Discontent with our DM: Grievances and question of what to do

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Player B's Grevances (Barbarian)
Most combats begin with heavy control or terribly unfourtunate circumstances or just focused fire falling on the Barbarian.
He spends half the combat encounter just recovering before he can go back to trying to do what he wanted to do in the first place.

Player C's Grevances (Cavalier)
Marks and the defender aura are being largely ignored. He may be near untouchable in that armor, so it seems the DM has taken to only using monsters that can afford to ignore the damage for attacking the other PCs. We only see minions once in a blue moon now.

Player E's Grevances (Executioner)
He joined the party after at least 12 sessions. He is woefully underequipped in comparison to the party. Misses attacks far more often than everyone else.

Player E2's Grevances (Elementalist)
We've been underground for so long, we've out-leveled our gear. Our Enhancement bonuses are between 0 and 1 when we should have them all at 2 by now. We haven't had a single drop of neck slot items, or usable armor or weapons. Only junk that we'll end up selling. It's been at least 5 sessions since we've been able to go to some market for new gear.


General Party Grevances
1) Getting anything finished is taking forever. We went uderground to do specific things and we are constantly being set back by "getting lost" or running into every monster of the caves and their mother. It's gotten to the point where we've lost whatever player motivation we've had to actually complete the quest for this NPC and would rather just leave the caves and do something else. Problem is, we can't. Turning back would probably mean having to spend the same amount of time getting out than we did to get in.

2) We're level 8, and in one session our DM sent is a level 15 (adjusted) encounter but with damage numbers that hit the entire party for half their HP. He's been trying to get us knocked out and captured for a while now. We certainly don't want to let that happen because we're already tired of set backs. We've been surviving so far against all odds.

3) Having spent so much actual playtime on these quests that we really aren't that invested in, we've become a bit jaded. Our characters had their own stories, their own motivations, their own quests they could be doing but none of that has come into play. Save a minor role play encounter that slightly touches on something a character is particularly invested in, we've just been going around doing these quests that no one in the party would be particularly motivated to do. We go along with it cause otherwise it seems there's no game.

----

The only other thing of note to mention is that while we're playing this game, we're also prepping for another game which I will be DMing. The mayority of the players know my DMing style and are quite excited for it. We were hoping to take our current game into high level Paragon Tier, but we're now among the players talking about how to salvage it before it really turns into a chore and not the game we were hoping to play.
B needs some initiative.  Going first is the best way to stop the monsters harming you.  Failing that, he needs better defences, so they don't hit him.

C has realised why Cavaliers suck.  Not a lot to be done about that one I'm afraid, though picking up Battle Awareness would help.  Sanctions are one way to at least partly fix the Cav, but in heropic, they're not up to much.  Sorry to be harshing, but Cavaliers are terrible.  The only good part of them is the mount.

E: either your DM needs to use inherent bonuses, or he needs to give out appropriate starting gear.  No excuses for this one.  Magic is part of the scaling of the game.

E2: See E.

1: Not a lot to be said there, sounds like not a terribly well-designed adventure.

2: Not sounds like a good DM here.

3: Remember, no gaming >>> bad gaming.

Generally, I'd say firstly talk to the DM about chainging the parameters of the game, because you're not having fun.  If he doesn't, change DMs.  Playing a bad game just to be playing a game at all is a terrible idea.  When you change DMs, make sure to have a proper session 0 where you set out what you all want out of the game, and any houserules you're intending to use.  Make sure you occasionally have a look back and see if everything's going right; if there's anything you need to change etc etc.
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
As a small note, the next game we play would be DM'd by me. Here's what it's going to be about, if anyone's curious.

E: either your DM needs to use inherent bonuses, or he needs to give out appropriate starting gear.  No excuses for this one.  Magic is part of the scaling of the game.

E2: See E.


Specifically addressing this one right now.

I'm thinking that, since we are currently dungeon crawling (though that wasn't what we thought we had signed up for), our DM is playing the "realism" card by dropping items that we can't use ourselves, that we'd likely sell, but that were appropriate for the enemies to have who dropped them.

