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1 year ago ::
May 15, 2012 - 8:04AM
#221
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Date Joined:
Aug 31, 2007
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I had hopes for one things i don't see at the moment.
with spells not increasing with caster level byt by what kind of spell slot you prepare it in your lower level spell slots will become less usefull as you level.
I hoped they would have put in a system that would avoid useless low level spell slots.
Actually there may be something like that. Notice that he said there are hard caps on total spells and spells per level. This only makes sense if there is some degree of flexibility in how a wizard picks his spell slots. How much flexibility is unclear though.
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1 year ago ::
May 15, 2012 - 8:18AM
#222
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Date Joined:
Aug 19, 2007
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To illustrate this a grease spell from a bacon Mage might cover the ground in pig fat. The same grease spell from the ice Mage might just freeze the ground. In 3e it was very hard to refluff the grease spell to create icy terrain because many mechanics were linked to it being greasy. The reflavoured spells can interact with the game world differently too. The bacon Mage can use grease to distract hungry dire wolves and the ice Mage could use grease to cross a large river. When too many mechanics are entwined in the spells mechanics creativity is hindered.
@Reflavoring debate: this.
Also, MechaPilot said some good stuff too. The problem I had was in the last lines of the article, where he referenced a "detailed description" of the spell, specifying all the effects of that spell in the game world rather than in the model created by the rules. I'd still be fine as long as all mechanics are packed somewhere, or bolded, or whatever, so that I can know what to skip when considering the spell itself.
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Reflavoring: the change of flavor without changing any mechanical part of the game, no matter how small, in order to fit the mechanics to an otherwise unsupported concept.
Retexturing: the change of flavor (with at most minor mechanical adaptations) in order to effortlessly create support for a concept without inventing anything new.
Houseruling: the change, either minor or major, of the mechanics in order to better reflect a certain aspect of the game, including adapting the rules to fit an otherwise unsupported concept.
Homebrewing: the complete invention of something new that fits within the system in order to reflect an unsupported concept. Ideas for 5ESpoiler:
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1 year ago ::
May 15, 2012 - 8:52AM
#223
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Date Joined:
Mar 22, 2008
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I have an issue with the balancing of scrolls as it is explained......
What is to stop the wizard from expeding his/her spell slots during a compressed period of time, say a month to create maximum scrolls? There are always periods of downtime in a campaign, and what is to stop the wizard from taking 6 months off to craft countless scrolls? Since he is expending his spells slots daily not doing anything he will need spells for, he can create a veritable plethora of scrolls.
I can tell you that as a DM, my game doesn't do 6 months of down time. The world progresses and so do the storylines, with or without the PCs. So if they try it, they will either be sucked back in, or the party will lose while they sit on their rears waiting for the wizard.
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1 year ago ::
May 15, 2012 - 8:54AM
#224
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Date Joined:
Aug 19, 2007
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I have an issue with the balancing of scrolls as it is explained......
What is to stop the wizard from expeding his/her spell slots during a compressed period of time, say a month to create maximum scrolls? There are always periods of downtime in a campaign, and what is to stop the wizard from taking 6 months off to craft countless scrolls? Since he is expending his spells slots daily not doing anything he will need spells for, he can create a veritable plethora of scrolls.
I can tell you that as a DM, my game doesn't do 6 months of down time. The world progresses and so do the storylines, with or without the PCs. So if they try it, they will either be sucked back in, or the party will lose while they sit on their rears waiting for the wizard.
Hopefully both your and my playstyle will be supported. Last session spanned four in-game months.
Are you interested in an online 4E game on Sunday? Contact me with a PM! Spoiler:
Show
Reflavoring: the change of flavor without changing any mechanical part of the game, no matter how small, in order to fit the mechanics to an otherwise unsupported concept.
Retexturing: the change of flavor (with at most minor mechanical adaptations) in order to effortlessly create support for a concept without inventing anything new.
Houseruling: the change, either minor or major, of the mechanics in order to better reflect a certain aspect of the game, including adapting the rules to fit an otherwise unsupported concept.
Homebrewing: the complete invention of something new that fits within the system in order to reflect an unsupported concept. Ideas for 5ESpoiler:
Show
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1 year ago ::
May 15, 2012 - 8:58AM
#225
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Date Joined:
Mar 22, 2008
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I have an issue with the balancing of scrolls as it is explained......
What is to stop the wizard from expeding his/her spell slots during a compressed period of time, say a month to create maximum scrolls? There are always periods of downtime in a campaign, and what is to stop the wizard from taking 6 months off to craft countless scrolls? Since he is expending his spells slots daily not doing anything he will need spells for, he can create a veritable plethora of scrolls.
I can tell you that as a DM, my game doesn't do 6 months of down time. The world progresses and so do the storylines, with or without the PCs. So if they try it, they will either be sucked back in, or the party will lose while they sit on their rears waiting for the wizard.
Hopefully both your and my playstyle will be supported. Last session spanned four in-game months.
