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1 year ago ::
May 13, 2012 - 4:12AM
#41
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Date Joined:
Jun 15, 2006
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TamRad, my attitude is when I am creating MY monster heroine, I don´t want a face of unsightly traits. If it´s the art or work by other autor, it isn´t my matter, (they are his characters, no the mines) but I don´t want my females monster PC uglier that a cow.
I have seen some pictures for next edition. Some faces of orcs or ogres are ugly, but they are perfect for monster to be killed by PCs, but they show stupidity too much for my possible female monster PC. I wish the option to choose a no-ugly face for my characters.
"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)
Book 13 Anaclet 23
Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"
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1 year ago ::
May 13, 2012 - 12:20PM
#42
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TamRad, my attitude is when I am creating MY monster heroine, I don´t want a face of unsightly traits. If it´s the art or work by other autor, it isn´t my matter, (they are his characters, no the mines) but I don´t want my females monster PC uglier that a cow.
I have seen some pictures for next edition. Some faces of orcs or ogres are ugly, but they are perfect for monster to be killed by PCs, but they show stupidity too much for my possible female monster PC. I wish the option to choose a no-ugly face for my characters.
I am not denying your personal choice in the matter.You have the right to make your characters the way you want and to run your games as you please.The only thing I was trying to say is that I believe you are painting yourself into a corner on the matter.If you believe all heroines should at least be average looking and have some kind of gentile look to them then that is your choice.I just feel it is a rather close minded attitude to have.We agree to disagree on the matter and that is all it really is.
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1 year ago ::
May 13, 2012 - 1:29PM
#43
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Date Joined:
Jun 15, 2006
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I don´t say all heroine should be pretty (it isn´t realistic, is it?) but I say sometimes I would like the option of choosing a no-ugly face for my female monster character. My concern is I suppose if the new look or image of orcs and ogres are going to be canon, I could lose the option of paint/draw a no-ugly face for my female half-orc or half-ogre. I don´t ask a queen of beauty for every time but the possibility, if I choose it, giving a face what can make you feel empathy and not unfriendliness or rejection. I wish the face like by somebody who can be your ally and inspire trust and respect, nor the kind of you like smashing enemies’ faces in. I can imagine my female half-orc like a Xena without nose, or like Fionna, Shreck´s wife, but I can´t imagine her like a ugly and stupid orc from warhammer with brassiere and mane/long hair. If you look for fan-art of females orcs, trolls and goblins from warcraft (I talk about decent pictures, forget the prevent hentai) you can realize they usually are painted/drawn like sexy/hot girls. People don´t want heroines with a head of Australopithecus.
I don´t wish forcing all heroines must to be pretty but I only ask a open door, other option to choose.
"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)
Book 13 Anaclet 23
Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"
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1 year ago ::
May 13, 2012 - 1:45PM
#44
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In 4E it was rare to get a charisma score below 10 (average) so at best your character would look plain and not 'ugly'.
So unless they put the whole swingy thing back in, its unlikely that your character will be flat out ugly...
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1 year ago ::
May 13, 2012 - 2:29PM
#45
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Date Joined:
Jun 15, 2006
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Don´t confunse presence and charisma. Imagine two masked men, they may be death knights, lord zombies, lichs or vampires. Their faces can´t be seen, but they have got different value of Charisma. The most Charismatic could be more convincing and the less one... has got a annoying voice.
"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)
Book 13 Anaclet 23
Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"
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1 year ago ::
May 14, 2012 - 12:13AM
#46
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Date Joined:
May 18, 2003
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agreed. Charisma *can* include appearance, but it doesn't have to. An person can look like a fashion-model and still be plain and un-charismatic. Luis, I know this thread is for female character art, but does your need for "non-uglyness" in heroes apply to male NPC, too? Just curious 
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1 year ago ::
May 14, 2012 - 1:01AM
#47
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I am not denying your personal choice in the matter.You have the right to make your characters the way you want and to run your games as you please.The only thing I was trying to say is that I believe you are painting yourself into a corner on the matter.If you believe all heroines should at least be average looking and have some kind of gentile look to them then that is your choice.I just feel it is a rather close minded attitude to have.We agree to disagree on the matter and that is all it really is.
I mostly agree with you, except I think you mean "genteel" (as in aristocratic and elegant) rather than "gentile" (as in non-Jewish). I normally don't pick at this stuff away from work, but in this case it makes a big difference. But the real point is, yeah, wow, why would heroic and attractive have to always be together?!?
