instead.'

Also given my example character I built there how does that guy not have the ability to make that same thing happen?  He has the int and military lore to be able to build plays, and call plays pre snap, then actually carry out the various tasks needed of him during the different plays.  I mean maybe for peyton we dial up the int and dial down the dex.  Basically your saying peyton is powerful because of his int, not his arm, trade off the one that starts at 16 and the one that starts at 14 and then trade int and dex in the ability adjustment scale.

While yes in Peyton's case he is inadvertantly telling them where to go, and when he isn't doing that with his actions those are not the actions he is taking (as most in this thread would demand be the actions of a warlord).  He had the int to do the planning before, and the into to see how the defense is lining up, but at best he uses a free action to call out another completely pre structured battle plan.  He doesn't spend his actions directing others or creating openings or inspiring his allies.  He spends his actions moving around, and tossing the ball, or handing it off, or running it.  His actions that he takes on the field, are not the demanded capabilities of a warlord.  However his actions outside of combat which are basically covered by int and lore checks...entirely cover the concept as it is described here.  Like I said I totally see the value of the warlord concept, and even somone with the demanded capabilities, but labling things like a QB as a warlord mars the argument because while he fills your concept he has none of the capabilities your looking for that type of character to have.

Always remember the average football play is one to two rounds of prep, where everyone gets in starting positions, and agrees on the plan, int checks military lore, and all that, people readying actions acordingly, then two rounds of combat.  Two rounds of combat where the QB does nothing but move,  toss, hand, off, or run the ball, and bluff as to where the ball actually is.

Oh also for that rouge elf:  he needs to have conceal an object trained (yet again faking handoffs, likely take out spot for this because of keen senses) and definitely bluff over persuade for background skills.