Magic 2014 - Deck Laboratory

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Thanks, it was a late time idea.

Unless you want to question the deck fixing, and ask for 1.2 version, yes it's too late. Wink 
Time to start making suggestions to improve the last deck selected, Enter the Dracomancer.

Just read the rules before you post anything or your post will be ignored.

The deadline to make suggestions will be until wednesday.
-1 Volcanic Dragon, -1 Penumbra Wurm, -1 Spellbreaker Behemoth: +3 Slumbering Dragon
-2 Sangrite Surge: +2 Jund Charm

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The essential problem with this deck is that it dies while you still have big expensive dragons in your hand with not quite enough mana to cast them. Slumbering Dragon creates a difficult but thematic choice for your opponent at 1 CMC. Do I attack with everything and awake the dragon? Or play it slow but give him/her more time to bring the higher cost creatures out onto the battlefield? I suggest removing some of the higher costed creatures that don't really make sense in this deck. The extra Jund Charms provide additional sweeping power while also comboing with the Slumbering Dragons. 
I like the synergy between Slumbering Dragon and Jund Charm. Hum, I see a plan forming in my mind. Undecided

Let's wait for more input before pursuing this route.

Here are my first suggestions:

- Replace Dragon Roost with Gruul War Plow
- Replace one Hellkite Hatchling with a second Savage Twister
- Replace both Sangrite Surge with Sprouting Thrinax

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Gruul War Plow would be a great addition. It gives tample to all your creatures, it is colorless, it can become a creature, and it serves as a target for Artifact Mutation if necessary.

Savage Twister and Sprouting Thrinax don't need an explanation.

OBS: Flesh // Blood would be awesome, but let's not think about it now. The card is too new.



So as no more suggestions were made, I will make my last suggestion pursuing the path Aught_3 opened for me.

Suggestion:

- Replace all three Torrent of Fire with Slumbering Dragon.
- Replace Volcanic Dragon with Vastwood Hydra.
- Replace Bloodbraid Elf with Forgotten Ancient.

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Slumbering Dragon: See Aught_3 explanation above. Plus it can be eaten if necessary and it enhances the value of Soul's Fire.

Vastwood Hydra: Not a very good card in CMD, but potencially very good here, because chances are you will have at least one target for it, and you can always eat it and put the counters on your dragon. Also it has a good synergy with Slumbering Dragon.

Forgotten Ancient: Bloodbraid Elf is a great card in the wrong deck. His offensive ability is almost useless and his Cascade ability may often result in a waste. Forgotten Ancient is better on defense, it can be used to activate the ability not used of Hellkite Hatchling, it can help other creatures, and also it has a good synergy with Slumbering Dragon.
So as no more suggestions were made, I will make my last suggestion pursuing the path Aught_3 opened for me.

Suggestion:

- Replace all three Torrent of Fire with Slumbering Dragon.
- Replace Volcanic Dragon with Vastwood Hydra.
- Replace Bloodbraid Elf with Forgotten Ancient.

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Slumbering Dragon: See Aught_3 explanation above. Plus it can be eaten if necessary and it enhances the value of Soul's Fire.

Vastwood Hydra: Not a very good card in CMD, but potencially very good here, because chances are you will have at least one target for it, and you can always eat it and put the counters on your dragon. Also it has a good synergy with Slumbering Dragon.

Forgotten Ancient: Bloodbraid Elf is a great card in the wrong deck. His offensive ability is almost useless and his Cascade ability may often result in a waste. Forgotten Ancient is better on defense, it can be used to activate the ability not used of Hellkite Hatchling, it can help other creatures, and also it has a good synergy with Slumbering Dragon.



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Slumbering Dragon really good suggestion!

Sprouting Thrinax I can never understand why this is not in the deck when this card is in the game encounter...too powerful for devour? compare to other token cards in other deck is obviously not (eg, images, fateful hour townfolk , dudes that bring 2 tokens and avenger!)

