Goodbye, DotP make no fun anymore.

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After years of following DotP i think it's time to leave. I feel only anger and disappointment about the series. I was hyped at the Demo for Dotp 2009, and in the forum for Dotp 2012, Dotp 2013 and at the beginning for DotP 2014.
But sadly, things chanced into worse.

Like every year, I was hyped about the first new decks ("Chant of Mul Daya" and ("Dracomancer"). I had high hopes for the game and the first things we kown are mostly amazing. But than the ultimate shock: The Illusions and Zombie deck get spoiled. My hype died instantly after reading this decklists. Not... this... damn... aggro... decks... again. But i get hyped again short before relase and had hopes that it could make fun anyway.

This hopes get yet destroyed. The zombie deck and the illusion deck are totaly imbalanced, i cant believe it. And allways my favorite decks get the hurt. I know this feel against Vampires (DotP 2009), Illusions (Dotp 2012) and Goblins (Dotp 2013) before, i don't need that feel against two decks AGAIN ! I hate aggro so much and love fattie decks i had such high hopes that the developer could make a balance, but they didn't and failed more than ever.

But anyway, the real falldown for DotP begun before we knew some deckslist, because after i saw Hex and Hearthstone i feel that DotP isn't the future anymore. Yet i'm 100% sure. It was a nice time with DotP with more than thousand of hours, but we get allways the same every year, time to move on and build own decks in better games.

So goodbye, i read a lot here and the community here was awesome, i learned and discuss a lot, keep up Smile
We'll miss you.
Don't come back now, hear?

It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. - Mark Twain

Mastergear_Owen's take on Magic 2014 Campaign.

Show
You know what I've got more issues. Whats up with the story in this game? The adverts said I was going to team up with Chandra and we were going to kick butt and chew bubblegum across the planes on a revenge campaign against some... guy she knew I guess? Who's Ramaz anyway? What do I get instead? I beat Chandra like 2 minutes in with a mono-green stompy thing Garruk gave me (why does he keep giving all these new planeswalkers his deck) and then I spent like 5 hours jumping from plane to plane picking up random nicknacks for her mantlepiece while she sits back back doing her nails or something. I was thrown in jail! I got hit by a Roil Storm twice! Do you know how many rats are on Ravnica, Chandra? All of them! All of the rats! All of the rats eating me!

Then we go kick her Ex's bearded-screaming-butt and what does she do to help? Nothing! She throws of the occasional fire ball and spends her time trying not to freeze to death. You should have worn pants Chandra. While we're on the subject what happened to your shoes? You had like Steelies on. Steelies are cool. Now your running around with stupid boots with like 5-inch heels? Thats not appropriate footware for Planeswalking! That's not appropriate footware for normal walking! At least Liliana is doing it for the whole 'evil is sexy' thing and can summon undead to carry her when she breaks her ankle. What are you going to do ride a Phoenix? Its made of fire! You'll fall right through! Man I should have gone Planeswalking with Liliana - yeah she'd crack my head open with a rock 5 minutes in and raise my corpse to serve her but at least we could have gone dancing!

Now with more original content and open bar!

https://www.youtube.com/user/thedevilwuster

I think what I'm supposed to type here is "cool story bro".

Did I do that right?
Dude, it's a $10 game. I think for my money this series has been the best investment out of any game I have ever purchased. It has it's shortcomings, but very year the core game is a little different. There's plenty of new cards, and the competition is hot. If you can't stand the heat then you best leave.
Dude, it's a $10 game.



This is a recurring argument that doesn't really make any sense. The OP is not asking for top-notch production value; he is only pointing out that some decks are significantly overpowered. I don't see why the condition of this issue should be price-dependent.





We only know less than half of this year decks. Maybe they release some decks that will destroy MMz and DW but are terrible against the decks you like. Even the promos can shake the metagame a lot (they will make possible to build MMz as a control deck. If it will be reliable remains to be seen).

This is a weak reason to leave the game, but you know better than anyone how you feel about the game.

"So long, and thanks for the fishes"

WotC doesn't care about flavor. Their forum is the only place where an ORC can kill a troll...

Lost around 120 posts in the forum migration

Post #1000 on Feb 02, 2013

Post #2000 on Sep 04, 2013

This is hands down the best game in the series. Every deck is fully outfitted with everything it needs to be playable. You're a noob if you don't think so (and by your love of fat, that's probably the case, anyway.)


I mean, even mono green has a full suite of removal and utility cards, and it no longer dies immediately if you play a card that says "flying" on it. Things are way better than they once were. A lot of the cards in the game are even playable in Legacy.


Strong cards, good removal, returning favorites, improved versions of old decks, variety, MANA-BASE TUNING, being able to build your own deck(however limited)... What's not to like?

I've yet to play much in the way of Multiplayer outside sealed. Is the meta already so defined? I imagine there's still a lot of work to be done in finding optimal builds for each deck before we can start calling "OP!".
Dude, it's a $10 game.



This is a recurring argument that doesn't really make any sense. The OP is not asking for top-notch production value; he is only pointing out that some decks are significantly overpowered. I don't see why the condition of this issue should be price-dependent.



Exactly this, i wonder why people think worth = price.

We only know less than half of this year decks. Maybe they release some decks that will destroy MMz and DW but are terrible against the decks you like. Even the promos can shake the metagame a lot (they will make possible to build MMz as a control deck. If it will be reliable remains to be seen).

