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9 months ago ::
Oct 07, 2012 - 5:05PM
#161
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@Lokiare
People left 4e because of 4e and not some character builder. I was amongst those groups that left during that time and I never used any version of the character builder. D&D had a powerful brand built up. It took a while for people to try the game and then reject it for Pathfinder.
The developers were likely told they were doing an additional piece of web code using a common backend. That's all they knew. The decision to not support the downloadable character builder is one that could easily have been decided purely for business reasons at the last second. I imagine the loss of DDi subscribers led them to try to force people to be a member all the time and not once every three or four months.
I think you are a conspiracy theorist Lokiare. At least with regards to D&D. I suspect other areas too though from what I've seen you mention. Thats you right but it doesn't mean the rest of us have to buy into it.
I like how I start showing facts and people start trotting out the 'conspiracy theorist' nonsense excuse to ignore the facts of the matter. I could just as well call you a WotC fan boy, but that wouldn't change the facts or further the discussion which is why I don't call people names or try to categorize them into little boxes to feel safe.
Your anecdotal evidence is not as compelling as the factual evidence of Paolo's statement and the subsequent loss of subscriptions which happened almost 2 years after the release of the 4E. Also if you knew how .NET and Silverlight work you would know what you proposed is impossible. Especially since the Silverlight portion requires server side programming and client side programming and since the database changed between the two versions (you can verify this by deconstructing the database that was in the offline version at the last update and the downloaded database that the online version downloads to your computer every time it updates). So no, they weren't using the same database structure which means they intended to only support the online version.
Also if all of that weren't true, your personal speculation doesn't prove anything. The facts of the matter are that the programming lead (the guy in charge of designing and implementing both character builders) came out and either lied outright, or didn't understand his job and was letting a subordinate do his work (which is unlikely in such a small company). Please look into it and quit spouting nonsense to try to support your insupportable position...
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9 months ago ::
Oct 07, 2012 - 5:37PM
#162
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Date Joined:
Jul 18, 2012
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Greetings, This thread is starting to derail off topic with signs of baiting. This is against Code of Conduct and prohibited on our forums. If this continues I will have to return and take further action. Please keep the discussion clean and most importantly, fun.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 07, 2012 - 6:33PM
#163
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Date Joined:
Apr 23, 2009
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@Lokiare
Yeah this thread is going nowhere on this subject. I just don't agree with how you interpret events. You seem to weight the likelihood of foul play higher than I do. Unless more evidence surfaces, we'll just have to agree to disagree on the facts we have.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 07, 2012 - 6:43PM
#164
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No, what Paolo said was "The new tool will complement the existing tools (CB and MB at that time), we think you will be pleasantly surprised." Or something very close to that. That you can't see the lie in that is your own WotC apologist blindness at work...
This is going to be a dumb question I know, but have you ever thought that maybe since you're pretty much the only one repeating this bit ad nauseum (seriously, it got old a long time ago), that maybe you're the one in the wrong? That maybe - just maybe - you did in fact misinterpret things?
Lokiare is right about this one.
Not only did WotC pull the old switch-a-roo with the new Character Builder, but there was also reports that if you tried to update your offline CB then it would be corrupted (and of course no where to download a new copy)
Pro DnD Member of the Axis of Awesome Fighters: Using socks to kill monsters since 2012 DnD Next: Now with more then 4 minutes of Roleplay per gaming hour Spoiler:
Show
"If you can't make an interesting human fighter, then you aren't ready to play anything else yet" Edymnion
"The idea of resting up between encounters to fill-up on hit points and spells struck my meta-gaming nine-year-old as a distinct possibility. "Are you mad?" says my seven-year-old "This place is full of monsters!" "jamesgrahamuk
All characters have a story. Spoiler:
Show
Sometimes that story is short and sometimes it is long. They can be tragic, comic or absurd. Some teach. Some are just to fill the empty spaces in our lives. Rarely it is a transcendent fugue only half remembered but wondered at. And frequently: "it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing." -William Shakespeare
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9 months ago ::
Oct 07, 2012 - 6:45PM
#165
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Date Joined:
Jan 23, 2012
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Lokiare is right about this one.
Not only did WotC pull the old switch-a-roo with the new Character Builder, but there was also reports that if you tried to update your offline CB then it would be corrupted (and of course no where to download a new copy)
Okay, so it's up to two people saying so. Either way, my other point remains: is there any reason whatsoever to keep beating that dead horse? I mean, if it happened, it happened. What benefit are folks getting from continuing to bitch about it?
For those confused on how DDN's modular rules might work, this may provide some insight: http://www.tor.com/blogs/2012/11/the-world-of-darkness-shines-when-it-abandons-canon
@mikemearls: Uhhh... do you really not see all the 3e/4e that's basically the entire core system?
