I love the 4th and 4e power system but....

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I love the AEDU powers system. It gives each player and class choices to make during building and battles. It simpifies what was overly complicated and gives everyone something different to do each turn as opposed to the old timey "basic attack" or editions gone by.

But now I am reminded that that 4th Editition was made without an OGL and thus no extra 4e compatible material could be released beyond what WotC released themselves.

3rd and 3.5 had their OGL and the amount of compatible material is staggering, and with plenty of variants and setting changes, there was more than enough to keep things interesting for a long time. But... it all lacks the power system that make each class interesting and balanced.
As much as I may love a few aspects of a system, especially one tailor made to a non-traditional setting, when I look it over and see nothing that could properly replace the power sytem, I feel like I'm taking a huge step backwards.

So now I'm at a point where I want to mix things up a bit. I want to run with classes and features that came from older systems and third party material. I want to take both the setting and a bit of the mechanics outside the usual D&D setting....
...But I don't want to go back to a place where spells are three paragraphs long and come by the dozen and non-casters are stuck doing the same one attack for their entire career.


So then I ask, have any of you previously (and successfully) taken the power system and meshed it with older, 3rd edition material?
You do not understand how the GSL works. There is a lot of 4e compatible 3rd party material out there, nowhere near as much as under the looser 3x OGL, but still, there is quite a bit.

Here is an example of a 4e GSL product with new races, classes, etc

www.goodman-games.com/4370preview.html
You do not understand how the GSL works. There is a lot of 4e compatible 3rd party material out there, nowhere near as much as under the looser 3x OGL, but still, there is quite a bit.

Here is an example of a 4e GSL product with new races, classes, etc

www.goodman-games.com/4370preview.html



Very much appreciated. Thanks for the info. I think I'll be looking into this one very soon.

But that aside, my actual question still stands. 
So then I ask, have any of you previously (and successfully) taken the power system and meshed it with older, 3rd edition material?
 
I havent personally, though I think that others might be interested in that idea. If you end up wanting to develop it, here is some info on the GSL

www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/welcom...
Have tried the Tome of Battle?
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I do, however, have one last lesson on this subject. That last one? The only build in this post that can one-shot average opponents[by dealing twice as much damage as they have HP? I would argue that it is not optimized. Why isn't it optimized? Because it's overkill. Overkill is NOT optimizing. This means that there are portions of this build dedicated to damage which can safely be removed and thrown elsewhere. For example, you probably don't need both Leap Attack AND Headlong Rush at the same time. You could pick up Extra Rage feats for stamina, feats to support AoO effects, feats that work towards potential prestige classes, and so on. However, you could also shift our ability scores around somewhat. I mean, if you're getting results like that with 16 starting Strength, maybe you can lower it to 14, and free up four points to spend somewhere else - perhaps back into Charisma, giving you some oomph for Intimidating Rage or Imperious Command if you want. You can continue to tune this until it deals "enough" damage - and that "enough" does not need to be "100%". It could easily be, say, 80% (leaving the rest to the team), if your DM is the sort who would ban one-hit killers.
Tempest_Stormwind on Character Optimization
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Have you tried the Tome of Battle?



While I knew well that Tome of Battle (Book of the Nine Swords) was what laid the ground work for 4th Edition's power system, I can't believe I never actually read it.

I'm looking into it right now and it basically amounts to encounter powers these martial classes get here and there. And while they are written far more like 3e spells than they are 4e powers, I get the basic idea that works around them.

I'm thinking that if such a hybrid could be made, it might be as simple as providing encoutner powers to the existing classes and adjust for the system's math.
Sounds simple on paper, but I'm pretty sure that it's not that easy, especially when both editions work with different progressions and expect different ability score distributions.
Are you trying to adapt 4E powers to 3E or vice versa?

If it's 4E->3E then the Tome of Battle probably provides the best framework, since it already uses quasi-encounter powers. (Quasi because they're rechargeable, which 4E doesn't usually allow.) There isn't any viable formulaic method to convert powers, though; they'd have to be adapted on a case-by-case basis.

Daily powers could probably be converted too, occupying a maneuver slot like encounter powers but not recovering except during an extended rest.
Are you trying to adapt 4E powers to 3E or vice versa?


At this point, I'm thinking it might be better to go the other way around.
Start with 4E characters, perhaps a tiny bit simplified, and add to them features and abilities from previous editions. Stuff that's usually non-combat or utilitarian in nature.
  Assuming that you want to go beyond the existing structure (themes, feats, powers), the simplest approach conceptually (balancing it might be a challenge, mind) would be to employ power swaps. You take a 2nd level utility feature instead of a 2nd level utility power.
But now I am reminded that that 4th Editition was made without an OGL and thus no extra 4e compatible material could be released beyond what WotC released themselves.


As has already been stated, there is 3rd party material for 4e. Some has been released under the GSL, some under the OGL, and some under no license at all. Even if WotC cuts off the GSL, people can still produce material if they so choose.
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