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1 year ago ::
Apr 27, 2012 - 1:51PM
#491
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Date Joined:
Feb 12, 2009
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your wording here also seems to imply that Paladins have a code. Namely because you say clerics ALSO have a code. Yet a gain thank you for finally agreeing with me that Paladins have codes.
Paladins of Gods, yes. Paladins without Gods, no. A Paladin of a concept/philosophy is free to act as he views the concept/philosophy. The concept/philosophy is unable to impart a code upon the Paladin like a God can.
Definition for code of conduct: a set of conventional principles and expectations that are considered binding on any person who is a member of a particular group.
Definition for tenets: A principle or belief, esp. one of the main principles of a religion or philosophy.
Definition for Principle:
- A fundamental truth or proposition that serves as the foundation for a system of belief or behavior or for a chain of reasoning.
- A rule or belief governing one's personal behavior.
con·cept/ˈkänsept/
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- An abstract idea; a general notion.
- A plan or intention; a conception.
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noun, plural phi·los·o·phies.1.the rational investigation of the truths and principles ofbeing, knowledge, or conduct. 4.the critical study of the basic principles and concepts of aparticular branch of knowledge, especially with a view toimproving or reconstituting them: the philosophy of science. 5.a system of principles for guidance in practical affairs. nounphilosophy dealing with the principles of morality; ethics. No matter what if it is of a god or of a concept/philosophy or what the Paladin stands for it always comes back down to his principles and a principle is A rule or belief governing one's personal behavior. Paladins have rules Paladins have codes. It is who they are. It just so happens a few other people have rules and codes as well. Thanks for agreeing with that.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 27, 2012 - 1:51PM
#492
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Date Joined:
Aug 30, 2007
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An LG paladin buys a samsung monitor... and loses all of his powers. Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!
I cracked a smile at that.
Owner and Proprietor of the House of Trolls.
God of ownership and possession.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 27, 2012 - 1:55PM
#493
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Date Joined:
May 18, 2002
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I think that might make sense if the Paladin was dedicated to a deity of Temperence instead of basing their life on a brand name:
What if I want the Pally swag, but this logo instead?:
or this one?:
(can we do a chart of "The Nine" using just corporate logos? That would be awesome!)
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1 year ago ::
Apr 27, 2012 - 2:00PM
#494
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(can we do a chart of "The Nine" using just corporate logos? That would be awesome!)
Are there enough logos to cover all nine?
Why Mechanics-Alignment Integration is Bad
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so why even play a fighter if you can play the paladin the exact same way behaviorally and get added power to boot. "Paladin" is about accepting better game-enhancing mechanics at the price of more rigid in game behavior.
Really? So it goes something like this?
Fighter: "I want to be a paladin."
NPC: "Really?"
Fighter: "Yes."
NPC: "Very well." Starts reading from a holy book while still in-character "Do you accept having to choose and stick to the lawful good alignment, eventhough neither of us actually knows that it exists or what it is?"
Fighter: "I do."
NPC: "Do you reject good game balance because you accidentally rolled a high Charisma?"
Fighter: "What?"
NPC: "I don't know what it means either."
Fighter: "Oh. Umm, ok I do."
NPC: "In the name of all that is metagamey and broken, accept these better game enhancing mechanics."
Fighter: "These what?"
NPC: "Just get out there and try to fulfill a million different people's notion of good while not violating and part of any of them."
So the system is designed such that every single hit needs to be described to avoid confusion? Here's a scenario. The players are nudists, everybody in the world are nudists, it's not weird, it's totally normal in this land. They are naked and they fight drakes taking damage throughout, but healing up with surges. Later they meet the guy who raised the drakes.
Part 1: I didn't describe any of the hits. What does he see?
Part 2: Lets say I described the drakes as biting the players, yet they healed up. What does he see?
D20 Modern Toon PC Race.
Mecha Pilot's Skill Challenge Emporium.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 27, 2012 - 2:05PM
#495
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Date Joined:
Mar 22, 2008
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your wording here also seems to imply that Paladins have a code. Namely because you say clerics ALSO have a code. Yet a gain thank you for finally agreeing with me that Paladins have codes.
Paladins of Gods, yes. Paladins without Gods, no. A Paladin of a concept/philosophy is free to act as he views the concept/philosophy. The concept/philosophy is unable to impart a code upon the Paladin like a God can.
Definition for code of conduct:
a set of conventional principles and expectations that are considered binding on any person who is a member of a particular group.
