Corrosive Sigil - Artificer

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A friend and I were looking at Corrosive Sigil, a lvl 5 Daily Power for Artificers and some questions came up.  The power states:


Corrosive Sigil

Your sigil imbues a weapon or an implement with arcane acid.


Daily        Acid, Arcane Minor Action      Melee touch


Target: One weapon


Effect: Until the end of the encounter, any attack that uses the target as a weapon deals ongoing 5 acid damage (save ends). As a free action, the target’s wielder can end the effect when he or she hits a creature using the target in order to give that creature a penalty to AC equal to your Constitution modifier (save ends).



 
First question:  The power doesn't state explicitly that the power has to hit to cause a 5 acid ongoing damage.  We thought this odd, and normally assumed that it would infact infer this, but other powers state this part more plainly.  We ruled that this power does require a hit from the target (that is the weapon must smack a creature to wipe off some acid on it).  We do this right?

Second question:  The power states that when they hit a creature using the target (weapon) that they can end the effect in order to inflict an AC penalty on the creature (save ends).  Question is what effect ends?  Does the effect on the target end, meaning that the weapon is no longer embued with acid?  Does the effect mean that the creature doesn't take the 5 OG acid damage, and now takes the AC penalty?  If this were the case why not just state that the attacker gets a choice of AC penalty or acid damage?  Maybe it means that the creature must first be struck and receive the 5 OG acid damage, and then be struck again and then the player can remove the OG damage (if the critter didn't save) and then inflict the AC penalty?

At this point I think we are just over thinking it and need a fresh pair of eyes on a ruling.  What do any of you suggest or know?  Your comments would be hugely appreciated.  Thank you.

        
The power does the ongoing damage whether an attack hits or misses. All it requires is that it is a weapon attack with the target (i.e. the weapon) that was touched. That effect (i.e. the ability to add ongoing damage with every weapon attack w the target) ends if you want to do the AC penalty. Note that being able to add that AC penalty DOES require a hit. The AC penalty would only be a good choice against say, a Solo creature, as the ongoing damage doesnt stack. If you were fighting a ton of creatures, I would just leave the ongoing effect on for the whole encounter. You will want to use this power as early as possible in an encounter to get the most out of it.
I don't know if frothsof's answer is what was intended, but it's definitely RAW. If you read the text of other Sigil powers from an Artificers, it seems (to me) that you are supposed to only apply the Ongoing Acid on a hit. However, this is NOT RAW.  In addition, since it doesn't appear likely that we'll ever get any more Rules Updates for 4e, I don't think we'll ever know the actual intent.
I dont even think its that strong. If it required a hit, it would be reeaaallly weak for a daily. Think about it. Most fights last like 4 rounds. If the weapon only attacks once per round, that is probably not going to result in a lot of ongoing damage. Some of it will likely be wasted by a creature being killed before it has a chance to take it. Even if you have a Ranger or other multi-attacker, the damage does not stack, so multiple targets have to be engaged for it even to be worth it, which makes it situational as well. It is def written as intended, and I dont think its overpowered. It is a daily, after all.
First, thank you for the replies.  I do appreciate it.  Really did need an opinion from someone else at this point.

Devodog, I had the same opinion of you at first.  WOW, that is over the top powerful!  You don't have to hit to make it even work!  How cool is that?!  But when I read what frothsof had to say on this matter it made me think some.  Really it is only 5 points every turn.  That's not a ton, and there is a 50/50 chance that the attack will stick as a save ends the OG damage.  This will require the wielder to stay on target every turn if he wishes the OG to really stick.  This would be very nice if it was an encounter power, but this is a Daily.  That is the part that sticks in my mind.  You are level 5, and this is the best trick in your bag?  It should really pack some punch, and 5 OG just isn't that phenominal.  A common magic missile will do that much damage (but admittedly requires a Standard action), and it is just a level 1 At-Will.  This isn't to say the Power stinks, I rather like it, but now I don't think it is as powerful as I originally thought.  I think the AC penalty issue is more than a bit suspicious, and I'm not certain that any three of us have that correct as of yet, but as written, I believe the power discharges the sigil, much like frothsof states.  When would I ever do this?  It just isn't that powerful.  That is what makes me second guess our interpretations.

Anymore insight on this is still very welcome.  However for now, I'm going to go with OG damage regardless of a hit, and inflicting the AC penalty in essence ends the Daily Power.

Thank you.   

You could always rework the power so that the ongoing damage and the penalty are both applied on a hit (save ends) and then you can end the effect on the weapon to impose an AC penalty until the end of the encounter - no save.


It's much more powerful, and it might be worth it to change it to a standard action, but at least it's a powerful effect with some garanteed use.


IMO, if you don't pick it because it feels to weak, it is. Modify it with your DM with the caveat that if it feels too strong, it is to be tweaked it until all parties are satisfied. It's really not a massive game-changer : damage rarely is - especially ongoing damage. It's the action denial you have to watch out for. A power such as this, in a standard 4e game will have minimal impact on an encounter's difficulty - unlike stunning (even just one round) that controller...

I think the AC penalty issue is more than a bit suspicious, and I'm not certain that any three of us have that correct as of yet, but as written, I believe the power discharges the sigil, much like frothsof states.    


I assure you that I am correct, but if you dont believe me, take it to the gurus in the 4e Rules Q&A forums and they will tell you the exact same thing.
Frothsof's explanation is correct. I also second him on reposting this in Rules Q&A if you're still not convinced. That's really where this thread should have been started in the first place.

"My flying carpet is full of elves."

As Duskweaver has kindly pointed out, this topic does belong in the Rules Q&A.  This is my very first post and am very pleased with the kind response of others.  Going with what frothsof stated.  My thanks to all.