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7 months ago ::
Nov 17, 2012 - 6:19PM
#11
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Date Joined:
Oct 23, 2012
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I mostly disagree with adding encounter powers to most classes. Combat in Next seems very fast maybe 3 rounds average, encounter powers seem like they would just make such short combats always feel the same. If you have 1 or 2 encounter powers that are way better then your manuevers, then it just means EVERY combat your going to lead with them.
This seems like it will undermine all of the tactical complexity of XD and leave us with too many obvious "easy-button" solutions. It would just mean the real tactical plays in combat would just begin in round three after everone has extinguished their encounter powers.
I would be okay with encounter powers that are not actions, but instead things more like words of power in application, I like the idea of them not being "power moves" but changing how players play or giving a one turn buff to the player or group.
Examples of encounter powers I WOULD be okay with:
Fighter: 1/encounter fighter can choose to reroll any XD until the end of his next turn.
Rogue: 1/encounter rogue can make a skill check without spending an action.
As far as power moves, I'd prefer a few Daily powers as a general mechanic.
My mind is a deal-breaker.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 17, 2012 - 9:38PM
#12
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Date Joined:
Feb 19, 2012
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I think encounter utility powers offer a really cool benefit (esp. If tied to race).I would dig seeing (as has been discussed in several other threads) a way to "burn" XD to do exceptionally strenuous maneuvers. These dice wouldn't be recovered until after a short rest. Sure. Go nova. The rest of the fight won't be nearly as fun.
"What's stupid is when people decide that X is true - even when it is demonstrable untrue or 100% against what we've said - and run around complaining about that. That's just a breakdown of basic human reasoning."
-Mike Mearls
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7 months ago ::
Nov 17, 2012 - 10:02PM
#13
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Date Joined:
Feb 22, 2012
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The problem has always been martial classes having encounter and daily powers. Those don't make sense. Everyone who doesn't like vancian magic (probably most of us) enjoy spell casters having at will and encounter spells. That's the difference. There is no logical reason to limit martial characters in such a way.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 17, 2012 - 10:57PM
#14
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Date Joined:
Jun 24, 2005
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True. Grognards get it the worse. You get a Vancian tradition smeared with AEDU. Encounter powers would do the same to other classes.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 17, 2012 - 11:07PM
#15
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Date Joined:
Jun 15, 2012
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I like encounter powers, but I don't think it would make the game more fun to play if I'm imagining it, so I can live without it.
A few guidelines for using the internet:
1. Mentally add "In my opinion" to the end of basically anything someone else says. Of course it's their opinion, they don't need to let you know. You're pretty smart.
2. Assume everyone means everything in the best manner they could mean it. Save yourself some stress and give people the benefit of the doubt. We'll all be happier if we type less emoticons.
3. Don't try to read people's minds. Sometimes people mean exactly what they say. You probably don't know them any better than they know themselves.
4. Let grammar slide. If you understood what they meant, you're good. It's better for your health.
5. Breath. It's just a dumb game.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 17, 2012 - 11:46PM
#16
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Date Joined:
Aug 28, 2005
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The problem has always been martial classes having encounter and daily powers. Those don't make sense.
They make perfect sense to anybody willing to listen to something new. The only problem with martial encounter and daily abilities is some people being unable to get past their preconceived notions of what those limiters are meant to represent. To contrast, I see many experienced gamers who have issue with them but have not met even a single new player who thought they were any more immersion-breaking than encounter or daily spells.
