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1 year ago ::
Feb 24, 2012 - 7:23PM
#1
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Date Joined:
Oct 12, 2011
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Who actually needs D&DN to come out?
There have already been 4 fantastic editions of D&D with their own fanbases. Pathfinder exists to support 3e and tons of retroclones cover AD&D and earlier. 4e has fantastic online tools readily available.
So... what exactly is the need for D&DN? Who benefits from it?
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1 year ago ::
Feb 24, 2012 - 7:46PM
#2
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Date Joined:
Jun 29, 2010
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In truth, no one.
It's costing Wotc an arm and leg to develop, even if it works they'll only get a portion of the player base because in this economy not everyone can rebuy an entire book line, and that's assuming they manage to do the impossible and actually create a single game better than all 3 of the individual game styles currently available (pre-3rd, 3rd, 4th).
Probably the people with the most to gain are the pre-3rd players. While there are retroclones, none have the depth and polish of an actual TSR/WotC product. If they can manage to create a system which works as the revision to D&D/1st/2nd in feel and style, while fixing some long standing issues and improving on what we have now, this demographic will make out like bandits. Especially since we're the longest invested and have gotten the best return on our money, but don't currently give anything to WotC.
The people with the least to gain are 4th edition players, who have a brand new, working system that they are passionate about, and they have all new tools and options available. While some people have some minor complaints, it's nothing that couldn't be solved through a simple revision or errata. So far as I can tell 5th edition is nothing but a big slap in the face to 4th edition players.
As I've said from the beginning, if they can truly do it, bless them and I'll buy. But I think they'd be MUCH better served by launching a revised pre-3rd edition development team, and starting a 4th edition revision team, and catering directly to the two camps. Really 5th edition is going to have to be this anyway, just under the same label (which is more work than discrete products would be). As for 3rd, well, there's Pathfinder. If WotC wanted to pick them up and fold them in to continue development with them, that'd work too. If not, it's an active community with its legs under it, and will do just fine without WotC.
DISCLAIMER - Everything said by anyone is absolute subjective opinion. There are no objective claims being made by me, or anyone else, unless they overtly state 'The following is an objective claim'. At this point if you choose to be offended by anything I (or anyone else) say the problem is ENTIRELY your own.
WotC won't let us give them money because they won't produce a game we want to play.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 24, 2012 - 8:08PM
#3
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Date Joined:
Oct 17, 2007
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WotC needs D&DNext. Mostly for the money. 
'I have had players complain about having extra rares in a pack. I’ve had players complain about getting free things. I have had players complain because they liked something “too much”.' - Mark Rosewater's Twitter, May 7th, 2013
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1 year ago ::
Feb 24, 2012 - 8:13PM
#4
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Date Joined:
Oct 19, 2008
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WotC needs D&DNext. Mostly for the money.
Or they could individually develop things for each system. I guess that's just silly. 
"I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everybody." --Bill Cosby (1937- )Vanador: OK. You ripped a gateway to Hell, killed half the town, and raised the dead as feral zombies. We're going to kill you. But it can go two ways. We want you to run as fast as you possibly can toward the south of the town to draw the Zombies to you, and right before they catch you, I'll put an arrow through your head to end it instantly. If you don't agree to do this, we'll tie you this building and let the Zombies rip you apart slowly. Dimitry: God I love being Neutral. 4th edition is dead, long live 4th edition.Salla: opinionated, but commonly right. fun quotes
Show
You have to do the work first, and show you can do the work, before someone is going to pay you for it.
If you can't understand how someone yelling at another person would make them fight harder and longer, then you need to look at the forums a bit closer.
quote author=56832398 post=519321747]Considering DnD is a game wouldn't all styles be gamist?
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1 year ago ::
Feb 24, 2012 - 8:14PM
#5
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Date Joined:
Jun 17, 2003
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WotC needs D&DNext. Mostly for the money.
More accurately (if various reports are to be believed) Wotc needs a huge spike in sales and volume in DnD to keep Hasbro from killing DnD as a TRPG (or at least tabling it as a TRPG for a decade or more). Really, that's pretty much it.
-Polaris
Edit PS: I strongly suspect that the mgt at Wotc doesn't really care if 5e has any true long term viability or not. They simply need to give Hasbro it's short term "pound of flesh" (50 million in sales if Dancey and others are to be believed which would be more than probably any TRPG in history but I digress) and make the bean counters as Hasbro go away at least for a while. Given what Wotc has done the past ten years, I don't think they have a long term plan for DND (or period for that matter).
