Bard - Greatclub + Implement Casting?

14 posts / 0 new
Last post
Hi there.

I'm starting in a D&D Campaign (Loosely based on the Dark Sun setting, but I am unfamiliar with the rules and I am not sure the actual DS rules will apply here) where I will be playing a Dwarf Bard called Desmond.

Desmond was once the guitarist of a local Dwarven metal band known as Iron Moradin, one of many musical acts based around the new concept of Bardiac magic, weaving magic into art to influence its impact on the audience. This band eventually split and went their separate ways, but Desmond not quite let go of the dream of being a musician and starting touring solo, despite his own terrible singing (So bad, even his magic can't help it) voice which caused him to be booed off from many stages, and often causing a good barfight while he was at it. This character is now a bit of a washed up loser who would do anything to promote himself, including starting an adventuring career.

In terms of combat, I want to reflect his rowdy nature and musical talent. Half of his powers have him whacking his foes over the head with a guitar, the other half have him playing music to magically manipulate his allies, foes and the battlefield.

Or put in game terms, He's a Valorous bard with half of his powers being Melee Weapon powers and the other half being implement powers, preferably close blast/burst powers. I thought the best weapon to simulate being whacked over the head with the guitar would be a greatclub, and perhaps using a wand to simulate the pick or plectrum being used for the implement powers. But there lies the obviously problem of being a two-handed weapon and not allowing me to use a wand at the same time, even though the situation I'm trying to emulate would easily allow for it by simply holding the pick tightly against the fret board whilst whacking foes. 

So my question is: Are there any feats or options which would allow me to simulate my ideas more effectively within combat? I.E Allow me to use both a 2Handed weapon and an Implement effectively? I hope to be able to use Melee Weapon Powers one turn and Implement powers the next (And Vice Versa of course) without any penalties, is this possible?

I imagine one of three things I would need to do for this character to be effective:

1. Find an option that allows me to use a Greatclub and a wand at the same time.
2. Find an option that allows me to switch between the two weapons without using actions, and hopefully without a penalty.
3. Find an option to gain my + to hit and damage to implement powers without actually using an implement.

Does anyone know a way to achieve one of these three?

P.S Sorry if this is the wrong boards to post this in, But character optimization is the closest thing I can think to for this issue. I'm also aware that A Bard being a Dwarf and using a Greatclub is in itself very far from what could be considered optimized, I'm aware with of that and am happy with it. I generally try to optimize within the bounds of a character concept, even if the concept itself is not very optimal.
Thanks for the reply, very useful. 

But seriously, this has been mentioned by my friends and I fail to see how sharp axe blades better simulate being hit by a guitar then a large piece of wood in the form of a greatclub. I did consider using an axe, but thought the Greatclub would simulate the idea better, especially the size of the guitar in proportion to the dwarf. If there's no possible way to make it work with the greatclub, I'll switch to the axe.

Also, Arcane Implement Proficiency and Versatile Expertise.  Or if you can MC into something that gets proficiency in holy symbols, those don't take up a hand and there's Mighty Crusader Expertise if you have to use a 2-handed weapon (or Devout Protector Expertise if you use a shield).
The only advice that can be given regarding greatclubs is not to use them.

Also, the word "simulate" is wrong, because guitars are not solid objects and if you hit someone with a guitar in reality, it likely breaks. Also they didn't have guitars in the high middle ages, much less electric ones. Also, dwarves aren't real and you can't really kill dragons with rock music. In short, if you're getting hung up on "but the realisms!" here, you're being absolutely, laughably myopic.

If it helps your unbelievably narrow mind, here are some literal axe-guitars for visualization purposes.

Narrow minded? Coming from the person who looked at the author's idea of a guitar wielding Bard and because he isn't using an axe, decided that this person has no right to play the class or race because it didn't match his expectations.

I'm aware of the idea of Axe guitars, but I don't imagine my character nor an electric guitar, I'll probably use some excuse that it is enchanted and thats how it can play magical music like discussed in my first post and also the reason why it doesn't break upon hitting someone.

The phrase I used was "Better simulate" as in a greatclub better simulates hitting someone with a guitar then an axe, not perfectly. I'm not going for full realism here.  Frankly the entire concept behind the character is quite ridiculous. Thats partly why i want to play it. If I were going for realism, I would not play D&D.

To my own fault, I did fail to include some of that information in my original and second post and for that i apologize, but I'm here for advice on how to make this concept work most effectively, not to criticize the concept itself.


Celerian, thank you for the response, I shall look into those options you provided me and see if they work.

Ki focus
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
Ki focus

Elemental Initiate would seem to be the clear cut winner here. After all, they study the elements. Such as Rock.
Ki focus

Elemental Initiate would seem to be the clear cut winner here. After all, they study the elements. Such as Rock.


At the moment I seem to have gone with Multiclassing into Paladin and using a holy symbol. I don't like the flavour, as the character isn't very religious but I can just ignore the flavour.

Thanks for the replies.  
To be fair, you said optimize within a concept. And nothing says you have to use a greatclub besides you. You're already refluffing, what not refluff to something that doesn't suck?
10/10 Would Flame Again: An Elite Paladin|Warlock The Elemental Man (or Woman): A Genasi Handbook The Warlord, Or How to Wield a Barbarian One-Handed The Bookish Barbarian Fardiz: RAI is fairly clear, but RAZ is different That's right. Rules According to Zelink!
First of all, nice work on the Iron Moradin.

Secondly, era/zelink have a point that your main problems are caused by your determination that a guitar needs to be a greatclub. Anyone built like a dwarf could easily swing a guitar with one hand, therefore why not make it a mace or regular club? After all, if you really wanted to be a stickler, you'd just bash people with a lute as an improvised weapon.

It might help to just take a step back from the assumptions you brought here. You say, "If I were going for realism, I wouldn't be playing D&D," yet your defense of the greatclub (which is really one of the worst weapons you could possibly use and we would be remiss not to bring this up in CharOp) is all based on what seems "real."

So anyway the point is, as long as you're refluffing, you might as well base your guitar on something decent. It doesn't have to be the Best Weapon Evar like a gouge or something, but give yourself and your party a break and make it something that doesn't require all kinds of investements just to get it to work. Consider it as a way to free up your theme, feats, etc up for things that will actually be more fun and flavorful in combat.
Why isn't he named "El Kabong"?
Meh, its the first time I'm playing with this DM and I've just discovered he really likes to push the characters to their limits. 

I was basing the entire thing on the fact that A guitar could not be effectively used in one hand to hit someone with. I was trying it myself (Just the lifting and swinging, and very carefully at that) but then again my strength score is not particularly great XD

So considering I've discovered the DM is tough on characters, I think i am forced to re-think how I'm building this character.

So yeah. I'm using an axe. You win. *Desmond plays a sad song*


Whilst this thread still has a decent amount of attention, I may as well get feedback on some of the other ideas I was planning, since I have an obsession wanting to play a character from levels 1 - 30.

I'm pretty sure I'm going with the War Chanter PP, as the Bard Handbook outright states its the path to take for Valourous bards and I've personally seen no path with better features or powers. I'll probably reflavour it into Crowd Worker or something like that.

I intend to go with the Archspell ED, reflavouring into Archriff as I hope for the character to develop a musical riff which embodies the history of the Dwarves. I'm intending to create my custom spell named Dragonforge (I'm so lame) but if the DM does not allow that, as there any bard spells worth the investment of this path?
Sign In to post comments