I agree with some observations. One thing that frustrated me to no end in 4ed was that players looked up to "Skills" section of their character sheets as some kind of choice menu. Considering that skill system is mostly used out of combat, in roleplaying situations - it felt like it was overly restricting. Furthermore, penalizing party for failures created a situation where players would pass on interesting ideas because their characters are unlikely to make the roll. I also didn't...
View full commentI agree with some observations. One thing that frustrated me to no end in 4ed was that players looked up to "Skills" section of their character sheets as some kind of choice menu.
Considering that skill system is mostly used out of combat, in roleplaying situations - it felt like it was overly restricting. Furthermore, penalizing party for failures created a situation where players would pass on interesting ideas because their characters are unlikely to make the roll.
I also didn't quite like the way the skills were always tied to the same ability score. I liked World of Darkness system idea of combining skills with different abilities depending on the action performed. Think the episode in Terminator 2 when the machine cuts open his arm to remove the skin - that would be great example of Intimidate (CON) roll. Or scaring someone by punching a hole in a wall beside his head would be Intimidate (STR).
I think that ability checks could work for all 'skill' checks. But there are two things missing from that basic approach. The first is that some skills really do require learning and, secondly, people can get better with practice. But I think it's a very simple prospect to address both while still retaining the same mechanic. First is to have a small list of skills that require training (acrobatics, swimming, etc.). There would have to be a mechanic for limiting the number and types....
View full commentI think that ability checks could work for all 'skill' checks. But there are two things missing from that basic approach. The first is that some skills really do require learning and, secondly, people can get better with practice.
But I think it's a very simple prospect to address both while still retaining the same mechanic.
First is to have a small list of skills that require training (acrobatics, swimming, etc.). There would have to be a mechanic for limiting the number and types. It could be similar to any of the older systems, or like feats.
Second, the modifier would be the ability score modifier plus 1/2 the character's level or something similar. Yes, that means that somebody picking up the skill at 10th level would be as proficient as somebody who learned it at 1st level and is now 10th level. But for simplicity (and you could argue that a 10th level character could learn faster and more easily), this mechanic would work well.
Combining a question from another post, I do think that a 'skill feat' should be separate from choosing a 'combat feat'.
Although players in my campaigns learned that I don't always play to their strengths, and the environment is a powerful ally or enemy so they tended not to min/max on just combat abilities.
Except then You have to sacrifice your background and specialty choices just to approximate that class, rather than having an equal ability to explore different stories within the class as the Fighter, Rogue, Cleric, and Wizard do. NO WAY.
View full commentExcept then You have to sacrifice your background and specialty choices just to approximate that class, rather than having an equal ability to explore different stories within the class as the Fighter, Rogue, Cleric, and Wizard do.
I think in relation to paragraph 2 above, it would be awesome if a paladin had martial dice to use but instead of straight damage they could be used to provide effects based on deity choice. For example: I follow the edicts of a god of healing and as an option I can spend a martial die on a hit allowing the party member with the lowest HP to gain HP equal to a given modifier.
Let me cite another classic douzie. Dragon 379 describes the assassin. Under the heading "Shade Form", the article read that you can pass through barriers. It still does say that in the text blocks - but it also used to say it in the compendium entry. It doesn't say it in the compendium entry anymore - they realized the flavor text did not match the power as written or even intended probably. The flavor text for the power in the compendium entry is now more precise - but the "pass through...
View full commentLet me cite another classic douzie. Dragon 379 describes the assassin. Under the heading "Shade Form", the article read that you can pass through barriers. It still does say that in the text blocks - but it also used to say it in the compendium entry. It doesn't say it in the compendium entry anymore - they realized the flavor text did not match the power as written or even intended probably. The flavor text for the power in the compendium entry is now more precise - but the "pass through barriers" sentence still exists in the Dragon article.
Here is an example of more recent vintage. In Mordenkainen's the flavor text for Banded Mail says "A warrior in Banded Mail moves as quickly as one in Leather armor." Of course the stats for Banded Mail do not bear this out - still a minus to skill and minus to speed, weighs a lot more than 15lbs. So here is a bit of flavor text supposed to serve as INSPIRATION, but it is nothing more than a PIPE DREAM. With 10 players (usually no more than seven at a time) and a DM, every little...
View full commentHere is an example of more recent vintage. In Mordenkainen's the flavor text for Banded Mail says "A warrior in Banded Mail moves as quickly as one in Leather armor." Of course the stats for Banded Mail do not bear this out - still a minus to skill and minus to speed, weighs a lot more than 15lbs.
So here is a bit of flavor text supposed to serve as INSPIRATION, but it is nothing more than a PIPE DREAM.
With 10 players (usually no more than seven at a time) and a DM, every little disconnect of flavor text and rule is going to rear its ugly head inevitably. The only thing that keep arguments done to two minutes instead of ten is precision.
Considering that skill system is mostly used out of combat, in roleplaying situations - it felt like it was overly restricting. Furthermore, penalizing party for failures created a situation where players would pass on interesting ideas because their characters are unlikely to make the roll.
I also didn't...
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But I think it's a very simple prospect to address both while still retaining the same mechanic.
First is to have a small list of skills that require training (acrobatics, swimming, etc.). There would have to be a mechanic for limiting the number and types....
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