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1 year ago ::
Mar 02, 2012 - 8:51AM
#41
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Date Joined:
Oct 18, 2008
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Short answer: No.
Long answer: Hell no!
Longer answer: Whatever the DM wants to do with it, but no baked-in mechanics anywhere in the books.
+1
I want absolutely nothing to do with an antiquated morality system that needs to be tossed away.
If I could travel back in time I would slap the back of the heads of the D&D creators of alignment, and vanacian magic.
Leroy Jethro Gibbs NCIS "A slap to the face is humiliating. A slap to the back of the head is a wake up call."
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1 year ago ::
Mar 02, 2012 - 8:58AM
#42
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No
guides
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my builds
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F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways. Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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1 year ago ::
Mar 02, 2012 - 9:13AM
#43
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Yes.
Kalex the Omen Dungeonmaster Extraordinaire Concerning Player Rules Bias
Show
Gaining victory through rules bias is a hollow victory and they know it.
The argument goes, that some idiot at the table might claim that because there is a "default" that is the only true way to play D&D. An idiotic misconception that should be quite easy to disprove just by reading the rules, coming to these forums, or sending a quick note off to Customer Support and sharing the inevitable response with the group. BTW, I'm not just talking about Next when I say this. Of course, D&D has always been this way since at least the late 70's when I began playing.
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1 year ago ::
Mar 02, 2012 - 9:37AM
#44
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Date Joined:
Jun 16, 2005
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Yes
I'll refrain from asking people to provide examples of how a level 1 spell easily countered by another level 1 spell (or actual adventure design instead of ripping your plot straight from a book/movie) ruined any mystery that required analytical thought in the first place. They never have answers related to the rules anyway.
My way:
Stick to the things that specifically had "Aura of x". If you are a representative of an ultimate power of Alignment X, then you should detect appropriately. As such, clerics, paladins, blackguards, outsiders, consecrated/desecrated locations/items, inherently aligned spells (and maybe undead and/or warlocks) would register. No one else. I don't care if it's a level 30 Assassin in the middle of murdering some innocent brutally, if some supernatural power of the outer planes isn't backing him then he doesn't radiate an "aura of Evil". Those characters that have the aura would be able to wield the power of similarly imbued locations/items (probably granted by a ritual). That's it, it just doesn't work for anyone not "consecrated" to the service of their alignment. Only characters specifically consecrated/desecrated to the opposing alignment would take damage or other negative effect from contact.
There, it still does everything that it should for high fantasy drama ("I sense great evil in this place!, Only the pure of intent can wield this sword", ect) and has no effect on anyone that doesn't deliberately flag themself for Alignment vs Alignment play. Takes all of maybe 3pg and a single ritual in the book to pull off.
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1 year ago ::
Mar 02, 2012 - 10:02AM
#45
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Date Joined:
Jun 30, 2008
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Stick to the things that specifically had "Aura of x". If you are a representative of an ultimate power of Alignment X, then you should detect appropriately. As such, clerics, paladins, blackguards, outsiders, consecrated/desecrated locations/items, inherently aligned spells (and maybe undead and/or warlocks) would register. No one else.
The thing is its a whole lot easier to add that in as a module than it is to take it out via a module. I don't want to have to worry about a bunch of counterspell junk and I don't think anyone, especially low level creatures, should be putting out an easily detectable aura.
I don't want to have to take anything out of my core books, but if they put it in as a module that is fine with me since it won't be in my game and I don't care if its in your game.
my handbooks & builds
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1 year ago ::
Mar 02, 2012 - 10:09AM
#46
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I don't want to have to take anything out of my core books, but if they put it in as a module that is fine with me since it won't be in my game and I don't care if its in your game.
The thing is alignment has been in D&D for its entire lifespan and I don't want to have to pay extra for it. In other alignment threads people have suggested that optional rules can be in the core books, but called out as optional. I think this is an acceptable compromise unless you are one of those anti-alignment people who nerd rage at the sight of the word in print.
Kalex the Omen Dungeonmaster ExtraordinaireConcerning Player Rules Bias
Show
Gaining victory through rules bias is a hollow victory and they know it.
The argument goes, that some idiot at the table might claim that because there is a "default" that is the only true way to play D&D. An idiotic misconception that should be quite easy to disprove just by reading the rules, coming to these forums, or sending a quick note off to Customer Support and sharing the inevitable response with the group. BTW, I'm not just talking about Next when I say this. Of course, D&D has always been this way since at least the late 70's when I began playing.
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1 year ago ::
Mar 02, 2012 - 10:32AM
#47
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Date Joined:
Jun 30, 2008
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But the mechanical impacts of alignment were largely absent in 4E "Core", and the OP is asking about what mechanics should be in core.
You could blot out every mention of alignment in the 4E PHB/DMG/MM and it would almost not effect the mechanics of the books at all. The one minor area I can think of that it would effect is what channel divinity powers paladins and clerics could pick since that is slightly related to their alignment.
They added more alignment mechanics later on and it worked fine, even though people like me didn't like them and could easily ignore them.
my handbooks & builds
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1 year ago ::
Mar 02, 2012 - 10:58AM
#48
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Date Joined:
Jun 16, 2005
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Umm....what "counterspell junk"?
I also at no point specified who could detect auras, how, or at what level, only that detection would be possible. I'm even fine with it requiring a check or something that can be opposed. Heck, you could even just make the aura apply a modifier to the Insight (sense motive) check to ID a creature opposed to your morals. After all, Paladins that occasionally doubt themselves are a convenient preventative to poor roleplayers taking the "scan and smite" path of Lawful Stupid.
It belongs in the Core books without a doubt. Move it to the DMG if it makes you happier and he can just keep his opinion on your alignment to himself and describe the resulting effects as he pleases. It isn't like characters typically have a way to know their own alignment anyway.
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1 year ago ::
Mar 02, 2012 - 10:59AM
#49
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But the mechanical impacts of alignment were largely absent in 4E "Core", and the OP is asking about what mechanics should be in core.
You could blot out every mention of alignment in the 4E PHB/DMG/MM and it would almost not effect the mechanics of the books at all. The one minor area I can think of that it would effect is what channel divinity powers paladins and clerics could pick since that is slightly related to their alignment.
They added more alignment mechanics later on and it worked fine, even though people like me didn't like them and could easily ignore them.
I think you can have mechanics that don't have an impact when alignment is stripped from the game. This is what I have been arguing for in several threads. The Divine Concodrance idea is just one such method. But I do think alignment should remain in the core books, even if it is considered optional.
Kalex the Omen Dungeonmaster ExtraordinaireConcerning Player Rules Bias
Show
Gaining victory through rules bias is a hollow victory and they know it.
The argument goes, that some idiot at the table might claim that because there is a "default" that is the only true way to play D&D. An idiotic misconception that should be quite easy to disprove just by reading the rules, coming to these forums, or sending a quick note off to Customer Support and sharing the inevitable response with the group. BTW, I'm not just talking about Next when I say this. Of course, D&D has always been this way since at least the late 70's when I began playing.
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1 year ago ::
Mar 02, 2012 - 11:22AM
#50
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No.
Also, the idea that players don't know their own alignment makes me want to vomit.
More sex and gender equality and racial equality shouldn't even be an argument--it should simply be an assumption for any RPG that wants to stay relevant in the 21st century.
I could say anything in D&D is silly though, because it's a silly game and we are silly people.
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