G/B/W Midrange your thoughts please

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This deck will be played in side events on Friday at GP Beijing and if I don't make the sealed deck day two this will be played in a large day two standard tournament.

Green, Black and White Midrange

Creatures (22):

4xAvacyn's Pilgrim
4xLoxodon Smiter
4xCentaur Healer
4xRestoration Angel
4xThragtusk
2xObzedat, Ghost Council

Sorceries (7):

4xFarseek
3xUnburial Rites

Instants (4):

2xAbrupt Decay
1xSelesnya Charm
1xOrzhov Charm

Enchantments (2):

2xOblivion Ring

Planeswalkers (1):

1xGarruk, Primal Hunter

Sideboard (15):

2xPithing Needle
1xAbrupt Decay
4xPurify the Grave
1xGarruk, Primal Hunter
2xLiliana of the Veil
1xSigarda, Host of Herons
1xDevour Flesh
3xDuress

Match-ups:

Geist of Saint Traft.dec

IN-2xLiliana of the Veil
     1xDevour Flesh

OUT-1xSelesnya Charm
        2xAbrupt Decay

American Control (R/W/B)

IN-1xSigarda, Host of Herons
     3xDuress
     2xPurify the Grave

OUT-4xCentaur Healer
        1xSelesnya Charm
        1xOrzhov Charm

Reanimator

IN-4xPurify the Grave

OUT-2xLoxodon Smiter
        1xAbrupt Decay
        1xOrzhov Charm

Jund Midrange

IN-1xGarruk, Primal Hunter
     2xPithing Needle
     3xDuress

OUT-4xCentaur Healer
        1xSelesnya Charm
        1xOrzhov Charm

Naya Blitz

I think we're fine against Naya Blitz actually. This deck curves well against that type of aggro deck and should be ok, unless I'm missing something?

Mirror

Not so sure on this one yet.



What else am I missing? What looks good? What doesn't? I think it's pretty close to a finished piece but we can tweek it a bit if needed.

Thanks!
    





bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
Not tier one, but looks solid. Putrefy is often better than Adrupt decay. a little slower but better vs midrange.

blood baron deserves a spot. He's so hard to kill and does plently of life gain.

More Garruk, he's awesome.
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oh my god, AWESOME! Then changing the Slivers was your idea! haha lol
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Not tier one, but looks solid. Putrefy is often better than Adrupt decay. a little slower but better vs midrange.

blood baron deserves a spot. He's so hard to kill and does plently of life gain.

More Garruk, he's awesome.



^This, though i think the baron should be in the SB to bring in against control decks. Btw idk why you are running rites in the deck without the engine, it's like handycapping yourself, i mean i get bringing back ghost council and tusk are good but not compared to what other actual reanimator decks are bringing back.
Not tier one, but looks solid. Putrefy is often better than Adrupt decay. a little slower but better vs midrange.

blood baron deserves a spot. He's so hard to kill and does plently of life gain.

More Garruk, he's awesome.



The deck was originally made with the Blood Baron as the centerpiece but it was getting hosed it play-testing. Still I'm willing to consider it because I really like the card.

I agree that Putrefy can be better than Decay but I mainly found myself using Decay against enchantments which is nice.

This deck seems to hose Naya Blitz maindeck which was one of the main things I was looking to do.

Where would you put "more Garruk? I'm maindecking one and bringing in one from the sideboard depending on the match-up. All the cards you're suggesting (aside from Putrefy) are 5 drops and mana intensive (in opposit directions). Garruk has GGG and blood barons require both BW and are all five drops!

Could you be more specific on how that build would be better and still be easy to cast because when I was running 2 Garruk main and two blood barons I would have trouble casting one or the other.

Thanks

bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
Not tier one, but looks solid. Putrefy is often better than Adrupt decay. a little slower but better vs midrange.

blood baron deserves a spot. He's so hard to kill and does plently of life gain.

More Garruk, he's awesome.



^This, though i think the baron should be in the SB to bring in against control decks. Btw idk why you are running rites in the deck without the engine, it's like handycapping yourself, i mean i get bringing back ghost council and tusk are good but not compared to what other actual reanimator decks are bringing back.



I wasn't running rites at all in my original build but as my friends and I play-tested against strong decks it became more and more obvious that this card would be helpful with the aforementioned creatures.