This is a weak reason to leave the game, but you know better than anyone how you feel about the game.

"So long, and thanks for the fishes"



Maybe, but idon't like the idea of counterdecking, it' bad gameplay. And Tribal-Aggro never get hard-countered in the DotP series.

This is hands down the best game in the series. Every deck is fully outfitted with everything it needs to be playable. You're a noob if you don't think so (and by your love of fat, that's probably the case, anyway.)


I mean, even mono green has a full suite of removal and utility cards, and it no longer dies immediately if you play a card that says "flying" on it. Things are way better than they once were. A lot of the cards in the game are even playable in Legacy.


Strong cards, good removal, returning favorites, improved versions of old decks, variety, MANA-BASE TUNING, being able to build your own deck(however limited)... What's not to like?




You look like an aggro-player, no wonder why you think it's the best DotP game. And i am a noob, i never played Magic in reallive, but i know what people plays and so i never want to play Magic anyway. It's all about aggro, it's so boring, but i love the mechanic so DotP was perfect. But with this tribal/aggro edition i don't want DotP anymore. Why should i play game what make no fun for me ?

I've yet to play much in the way of Multiplayer outside sealed. Is the meta already so defined? I imagine there's still a lot of work to be done in finding optimal builds for each deck before we can start calling "OP!".



I don't know much about the meta, but after i played Chant vs Zombies and Illusions and get roflstomped by them i know this game make no fun for me. I saw this comming but it's really aweful. 2x All is Dust isn't enough. If i wouldn't care about Chant this wouldn't be no problem, but i wanted this deck so bad, it hurt so much that i can't play like i hoped for. I endured alot of aggro in the past , yet it's all about and i can't see it anymore, sorry.



Fair enough...if you don't enjoy it, it'd be foolish to continue playing. However, I'd recommend you at least check in from time to time and check out the meta. I remember how "OP" Ancient Depths was in 2012 for like a week. Then it quickly "fell" to merely being a pretty good deck. Also, I'd think more about changing your deck build before actually giving up.

Just because a deck build is good in a vacuum doesn't mean it will be good in a given meta. Try mixing it up, keeping Zombies and Illusions in mind. Eventually, people will build to stop those decks, and people will stop using them and move onto whatever beat them, and so on. 

tl;dr
If you're not having fun, sorry, and I wouldn't play a game I don't enjoy either. But bear in mind that the game has only been out for like 2 or 3 days. 


We only know less than half of this year decks. Maybe they release some decks that will destroy MMz and DW but are terrible against the decks you like. Even the promos can shake the metagame a lot (they will make possible to build MMz as a control deck. If it will be reliable remains to be seen).

This is a weak reason to leave the game, but you know better than anyone how you feel about the game.

"So long, and thanks for the fishes"



Maybe, but i don't like the idea of counterdecking, it' bad gameplay. And Tribal-Aggro never get hard-countered in the DotP series.






It's how the game works (not only DotP, but Magic), like you or not. But, as you said, you shouldn't play the game if you don't like anymore. I hope you find enjoyment in whatever you're going to play from now oon.

WotC doesn't care about flavor. Their forum is the only place where an ORC can kill a troll...

Lost around 120 posts in the forum migration

Post #1000 on Feb 02, 2013

Post #2000 on Sep 04, 2013

You look like an aggro-player, no wonder why you think it's the best DotP game. And i am a noob, i never played Magic in reallive, but i know what people plays and so i never want to play Magic anyway. It's all about aggro, it's so boring, but i love the mechanic so DotP was perfect. But with this tribal/aggro edition i don't want DotP anymore. Why should i play game what make no fun for me ?

I wouldn't say I'm an aggro player. I like playing aggressively, sure, but I always play decks that disrupt opponents a lot as well and can interact in a lot of ways in response to the opponent. Basically, I'm a "good deck" player. What are you, a "accellerate mana for 6 turns and try to play something fat before I die" player? Do you want to show off who can play the craziest sequence of cards or do you want to actually play a game?

Anyway, what's stopping you from playing the decks you like? I guarantee even the fatty ramp decks are better than what we've had before, like Ancient Depths with the crazy ramp and creatures but absolutely no way to defend any of it or interact with the opponent other than slamming creatures together.

This game is WAY more balanced than 2013 was on release. The promos are not even in these decks yet and people are acting like they know the game. It's funny, running across noobs in 2HG games who think the game is imbalanced and THEN they go on to say how balanced 2013 was (aka I use Crosswinds every other game) and how that game was perfect. LULZ. You people are hilarious. 2HG in 2013 was a joke and all in all counting all the decks so was 1v1 in many ways though MUCH better than 2HG.

I think I played enough to get to rank 4 in 2HG. I feel this game gets more fun the more you play it. I will get into 1v1 now and try some of that although I don't really care for the mode.

Expansions will AGAIN change the entire balance of this game. Ranting on this stuff now is ridiculous. There is nothing as bad as Jace/Lili, Burn, Or CW and whatever else in this game.

MMz is going to be quite powerful after promos but I still think it has some major contenders. Also burn rocks in 2HG.




'bout time to lose the Crosswinds hate.


Bruh!

It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. - Mark Twain

Mastergear_Owen's take on Magic 2014 Campaign.