Ed_Warlord, on what it takes to make a thread work: I think for it to be really constructive, everyone would have to be honest with each other, and with themselves. Quotation of the moment
Show
Areleth: How does this help the problems we have with Fighters? Do you think that every time I thought I was playing D&D what I was actually doing was slamming my head in a car door and that if you just explain how to play without doing that then I'll finally enjoy the game?
Quotation of ALL moments
Show
TD: That's why they put me on the front of every book. This is the dungeon, and I am the dragon.
A word of warning though: I'm totally not a level appropriate encounter.
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1 year ago ::
May 14, 2012 - 4:04AM
#48
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Date Joined:
Jun 15, 2006
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Sephyrill, I don´t need male good-looking charactes like from the cover of a romancel novel. A monster humanoid can be "no-handsome" but very charismatic. For example Vincent, the main character from TV Show "The beauty and the Beast" was very popular for female audience for those days.
For me a male half-ogre PC could have got a face of fierce wild but he can inspire confidence by his nobility. Why? Because you can realise he isn´t a bag of muscles without brain but a man with a sense of honor and frienship. I don´t reject monster humanoid PCs like the monkey-like vanara (Oriental Adventures) or the head-crow kenku. And I would like the tengu (oriental adventures) like PCs race similar to raptorans (Races of wild), and with long noses (symbol of proud). I wish a female tengu PC with a nose like wuxia oriental feminine version of Cyrano de Bergerac.
The character played by Christina Ricci in the movie "Penelope" had a pig nose (literaly, it was a family curse), but she didn´t give up be sexy/hot. (the right word is give up..isn´t it?).
"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)
Book 13 Anaclet 23
Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"
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1 year ago ::
May 14, 2012 - 1:44PM
#49
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agreed. Charisma *can* include appearance, but it doesn't have to.
Appearance is often considered to be part of the equation, but how much weight it is given is very subjective. This is primarily because of character concept. You can have a charismatic fighter who was born average looking, who later developed several ugly scars, but is still charismatic because of his leadership experience in combat.
Why Mechanics-Alignment Integration is Bad
Show
so why even play a fighter if you can play the paladin the exact same way behaviorally and get added power to boot. "Paladin" is about accepting better game-enhancing mechanics at the price of more rigid in game behavior.
Really? So it goes something like this?
Fighter: "I want to be a paladin."
NPC: "Really?"
Fighter: "Yes."
NPC: "Very well." Starts reading from a holy book while still in-character "Do you accept having to choose and stick to the lawful good alignment, eventhough neither of us actually knows that it exists or what it is?"
Fighter: "I do."
NPC: "Do you reject good game balance because you accidentally rolled a high Charisma?"
Fighter: "What?"
NPC: "I don't know what it means either."
Fighter: "Oh. Umm, ok I do."
NPC: "In the name of all that is metagamey and broken, accept these better game enhancing mechanics."
Fighter: "These what?"
NPC: "Just get out there and try to fulfill a million different people's notion of good while not violating and part of any of them."
So the system is designed such that every single hit needs to be described to avoid confusion? Here's a scenario. The players are nudists, everybody in the world are nudists, it's not weird, it's totally normal in this land. They are naked and they fight drakes taking damage throughout, but healing up with surges. Later they meet the guy who raised the drakes.
Part 1: I didn't describe any of the hits. What does he see?
Part 2: Lets say I described the drakes as biting the players, yet they healed up. What does he see?
D20 Modern Toon PC Race.
Mecha Pilot's Skill Challenge Emporium.
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1 year ago ::
May 14, 2012 - 1:57PM
#50
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Date Joined:
Sep 29, 2003
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Sephyrill, I don´t need male good-looking charactes like from the cover of a romancel novel. A monster humanoid can be "not-handsome" but very charismatic. For example Vincent, the main character from TV Show "The beauty and the Beast" was very popular for female audience for those days.
I agree that Charisma shouldn't necessarily equal beauty and most DMs I know consider it a part of CHA but not the primary aspect of it. They usually allow players to set their apperance at whatever they want, regardless of their CHA stat. Honestly I think a way to satisfy everyone is to provide an optional Comeliness (COM) stat for those players who want a actual number to base their physical appearance on.
Funny that you mentioned the old Beauty and the Beast TV series, my wife and were just talking about that the other day and she remembered that they had a 976 number people could call to hear Vincent read love letters (which she confessed to calling once or twice as a tween :D lolol). Vincent would be a perfect example of a high CHA, low COM PC.
"We are men of action, lies do not become us" ~ D.P.R.
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