What's your suggestion?

bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
Unburial rites is so weird in here. And there's sufficient gy hate in the format I'm a little baffled as to how you found the rites as the best answer in your testing, especially when you're main decking resto to flash in against spot removal and you have Obzedat against sweepers. 

I say more stag tusk and more lingering souls for starters.  The miser charms feel like they should be sb material, or you should do two Seles charms and tuck the orz charms in the sb. 

I found Carmen Sandiego before you were born unless you're Zlehtnoba.

this looks like it's trying really hard to be reanimator...but then it got kicked in the head really hard during the design process.
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When brewing, or going rogue per se, in standard you need to reach a point in deck construction where you ask yourself if your deck is doing the same thing as another deck, but just worse.

As Anthos indicated a little uncouthly you've got a value junk deck... but the 'best' version of value-junk is reanimator.

In order to turn your deck into reanimator you could make the following changes and tweak the manabase for performance:

Cut Centaur Healer (move it to the sideboard, very important card to keep in the 75).

Remove Farseek.

Cut 2 Charms and 2 O-Rings (might go to sideboard).

Cut Garruk PH (move to sideboard, perhaps)

Trim 1 restoration angel.

Add 4 Arbor Elf/Deathrite Shaman mix (some people like 2/2, with the meta looking to continue to be reanimator dominant you should get mileage from 3 DRS 1 Arbor Elf). 

Add 4 Grisly Salvage
Add 3 Mulch
Add 3 Angel of Serenity

24 lands seems right... even with the boosted mana dork count. Make sure you have 1-2 Gavony Township in the new mix. With extra dorks you just get there.

Now the next part you'll not like, but its what the deck is. Remove 2 Abrupt Decay OR 2 more resto angels and add 2 Liliana of the Veil from yoursideboard. You could cut all 3 resto angels and add a single Craterhoof Behemoth which loves your mana dorks.

Next we should find a way to get 4 Lingering Souls in the deck. The obvious switch is Loxodon Smiter... however you need to ask yourself... how do you want to respond to an opposing Liliana discard? making a 4/4 is cool... and kills her on your turn... discarding to cast 2 tokens is also fine...but doesn't smash her on the backswing. Figure out how meta-gamed you want to be against Reanimator and go with your comfort zone on this choice. Its more important than a few percentage points on theoretical construction at times... comfort.

From here retool your sideboard to adjust to a better g1 reanimator matchup (thanks DRS, and I'm sure you'll be on Smiter)...  probably cut Sigarda, trim Purify the Grave down from 4... and see about re-adding some of the mainboard things we cut. I recommend you find room for the Centaur Healers.

Good luck. 

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Thanks for all the replies so far!

I think I'd rather go away from the Unburial Rites instead of build straight reanimator.

The reason they were in the deck at all was through play testing. Originally they weren't there (the deck was also a bit different) and I was losing quite a bit in the crucial matchups. After adding three rites I started winning quite a few games, even against decks that seemed like they should be stronger.

I'll take the communities advice for now and try to switch them out for something else.

I also removed the two charms from my main board in favor of two Putrefys as they seem to be testing better versus the Boros Reckoner which has been giving me problems.

From my original list:

OUT-3x Unburial Rites
        1x Selesnya Charm
        1x Orzhov Charm

IN-2xPutrefy
     ???

I'm looking at maybe the Blood Baron (how many, not sure), maybe another Garruk, possibly one Angel of Serenity as a finisher.

Anyway I could take advantage of Deadbridge Chant? Laughing

The Centaur healers, curve into restoration Angel, Thragtusk has been very sweet against aggro/blitz so I don't mind healer mainboard for now, notice in my notes, I think he's sideboarded out when appropriate.

Got a few days still to play test and brew until Beijing GP.
bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
Good luck, I cannot be of any assistance if you're looking for help to continue doing something worse than another deck. I'm not trying to be catty with you, but I won't take part in helping you potentially throw money away.

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"Against logic there is no armor like ignorance." - Laurence J. Peter 
"It is the province of knowledge to speak, and it is the privilege of wisdom to listen.” - Oliver Wendell Holmes

Good luck, I cannot be of any assistance if you're looking for help to continue doing something worse than another deck. I'm not trying to be catty with you, but I won't take part in helping you potentially throw money away.



Pity you want to take that position. But it does come across rude and arrogant.

I'd like your help. I'm here to get opinions on tweeking my build.

I don't want to play a net deck reanimator. I can find THAT decklist just as easily as you can.