Show
You know what I've got more issues. Whats up with the story in this game? The adverts said I was going to team up with Chandra and we were going to kick butt and chew bubblegum across the planes on a revenge campaign against some... guy she knew I guess? Who's Ramaz anyway? What do I get instead? I beat Chandra like 2 minutes in with a mono-green stompy thing Garruk gave me (why does he keep giving all these new planeswalkers his deck) and then I spent like 5 hours jumping from plane to plane picking up random nicknacks for her mantlepiece while she sits back back doing her nails or something. I was thrown in jail! I got hit by a Roil Storm twice! Do you know how many rats are on Ravnica, Chandra? All of them! All of the rats! All of the rats eating me!

Then we go kick her Ex's bearded-screaming-butt and what does she do to help? Nothing! She throws of the occasional fire ball and spends her time trying not to freeze to death. You should have worn pants Chandra. While we're on the subject what happened to your shoes? You had like Steelies on. Steelies are cool. Now your running around with stupid boots with like 5-inch heels? Thats not appropriate footware for Planeswalking! That's not appropriate footware for normal walking! At least Liliana is doing it for the whole 'evil is sexy' thing and can summon undead to carry her when she breaks her ankle. What are you going to do ride a Phoenix? Its made of fire! You'll fall right through! Man I should have gone Planeswalking with Liliana - yeah she'd crack my head open with a rock 5 minutes in and raise my corpse to serve her but at least we could have gone dancing!

Now with more original content and open bar!

https://www.youtube.com/user/thedevilwuster

Fair enough...if you don't enjoy it, it'd be foolish to continue playing. However, I'd recommend you at least check in from time to time and check out the meta. I remember how "OP" Ancient Depths was in 2012 for like a week. Then it quickly "fell" to merely being a pretty good deck. Also, I'd think more about changing your deck build before actually giving up.

Just because a deck build is good in a vacuum doesn't mean it will be good in a given meta. Try mixing it up, keeping Zombies and Illusions in mind. Eventually, people will build to stop those decks, and people will stop using them and move onto whatever beat them, and so on. 

tl;dr
If you're not having fun, sorry, and I wouldn't play a game I don't enjoy either. But bear in mind that the game has only been out for like 2 or 3 days. 



Yes sure. But your "AD" example happend before release. After we saw the decklist Chant, people say this deck is overpowered. But after we get slivers, Illusions and Zombies, people can't image how Chant could be good. Because people know what happend with AD we can image what happen with Chant here and it looks like it is true. Chant have no defense against fliers and only 2 removals. This can't work against decks, what can start with 2 damage creatures on turn 1.

Anyway, i will look sometimes for DotP, but i don't care that much anymore.


It's how the game works (not only DotP, but Magic), like you or not. But, as you said, you shouldn't play the game if you don't like anymore. I hope you find enjoyment in whatever you're going to play from now oon.



I know, counterdecking was allways there, but counterdecking don't help to make my favorite decks better, only to beat some other decks with decks i don't really care... this make no fun. If i see some Magic tournament decks, they are all about a tacgic and a countertactic... and look almost the same, very onesided and boring. Anyway, thanks, i think i found my new cardgames.


I wouldn't say I'm an aggro player. I like playing aggressively, sure, but I always play decks that disrupt opponents a lot as well and can interact in a lot of ways in response to the opponent. Basically, I'm a "good deck" player. What are you, a "accellerate mana for 6 turns and try to play something fat before I die" player? Do you want to show off who can play the craziest sequence of cards or do you want to actually play a game?

Anyway, what's stopping you from playing the decks you like? I guarantee even the fatty ramp decks are better than what we've had before, like Ancient Depths with the crazy ramp and creatures but absolutely no way to defend any of it or interact with the opponent other than slamming creatures together.



Lol, this "accellerate mana for 6 turns and try to play something fat before I die" is a reason why i love fatty decks, It's the thrill to survive long enough to see something amazing. As a gamer i'm on the visual side, i will see something amazing. In magic, many fattycard have amazing abilities and are not streamlined (and boring) like aggro and tribal where every round is the almost the same. I love to see a 9 mana Rites of Replication or how Eldrazis annahilate all permanten cards from my opponent. And the way to go to get to this is very thrilling. It's like a raid in an dungeon and you hoped to get something amazing from the chast. In Magic, i want an spectalcular overheming lategame win.


Aggro decks stopped me to play decks like Chant. People play aggrodecks, because it's so easy to win and they don't need much to do or hope for. Sadly the developers gave this people this year more aggro decks than last year, and i know from 2009 and 2012 that people abuse such decks.




This game is WAY more balanced than 2013 was on release. The promos are not even in these decks yet and people are acting like they know the game. It's funny, running across noobs in 2HG games who think the game is imbalanced and THEN they go on to say how balanced 2013 was (aka I use Crosswinds every other game) and how that game was perfect. LULZ. You people are hilarious. 2HG in 2013 was a joke and all in all counting all the decks so was 1v1 in many ways though MUCH better than 2HG.

I think I played enough to get to rank 4 in 2HG. I feel this game gets more fun the more you play it. I will get into 1v1 now and try some of that although I don't really care for the mode.

Expansions will AGAIN change the entire balance of this game. Ranting on this stuff now is ridiculous. There is nothing as bad as Jace/Lili, Burn, Or CW and whatever else in this game.

MMz is going to be quite powerful after promos but I still think it has some major contenders. Also burn rocks in 2HG.



