D&D Level 50 Character

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Hey everyone, I will be participating in a new 3.5 campaign soon and I need some ideas for a character.
The level of the campaign is 50, and I've never actually played this high of a level, so I'm hoping I can get some ideas rolling.
One of my friends is playing a Goliath Monk Soul Eater, and my brother is going to be a Tiefling Rogue Assassin.
I'm thinking something along the line of a complete tank, but I really just can't decide. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks!
This is the 4e section of the boards.  You will want to scroll down to the Previous Editions section to get your advice.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
Bummer ,I was hoping they was gonna up the level limit. Isnt it about time we got an Immortal Tier?
I survived Section 4 and all I got was this lousy sig Off-topic and going downhill from there
Bummer ,I was hoping they was gonna up the level limit. Isnt it about time we got an Immortal Tier?

4e has rules extending to level 30, where 3.5 doesn't absolutely STOP at a specific level, but really only has rules for stuff up to level 20 (I guess there's some sort of epic book for beyond that, I'm not really that up on 3.5 stuff). You COULD continue the 4e progression beyond 30, though you'd have to make up new things to add to PCs. In any case 4e's rules are pretty different from 3.x rules, so there's not a lot of similarity, especially at those levels.

TBH I'm not sure what sort of play 3.5 would offer a level 50 PC. I'm sure you could make up something along the lines of the old Immortals stuff from B/X, but characters of that level are pretty close to impossible to write an adventure for in the normal way. AD&D 1e was a bit less 'out there' at ultra high levels, but even so there just wasn't much point to progressing after level 20, you can already do everything there are published rules for.
That is not dead which may eternal lie
I'm hoping I can get some ideas rolling.

The Throne of Bloodstone "includes a substantial section on running games with 100th level characters. The guidance rests on three principles:

  • 100th-Level characters are not ten times more powerful than 10th-level characters

  • Apply all the rules strictly

  • Never give a 100th-level character an even break"

Bummer ,I was hoping they was gonna up the level limit. Isnt it about time we got an Immortal Tier?

4e has rules extending to level 30, where 3.5 doesn't absolutely STOP at a specific level, but really only has rules for stuff up to level 20 (I guess there's some sort of epic book for beyond that, I'm not really that up on 3.5 stuff). You COULD continue the 4e progression beyond 30, though you'd have to make up new things to add to PCs. In any case 4e's rules are pretty different from 3.x rules, so there's not a lot of similarity, especially at those levels.

TBH I'm not sure what sort of play 3.5 would offer a level 50 PC. I'm sure you could make up something along the lines of the old Immortals stuff from B/X, but characters of that level are pretty close to impossible to write an adventure for in the normal way. AD&D 1e was a bit less 'out there' at ultra high levels, but even so there just wasn't much point to progressing after level 20, you can already do everything there are published rules for.



I cant be the only one wishing for an Epic Level Handbook for 4e am I? I admit I loved ultra high level games where we were kickin gods and devil's **** and taking over their planes, been a long, long, time since I been in a game like that. Im not sure how you would pull that off in 4e, my best guess would be to take an encounter power and turn it into an At-Will, or add in Weekly powers!!
I survived Section 4 and all I got was this lousy sig Off-topic and going downhill from there
Bummer ,I was hoping they was gonna up the level limit. Isnt it about time we got an Immortal Tier?

4e has rules extending to level 30, where 3.5 doesn't absolutely STOP at a specific level, but really only has rules for stuff up to level 20 (I guess there's some sort of epic book for beyond that, I'm not really that up on 3.5 stuff). You COULD continue the 4e progression beyond 30, though you'd have to make up new things to add to PCs. In any case 4e's rules are pretty different from 3.x rules, so there's not a lot of similarity, especially at those levels.

TBH I'm not sure what sort of play 3.5 would offer a level 50 PC. I'm sure you could make up something along the lines of the old Immortals stuff from B/X, but characters of that level are pretty close to impossible to write an adventure for in the normal way. AD&D 1e was a bit less 'out there' at ultra high levels, but even so there just wasn't much point to progressing after level 20, you can already do everything there are published rules for.



I cant be the only one wishing for an Epic Level Handbook for 4e am I? I admit I loved ultra high level games where we were kickin gods and devil's **** and taking over their planes, been a long, long, time since I been in a game like that. Im not sure how you would pull that off in 4e, my best guess would be to take an encounter power and turn it into an At-Will, or add in Weekly powers!!

