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12 months ago ::
Jun 20, 2012 - 3:47PM
#531
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And when the party really needs healed? Do you just hope for the best with the person who has the highest ranks in the Heal check and a healer's kit, spam a wand of CLW with somone who has CLW on their list or a high UMD, or mass rest for 8 hrs and go at it again?
It's probably the wand of CLW. As long as they're available, wand of CLW is a really efficient healing item, and a huge number of classes can use it without UMD. It's a very rare PF party that doesn't have someone who can use it. "You really need a cleric" is just not part of the standard PF mentality, and not just because the oracle (spontaneous divine caster) exists. I'm not sure exactly why, since the game is otherwise quite a bit like 3.5, but a great many parties don't have a cleric or oracle and do fine, where in 3.5 "someone should really be a cleric" was more the conventional wisdom.
Dwarves invented beer so they could toast to their axes. Dwarves invented axes to kill people and take their beer.
"Feel free to claim I said anything you like. How's someone going to call you out on it? Are they going to be all like, 'I know all of the things that Gary said, and that's not one of them?'"
- Gary Gygax
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12 months ago ::
Jun 20, 2012 - 5:26PM
#532
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Date Joined:
Aug 27, 2007
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I'm not sure exactly why, since the game is otherwise quite a bit like 3.5, but a great many parties don't have a cleric or oracle and do fine, where in 3.5 "someone should really be a cleric" was more the conventional wisdom.
I would guess "someone should really be a cleric" was just habit in 3.5. As a practical matter, someone should be a CoDzilla, but that was because of being incredibly powerful and useful, not because of healing.
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12 months ago ::
Jun 21, 2012 - 10:44AM
#533
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Date Joined:
Dec 24, 2007
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So...what exactly was the "concept" that led you to be a hybrid Warlord/Wizard spec'd out as a Striker, and how would a 3.5 build have captured the "feel" of that concept better?
I hate to do this but you're asking me to go back more than a year at this point and I just don't hold D&D character knowledge that long any more. No room, you see. I do apologize because the question is interesting and, of course, perfectly valid. I remember very few beginnings of characters over the last 20 years and I remember only two of my 4e characters - and those are not this specific one, unfortunately. I do feel bad about it. Looks like I'm dodgin'. I'm not, though. I just don't remember.
In an effort to show my good faith, I'll respond to the second part keeping in mind the two concepts I do recall the origin of in 4e. To be totally honest, in those cases there's nothing in 3.5 that would have captured the feel better. Simply put, I came up with those concepts when playing a 4e game and those concepts were tailored to the rules I was currently using. Just like how the concept I've put into play now with PF cannot be duplicated in 4e, those 4e concepts are impossible to duplicate in Pf or 3.5. Specific concepts, mind. I do adapt my concepts to the rules my group chooses to play by. I think that goes for everyone.
How's this campaign going for you? What do you do after a long hard series of encounters?
Well, I'm afraid I'll have to dissapoint once more. We've only just started. One session in, two combats or so. Luckily we weren't damaged too badly in the fights and they were written so we'd be immediately able to go back to town as this was an intro to the plot sort of session. I honestly don't know how we'll handle a series of difficult encounters - and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't concerned about it. My character has 7 CLW potions thanks to a background trait I chose - not for the potions (money) but because it matched my backstory perfectly. I really wanted to take a trait that upped my initiative but my DM pointed this one out and it really does match up perfectly. Anyhoo, I'm also an Elan Psion (Telepath) with a fair number of PP. That allows me to reduce damage I take so I can stand up a bit longer. Our party's main deficit, though, is melee. We don't really have any. Truth be told, I fully expect a bad day soon. Peeps is gonna die. Just how the game works - even with a DM creating encounters with the specific party in mind. At that point we'll probably see a melee character introduced. Likely not a Cleric unless I'm the one that bites it because nobody else really likes 'em. I do, though, and have an urge to play one. Still, I've waited years to play this character so I'll be doing my best to stay alive. 
Resident Prophet of the OTTer.Section Six Soldier Front Door of the House of Trolls If you're terribly afraid of your character dying, it may be best if you roleplayed something other than an adventurer.
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12 months ago ::
Jun 21, 2012 - 10:59AM
#534
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Date Joined:
Dec 24, 2007
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Good clerics (and neutral ones that hate Undead) gain spontaneous casting for healing spells. So they never ever have to worry about preparing a healing spell because it's always available. But that's beside the point. I think I feel people need to play roles because I feel D&D is more about cooperation and over coming obstacles (in combat) than "I'll do my thing over here, no need to worry about me." Mentaility. But I did play football for 10 years continually so perhaps that also has askewed my perspective too.
They can choose to convert but they don't have to. There's no reason to. Play your character how you want.
My group has played together for quite some time. The main three of us have been playing D&D for over 20 years together. The other guys are close to 10 - or over. So, as far as in game tactics are concerned, we know each other well enough that character role really doesn't come into play. It's sort of beyond the game at this point. We cooperate because we always have - regardless of who's playing what. And yeah, that's likely skewed my perspective to hell and back. 
And when the party really needs healed? Do you just hope for the best with the person who has the highest ranks in the Heal check and a healer's kit, spam a wand of CLW with somone who has CLW on their list or a high UMD, or mass rest for 8 hrs and go at it again? Normally I play the cleric in our groups and it's mostly due to my interest in party-supportive roles. When I played a Wizard, I went War Weaver and took feats that added healing spells to my list (tell me that's not munchkinism at it's finest  !)
I really don't know what we're going to do. Honest. We've only just started and, as I said in the other post, have only a couple combats under our belt that didn't beat us up too badly and we were able to 'go home' from immediately afterwards. That won't be how the game unfolds once we get past the intro phase. Our DM likes to challenge us.
Well, I know what my character is gonna do. He's got CLW potions and a way to shed damage. Not a lot, but right now he doesn't have a whole lot of HP anyway. Ideally I would play this type of character 'off' of the rest of the party since he's range and squishy. This time I can't. No melee in the party either. Yep, it's probably gonna get ugly. Oh well! 
I hope that DDN has some way of 'self-healing' outside of spending your HD with the use of a Healers kit. I think the idea is a bit too steeped in Simulationism for this OR at least give healing spells more "oopf" if they're going to be Standard Actions to cast.
You know, I hated Healing Surges when I started 4e. Still don't like 'em 'feel' wise but ... well, they serve one hell of a purpose. Once you don't have 'em, you do miss 'em. At least I do. I'd ideally like to see something between surge and hit die. Cuz the Hit Die mechanic? Yeah, it just doesn't do anything. Not good. But yeah, I can support the call for some better healing in 5e.
Resident Prophet of the OTTer.Section Six Soldier Front Door of the House of Trolls If you're terribly afraid of your character dying, it may be best if you roleplayed something other than an adventurer.
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