I never talk about 2HG, because i don't play it. I know that 2013 had a bad 2HG balancing, foremost in the first time with the lifelink deck. If you love Chant (and only than) and try in 1 vs 1 against Illusions and Zombies against players who trimmed their deck, you will understand. Of you don#t care about rampdecks and fatties than you can't understand.

Lol, this "accellerate mana for 6 turns and try to play something fat before I die" is a reason why i love fatty decks, It's the thrill to survive long enough to see something amazing. As a gamer i'm on the visual side, i will see something amazing. In magic, many fattycard have amazing abilities and are not streamlined (and boring) like aggro and tribal where every round is the almost the same. I love to see a 9 mana Rites of Replication or how Eldrazis annahilate all permanten cards from my opponent. And the way to go to get to this is very thrilling. It's like a raid in an dungeon and you hoped to get something amazing from the chast. In Magic, i want an spectalcular overheming lategame win.

Aggro decks stopped me to play decks like Chant. People play aggrodecks, because it's so easy to win and they don't need much to do or hope for. Sadly the developers gave this people this year more aggro decks than last year, and i know from 2009 and 2012 that people abuse such decks.


There's a contradiction here. You say you love the thrill of being able to survive to make something amazing happen. If that's the case, shouldn't you have some level of appreciation for aggro decks that actually make this something to behold?

I don't know what you mean by they don't have much to do or hope for. Isn't doing a lot of different things efficiently, consistently and flexibly the exact thing that makes them what they are? And what makes them good in the first place? They're certainly doing more than ramp up solitaire, and there's a lot of stuff to think about like whether to develop beats or leave mana open for counters or removal or whatever, what answers to use on what threats and what to save for what situation. Aggro-control is one of the most thought-intensive ways to play, playing one card at the wrong time can ruin what was once a guaranteed win. You literally don't know what you're talking about.

'bout time to lose the Crosswinds hate.


Bruh!


I picture Khron as this guy in dark robes who burns paper copies of Crosswinds on an altar every night, and every day writing poetry about how much he hates Crosswinds. I'm surprised he hasn't just made an I_Hate_Crosswinds account, just to hammer the point home. Guy can't talk ten minutes without making it about Crosswinds.

Wizards: If it isn't game design, we can't do it right. Frankly, we're kind of shaky on the game design sometimes too.

There's a contradiction here. You say you love the thrill of being able to survive to make something amazing happen. If that's the case, shouldn't you have some level of appreciation for aggro decks that actually make this something to behold?

I don't know what you mean by they don't have much to do or hope for. Isn't doing a lot of different things efficiently, consistently and flexibly the exact thing that makes them what they are? And what makes them good in the first place? They're certainly doing more than ramp up solitaire, and there's a lot of stuff to think about like whether to develop beats or leave mana open for counters or removal or whatever, what answers to use on what threats and what to save for what situation. Aggro-control is one of the most thought-intensive ways to play, playing one card at the wrong time can ruin what was once a guaranteed win. You literally don't know what you're talking about.



I don't see what is amazing to play 2 Gravecaller in row and on turn 4 an Undead Warchief and win the game ? Aggro decks try to get control the first turns, so there is no thrill that someting amazing happen, because this amazing is on turn "1-4". It's try and error, put many card on the field as fast a s possible and hope that you win with your creature spam before the opponent can do something. Fatty decks try to to control things, and crontroling is much more fun than according to plan. It's risky, should i play Explore with 4 mana and hope to draw a 5th mana to play with the 3 mana a Farhaven Elf. Should i play with 4 mana Oracle of Mul Daya instead of other ramp to get maybe faster ramp ? Should i play Grazing Gladehart to get life next round or should i ramp instead ? Should i wait and get some damage for a good moment to play All is Dust. And so on. But after all this risky stuff, if i get the fatties on the board and control your opponent, than i'm happy, it's amazing. Sadly this don't happen often here.


An aggro deck can only this: Play Phantasmal Bear, play Gossamer Phantasm, play Illusonary Servant, hold back Cancel and attack as long as you win. I can't stand this, so brainless and boring but incredible effective.

'bout time to lose the Crosswinds hate.


Bruh!


I picture Khron as this guy in dark robes who burns paper copies of Crosswinds on an altar every night, and every day writing poetry about how much he hates Crosswinds. I'm surprised he hasn't just made an I_Hate_Crosswinds account, just to hammer the point home. Guy can't talk ten minutes without making it about Crosswinds.

Hehe. True but I have my reasons. And I am not happy about the inclusion of that friggin' warp to MMz. It gonna bring some pain but we'll see.

And of course Atheism proves yet again that he watches me outside my window at night.



Hey!
You get Final Fortune this year!!!

Edit: oops. Have I not paid attention to MM getting a Warp?
        Doesn't need it.

It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. - Mark Twain

Mastergear_Owen's take on Magic 2014 Campaign.

Show
You know what I've got more issues. Whats up with the story in this game? The adverts said I was going to team up with Chandra and we were going to kick butt and chew bubblegum across the planes on a revenge campaign against some... guy she knew I guess? Who's Ramaz anyway? What do I get instead? I beat Chandra like 2 minutes in with a mono-green stompy thing Garruk gave me (why does he keep giving all these new planeswalkers his deck) and then I spent like 5 hours jumping from plane to plane picking up random nicknacks for her mantlepiece while she sits back back doing her nails or something. I was thrown in jail! I got hit by a Roil Storm twice! Do you know how many rats are on Ravnica, Chandra? All of them! All of the rats! All of the rats eating me!