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9 months ago ::
Oct 07, 2012 - 6:56PM
#166
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Lokiare is right about this one.
Not only did WotC pull the old switch-a-roo with the new Character Builder, but there was also reports that if you tried to update your offline CB then it would be corrupted (and of course no where to download a new copy)
Okay, so it's up to two people saying so. Either way, my other point remains: is there any reason whatsoever to keep beating that dead horse? I mean, if it happened, it happened. What benefit are folks getting from continuing to bitch about it?
The most important reason to remember what happened in the past is when we consider whether or not WotC will continue to support the online CB when they make the shift to DnD Next.
Pro DnD Member of the Axis of Awesome Fighters: Using socks to kill monsters since 2012 DnD Next: Now with more then 4 minutes of Roleplay per gaming hour Spoiler:
Show
"If you can't make an interesting human fighter, then you aren't ready to play anything else yet" Edymnion
"The idea of resting up between encounters to fill-up on hit points and spells struck my meta-gaming nine-year-old as a distinct possibility. "Are you mad?" says my seven-year-old "This place is full of monsters!" "jamesgrahamuk
All characters have a story. Spoiler:
Show
Sometimes that story is short and sometimes it is long. They can be tragic, comic or absurd. Some teach. Some are just to fill the empty spaces in our lives. Rarely it is a transcendent fugue only half remembered but wondered at. And frequently: "it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing." -William Shakespeare
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9 months ago ::
Oct 07, 2012 - 7:00PM
#167
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Date Joined:
Apr 12, 2008
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The most important reason to remember what happened in the past is when we consider whether or not WotC will continue to support the online CB when they make the shift to DnD Next.
My bet is no, they will not. I'm sure if they do have an online builder, it will be dedicated to DDN.
But since the people that seem to be up in arms about it aren't DDI subscribers anyway, I think it's a moot point.
In fond memory of Mark "Wrecan" Monack.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 07, 2012 - 7:01PM
#168
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Date Joined:
Jan 23, 2012
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The most important reason to remember what happened in the past is when we consider whether or not WotC will continue to support the online CB when they make the shift to DnD Next.
My bet is no, they will not. I'm sure if they do have an online builder, it will be dedicated to DDN.
But since the people that seem to be up in arms about it aren't DDI subscribers anyway, I think it's a moot point.
Yep, pretty much. So I don't see why there is much worry about it.
For those confused on how DDN's modular rules might work, this may provide some insight: http://www.tor.com/blogs/2012/11/the-world-of-darkness-shines-when-it-abandons-canon
@mikemearls: Uhhh... do you really not see all the 3e/4e that's basically the entire core system?
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9 months ago ::
Oct 07, 2012 - 8:04PM
#169
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The most important reason to remember what happened in the past is when we consider whether or not WotC will continue to support the online CB when they make the shift to DnD Next.
My bet is no, they will not. I'm sure if they do have an online builder, it will be dedicated to DDN.
But since the people that seem to be up in arms about it aren't DDI subscribers anyway, I think it's a moot point.
I was a DDI subscriber for years until I realised that it was not worth the $10 a month to subscribe.
I think about the time the Magazine editor decided not to combine the individual articles into a single pdf.
But that is a different issue to what Lokiare is talking about.
L: You can not trust WotC.
A: Why is that?
L: Look what they said before changing the CB.
A: There is no evidence of that.
S: Actually yes there is.
A: OK, well that maybe true but you are not even a subscriber to DDI anyway.
S: Well that just completely misses the point
Pro DnD Member of the Axis of Awesome Fighters: Using socks to kill monsters since 2012 DnD Next: Now with more then 4 minutes of Roleplay per gaming hour Spoiler:
Show
"If you can't make an interesting human fighter, then you aren't ready to play anything else yet" Edymnion
"The idea of resting up between encounters to fill-up on hit points and spells struck my meta-gaming nine-year-old as a distinct possibility. "Are you mad?" says my seven-year-old "This place is full of monsters!" "jamesgrahamuk
All characters have a story. Spoiler:
Show
Sometimes that story is short and sometimes it is long. They can be tragic, comic or absurd. Some teach. Some are just to fill the empty spaces in our lives. Rarely it is a transcendent fugue only half remembered but wondered at. And frequently: "it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing." -William Shakespeare
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9 months ago ::
Oct 07, 2012 - 8:14PM
#170
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Date Joined:
Apr 12, 2008
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If it is a different issue, then why did you bring it up?
I was simply answering your question about whether the CB will be supported after the DDN switch-over.
In fond memory of Mark "Wrecan" Monack.
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