Also on the "realism" card, being underground we've been stuck without a means to purchase items for about 3-4 levels.
Not finding a market underground wouldn't be a bad thing if it weren't taking us forever just to get from one point to the other, encountering all hell along the way slowing us down.
I think we're starting to get tired of random encounters already.
It seems like our DM doesn't like handwaving these things.
As I said, this is what Inherent Bonuses are for (Dark Sun Campaign Setting has the most up-to-date version).  If your DM is playing the realism card and not dropping or allowing access to adequate magic items to make the scaling work, then suggest to him that the game comes with a tool to fix the scaling in exactly that situation.  It works fine, it just needs to be used.
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
As I said, this is what Inherent Bonuses are for (Dark Sun Campaign Setting has the most up-to-date version).  If your DM is playing the realism card and not dropping or allowing access to adequate magic items to make the scaling work, then suggest to him that the game comes with a tool to fix the scaling in exactly that situation.  It works fine, it just needs to be used.


He knows about Inherent Enhancement.

Heck, we've used it more times than I can recall. Almost every single time I DM, I use it.

For some reason, he made the concious decision to not use Inherent Enhancement and specifically told us not to check it off in the CB. 
Talk to him about it.  If he;s not using it for a reason, find out why that is.  Communicate with him, not the internet ;)
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
I intend to, but I'm mostly venting. He can be a very "no" DM when he wants to be. Granted, that's him as a person too, always having to be right and do things his way.

We've already voiced these issues to him. If they aren't resolved by the next session, there's gonna be a real stern conversation about either fixing these issues or ending the game.
 

From everything you've said, it sounds like the DM has a specific outcome in mind. It also sounds like the group is not enjoying the journey to that specific outcome. Outside of the game, I would directly ask the DM if he has a specific outcome in mind. If not, let him know the party isn't enjoying what's been happening lately, and why. He might be willing to change, if he isn't vested in the result. On the other hand, if he says he does have a specific outcome in mind, do a full stop. Let him know you aren't interested in it or at least the way he is going about it. 


It just sounds like you are all there for his pleasure, and your desires are secondary. If most people aren't having fun, there is no point to realism, rules, story, or anything else.

Player B's Grevances (Barbarian)
Most combats begin with heavy control or terribly unfourtunate circumstances or just focused fire falling on the Barbarian.
He spends half the combat encounter just recovering before he can go back to trying to do what he wanted to do in the first place.

Player C's Grevances (Cavalier)
Marks and the defender aura are being largely ignored. He may be near untouchable in that armor, so it seems the DM has taken to only using monsters that can afford to ignore the damage for attacking the other PCs. We only see minions once in a blue moon now.

Player E's Grevances (Executioner)
He joined the party after at least 12 sessions. He is woefully underequipped in comparison to the party. Misses attacks far more often than everyone else.

Player E2's Grevances (Elementalist)
We've been underground for so long, we've out-leveled our gear. Our Enhancement bonuses are between 0 and 1 when we should have them all at 2 by now. We haven't had a single drop of neck slot items, or usable armor or weapons. Only junk that we'll end up selling. It's been at least 5 sessions since we've been able to go to some market for new gear.



This sounds like a DM who not only preps encounters for your specific group of characters, but does so in a way that hinders or impairs them. I would ask him not to do this. Instead, perhaps he could consider imagining the encounter as it makes sense organically in context rather than through the lens of a challenge to a very specific group of characters. I never design encounters with a specific group in mind. I design encounters appropriate to the scene. Sometimes that means nastiness for the PCs, sometimes not so much.

As for gear, there either needs to be inherent bonuses or the DM is going to have to use his imagination and put equivalents of "shops" in his adventures or start dropping wishlist items. Perhaps you can suggest a method I use: Everyone writes down a magic item they'd like for their character to find in the dungeon. The DM puts in his notes where magic items can be discovered, but not what magic item it is. As you're sifting through the cache after a battle or bit of exploration, he asks for a roll. Everyone rolls off, highest gets their wishlist item. This is also a good opportunity to collaborate on why the item was being sought by the character, what its history is, and what new adventures it might suggest. I like this method because it gives the players what they want, is less work for me, and people seem to like rolling off. Plus the collaboration offers of a lot of new details.