Why, yes, as a matter of fact I am the Unfailing Arbiter of All That Is Good Design (Even More So Than The Actual Developers) TMSpeaking of things that were badly designed, please check out this thread for my Minotaur fix. What have the critics said, you ask? "If any of my players ask to play a Minotaur, I'm definitely offering this as an alternative to the official version." - EmpactWB "If I ever feel like playing a Minotaur I'll know where to look!" - Undrave "WoTC if you are reading this - please take this guy's advice." - Ferol_Debtor_of_Torm "Really full of win. A minotaur that is actually attractive for more than just melee classes." - Cpt_Micha Also, check out my recent GENASI variant! If you've ever wished that your Fire Genasi could actually set stuff on fire, your Water Genasi could actually swim, or your Wind Genasi could at least glide, then look no further. Finally, check out my OPTIONS FOR EVERYONE article, an effort to give unique support to the races that WotC keeps forgetting about. Includes new racial feature options for the Changeling, Deva, Githzerai, Gnoll, Gnome, Goliath, Half-Orc, Kalashtar, Minotaur, Shadar-Kai, Thri-Kreen, Warforged and more!
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7 months ago ::
Nov 17, 2012 - 11:55PM
#17
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Date Joined:
Jul 29, 2012
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The only problem with martial encounter and daily abilities is some people being unable to get past their preconceived notions of what those limiters are meant to represent.
The only problem in your opinion; wow; new can be great, but not everybody in the party asking each other "...have you used your daily?"
I have had a lot of fun DMing 4th Ed, was on the train since day 1, but AEDU did not turn out to be something I am fond of.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 18, 2012 - 1:25AM
#18
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2012
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Really, the issue I had with 4e was its execution. I don't mind having some abilities used on a per-encounter basis. I don't see any reason why a martial character shouldn't have these kinds of abilities either. It depends on the ability and how powerful it is in the context of the rest of the ability set. If 5e uses a ton of ideas from 4e with different presentation, that's just fine by me. A lot of the ideas were good; I just didn't really like how they were implemented.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 18, 2012 - 1:37AM
#19
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Date Joined:
Sep 20, 2012
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Yeah, Signature spells, a bad "obfuscation" of the per-encounter deal; talk about immersion breaking and board-game/skirmish action, IMO.
I agree. Encounter Powers, were immersion breaking - and brought tons of metagaming to the table.
That said, I think that the Warlock and the Wizard bring an interesting element to make them more believable.
- The warlock needs a small incantation to his/her patron that requires a short rest.
- The Wizard must rest a while for him to refocus the spells powers.
That could actually be interesting as RPing.
So really what is an advancement in DDN in relation to 4e is that they're tying Encounters and Dailies to reasonable in believable solutions.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 18, 2012 - 5:15AM
#20
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Date Joined:
Aug 13, 2004
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I like encounter powers and 4th edition, but I don't like how they were defined and implemented.
I'm totally against dailies for non-magical classes, and I think that supernatural classes should only have access to the casting of a single (powerful) daily (one is the minimum number of encounters, easy take into consideration for DMs, and large amount of dailies are cheat paradise, intentional cheat or not).
Encounter spells can be justified for any class based on the surprise.
In french, we have the expression "botte secrète" for which I can't find direct translation online (maybe "secret weapon" or "artful thrust"). It comes from fencing and is an unique attack invented a kept secret by the fencer to surprise the enemy and is then almost unstoppable.
Basically, this secret attack is an at-will, but it works only once per encounter.
Developping and mastering these attacks require training and experience, so the number known by a fighter would be limited.
This surprise based system (encounter) can be used for a lot of things, like to disengage, or fake attacks to move across the battlefield without drawing attacks of opportunity.
Surprise based encounter abilities work even more easily with supernatural users.
And the short rest recuperation based encounter powers from DDN are still here to handle expended ressources like a breath weapon or supernatural power fuel.
"They are making it clear that when modern design and common sense come into conflict with tradition, tradition wins." - thecasualoblivion
"Vancian isn't broken, you just have to set your game to the wizard's clock!" - Oxybe
"In many ways, making a new edition of D&D is alot like trying to sell a car to the Amish." - Dwarfslayer
"Encounters are the heart of the AD&D game" - PHB AD&D 2nd edition.
"you shouldn't even bother trying to become like me." - Gary Gygax (Elfcrusher confirmed)
"Feel free to claim I said anything you like. How's someone going to call you out on it? Are they going to be all like, 'I know all of the things that Gary said, and that's not one of them?'"
- Gary Gygax
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