I'm okay with that  I've just never had a storyline that had more than a few weeks or a month of down time available.
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1 year ago ::
May 15, 2012 - 9:16AM
#226
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Date Joined:
Jun 23, 2005
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I'm about to end a 4e campaign that ran from 1st to 30th level. The whole campaign spans about 15 years of game time, and maybe 300 days of that were spent adventuring. Interspersed with the adventures, the heroes would play advisors to kings and were spending time overseeing the construction of libraries, schools, churches, and the raising of armies.
If the party could have spent that time crafting scrolls to make the adventuring easier, balancing things would have been nightmarish.
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1 year ago ::
May 15, 2012 - 9:36AM
#227
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Date Joined:
Apr 27, 2012
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Also, MechaPilot said some good stuff too. The problem I had was in the last lines of the article, where he referenced a "detailed description" of the spell, specifying all the effects of that spell in the game world rather than in the model created by the rules. I'd still be fine as long as all mechanics are packed somewhere, or bolded, or whatever, so that I can know what to skip when considering the spell itself.
If they exposed the build mechanics in a really clear way so that all aspects of a power could be quantified, wouldn't that also make reflavoring easy? That way the individual powers could be flavorfully described as they operate inside the world but you can easily convert to something else using the system.
Example.
1. Suppose requiring a ranged attack is a -5 points
2. Suppose X damage is worth 10 points
3. Suppose having a save is worth 15 points
4. Fire and cold effects are 5, acid is 7, lightning is 10. points
Now if a 3rd level spell is worth some definite number of points you can design anything. (Note a more complex system is ok too and may be required).
The exact numbers above are bogus too. I want the designers to figure out the real numbers. I just assigned something random to illustrate the concept.
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1 year ago ::
May 15, 2012 - 9:54AM
#228
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Date Joined:
Jun 29, 2011
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Some of the stuff seems interesting, others have me groaning in disappointment.
Im cool with scrolls taking up a spell slot but then deciding to also give them less spells per level? Depending on your group you already didnt have enough spells if you ran multi encounters a day. So with this its like your hitting the wizard with the nerf bat twice for the same thing. In our 3.5 games there is many times our group wizard did little else then use his reserve spell feat since he was running low on spells. Not sure how most dms run stuff but scrolls and wands cost money so unless you are giving your players mountains of plat scrolls and wands run dry as well.
Also cool with wands only having certain spells, as long as this list updates as new spells and source books come out over the years. In fact our groups house rule which wands can/can't be made.
And spells should increase as you level to make them still usable choice at higher levels but cap them like they did in 3rd (max 5d8) (max 10d6) etc. Fireball that does 10d6 sounds great but you get one or two a day and things get a saving throw or resistance greatly lowered its power. A fighter or rogue can easily double that damage each round all day long often with very little in the way of resisting the damage except rolling the dice to hit the thing.
Granted thats just my opinion and I know everyone thinks Im wrong so meh.
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1 year ago ::
May 15, 2012 - 10:05AM
#229
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Date Joined:
Aug 19, 2007
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Also, MechaPilot said some good stuff too. The problem I had was in the last lines of the article, where he referenced a "detailed description" of the spell, specifying all the effects of that spell in the game world rather than in the model created by the rules. I'd still be fine as long as all mechanics are packed somewhere, or bolded, or whatever, so that I can know what to skip when considering the spell itself.
If they exposed the build mechanics in a really clear way so that all aspects of a power could be quantified, wouldn't that also make reflavoring easy? That way the individual powers could be flavorfully described as they operate inside the world but you can easily convert to something else using the system.
Yep, that's the solution we always arrive to. x) We just need to see what they actually do, since there are ways out of the problem that satisfy both positions.
Are you interested in an online 4E game on Sunday? Contact me with a PM! Spoiler:
Show
Reflavoring: the change of flavor without changing any mechanical part of the game, no matter how small, in order to fit the mechanics to an otherwise unsupported concept.
Retexturing: the change of flavor (with at most minor mechanical adaptations) in order to effortlessly create support for a concept without inventing anything new.
Houseruling: the change, either minor or major, of the mechanics in order to better reflect a certain aspect of the game, including adapting the rules to fit an otherwise unsupported concept.
Homebrewing: the complete invention of something new that fits within the system in order to reflect an unsupported concept. Ideas for 5ESpoiler:
Show
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1 year ago ::
May 15, 2012 - 10:16AM
#230
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Date Joined:
Jan 21, 2004
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I was assuming that at-will cantrips might now be allowed to inflict damage by e.g. allowing mage hand to hurl objects, light to temporarily dazzle an opponent, ghost sound to distract opponents etc. If psychic damage is still in, these cantrips could do 1d4 psychic damage and grant allies +1 to attack that opponent until the start of his next turn. Maybe allowing a choice of 4 versatile cantrips that do nominal damage with minor secondary effects can be at-will, a standard attack power doing 1d6 of some type of energy damage (your choice) and your standard daily spells will give enough choice.
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