I'm ok with experimenting a bit and/or trying a slightly different build.

We could look at Thrag stag, blood baron, a variety of cards.

Let me decide what my money is worth spending on. If I deem it a waste I wont play it.

For example you build a BUG deck that isn't the optimal deck either, you could have build a tier one deck instead, but you went another route and built something else solid. I could nit pick that it's worse than several other decks but why?

I'm asking for suggestions on a build, not to be told I'm making a big mistake. This deck IS good, not top but still plenty strong.

Is it that difficult to just give a few suggestions?

Again, I would appreciate any help you could give me, but by help I mean within the framework of my question, not an entirely different deck.

Thank you!



bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
Unburial rites is so weird in here. And there's sufficient gy hate in the format I'm a little baffled as to how you found the rites as the best answer in your testing, especially when you're main decking resto to flash in against spot removal and you have Obzedat against sweepers. 

I say more stag tusk and more lingering souls for starters.  The miser charms feel like they should be sb material, or you should do two Seles charms and tuck the orz charms in the sb. 



I'm going away from the rites for now as it also opens up space to experiment with some newer cards.

I think the Stag could be a possibility along with lingering souls. I moved the charms out of main-board and added two Putrefys.

We've been testing this deck with several Chinese PTQ players against tier 1 and tier 2 decks but it's also difficult to predict what builds we will see with the new influx of cards.

My deck feels very solid against Naya Blitz which is important as in my meta that deck is pervasive.

My problem cards right now are the Aristocrat and Boros Reckoner (maybe others but those have slowed me down thus far).

Aristocrat feeds off a lot of my removal and slides under Selesnya Charm sometimes as well.

Reckoner stops most of my creatures dead in their tracks and is being protected rather well in the top RWU decks by counter magic.

I think the Stag could help me fight against the control match-up pretty well, and can borrow them from a semi-pro player if need be, but I need to feel it's worth it first.

What's your build here?

bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge

Pity you want to take that position. But it does come across rude and arrogant. I'd like your help. I'm here to get opinions on tweeking my build. I don't want to play a net deck reanimator. I can find THAT decklist just as easily as you can. 


Indicating a basic tenant of constructed magic deck building is to determine if your angle of attack is:
1. Valid
2. Doing it better than another existing deck

Is not arrogant or rude. If you take that line when you're given critique then you're going to have a hard time maturing a deck concept. Every deck must be evaluated against the current meta during construction to determine if it can compete... and if it's just wasting its time because its inferior to an existing product. This is not a personal attack. Do not take it as one.

It is worth pointing out that over the history of current standard Thragtusk-value.dec has gone from Bant Goodstuff, Blinking, and finally landed on Reanimator. This is because Reanimator has overpowered the other versions time and again. Your current decklist is a Blink/Reanimator hybrid, but your approach is not as focused as the Reanimator core... so when I indicated I wouldn't take part in you throwing your money away I simply mean I won't help you tune a worse version of an extremely popular deck... watch you drop 30-40 dollars on entering a large event with it... doing fine... then running into a focused Reanimator deck and having your day end on that note. I've done it myself in the past and I decided not to help anyone repeat past mistakes.

I'm ok with experimenting a bit and/or trying a slightly different build. We could look at Thrag stag, blood baron, a variety of cards. Let me decide what my money is worth spending on. If I deem it a waste I wont play it.


Alright, so let's not do Reanimator. We can try to re-approach this from a different angle.

For example you build a BUG deck that isn't the optimal deck either, you could have build a tier one deck instead, but you went another route and built something else solid. I could nit pick that it's worse than several other decks but why?


You're going to need to back this comment up. My buG deck attacks the meta from a unique angle of extremely resilient aggro and tempo based momentum changes that require extremely cerebral lines of play. You could argue I'm doing something worse than Aristocrats since there are similarities... but I'm undefeated against Aristocrats currently.. so that deck is actually doing something worse than me. Please take discussion on the bug deck to that thread. Dissenting discussion is always healthy.

I'm asking for suggestions on a build, not to be told I'm making a big mistake. This deck IS good, not top but still plenty strong.


It's unfortunate, but you'll find you're going to have to absorb positive critique with negative critique. The most mind-numbing thing is negative with no suggestions for change. Do note that while I provided negative commentary I did provide suggestions on how to correct your list. 