General Party Grevances

1) Getting anything finished is taking forever. We went uderground to do specific things and we are constantly being set back by "getting lost" or running into every monster of the caves and their mother. It's gotten to the point where we've lost whatever player motivation we've had to actually complete the quest for this NPC and would rather just leave the caves and do something else. Problem is, we can't. Turning back would probably mean having to spend the same amount of time getting out than we did to get in.


Getting lost seems like a reasonable (if questionably interesting) setback for a skill challenge or the like, not for fiat, unless the players agree that being lost would be fun as an ongoing complication to the adventure. Talk to the DM about the pacing of his games. Many DMs do not think about pacing. I obsess about it, and as a result my games move along fast. This also seems like an issue of goals and motivation. If they players don't see any interesting stakes in a given encounter, it's less likely to be fun because they have no real skin in the game. Another good topic to bring up with the DM, and one that's easily fixed by collaborating on real stakes in these scenes.

2)
We're level 8, and in one session our DM sent is a level 15 (adjusted) encounter but with damage numbers that hit the entire party for half their HP. He's been trying to get us knocked out and captured for a while now. We certainly don't want to let that happen because we're already tired of set backs. We've been surviving so far against all odds.


I don't have a problem with unbalanced encounters, provided you can "win" without having to kill everything. The real issue here seems to be intent. If he wants to play a capture-and-escape scenario, he should just tell you and ask for your buy-in on the idea. If everyone's onboard, bam, you're captured and on your way to the slave pits to play a classic D&D trope. No rolling or wasted session time required.

3)
 Having spent so much actual playtime on these quests that we really aren't that invested in, we've become a bit jaded. Our characters had their own stories, their own motivations, their own quests they could be doing but none of that has come into play. Save a minor role play encounter that slightly touches on something a character is particularly invested in, we've just been going around doing these quests that no one in the party would be particularly motivated to do. We go along with it cause otherwise it seems there's no game.


You've been given a choice between the DM's game or no game. I would choose no game. But before you do that, bring it up directly. When I run one-shots, which obviously are made without an particular character and his goals in mind, I spend some time in the beginning collaborating with the players on why they give a fudge about this situation. I list some elements of the adventure - important NPCs, treasures, monsters, locations - and ask the players to choose one and tell me how the character relates to it or why the character wants to engage with it. You'd be shocked at well this works.

No amount of tips, tricks, or gimmicks will ever be better than simply talking directly to your fellow players to resolve your issues.
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It seems to me that the DM is trying to get across how lethal and brutal the Underdark can be.  Maybe there is a good reason for this, and he plans to make it up to the characters when X happens.  The problem is, the game is losing its luster now, and DMs who wait for the cool often never get a chance to use it.  In a more diplomatic way than this, I'd tell him he's made his point.  Tell him you're down in the Underdark in the first place for story reasons, and the constant grind of random encounters is becoming a grind and not a game.  You'd like to get back to the story.  I'd offer to sacrifice some gear, and maybe even put the PCs in poor health, etc. as they finally manage to drag themselves to the next meaningful location.  If the DM is looking to tax the party, offer to let that happen and move the story along.  In my own experience, offering that level of trust to either the party as a DM or to the DM as a member of the party has the effect of improving game play and cohesion.

E: either your DM needs to use inherent bonuses, or he needs to give out appropriate starting gear.  No excuses for this one.  Magic is part of the scaling of the game.

E2: See E.


Specifically addressing this one right now.

I'm thinking that, since we are currently dungeon crawling (though that wasn't what we thought we had signed up for), our DM is playing the "realism" card by dropping items that we can't use ourselves, that we'd likely sell, but that were appropriate for the enemies to have who dropped them.

Also on the "realism" card, being underground we've been stuck without a means to purchase items for about 3-4 levels.
Not finding a market underground wouldn't be a bad thing if it weren't taking us forever just to get from one point to the other, encountering all hell along the way slowing us down.
I think we're starting to get tired of random encounters already.
It seems like our DM doesn't like handwaving these things.



I'm reading through the posts now, but remember that if something drops, you can use the Enchant Item ritual to transfer enchantments from one item to another. (ie, you can move that +2 armor bonus from the halfling sized platemail to the dragonborn size chainmail, provided it's an enchant that is compatible).
So many PCs, so little time...