However, I disagree Bloodbraid Elf in the wrong deck, and this elf is a SHE! After you unlock all the cards or even look at the promos, this deck is not going full devour strategy. Another way to play this deck is to remove all the devour stuff and the elf suit that playstyle.
I even wanted a 2nd or 3rd one in the promo unlocks!


This deck is still the worst jund deck ever lol.
Anyway, heres my suggestions for a more Dragon Jund theme.

-Hellkite Hatchling with Hunted Dragon
-Hellkite Hatchling with  Darigaaz, the Igniter
-Any burns for a stronger burn/removal with a single Lavalanche or Violent Ultimatum
-Torrent of Fire with Dragon Egg
-all Sangrite Surge with Sangrite Backlash
-any 2 cards for 2 Bloodbraid Elf

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Hunted Dragon combo nicely with Jund Charm to offset the drawback

Darigaaz, the Igniter is a very cool card or maybe too OP haha

Lavalanche or Violent Ultimatum to provide a mass removal

Dragon Egg for devour strategy is just pure evil. dragon eat their own eggs Tongue Out

Replacing Sangrite Surge with Sangrite Backlash is way better, you can use it as a Last Gasp or a +3 boost



If it's not too late I would replace Dragon Breath with Keldon Mantle

I have problems with Dragon Breath to be honest being that this is a tri-color deck and my experiences with this card so far have been nothing short of frustrating. Fists of Ironwood would also work well.
Time to start making suggestions to improve Hunter's Strength.

This deck wasn't selected by the majority as the four worst, but I think it deserves a little change.

Just read the rules before you post anything or your post will be ignored.

The deadline to make suggestions will be until wednesday.

WotC doesn't care about flavor. Their forum is the only place where an ORC can kill a troll...

Lost around 120 posts in the forum migration

Post #1000 on Feb 02, 2013

Post #2000 on Sep 04, 2013

I agree. Just 2 Strangleroot Geist, Vengevine and Chameleon Colossus would resolve the problem, but I don't know what to cut yet.
Sorry if I'm coming across dumb here. But are these change's you are recommending after all the Promo card's become available or are you able to make these change's already?
The goal was making both the aggro version and the midrange/ramp version more efficient

-3 Staff of the Wild Magus, -1 Beastmaster Ascension, +4 Skyshroud Claim
-1 Wurmskin Forger, -1 Living Hive, -1 Biorhythm, +3 Experiment One
-3 Gloomwidow, +3 Strangleroot Geist
-1 Decree of Savagery, -1 Crush of Wurms, +2 Masked Admirers
-2 Sacred Wolf, +2 Dungrove Elder
-2 Hunt the Weak, +2 Vengevine
-3 Sentinel Spider, +1 Predator Ooze, +2 Baru, Fist of Krosa
-1 Brawn, +1 Kalonian Hydra

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- This is all the ramp version really needs to be good. Claim is especially good because it allows you to play something more on turn 4.
- In to the aggro version. Exp1 is great here. He'll evolve basically every turn, and once it evolved twice, he'll be resilient to removal (which is great to recover from a sweeper).
- Geist is also great for the same reasons. It puts the pressure on your opponent and survives sweepers. In the ramp version, it's also a very good blocker.
- Admirers is probably my favorite last minute addition. He has passable stats for a 4-drop, can return from the grave by itself and draws cards. Sure, Harmonize is more explosive, but he gives a body to the aggro version and a blocker to the ramp version. Green CA at it's best.
- Elder is the reason to play Green beatdown/aggro.
- Vengevine is the reason to play Green beatdown/aggro.
- Ooze is probably the best creature in the deck right now. Another copy is very important. Baru is like Bellowing Tanglewurm, an Overrun effect with legs.
- Well, the deck must showcase some M14 cards, and Hydra is one of the best cards for this deck in the set (I thought about Scavenging Ooze, but that's probably too good). Hydra is awesome and end games in a heartbeat.