Is it that difficult to just give a few suggestions? Again, I would appreciate any help you could give me, but by help I mean within the framework of my question, not an entirely different deck.


I will provide the kind of suggestions you're looking for, which are reinforcement that your deck idea is valid and can simply be tuned up to compete. This is fine. But remember my initial battery of advice when the tournament is in swing. Also, you'll need to unblock me. I cannot respond to your PM... but I probably don't need to now.

I'll edit some ideas in to this post in a few minutes... moving away from Reanimator.

EDIT: Have you considered going with the Blink + Rhox Lifemender route? You can still brick aggro.. and potentially grind some games out with Reanimator and Jund that way. But you might get into trouble since its a little slow on the hand emptying and can be wrecked by a Rakdos Return. More to edit in..

EDIT2: How about a planeswalker control angle? You can still benefit greatly from Centaur Healer and Thragtusk and Resto and Obzedat... you can run some sweepers and try to grind wins out via 2 Garruk PH, a Sorin, and some measure of Vraska? The general plan would probably be to trade/sweep while rolling Vraska up... then create 3 assassins after you sweep... most decks cannot answer 3 must-answer threats after a sweeper. 

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Favorite Quotes

"Against logic there is no armor like ignorance." - Laurence J. Peter 
"It is the province of knowledge to speak, and it is the privilege of wisdom to listen.” - Oliver Wendell Holmes

Unburial rites is so weird in here. And there's sufficient gy hate in the format I'm a little baffled as to how you found the rites as the best answer in your testing, especially when you're main decking resto to flash in against spot removal and you have Obzedat against sweepers. 

I say more stag tusk and more lingering souls for starters.  The miser charms feel like they should be sb material, or you should do two Seles charms and tuck the orz charms in the sb. 



I'm going away from the rites for now as it also opens up space to experiment with some newer cards.

I think the Stag could be a possibility along with lingering souls. I moved the charms out of main-board and added two Putrefys.

We've been testing this deck with several Chinese PTQ players against tier 1 and tier 2 decks but it's also difficult to predict what builds we will see with the new influx of cards.

My deck feels very solid against Naya Blitz which is important as in my meta that deck is pervasive.

My problem cards right now are the Aristocrat and Boros Reckoner (maybe others but those have slowed me down thus far).

Aristocrat feeds off a lot of my removal and slides under Selesnya Charm sometimes as well.

Reckoner stops most of my creatures dead in their tracks and is being protected rather well in the top RWU decks by counter magic.

I think the Stag could help me fight against the control match-up pretty well, and can borrow them from a semi-pro player if need be, but I need to feel it's worth it first.

What's your build here?




It's tough. There are so many goodies in Junk right now I feel like you can go a lot of ways with it.

If I was going midrange, based on what you say about your meta, I'd try something like:

4 Avacyn's Pilgrim
4 Gyre Sage
4 Voice of Resurgence
4 Loxodon Smiter
4 Centaur Healer 
4 Restoration Angel
3 Thragtusk 
2 Obzedat, Ghost Council
2 Sigarda, Host of Herons 
4 Abrupt Decay
2 Putrefy

Gyre Sage should be best friends with Obzedat. Abrupt Decay kills Reckoner. Sigarda stops Jund and impedes Aristocrats. 

I'm looking into Valroz myself, and using Cartel Aristocrat to sac my Smiters then scavenge them onto the aristocrat and swing in for an unblocked 6/6, etc.

I found Carmen Sandiego before you were born unless you're Zlehtnoba.

If you want to prepare for tourney. Suggestion is to read article like TCGplayer and look at tourney site like TC Decks. Unsure forum is helpful to you preparing since you are out of time
I'll give you the list i run so you can get some ideas. Not sure if this is your flavor but it gets the job done, although haven't had a chance to test it with the barons, putrefy and ready/willing yet.

Creatures-23
4x avacyn's pilgrim
2x deathrite shaman
4x boros reckoner
4x loxodon smiter
4x restoration angel
3x thragtusk
2x obzedat, ghost council

Spells-13
3x farseek
3x putrefy
2x abrupt decay
3x selesnya charm
2x ready // willing

Lands
4x temple garden
4x overgrown tomb
3x godless shrine 
3x woodland cemetery
3x sunpetal grove
1x vault of the archangel
6x forest

Side Board
2x abrupt decay(for aggro matches mostly)
3x rest in peace(for reanimator)
2x blood baron of vizkopa(for midrange/control decks)
3x golgari charm(enchantment removal with options)
3x vorapede(bring in over tusk against drownyard control)
2x deathrite shaman(for reanimator)
I feel like this deck wants Sin Collector in it, especially with resto angel in the deck.
Unburial rites is so weird in here. And there's sufficient gy hate in the format I'm a little baffled as to how you found the rites as the best answer in your testing, especially when you're main decking resto to flash in against spot removal and you have Obzedat against sweepers. 