Then we go kick her Ex's bearded-screaming-butt and what does she do to help? Nothing! She throws of the occasional fire ball and spends her time trying not to freeze to death. You should have worn pants Chandra. While we're on the subject what happened to your shoes? You had like Steelies on. Steelies are cool. Now your running around with stupid boots with like 5-inch heels? Thats not appropriate footware for Planeswalking! That's not appropriate footware for normal walking! At least Liliana is doing it for the whole 'evil is sexy' thing and can summon undead to carry her when she breaks her ankle. What are you going to do ride a Phoenix? Its made of fire! You'll fall right through! Man I should have gone Planeswalking with Liliana - yeah she'd crack my head open with a rock 5 minutes in and raise my corpse to serve her but at least we could have gone dancing!

Now with more original content and open bar!

https://www.youtube.com/user/thedevilwuster

'bout time to lose the Crosswinds hate.


Bruh!


I picture Khron as this guy in dark robes who burns paper copies of Crosswinds on an altar every night, and every day writing poetry about how much he hates Crosswinds. I'm surprised he hasn't just made an I_Hate_Crosswinds account, just to hammer the point home. Guy can't talk ten minutes without making it about Crosswinds.

Hehe. True but I have my reasons. And I am not happy about the inclusion of that friggin' warp to MMz. It gonna bring some pain but we'll see.

And of course Atheism proves yet again that he watches me outside my window at night.



Are you talking about Temporal Mastery? I have good news for you: it's terrible.

WotC doesn't care about flavor. Their forum is the only place where an ORC can kill a troll...

Lost around 120 posts in the forum migration

Post #1000 on Feb 02, 2013

Post #2000 on Sep 04, 2013

In some ways I think Final Fortune is better for Firewave than Time Warp would be for MM. That card is off the chain with Kiln Fiend and a little burn. You can't tap out or commit to anything or be aggressive with them if they have a non zero number of Fiends out, if you do you lose.


Not that Time Warp isn't amazing and a better card overall.

Hey now, you make it seem like you can only play Zombies or Illusions to win. There's always Humans! That's three whole flavors of ice cream. But I swear if I wasn't so bad I could make some sort of Firewave list that would match up well against those 3, but yet get stomped by all the green decks.

As for 2013 launch, 2HG should be a little better, though I'll know more once my friend and I can hash it over over the weekend. Last year was horrible with it's Life gain/Crosswinds combo, and it wasn't a ton better even after the lameness of Serra was patched out. You were pretty much pigoned whole into Crosswinds to fight their sheningens by either countering their's, or doing yours first. Other option was just play Goblins/Chandra and speed boat them, which was just as bad, as losing by turn 4/5 constantly isn't much better than getting locked out of the game on turn 5/6 consistantly.

For singe player, before promo's, Chandra, Lily, Goblins, PK, and Crosswinds were all contenders, though GG and PK put a bad hurting on XW, which made up for it by putting a hurting on Lily. The other five lacked the oomph to be consistent, and while they could win with their amazing hands, on the whole, wouldn't post as near a good ratio over a 100 games. Except maybe Exalted, I never gave that deck enough respect at launch, and maybe it was really awesome if I just didn't turn my nose up at it.

This year, Zombies, Illusions, and Humans all look like top dogs. Playing mostly zombies, I lose more than I win against humans, and go about even with Illusions. The other 7 decks it's fairly lopsided win margins, with most losses coming from mana issues. (Or trying something silly like turn 2 Titan against slivers to get slammed with an Exile.) I'd say it'd be nice to have some really strong control deck to curb these in the expack, but I don't think any of the other decks would really fare any better. Maybe if it was some B/R thing focused on efficently fragging and sweeping x/3 and less things, but had a rough time with giant monsters?
This game is the best in the series. It goes back to building up to a big attack and you have to play smart. Not just drop bomb after bomb. Shame about the lack of any major card draw.

masks of dimir is a brilliant deck. If it had one sweeper like damnation, it would be the best deck in the game so far.
I agree with redrevolution.  This game is a disappointment to me and if i had something else to play i wuldnt play it.  To me 2013 was the best in the series.  In this game 5/10 decks r all tribal aggro lacking diversity and making u build the deck where it'll perform quickest just to compete in 1v1. Also, once you've played one aggro deck in this game then u've played all.  For the other 5 decks


  • chant,  dragons and aura r good but aura to me is boring escpecially a 3rd year in a row.

  • Chandras deck is weaker than last year,  i wish it had more burn control.



  • Garruks is a downgrade to me.  they brought it back to the simple overrun win which makes the deck lack strategy.

  • oh and dimirs unplayable. it only has a chance againts the slower deck because it can make them even slower


MM is completly op,  i play it and my build has only 18 land and all 3 or less drops and as long as my first hand has 2 lands i basically win.  The only decks ive lost to are Humans, and zombies.  Thoughts all ive come agianst besides one chandra and a couple chants  but those hav no chance from the start.

There are people that are talking about you have to play smart.

I lol'd.

This game is degenerate aggro, period. That isn't to say that there are no other decks of course, it's just to say that outside of some sharp bad luck/good luck in all the right places, the guy not playing aggro is living in the guy playing aggros world.

I still like the game, but all I can suggest to people is to avoid the online or play sealed if you really want the kick of playing other people.