I'm reading through the posts now, but remember that if something drops, you can use the Enchant Item ritual to transfer enchantments from one item to another. (ie, you can move that +2 armor bonus from the halfling sized platemail to the dragonborn size chainmail, provided it's an enchant that is compatible).


The power gamer/minmaxer in me would really hate to have to spend a feat on getting Ritual Casting rather than upping my combat potential. But it may be necessary.
I'm just hoping we can go back to playing with that DM rather than against the DM.
The power gamer/minmaxer in me would really hate to have to spend a feat on getting Ritual Casting rather than upping my combat potential. But it may be necessary.

Think of it as min/maxing the party, instead of just your character. If someone agrees to take Ritual Casting, the others chould agree to take feats that make it easier to back that character up in combat.

If I have to ask the GM for it, then I don't want it.



The power gamer/minmaxer in me would really hate to have to spend a feat on getting Ritual Casting rather than upping my combat potential. But it may be necessary.
I'm just hoping we can go back to playing with that DM rather than against the DM. 



I can sympathize (on the powergamer part, anyway) but that's preferable to not having items. HOWEVER, it SOUNDS like once you pull that particular stunt, your DM would "block" it by no longer dropping items you can transfer. 

I think the multiple posts above that advise talking to the DM, out of game and away from the dice, is the best way. Lay out your responses like you did in the beginning, though don't specifically name players (with one caveat mentioned below). Just tell him you guys feel like the game is almost a chore right now, and that you would like to advance the story along, possibly to whatever triumphant story arc conclusion in the Underdark he has in mind. 

**As for the monsters that ignore defender marks, I PRAY for a game like that! Especially with a paladin (or subset of that class). There are feats you can take to make your Divine Challenge particularly punishing (there is a feat that Slows the target of your Divine Challenge if they take damage from it, for instance). Enough that you can make the DM HAVE to attack your defender, simply to get to attack SOMETHING with that monster.

edit - I don't know why it says I'm saying what you said, but eh..
 
So many PCs, so little time...
I can sympathize (on the powergamer part, anyway) but that's preferable to not having items. HOWEVER, it SOUNDS like once you pull that particular stunt, your DM would "block" it by no longer dropping items you can transfer.

Good point.

If I have to ask the GM for it, then I don't want it.

I can sympathize (on the powergamer part, anyway) but that's preferable to not having items. HOWEVER, it SOUNDS like once you pull that particular stunt, your DM would "block" it by no longer dropping items you can transfer.

Good point.



This is why I don't particularly want to take this route. I've seen players be given exactly what they were asking for only to see it subverted later on. So this merits an off-table talk.
I can sympathize (on the powergamer part, anyway) but that's preferable to not having items. HOWEVER, it SOUNDS like once you pull that particular stunt, your DM would "block" it by no longer dropping items you can transfer.

Good point.



This is why I don't particularly want to take this route. I've seen players be given exactly what they were asking for only to see it subverted later on. So this merits an off-table talk.



Agreed. Usually your best recourse, anyway. ESPECIALLY if you are friends. I game with a group of people that I have known for a minimum of 6 years, and on the upper end 23 years, so I have a pretty decent rapport with them. If we don't like something, we have enough history to just say "Hey, man... this isn't fun. Can we try it this way instead?" and get some traction.
So many PCs, so little time...


**As for the monsters that ignore defender marks, I PRAY for a game like that! Especially with a paladin (or subset of that class). There are feats you can take to make your Divine Challenge particularly punishing (there is a feat that Slows the target of your Divine Challenge if they take damage from it, for instance). Enough that you can make the DM HAVE to attack your defender, simply to get to attack SOMETHING with that monster.

edit - I don't know why it says I'm saying what you said, but eh..
 


It's a Cavalier, not a Paladin.  Its aura damage is almost entirely ignorable; the best solution to the player's problem would be to change to an O-Paladin, and make basically the same character, but be infinitely more effective.
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
It's a Cavalier, not a Paladin.  Its aura damage is almost entirely ignorable; the best solution to the player's problem would be to change to an O-Paladin, and make basically the same character, but be infinitely more effective.