Well, 4e has epic levels 21-30 already built-in. WotC hasn't paid a lot of attention to them beyond publishing a pretty good number of Epic Destinies, a fair number of monsters, and a selection of items and artifacts. They did put out 3 Epic adventures (E1-3), but they were not that great from what I've heard.

The main thing with Epic is that you really need to change the basis of the game at each tier to some extent. 4e's Epic WORKS, but it doesn't automatically add in any really new elements. DMs are well-advised to create unique themes and a more open-ended style for epic play. Chris Perkin's Iomandra stuff is a good model for one way to do it.

Previous editions just pretty much lacked solid rules for 'epic'. In AD&D you could go to any arbitrary level, but the game really had nothing new to add past 20th (and really once you hit about level 15 or so the game sort of peters out, there's no threat left to face). 3e does have an epic level handbook, but it always seemed like to me that only a few select classes were really relevant to that level of play and said PCs are so unbounded in their capabilities it seems hard to frame an adventure for them. B/X has Immortals (and Birthright). That's a pretty good solution, though rather different than the one taken by 4e.

Seems like 4e could have a sort of Birthright style thing. The basic assumptions are a bit different, but I'm sure something could be worked out. Certainly in 5e elements of both approaches could be merged.
That is not dead which may eternal lie
Well the problem is that Epic level PCs/NPCs

A. become god-like
B. becoming increansingly complex

And its difficult to run a campaing where every PC needs a calculator (to calculate damage) and an extra page of notes just for magic items and attack/AC modifiers.

It's also very diffuclt to run a campaing where PCs can jump across rivers, lift homes and shape mountains. How does the DM set limits when you have +30 to a skill check?


In every edition of D&D, I find the game just breaks apart at high levels and becomes more maintenance then fun. Its hard to emulate the adventures of Drizzt and Artemis when it takes 20 minutes to resolve one round of combat with such powerfull PCs.
Yeah, B/X really has had the best answers to this of any edition of D&D. Immortals reimagines PCs with fewer and more 'godlike' powers, and reworks the focus towards more open-ended and narrative goals vs the simpler and more mechanical focus of 'mortal' levels. Birthright kind of takes that to its logical conclusion, creating a whole set of subsystems and setting that provide a context for the PCs to engage with. Its not perfect, and in some ways it diverges from classic D&D play style, but its interesting and workable for the most part.
That is not dead which may eternal lie
After level 20 in 3.5 **** just gets silly. I remember i had a hulking hurler build at level 25 or so that could lift so much I used scientific notation for his weight allowance and I could roll several thousand dice for damage (assuming I could find an object with sufficient mass).
In 3E and 3.5 the advancement after lv 20 was weird.
A fighter that got to 20 and then picked up 20 more levels of wizard was very different then a lv 20 wizard that gained 20 fighter levels.
The sea looks at the stabillity of the mountian and sighs. The mountian watches the freedom of the sea and cries.
After level 20 in 3.5 **** just gets silly. I remember i had a hulking hurler build at level 25 or so that could lift so much I used scientific notation for his weight allowance and I could roll several thousand dice for damage (assuming I could find an object with sufficient mass).

Did you take Weapon Focus (Texas)?
"Today's headlines and history's judgment are rarely the same. If you are too attentive to the former, you will most certainly not do the hard work of securing the latter." -Condoleezza Rice "My fellow Americans... I've just signed legislation that will outlaw Russia forever. Bombing begins in five minutes." - Ronald Reagan This user has been banned from you by the letters "O-R-C" and the numbers "2, 3, 4, and 6"
User Quotes
56788208 wrote:
I do, however, have one last lesson on this subject. That last one? The only build in this post that can one-shot average opponents[by dealing twice as much damage as they have HP? I would argue that it is not optimized. Why isn't it optimized? Because it's overkill. Overkill is NOT optimizing. This means that there are portions of this build dedicated to damage which can safely be removed and thrown elsewhere. For example, you probably don't need both Leap Attack AND Headlong Rush at the same time. You could pick up Extra Rage feats for stamina, feats to support AoO effects, feats that work towards potential prestige classes, and so on. However, you could also shift our ability scores around somewhat. I mean, if you're getting results like that with 16 starting Strength, maybe you can lower it to 14, and free up four points to spend somewhere else - perhaps back into Charisma, giving you some oomph for Intimidating Rage or Imperious Command if you want. You can continue to tune this until it deals "enough" damage - and that "enough" does not need to be "100%". It could easily be, say, 80% (leaving the rest to the team), if your DM is the sort who would ban one-hit killers.
Tempest_Stormwind on Character Optimization
So when do you think Bachmann will be saying she met a mother the previous night that had a son who got a blood transfusion using a gay guy's blood, and now the son is retardedly gay?
When she meets CJ's mom?
Resident Pithed-Off Dragon Poon Slayer of the House of Trolls

It's also very diffuclt to run a campaing where PCs can jump across rivers, lift homes and shape mountains. How does the DM set limits when you have +30 to a skill check?