I say more stag tusk and more lingering souls for starters.  The miser charms feel like they should be sb material, or you should do two Seles charms and tuck the orz charms in the sb. 



I'm going away from the rites for now as it also opens up space to experiment with some newer cards.

I think the Stag could be a possibility along with lingering souls. I moved the charms out of main-board and added two Putrefys.

We've been testing this deck with several Chinese PTQ players against tier 1 and tier 2 decks but it's also difficult to predict what builds we will see with the new influx of cards.

My deck feels very solid against Naya Blitz which is important as in my meta that deck is pervasive.

My problem cards right now are the Aristocrat and Boros Reckoner (maybe others but those have slowed me down thus far).

Aristocrat feeds off a lot of my removal and slides under Selesnya Charm sometimes as well.

Reckoner stops most of my creatures dead in their tracks and is being protected rather well in the top RWU decks by counter magic.

I think the Stag could help me fight against the control match-up pretty well, and can borrow them from a semi-pro player if need be, but I need to feel it's worth it first.

What's your build here?




It's tough. There are so many goodies in Junk right now I feel like you can go a lot of ways with it.

If I was going midrange, based on what you say about your meta, I'd try something like:

4 Avacyn's Pilgrim
4 Gyre Sage
4 Voice of Resurgence
4 Loxodon Smiter
4 Centaur Healer 
4 Restoration Angel
3 Thragtusk 
2 Obzedat, Ghost Council
2 Sigarda, Host of Herons 
4 Abrupt Decay
2 Putrefy

Gyre Sage should be best friends with Obzedat. Abrupt Decay kills Reckoner. Sigarda stops Jund and impedes Aristocrats. 

I'm looking into Valroz myself, and using Cartel Aristocrat to sac my Smiters then scavenge them onto the aristocrat and swing in for an unblocked 6/6, etc.



I think your build looks solid and fun!

I don't have access to the Voice of Resurgence quite yet though so I think I'll go another direction (for now).

I'll keep this for later digestion though!

Thanks
bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge

Pity you want to take that position. But it does come across rude and arrogant. I'd like your help. I'm here to get opinions on tweeking my build. I don't want to play a net deck reanimator. I can find THAT decklist just as easily as you can. 


Indicating a basic tenant of constructed magic deck building is to determine if your angle of attack is:
1. Valid
2. Doing it better than another existing deck

Is not arrogant or rude. If you take that line when you're given critique then you're going to have a hard time maturing a deck concept. Every deck must be evaluated against the current meta during construction to determine if it can compete... and if it's just wasting its time because its inferior to an existing product. This is not a personal attack. Do not take it as one.

It is worth pointing out that over the history of current standard Thragtusk-value.dec has gone from Bant Goodstuff, Blinking, and finally landed on Reanimator. This is because Reanimator has overpowered the other versions time and again. Your current decklist is a Blink/Reanimator hybrid, but your approach is not as focused as the Reanimator core... so when I indicated I wouldn't take part in you throwing your money away I simply mean I won't help you tune a worse version of an extremely popular deck... watch you drop 30-40 dollars on entering a large event with it... doing fine... then running into a focused Reanimator deck and having your day end on that note. I've done it myself in the past and I decided not to help anyone repeat past mistakes.

I'm ok with experimenting a bit and/or trying a slightly different build. We could look at Thrag stag, blood baron, a variety of cards. Let me decide what my money is worth spending on. If I deem it a waste I wont play it.


Alright, so let's not do Reanimator. We can try to re-approach this from a different angle.

For example you build a BUG deck that isn't the optimal deck either, you could have build a tier one deck instead, but you went another route and built something else solid. I could nit pick that it's worse than several other decks but why?


You're going to need to back this comment up. My buG deck attacks the meta from a unique angle of extremely resilient aggro and tempo based momentum changes that require extremely cerebral lines of play. You could argue I'm doing something worse than Aristocrats since there are similarities... but I'm undefeated against Aristocrats currently.. so that deck is actually doing something worse than me. Please take discussion on the bug deck to that thread. Dissenting discussion is always healthy.