We would, but our DM wanted us all to play E-classes this time.

Heck, the E-Classes have been so ineffective and/or boring that we've been houseruling in features and powers from their original counterparts.
Then switch to a Knight.  They definitely don't suck, and could retain much the same flavour, as well as the same armour and shield options.  The real problem with the Cavalier (and you have to outright softball it as a DM, to not take advantage of it) is that the aura damage is piddling, and you can avoid the penalty to hit by simply shifting, eating 6 radiant damage, and going after someone who's not tooled up in the heaviest armour in the game, nearly the highest HP in the game, and rocking a class bonus to NADS without any penalty.  At least on the Knight, you get to hit them, probably prone them (WSG+Defend The Line stance), do decent damage, maybe slide them if you're rocking a flail, etc etc etc.  The Cav can do this once, if the focus one of their stats in the wrong place and MC fighter to do it.

But honestly, the more you post about this, the more it sounds like you need to get a new game started ASAP =)
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
Or just invite your DM to play in the next game you run.

When I have time, I will respond with how I handle quantum events. My game uses a lot of time and plane travel, and everyone seems to enjoy it. You have already been given some nice advice, however.

Within; Without.



**As for the monsters that ignore defender marks, I PRAY for a game like that! Especially with a paladin (or subset of that class). There are feats you can take to make your Divine Challenge particularly punishing (there is a feat that Slows the target of your Divine Challenge if they take damage from it, for instance). Enough that you can make the DM HAVE to attack your defender, simply to get to attack SOMETHING with that monster.

edit - I don't know why it says I'm saying what you said, but eh..
 


It's a Cavalier, not a Paladin.  Its aura damage is almost entirely ignorable; the best solution to the player's problem would be to change to an O-Paladin, and make basically the same character, but be infinitely more effective.



Ah. I haven't had the pleasure, yet. We avoid the Essential classes, prefering the original AEDU builds.  I guess I assume the Cavalier was a paladin Essential build!
So many PCs, so little time...

Ah. I haven't had the pleasure, yet. We avoid the Essential classes, prefering the original AEDU builds.  I guess I assume the Cavalier was a paladin Essential build!


I like that some of the E-classes dare to break the AEDU mold while still using the same fundamentals.
I don't like that many of them do it by being boring or ineffective or really akward in their design.

Ah. I haven't had the pleasure, yet. We avoid the Essential classes, prefering the original AEDU builds.  I guess I assume the Cavalier was a paladin Essential build!


I like that some of the E-classes dare to break the AEDU mold while still using the same fundamentals.
I don't like that many of them do it by being boring or ineffective or really akward in their design.



There are a COUPLE that look interesting to me, and I'd like to give them a whirl. The Blackguard and the Hexblade, specifically. Beyond that, not a lot that drew me when I looked through them.
So many PCs, so little time...
...I'm just hoping we can go back to playing with that DM rather than against the DM.




That's the impression exactly that I got from your description:  that this DM was interpreting his role in the game as the guy who is supposed to defeat the PCs, and the guy who creates a "realistic" experience, rather than the guy who provides an interesting backdrop and interesting challenges for the PCs to look awesome with, and creates an entertaining experience.

I think some DMs never really get that there's a subtle difference there:  if they aren't trying to defeat the PCs, then the only remaining alternative is to just let them win.  They believe that if they aren't creating a "realistic" experience, then the only remaining alternative is to just let a totally unbelievable experience happen.  They believe that if they aren't taking the PCs down a peg or two at every opportunity, then they are just letting the PCs get away with murder.  They cannot (or will not) see any shades of grey between the two options, or any third alternatives, or (when appropriate) any way to provide both at the same time.

If your DM is one of those who cannot see subtleties between two outrageous extremes, or for some reason chooses not to see any subtleties or nuances, then I'm not really sure what you can do to change it, without changing DMs.