I made a lot of suggestions, but I think that's a good thing. That way, you can choose the ones you like more. You don't have to pick all of them (but I'll be very happy if you do pick all of them ).

WotC doesn't care about flavor. Their forum is the only place where an ORC can kill a troll...

Lost around 120 posts in the forum migration

Post #1000 on Feb 02, 2013

Post #2000 on Sep 04, 2013

Enter Dracomancer. Get rid of black spells. It complicates everything.

Remove all three Torrent of Fire
Remove all four Tukatongue Thallid
Remove Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund
Remove Hellkite Overlord
Remove Broodmate Dragon
Remove four Maelstrom Pulse (one promotional unlock)
Remove two Jund Charm
Remove Consume Strength
Remove two Igneous Pouncer
Remove Kilnmouth Dragon (promotional unlock)

Insert two more Dragon Fangs
Insert three Heal the Scars
Insert two Empty the Warrens
Inset one more Banefire
Insert three Dragon Hatchling
Inset three Dragon Egg
Insert one Canopy Dragon
Insert one Ancient Hellkite
Insert one Preyseizer Dragon
Insert one Viashivan Dragon
Insert one Ryusei, the Falling Star
Insert one Jugan, the Rising Star
Sorry if I'm coming across dumb here. But are these change's you are recommending after all the Promo card's become available or are you able to make these change's already?



I started this before promos being available, so promos are not considered.


My first suggestion:

- Replace all Gloomwidow with Ulvenwald Bear
- Replace all Sacred Wolf with Turntimber Basilisk
- Replace Savage Summoning with Ulvenwald Tracker
-3 Staff of the Wild Magus, +3 Essence Warden
-3 Gloomwidow, +2 Strangleroot Geist, +1 Pulse of the Tangle
-2 Oakenform, +2 Elephant Guide
-1 Overrun, +1 Vengevine
-1 Living Hive, +1 Howl of the Night Pack
-1 Wurmskin Forger, +1 Beacon of Creation
-1 Decree of Savagery, +1 Beacon of Creation
-2 Hunt the Weak, +2 Harmonize

More efficient aggro, but also much better late game due to token generation.



I really like Beacon of Creation for this deck, but in place of Living Hive.

I also see your suggestion about Elephant Guide as a very good one.

With the main problem of the aggro version being a relative lack of creatures maybe we could put in one or twocall of the herd Over a gloomwidow?

If we are not scared of his colors a pit fight or two could also be nice.


Beacon could be a little to much aggressive.


Open for comments about the fixed HS.
Are you going to continue with the other decks? I would find that interesting.

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Are you going to continue with the other decks? I would find that interesting.



Not in my plans, maybe after the expansion we will have the opportunity to do some more fixing. But Im glad at least one person found this thread interesting.



Ok the expansion is going for sometime now, time to retrieve this thread from the bottom of the chest. It will be used again only if necessary.

So I have a doubt and I'll ask here if anyone thinks any of the new decks is low tier.

True_Believer_02 wrote:

Ok the expansion is going for sometime now, time to retrieve this thread from the bottom of the chest. It will be used again only if necessary.

So I have a doubt and I'll ask here if anyone thinks any of the new decks is low tier.

I don't have the expsnsion yet (ps3) but I think the most deck that needs some fixing is HoC.

For others , I am a shadow , for me , others are known kinds of varied metals . I read but I don't write. I listen but I don't  speak .  ​my ideals are sculpted on the solid rock , and my wisdom speaks out for me.

True_Believer_02 wrote:

Ok the expansion is going for sometime now, time to retrieve this thread from the bottom of the chest. It will be used again only if necessary.

So I have a doubt and I'll ask here if anyone thinks any of the new decks is low tier.

What do you consider to be low tier?

I don't think any of the decks are on the level of EtD or HS.

SotS and HoC I think I would consider low mid tier.

LoD mid tier

SM either high mid tier or low high tier

D&B high tier

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Hall of Champions could use some help honestly.