It's a real shame, but the online in this game is already ruined. The online button is essentially "Super Jace Mode" where you too can run into try hard illusions 7 games out of 10.

That number isn't something I've just pulled out of the A btw. That's data.

I would hope for a control deck or something in the expansions, but it'll probably be something like Mana Mastery again, and I think we can all agree that was almost as bad an idea as doing the three drop top-out aggro thing again, only this time making them fliers with hexproof and versatile answers for just about everything.
I want to be Cultured.
I've yet to play much in the way of Multiplayer outside sealed. Is the meta already so defined? I imagine there's still a lot of work to be done in finding optimal builds for each deck before we can start calling "OP!".



Respectfully, you'd imagine completely wrong.

S-rank Illusions
A-rank Humans
B-rank Zombies

Everything else.

It really is mono blues game to drop most of the time. Stick with sealed mate.
I want to be Cultured.
We have less than half the decks and those that we do have are incomplete.

Yup, it's quittin' time.

Jerk-ness aside, I'd suggest you check back in September. The Expansion is likely to make a big difference to the game.
Re: Sepulchral Strength and Grinning Malice as well as the 2HG-mauling might of Mindstorms.
I'm not really sure what's going on here... but CoMD is a VERY solid fatty deck.  And when built right I think it can compete pretty well with most anything. I think the problem might actually be the builds you are using.  Sure MM is quite strong, but every deck this year (at least of the ones I've unlocked so far), when built well, can be very powerful.  I'm not so convinced that its that one sided.  I just think a lot of good/great players prefer blue, so of course the better versions of blue decks come out first.  I think even the new UB deck has major potential, and everyone was talking it down before release.  Yet, when you play on revenge mode, the UB deck is nuts, IMO harder to beat than MM.  So I'd give it some time.  Right now, people haven't figured all of the decks out yet, and of course aggro is always easier to assemble.

P.s.: have you figured out the main combo in CoMD yet?  I've frequently dropped the 12 CMC creature as early as turn 4/5.  Not sure what any deck would do to stop me other than counterspells. Obviously, it can be destroyed (of course I can always bring it right back, at least 2 times), but still, that's a serious fatty deck, if there ever was one.
We have less than half the decks and those that we do have are incomplete.

Yup, it's quittin' time.

Jerk-ness aside, I'd suggest you check back in September. The Expansion is likely to make a big difference to the game.
Re: Sepulchral Strength and Grinning Malice as well as the 2HG-mauling might of Mindstorms.



"Check back in three months" is not something we should be needing to tell people 2-4 days in. That's very close to a Blizzardism.

Wizards: If it isn't game design, we can't do it right. Frankly, we're kind of shaky on the game design sometimes too.

We have less than half the decks and those that we do have are incomplete.

Yup, it's quittin' time.

Jerk-ness aside, I'd suggest you check back in September. The Expansion is likely to make a big difference to the game.
Re: Sepulchral Strength and Grinning Malice as well as the 2HG-mauling might of Mindstorms.



Heard it here first folks.

An apparently quite serious MtG fan(I want to say You-Tuber? Might be getting my wires crossed there...), making a point to highlight how serious he is in his advice, recommends taking a 3 month break from the online 2 days in, THATS how retarded this meta is out the box.

Think it's busted now? Anybody want to take a stab at what two decks are going to get the best toys once the promos roll out, and the ones we have ARE complete?

I think I'll be taking that advice sir.


Snip.

"Chant is solid"



I think my definition of solid differs from yours. In another thread I reveal that I do actually know Chant the best of the whole line up(with Zombies coming second) and it was my Unlock for having 2013.

And "Solid" it ain't at least not to me. To my mind, solid implies consistency. And you're absolutely right, given the right grip Chant can do mental things. But that's just the problem, you're either going hard around turns 5-7, or you're hoping to christ their start is as stuttered as yours so you can draw one of your outs. Not to mention hoping they can't just outright answer it instantly.

But yeah, play the game more mate. Good luck bringing back an exiled Eldrazi, or watching them drop an Image on your monster and then bouncing or tapping out the original, or just blowing it straight up for days, never even mind that you'll be lucky to be above 10 health by the time you get there.

Its doable and I've done it, but you need some serious stars to align, and even then you can't answer their stuff, but they have a suite to answer yours.
I want to be Cultured.
The stars don't meet to align that much, but hey whatever.  After promos:
3 primeval titans
2 summoning traps
2 elvish pipers
2 fierce empaths
2 Green's sun zeniths
Eye of Ugin
and even tooth and nail (in case the rest wasn't enough) all of that matched with enough ramp and life gain to make it all go or keep you alive a long time.

I'm not sure how you could fail to make a consistent deck out of it.  *shrug*
The deck with no removal and very few cards that actually interact with the opponent(and no way to protect said options) doesn't need much to go in its favour on both sides of the table in order to win?

One of us hasn't unlocked all the decks yet. Also you're using cards you can't use yet to make a point. Poor form. Respectfully sir: Give it another few days, catch up to the rest of us in terms of time spent, and maybe you'll answer for yourself the question of "Why am I one of very few people/the only person that doesn't think the Eldrazi pile eats spit for one reason or another?"

One thing I will concede is that the stock on Summoning Trap goes up considerably when there are two of them, and when there is a deck in the format that has a high enough number of counters to make the trap part actually work reliably-ish.
I want to be Cultured.
We have less than half the decks and those that we do have are incomplete.

Yup, it's quittin' time.

