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11 months ago ::
Jul 11, 2012 - 10:48AM
#51
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Date Joined:
Jun 20, 2012
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I find the subtle mechanical differences to be enough to set them apart mechanically - I don't need some little trick for each, or some "unique" power for each, because separating them through roleplay comes very naturally to me and is easily received by my players.
We have one goblin charging headlong into the dwarves of the party shouting curses and threats, a pair lagging back firing arrows - that panic and retreat before firing more each time the party takes out one of their friends - and all this simple opportunities to present personality for each and every monster, and I always take them.
My players fought a dozen goblins in one encounter, and despite each having the same AC, same HP, same attack and damage regardless of spear or mace, and the tiny mechanical difference of +1 to hit and damage on the ones with short bows - and they felt like they encounter 12 different goblins.
The party will probably face another dozen goblins with the exact same stats next time we get together for the playtest, and I am sure that they will think nothing of them having had the same numbers behind them because each will behave as an individual and be seen as an individual - even if I have to resort to giving one of them a squeaky voice to do it.
I guess what I mean to say is: My methods vary... wildly.
This kind of style which while not a core mechanic, is something that probably would better serve us in the "GM Guidenlines" than a series of example DCs. Or probably better still, in the adventure "room" description itself.
I do agree many DMs are better at this in general, some direction for newer DMs and DMs who don't have that innate ability would be a really nice addition. It does create a barrier between the DM chair and the player chair that DMs are expected to just be good at coming up with stuff for every encounter- and make it unique and interesting.
right on
A rogue with a bowl of slop can be a controller.
WIZARD PC: Can I substitute Celestial Roc Guano for my fireball spells?
DM: Awesome. Yes.
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11 months ago ::
Jul 11, 2012 - 10:56AM
#52
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Date Joined:
Jun 20, 2012
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I guess my problem wasn't that they felt too much the same mechanically, because each monster has its own little power--it's that the MONSTERS feel too much the same.
Gnolls, goblins, hobgoblins, orcs, bugbears: pretty much all of them end up feeling like big dirty monsters dressed in patch-together armor with big rusty weapons that dwell in cramped ruins and squalor and then "boil out across the countryside" to enslave, kill and eat people and or sacrifice them to profane demon gods.
We've gone pretty far in D&D. Each of these monsters has a lot of history--certainly enough to be able to do a writeup on each and make it feel special and fun. But that just didn't come across in the sample bestiary.
That and a lot of the powers given to each kind of creature felt a little...stank. Like the gnoll leader ability Devour the Fallen that gives the critter extra HP every time a foe dies around it. That doesn't feel particularly "gnoll" to me, and it doesn't even really make that much sense as the gnoll doesn't seem to take the time to actually devour the fallen so much as maybe get some gore splatted on it. Plus eating things to get hp has always felt a little weak. On the other hand, maybe I could see the idea of the hp as a morale bonus thing...but if so, the name sort of derails that idea.
I dunno. I kind of see gnolls as the sort of monster that if they see bloodshed they all just kind of go nuts and start cutting on themselves and frothing at the mouth. Maybe something like: if a gnoll scores a 20 on an enemy, all gnolls within sight of the first gnoll get a free attack. I kind of like that.
I guess the point is: first figure out a unique flavor for each monster, and then make the power embody that flavor in a vivid fun way.
I like your idea of a morale bonus of some sort going to nearby enemies when one of their allies makes a critical hit.
A rogue with a bowl of slop can be a controller.
WIZARD PC: Can I substitute Celestial Roc Guano for my fireball spells?
DM: Awesome. Yes.
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11 months ago ::
Jul 15, 2012 - 10:34PM
#53
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My players never saw their stats; they only saw my roleplaying. I'd give them different weapons and hp amounts sometimes as well, like the eye-patched hobgob captain and the fat little goblin captain with the humongous, fancy helm. Keep in mind there were hordes of these folk serving roughly the same role in the module; it's in this case easier if many are the same.
Because most numbers will not change with level, I feel it would be easier to see what I have at hand if I have 1 stat block with a handful of thematically appropriate abilities to take or leave as desired, no need for extra math (like there was adding things in 3e). This would give us more goblins per page space, and free up the page count for more monsters entries. I'm more concerned about fitting a great variety of monsters in than making variants of each monster, but I think we can have both if done right.
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11 months ago ::
Jul 16, 2012 - 4:39PM
#54
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Date Joined:
Oct 27, 2007
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Can GMs make NPCs cool with or without help from the material--sure. It sure is easier though if the material presents each monster as different and unique. As it stands, I'm thinking they blend together too much. Yeah you can make each one a distict character--and it's great that folks are doing that, but there needs to be a real sense of hobgoblin culture as distinct from orc culture as distinct from gnoll culture. They just feel too much like a bunch of dirty slaver guys in loincloths who are sadistic and lazy. That's too much overlap. They should feel like totally different races--their societies at least as different from each other as say dwarves and elves, or mind flayers and drow. You should be able to have the characters run into a room full of them and without even describing what they look like, they should feel "orcs" just from how they act and their surroundings.
Now with 100% more Vorthos!
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11 months ago ::
Jul 16, 2012 - 11:45PM
#55
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Date Joined:
Aug 22, 2007
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Goblin fodder with mace, check,
Goblin archer, check.
Goblin skirmisher with spear, check.
Elite goblin guardswith axe, check.
Goblin hexer.., where's the goblin, hexer.
I gave one of the goblin chieftain's mates (Britny the blond) the @-will spell Hex range 100', Charisma save Dc 13, the target grants advantage to all attacks. So she gives up an attack with the mace to give her chief an opportunity for an attack with advantage against an enemy. The chief does 2d6 extra damage for with advantage, ouch.
I am glad to trade individual powers for each monster for a set special rules covering special combat moves, for example, disarm, shield wall, trip, etc. But I also would like to see a little more variety in monster types, like a hobgoblin guardian, who can protect his allies or a kobold witchdoctor. But I would like to see these special types as remaining special. I just don't want to see a dozen goblin types, each with thier own special rule.
The DND Next Caverns of Chaos is very true to the original source material in presentation. The original module for the DND basic game was very basic. The one thing I like is that the bare bones approach to the design, allows me to layer on 30+ years of Dm experience over it and what I am getting is beautiful and a lot of fun so far.
Its probably just fond nostalgia, but maybe having to flesh out the Caverns of Chaos, all those years ago help me discover and practice the art of Dming.
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