In HC, the problem is more in land quality than card quality. SS has some card problems and SM no removal, despite being a powerful deck.

In HoC since most of your 3 cmc drops will be cast in turn 4 , I think instants will be good in there , like cloudshift , death ward to protect your creature or awe strike to even gain more life , and mana tithe is much better in here than in SotS.

For others , I am a shadow , for me , others are known kinds of varied metals . I read but I don't write. I listen but I don't  speak .  ​my ideals are sculpted on the solid rock , and my wisdom speaks out for me.

Rampant growths HoC definitely needs those

Time to start making suggestions to improve Hall of Champions.

Remember suggesting lands isn't an option. We have to work with what we have.

Just read the rules before you post anything or your post will be ignored.

The deadline to make suggestions will be until Sunday.

The obvious addition would be Noble Hierarch, too bad it cannot be used.

Add:

Hindering Light

Shield of the Oversoul

Bant Battlemage

Bant Sureblade

Silhana Ledgewalker
Sakura-Tribe Elder

Search for Tomorrow

I also like Arqwart's suggestion of Stoic Angel

 

Remove:

Deft Duelist

Jhessian Infiltrator

Waveskimmer Aven

+ all of Arqart's suggestions

 

Explanations

Hindering Light and Shield of the Oversoul protect your singleton beater from being taken out, nothing is more fustrating when playing this deck than having your attacking phase completely blanked by a Lightning Helix or similar.

Bant Battlemage helps avoid the simple chump block and makes sure your opponent keeps taking damage.

Bant Sureblade and Silhana Ledgewalker are just easier to cast versions of the previous 2-drops

Sakura-Tribe Elder fixes colours while not being completely useless as a body if drawn later. I quite like Search for Tomorrow as you don't often need the Island until turn three anyway.

 

Deft Duelist and Jhessian Infiltrator are good, just a pain with the mana base. Hopefully my suggestions of 2CMC creatures make up for the loss. Waveskimmer Aven is too expensive.

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Stoic Angel and Bant Sureblade are guaranteed to make an appearance. Im considering using Geist of Saint Traft also, but Im not sure the effects will trigger right.

True_Believer_02 wrote:

Stoic Angel and Bant Sureblade are guaranteed to make an appearance. Im considering using Geist of Saint Traft also, but Im not sure the effects will trigger right.

Speaking of DotP's stack rules, it would work like so.

 

  1. Traft attacks
  2. All sources of Exalted played before him trigger
  3. His angel is summoned
  4. All sources of Exalted played after him do nothing

Thats the problem. Because in theory it should have work right.

True_Believer_02 wrote:
Open for comments about the fixed HS.

 

Removing Gloomwidow is a terrible idea that crippled the decks best defense against fliers.  Sentinel spider cannot achieve near the same effectiveness, especially by itself, until much later in the duel, especially since the artifact destruction now costs 5 mana, and the deck has become very top heavy.  

 

If you don't want to put them back in, then I would suggest replacing at least one sentinel spider with a silklash spider, and/or putting one or two spidersilk armor in the deck.

2 + 2 = fish

Arqwart wrote:

 

True_Believer_02 wrote:

Stoic Angel and Bant Sureblade are guaranteed to make an appearance. Im considering using Geist of Saint Traft also, but Im not sure the effects will trigger right.

 

Speaking of DotP's stack rules, it would work like so.

 

  1. Traft attacks
  2. All sources of Exalted played before him trigger
  3. His angel is summoned
  4. All sources of Exalted played after him do nothing

 

The angel token never attacked it is put into play tapped attacking ALL  exalted triggers will trigger correctly regardless of if you played exalted before or after geist because they all get put on to the stack at the same time. In this case it doesn't actually matter what order they resolve

 

In DotP It would work like this

1 Taft attacks

2 All sources of exalted and his own attack trigger go on the stack

3 all scources of exalted played before taft resolve

4 Angel token enters

5 all scources of exalted played after taft resolve just pumping taft

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