Jerk-ness aside, I'd suggest you check back in September. The Expansion is likely to make a big difference to the game.
Re: Sepulchral Strength and Grinning Malice as well as the 2HG-mauling might of Mindstorms.



Yeah, the decks aren't complete. I'm sure after we get all the promo unlocks, illusions will be weaker with another Counterspell, Force of Will, Snapcaster Mage, Cryptic Command, and Mind Control. (Wow, Mind Control looks weak on that list. Mind Control, weak... uhh)

Duels of the Planeswalkers deck builds and analysis: http://megamaster125.angelfire.com/dotp

 

Another one of my websites: http://megamaster125.angelfire.com/rationalchristianity/

 

I am Blue/White

"Check back in three months" is not something we should be needing to tell people 2-4 days in. That's very close to a Blizzardism.



Heard it here first folks.

An apparently quite serious MtG fan(I want to say You-Tuber? Might be getting my wires crossed there...), making a point to highlight how serious he is in his advice, recommends taking a 3 month break from the online 2 days in, THATS how retarded this meta is out the box.



Uh... what are you two talking about?
I don't give a flying **** if anyone quits playing.


I have nothing against RedRevolution, that's why I
A: didn't waste his or my time trying to convince him to not quit, because I can respect his decision,
and B: Didn't just say, "Cool, you don't like the game, **** off."

The clear-as-day point is, come September the metagame will likely be very different than it is now.
Since he's quitting now, I suggested he come back in 3 months and see if anything's changed more to his liking.


Also, you-tuber? Define please.
And genuinely curious: What motivated you to tag me as "a quite serious MtG fan"?


Chill out man it's a game.

That said, no removal? Terastodon? All is dust? You'll eventually have six if you want them, you have 4 now.
If you hit MM with All is Dust right before they kill you, it's going to be GG, and Terastodon can take 3 down at a time if they aren't hexproof yet (pretty sure no tokens then).
 
In any case, it's a fun, interesting deck to play and build.  What more do you want out of a game?

p.s.: let's just stop this here... Sorry you're disappointed.  I'm pretty sure the red deck is the counter to MM (no I haven't built it yet).  It just needs to be played defensively.
Avdemiesen

seems as youre such a magic legend then youll know how stop the aggro decks in one move right? To say this is an aggr game is crazy. We have 10 decks, not all decks are aggro but the ones that are get wiped by mutilate pretty easy. Seems as a lot of decks have 0 card draw, all you need to do is play smart...ohh but wait, you cant play smart you say?

So just slap all your creatures down and press x for awesome right? Totally ignoring removal heavy decks.

Ive played this game solid online on 360 and there isnt a goblins or mill deck ruining everything. Each deck has a counter, learn it and us it instead of talking down to people on here like you're a god of magic.

to me it sounds like you got your arse kicked by optimum builds while you were using a poorly constructed deck and not playing smart
Avdemiesen seems as youre such a magic legend then youll know how stop the aggro decks in one move right? To say this is an aggr game is crazy. We have 10 decks, not all decks are aggro but the ones that are get wiped by mutilate pretty easy. Seems as a lot of decks have 0 card draw, all you need to do is play smart...ohh but wait, you cant play smart you say? So just slap all your creatures down and press x for awesome right? Totally ignoring removal heavy decks. Ive played this game solid online on 360 and there isnt a goblins or mill deck ruining everything. Each deck has a counter, learn it and us it instead of talking down to people on here like you're a god of magic. to me it sounds like you got your arse kicked by optimum builds while you were using a poorly constructed deck and not playing smart



I haven't been online yet, so I'm interested in what you think the counters are to the game's aggro decks.  The one example you listed is a card that happens to be in one of the game's aggro decks, making it one of the top 3 decks in the game.  So it's not very persuasive to me.  Since you've been online, what would you play against illusions, zombies or humans (aside from illusions, zombies or humans?)  All 3 of those decks have card draw (more than most decks), removal (more than most), and seem to have good cards that hedge against overextension.  

As far as 'not aggro this year' - Hunter's Strength, Slivers and the enchantment deck seem fairly aggro to me in the few games I've played with them as well, but maybe my assessment of them is incorrect.  At least to me it looks like 6/10 decks are aggro, with 3 being incredibly dominant.  

I haven't unlocked very much of any deck so I'm not qualified to make any assessment of the game's balance yet.   My initial impression though is the top 3 decks are somewhat balanced against each other, but wreck everything else - basically there appear to be 3 different versions of goblins.  Is this incorrect?  And if so, please explain more than 'removal, mutilate' which wasn't very informative.

Also, how did mill make your list of decks that ruined everything?  It wasn't anywhere near the top half of decks.  Are you just talking about 2HG here?  It might explain a lot I guess.


Uh... what are you two talking about?
I don't give a flying **** if anyone quits playing.


I have nothing against RedRevolution, that's why I
A: didn't waste his or my time trying to convince him to not quit, because I can respect his decision,
and B: Didn't just say, "Cool, you don't like the game, **** off."

The clear-as-day point is, come September the metagame will likely be very different than it is now.
Since he's quitting now, I suggested he come back in 3 months and see if anything's changed more to his liking.


Also, you-tuber? Define please.
And genuinely curious: What motivated you to tag me as "a quite serious MtG fan"?




Firstly, the stuff for me-
You-Tuber: One who makes videos and uploads them to youtube.