The ranger I ran through epic had about a 45 passive perception. The gigantic gelatinous cube had a DC 50 hide. They eventually saw it, but we had one level 29 paladin in aspic at that point. If I had been in a more mean frame of mind, I would have given it the ability to go opaque at will ("oh, sorry, teleport no longer works") but the others were pretty tied up with the epic level rust monster and the 2-10 level 32 demon minions incoming each round.

Here's the good thing about running an epic campaign: Since everyone knows the characters (they are epic), they will research them and *plan how to take them down*. Anytime I built a fight, I though about what I'd seen the players do previously and so was "common knowledge". It's hard to surprise an enemy when the local taverns ring with songs explainign in detail how they defeated previous people.

As a side note, this means that if any of your players' characters have a lousy will save, they are toast. Hiring a monster to dominate them -- sometimes even at-will -- is then a no brainer. Hey epic slayer, can you charge your friend, running through the lich's aura and provoking from my brute please? Ooo. You rolled a 20. How nice.

 
After level 20 in 3.5 **** just gets silly. I remember i had a hulking hurler build at level 25 or so that could lift so much I used scientific notation for his weight allowance and I could roll several thousand dice for damage (assuming I could find an object with sufficient mass).

Did you take Weapon Focus (Texas)?


More like weapon focus (the moon), or (great pyramid of Giza).
After level 20 in 3.5 **** just gets silly. I remember i had a hulking hurler build at level 25 or so that could lift so much I used scientific notation for his weight allowance and I could roll several thousand dice for damage (assuming I could find an object with sufficient mass).

Did you take Weapon Focus (Texas)?


More like weapon focus (the moon), or (great pyramid of Giza).


Wouldn't Texas be between those two in size?
Ahh, so THIS is where I can add a sig. Remember: Killing an ancient God inside of a pyramid IS a Special Occasion, and thus, ladies should be dipping into their Special Occasions underwear drawer.
Yes, but all that poofy Texas hair makes it lighter.
"Today's headlines and history's judgment are rarely the same. If you are too attentive to the former, you will most certainly not do the hard work of securing the latter." -Condoleezza Rice "My fellow Americans... I've just signed legislation that will outlaw Russia forever. Bombing begins in five minutes." - Ronald Reagan This user has been banned from you by the letters "O-R-C" and the numbers "2, 3, 4, and 6"
User Quotes
56788208 wrote:
I do, however, have one last lesson on this subject. That last one? The only build in this post that can one-shot average opponents[by dealing twice as much damage as they have HP? I would argue that it is not optimized. Why isn't it optimized? Because it's overkill. Overkill is NOT optimizing. This means that there are portions of this build dedicated to damage which can safely be removed and thrown elsewhere. For example, you probably don't need both Leap Attack AND Headlong Rush at the same time. You could pick up Extra Rage feats for stamina, feats to support AoO effects, feats that work towards potential prestige classes, and so on. However, you could also shift our ability scores around somewhat. I mean, if you're getting results like that with 16 starting Strength, maybe you can lower it to 14, and free up four points to spend somewhere else - perhaps back into Charisma, giving you some oomph for Intimidating Rage or Imperious Command if you want. You can continue to tune this until it deals "enough" damage - and that "enough" does not need to be "100%". It could easily be, say, 80% (leaving the rest to the team), if your DM is the sort who would ban one-hit killers.
Tempest_Stormwind on Character Optimization
So when do you think Bachmann will be saying she met a mother the previous night that had a son who got a blood transfusion using a gay guy's blood, and now the son is retardedly gay?
When she meets CJ's mom?
Resident Pithed-Off Dragon Poon Slayer of the House of Trolls
Yes, but all that poofy Texas hair makes it lighter.



You've never used Hairspray, have you?  That stuf makes it heavier.  Trust me.

Ahh, so THIS is where I can add a sig. Remember: Killing an ancient God inside of a pyramid IS a Special Occasion, and thus, ladies should be dipping into their Special Occasions underwear drawer.
weapon focus (great pyramid of Giza).



BIGGEST.
D4.
EVAR.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
I chose not to mess with Texas. :P
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