With any luck, though, it is instead a misunderstanding, and the DM would be willing to make adjustments with the benefit of a little constructive criticism and support.
[spoiler New DM Tips]
  • Trying to solve out-of-game problems (like cheating, bad attitudes, or poor sportsmanship) with in-game solutions will almost always result in failure, and will probably make matters worse.
  • Gun Safety Rule #5: Never point the gun at anything you don't intend to destroy. (Never introduce a character, PC, NPC, Villain, or fate of the world into even the possibility of a deadly combat or other dangerous situation, unless you are prepared to destroy it instantly and completely forever.)
  • Know your group's character sheets, and check them over carefully. You don't want surprises, but, more importantly, they are a gold mine of ideas!
  • "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." It's a problem if the players aren't having fun and it interferes with a DM's ability to run the game effectively; if it's not a problem, 'fixing' at best does little to help, and at worst causes problems that didn't exist before.
  • "Hulk Smash" characters are a bad match for open-ended exploration in crowds of civilians; get them out of civilization where they can break things and kill monsters in peace.
  • Success is not necessarily the same thing as killing an opponent. Failure is not necessarily the same thing as dying.
  • Failure is always an option. And it's a fine option, too, as long as failure is interesting, entertaining, and fun!
[/spoiler] The New DM's Group Horror in RPGs "This is exactly what the Leprechauns want you to believe!" - Merb101 "Broken or not, unbalanced or not, if something seems to be preventing the game from being enjoyable, something has to give: either that thing, or other aspects of the game, or your idea of what's enjoyable." - Centauri
I can sympathize (on the powergamer part, anyway) but that's preferable to not having items. HOWEVER, it SOUNDS like once you pull that particular stunt, your DM would "block" it by no longer dropping items you can transfer. 

I think the multiple posts above that advise talking to the DM, out of game and away from the dice, is the best way. Lay out your responses like you did in the beginning, though don't specifically name players (with one caveat mentioned below). Just tell him you guys feel like the game is almost a chore right now, and that you would like to advance the story along, possibly to whatever triumphant story arc conclusion in the Underdark he has in mind....



QFT - trying to adjust the character in a way that will undermine whatever it is that this DM is trying to heavy-hand his way to, would be an in-game solution to an out-of-game problem.  It addresses a symptom of the out-of-game problem, rather than the cause of it; if the DM's out-of-game problem isn't resolved, then he'll find a way to manifest his out-of-game problem elsewhere in-game, while the players compete with the DM in a game of whack-a-mole to deal with the symptoms of each others' out-of-game issues.

Players not having fun = out-of-game problem

DM treating his role in the game as the guy who ensures the Players are not having fun = out-of-game problem

DM not realizing that things he might enjoy doing are detracting from the Players enjoyment = out-of-game problem


Instead of trying some attempt at an in-game solution, I'd just go with stopping the game, setting the books and dice and character sheets aside, and talking to the DM as a friend, family member, co-worker, or whatever, rather than treating him as an in-game challege to the PCs.

Good luck
[spoiler New DM Tips]
  • Trying to solve out-of-game problems (like cheating, bad attitudes, or poor sportsmanship) with in-game solutions will almost always result in failure, and will probably make matters worse.
  • Gun Safety Rule #5: Never point the gun at anything you don't intend to destroy. (Never introduce a character, PC, NPC, Villain, or fate of the world into even the possibility of a deadly combat or other dangerous situation, unless you are prepared to destroy it instantly and completely forever.)
  • Know your group's character sheets, and check them over carefully. You don't want surprises, but, more importantly, they are a gold mine of ideas!
  • "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." It's a problem if the players aren't having fun and it interferes with a DM's ability to run the game effectively; if it's not a problem, 'fixing' at best does little to help, and at worst causes problems that didn't exist before.
  • "Hulk Smash" characters are a bad match for open-ended exploration in crowds of civilians; get them out of civilization where they can break things and kill monsters in peace.
  • Success is not necessarily the same thing as killing an opponent. Failure is not necessarily the same thing as dying.
  • Failure is always an option. And it's a fine option, too, as long as failure is interesting, entertaining, and fun!
[/spoiler] The New DM's Group Horror in RPGs "This is exactly what the Leprechauns want you to believe!" - Merb101 "Broken or not, unbalanced or not, if something seems to be preventing the game from being enjoyable, something has to give: either that thing, or other aspects of the game, or your idea of what's enjoyable." - Centauri