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1 year ago ::
Feb 24, 2012 - 8:38PM
#6
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Date Joined:
Oct 17, 2007
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I strongly suspect that the mgt at Wotc doesn't really care if 5e has any true long term viability or not. They simply need to give Hasbro it's short term "pound of flesh" (50 million in sales if Dancey and others are to be believed which would be more than probably any TRPG in history but I digress) and make the bean counters as Hasbro go away at least for a while. Given what Wotc has done the past ten years, I don't think they have a long term plan for DND (or period for that matter).
Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if 5ed is just a lead-up for a cool down for the PnP part of D&D. Hasbro knows that D&D can be a good moneymaker for videogames, MMOs, and basically anything but PnP. The PnP RPG is basically an advertising tool to enhance the D&D IP (with little expectations for revenue) in order to promote the actual moneymaking parts of the IP.
In that light, I can imagine that an OGL-like deal will happen. If D&D can gain that market penetration they had in the early '80s and '00s AND connect that to a multi-media web of revenue, then Hasbro can make its money.
'I have had players complain about having extra rares in a pack. I’ve had players complain about getting free things. I have had players complain because they liked something “too much”.' - Mark Rosewater's Twitter, May 7th, 2013
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1 year ago ::
Feb 24, 2012 - 8:41PM
#7
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Date Joined:
Jun 17, 2003
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I strongly suspect that the mgt at Wotc doesn't really care if 5e has any true long term viability or not. They simply need to give Hasbro it's short term "pound of flesh" (50 million in sales if Dancey and others are to be believed which would be more than probably any TRPG in history but I digress) and make the bean counters as Hasbro go away at least for a while. Given what Wotc has done the past ten years, I don't think they have a long term plan for DND (or period for that matter).
Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if 5ed is just a lead-up for a cool down for the PnP part of D&D. Hasbro knows that D&D can be a good moneymaker for videogames, MMOs, and basically anything but PnP. The PnP RPG is basically an advertising tool to enhance the D&D IP (with little expectations for revenue) in order to promote the actual moneymaking parts of the IP.
In that light, I can imagine that an OGL-like deal will happen. If D&D can gain that market penetration they had in the early '80s and '00s AND connect that to a multi-media web of revenue, then Hasbro can make its money.
If you are right, Hasbro will nix any possibility of an OGL type deal. Hasbro will want tight control over the IP in the scenario you mention. However, I do see Hasbro taking DnD away from Wotc in that case given their (frankly dismal) record when it comes to computer gaming and computer support and sub-contracting the IP to another company.
-Polaris
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1 year ago ::
Feb 24, 2012 - 9:11PM
#8
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Date Joined:
May 26, 2007
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To be fair, no one NEEDS any of the editions, 4th, 3rd, 2nd, 1st. The thing is, we want them. I *want* to see where they take the game, because none of the previous editions, or any other game, have really enthralled me. I've played many of them, but none of them excite me.
I *want* to see what they do, I want them to make a game that is different enough that it is new, and hopefully different enough that I actually want to play it every day of my life or something.
I don't need those things. But dammit, I worked hard to be born in a first world country, I want pretty things.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 24, 2012 - 9:40PM
#9
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If 5e introduces new players to the hobby then everyone benefits. An expansion of the player base is much more important than gathering together already existing players.
I also agree with Alter_Boy that making the D&D IP valuable outside the pen and paper realm is a primary concern. Keeping the D&D brand strong is very beneficial to our hobby.
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1 year ago ::
Feb 24, 2012 - 9:48PM
#10
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Date Joined:
Feb 14, 2009
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To be fair, no one NEEDS any of the editions, 4th, 3rd, 2nd, 1st. The thing is, we want them. I *want* to see where they take the game, because none of the previous editions, or any other game, have really enthralled me. I've played many of them, but none of them excite me.
I *want* to see what they do, I want them to make a game that is different enough that it is new, and hopefully different enough that I actually want to play it every day of my life or something.
I don't need those things. But dammit, I worked hard to be born in a first world country, I want pretty things.
I totally agree with this. I wanna see where the game goes in the future. I like to see how cosmology and the setting stories progress. Also, I'm always up to try new systems, and there is no perfect gaming system. So they can always do better.
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