For some reason I thought that was you, I know at least one of the regulard around here keeps a proper channel, thought that was you for some reason. Clearly not. My bad.

As for the tag, the straight up answer to that would be the 7000+ posts on this site over the course of 7 years. That, to me, says dedicated fan.

The general teeth gnashing bulk of your post - You miss the point. Day 2. People from the beginner, to the intermediate, to the long-time fan are agreeing(more or less) that this meta is wildly imbalanced. Some like that, others don't. Some are quiting, others will eat it up anyway. The point is, for more than a few of us, that's a very bad thing.
I want to be Cultured.
Turbo mill ruined 2hg because it was interactive with opponents and your own team mates.

I wouldnt consider slivers aggro. The deck is slow, unless you nail a very lucky draw. Most are susceptible to single removal. Masks of dimir can out control illusions, steal lords and kill creatures. Same with chandra.

as for the other decks, you have 5 mono coloured bog standard decks. White life gain/aura, red burn green big creature etc etc. So its unfair to say it is all aggro.

compare this game to 2012, that was very aggro to start with but the deck packs changed everything. This is the same thread we have every dotp release or dlc/deckpack leak.

these decks are designed to be easy to play for new players, in a few month when the harder decks come, aggro will be forgotten outside of 1 vs 1. If you dont like aggro dont play 1 vs 1 anyway.

Firstly, the stuff for me-
You-Tuber: One who makes videos and uploads them to youtube.
For some reason I thought that was you, I know at least one of the regulard around here keeps a proper channel, thought that was you for some reason. Clearly not. My bad.


That's what I thought, but wanted to make sure.
As for the tag, the straight up answer to that would be the 7000+ posts on this site over the course of 7 years. That, to me, says dedicated fan.


3000+ posts of that are from the Star Wars Saga Edition RPG.
The other 3000+ are from Duels.
None of it is "Magic the Gathering".
I'm very knowledgeable of Magic, but beyond Duels I haven't played in over a decade. 

I'm considering asking you to further define "dedicated fan". That can me a whole lot of different things....

The general teeth gnashing bulk of your post - You miss the point. Day 2. People from the beginner, to the intermediate, to the long-time fan are agreeing(more or less) that this meta is wildly imbalanced. Some like that, others don't. Some are quiting, others will eat it up anyway. The point is, for more than a few of us, that's a very bad thing.


More than a few is what? 4?
4 is a few last I checked...
4 confirmed out of several hundred thousand is infinitesimal.

So far one has confirmed to have quit because of it. Negligible does not begin to describe the scope of how insignificant that figure is in the grand scheme.

So yeah, tons of hyperbole going on here.

Avdemiesen seems as youre such a magic legend then youll know how stop the aggro decks in one move right? To say this is an aggr game is crazy. We have 10 decks, not all decks are aggro but the ones that are get wiped by mutilate pretty easy. Seems as a lot of decks have 0 card draw, all you need to do is play smart...ohh but wait, you cant play smart you say? So just slap all your creatures down and press x for awesome right? Totally ignoring removal heavy decks. Ive played this game solid online on 360 and there isnt a goblins or mill deck ruining everything. Each deck has a counter, learn it and us it instead of talking down to people on here like you're a god of magic. to me it sounds like you got your arse kicked by optimum builds while you were using a poorly constructed deck and not playing smart



I have to say, you actually did get a chuckle from me at the start, you say that the game isn't dominated by aggro(fair enough statement. But...)and the back that up you reference mutilate. A card that is included in the zombies deck. Which is aggro.

And I've never said I was some Magic legend, don't get mad at me just because I don't cow myself before the mighty post counts of the regulars like most forum kiddies. Someone wants to turn around and A)admit they have a very limited play time and then B)tell me that me and everyone else that's calling BS on Illusions are wrong and this guy is right and that Chant totally got a favourable matchup against aggro decks.

Calling stuff like that out doesn't make me condescending(I didn't insult the guy, unlike his implications of my skill and your outright calling me out on it).

But when I said this game is an aggro game, perhaps I should have elucidated. What I mean when I say that is that it's *dominated* by aggro, in a bit of a manner. The unquestioned kings of the pile in this game are all not only aggro, but tribal aggro that resembles one another quite a bit. Good luck arguing that and not looking like you're just disagreeing with me for the sake of it.
I want to be Cultured.
Well I said 6/10 aggro, not all aggro.  As for Slivers, I don't know - I've only played with it 3 or 4 times so far, but it seemed pretty aggro to me.  Maybe I just got lucky with my starting hands.  I'll have a more definite opinion once I fully unlock it.

I agree that Masks and Flamewave have cards in them to help against illusions; it just seems to me that illusions has far more consistency than either of those decks.  Time will tell I guess.  

The claim that 'this is the same thread we have every dotp release' I think is incorrect; 2013 appeared far more balanced out of the gate and there was almost universal praise for it, despite goblins.  It was widely considered to be a vast improvement over the lack of balance from 2012.  2014 seems to be a return to the poor balance of 2012.

'If you don't like aggro don't play 1 vs 1 anyway' is a pretty weak response that concedes the format is incredibly aggro.  Hence the complaints about 2014.  2013 was a strong step forward for 1v1; 2014 appears to be a giant step back.  

I don't know, maybe I'll have a different perspective after I've unlocked everything.  But 'don't play 1v1' doesn't exactly inspire confidence in the game's balance.

 
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