You bolded the wrong part. Principles that are not binding, such as tenets and personal philosphies are not codes. 
Now, Gods would bind their Paladins and Clerics to their tenets, turning them into a code, but a philosophy or concept has no ability to bind.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 27, 2012 - 2:10PM
#496
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Date Joined:
May 18, 2002
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1 year ago ::
Apr 27, 2012 - 3:16PM
#497
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You guys are overlooking Monks who at a certain level had to fight other monks in single combat with the loser losing his level. Lots of stinky rules in 1e.
Yeah and those rules didn't persist through every edition that has ever existed.
I quite like those stinky rules. They add a bit more character into the game - you know that if you are the Grandmaster Monk, that you really are the toughest mofo Monk.
I can understand that not everyone liked them though and it appears that design has specifically gone against PvP.
Pro DnD Member of the Axis of Awesome Fighters: Using socks to kill monsters since 2012 DnD Next: Now with more then 4 minutes of Roleplay per gaming hour Spoiler:
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"If you can't make an interesting human fighter, then you aren't ready to play anything else yet" Edymnion
"The idea of resting up between encounters to fill-up on hit points and spells struck my meta-gaming nine-year-old as a distinct possibility. "Are you mad?" says my seven-year-old "This place is full of monsters!" "jamesgrahamuk
All characters have a story. Spoiler:
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Sometimes that story is short and sometimes it is long. They can be tragic, comic or absurd. Some teach. Some are just to fill the empty spaces in our lives. Rarely it is a transcendent fugue only half remembered but wondered at. And frequently: "it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing." -William Shakespeare
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1 year ago ::
Apr 27, 2012 - 3:19PM
#498
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Y'know ... I've had a change of mind about all this.
The Paladin shouldn't be a class. It's just a mash-up of Fighter and Cleric, so that's how it should be built; you multiclass Fighter and Cleric, or hybrid, or whatever you need to do. Since your character can call himself whatever he wants, regardless of what it says in the Class: entry on your character sheet, there you go.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 27, 2012 - 3:26PM
#499
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Date Joined:
Feb 12, 2009
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your wording here also seems to imply that Paladins have a code. Namely because you say clerics ALSO have a code. Yet a gain thank you for finally agreeing with me that Paladins have codes.
Paladins of Gods, yes. Paladins without Gods, no. A Paladin of a concept/philosophy is free to act as he views the concept/philosophy. The concept/philosophy is unable to impart a code upon the Paladin like a God can.
Definition for code of conduct:
a set of conventional principles and expectations that are considered binding on any person who is a member of a particular group.
You bolded the wrong part. Principles that are not binding, such as tenets and personal philosphies are not codes.
Now, Gods would bind their Paladins and Clerics to their tenets, turning them into a code, but a philosophy or concept has no ability to bind.
Principle:
A rule or belief governing one's personal behavior
governing present participle of gov·ern (Verb)
| Verb: |
- Conduct the policy, actions, and affairs of (a state, organization, or people).
- Control, influence, or regulate (a person, action, or course of events).
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The fact that you yourself are the one binding you to the principle is irrelevant. You are bound to it, that is what swearing to it means. If there is no binding principle then there is no true to the core belief in the philosphy or concept you are not a true believer or paladin of it. You can't kinda be a paladin of something.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 27, 2012 - 3:32PM
#500
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Date Joined:
Jun 17, 2007
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Y'know ... I've had a change of mind about all this.
The Paladin shouldn't be a class. It's just a mash-up of Fighter and Cleric, so that's how it should be built; you multiclass Fighter and Cleric, or hybrid, or whatever you need to do. Since your character can call himself whatever he wants, regardless of what it says in the Class: entry on your character sheet, there you go.
Agreed. As much as I think the concept of the Paladin is an awesome one, I don't think it justifies a class in the class+race+theme+background world of D&D Next. Paladin can easily be represented by a particular combination of those choices. Just as the Knight shouldn't be a class separate from the fighter, the paladin shouldn't be a class separate from the cleric.
I'd love to see the martial training + code of honor aspect of the paladin class captured by a theme, background or both. That way you could easily engineer the militant arm of druidism or other variants on the paladin concept.
Looking back, I remember how the 3.5 Book of Exalted Deeds had a bunch of feats pertaining to sacred oaths or vows that in turn granted divine abilities. I'd like to see some of those ideas converted into DDN feats and themes for building a character of the paladin archetype.
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