I'm asking for suggestions on a build, not to be told I'm making a big mistake. This deck IS good, not top but still plenty strong.


It's unfortunate, but you'll find you're going to have to absorb positive critique with negative critique. The most mind-numbing thing is negative with no suggestions for change. Do note that while I provided negative commentary I did provide suggestions on how to correct your list. 

Is it that difficult to just give a few suggestions? Again, I would appreciate any help you could give me, but by help I mean within the framework of my question, not an entirely different deck.


I will provide the kind of suggestions you're looking for, which are reinforcement that your deck idea is valid and can simply be tuned up to compete. This is fine. But remember my initial battery of advice when the tournament is in swing. Also, you'll need to unblock me. I cannot respond to your PM... but I probably don't need to now.

I'll edit some ideas in to this post in a few minutes... moving away from Reanimator.

EDIT: Have you considered going with the Blink + Rhox Lifemender route? You can still brick aggro.. and potentially grind some games out with Reanimator and Jund that way. But you might get into trouble since its a little slow on the hand emptying and can be wrecked by a Rakdos Return. More to edit in..

EDIT2: How about a planeswalker control angle? You can still benefit greatly from Centaur Healer and Thragtusk and Resto and Obzedat... you can run some sweepers and try to grind wins out via 2 Garruk PH, a Sorin, and some measure of Vraska? The general plan would probably be to trade/sweep while rolling Vraska up... then create 3 assassins after you sweep... most decks cannot answer 3 must-answer threats after a sweeper. 



Thank you for the detailed response!

Planeswalker control could be fun.

I think I probably have all the cards for it (depending on the build) what's a rough outline of that deck? I'm short on time I hope we can put something together.

bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
If you want to prepare for tourney. Suggestion is to read article like TCGplayer and look at tourney site like TC Decks. Unsure forum is helpful to you preparing since you are out of time



The tourney is actually GP SEALED.

 I will only be playing in the large Standard side event if I don't make day two drafting in the main event.

Let's take a look at what I can find. Thanks for your deck list by the way, I saved it.

bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
I'll give you the list i run so you can get some ideas. Not sure if this is your flavor but it gets the job done, although haven't had a chance to test it with the barons, putrefy and ready/willing yet.

Creatures-23
4x avacyn's pilgrim
2x deathrite shaman
4x boros reckoner
4x loxodon smiter
4x restoration angel
3x thragtusk
2x obzedat, ghost council

Spells-13
3x farseek
3x putrefy
2x abrupt decay
3x selesnya charm
2x ready // willing

Lands
4x temple garden
4x overgrown tomb
3x godless shrine 
3x woodland cemetery
3x sunpetal grove
1x vault of the archangel
6x forest

Side Board
2x abrupt decay(for aggro matches mostly)
3x rest in peace(for reanimator)
2x blood baron of vizkopa(for midrange/control decks)
3x golgari charm(enchantment removal with options)
3x vorapede(bring in over tusk against drownyard control)
2x deathrite shaman(for reanimator)



I see, somewhat similar to mine.

With only ten white sources and 4xBoros Reckoner doesn't if end up being difficult to cast him?

bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
I feel like this deck wants Sin Collector in it, especially with resto angel in the deck.



Good point! Could we make a nice deck around Resto, Thrag, Sin Collector, healers, etc?

bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
I see, somewhat similar to mine.

With only ten white sources and 4xBoros Reckoner doesn't if end up being difficult to cast him?




You actually have 14 white sources with the pilgrim, if you don't like reckoner then replace him with sin collector. 
I see, somewhat similar to mine.

With only ten white sources and 4xBoros Reckoner doesn't if end up being difficult to cast him?




You actually have 14 white sources with the pilgrim, if you don't like reckoner then replace him with sin collector. 



I'm not aying I didn't like him, I just looked at the lands without checking for dorks.

bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
Btw if you wanted a more aggro midrange feel you can toss in strangleroot geist and dreg mangler. That list i posted used to have them, rancor and selesnya charm in it to kind of have the early beats and to recover faster from board wipes.
I'd actually like to run some sort of planeswalker control. using sweepers and Vrazka, Garruk, etc.

Quite different but maybe fun. Any ideas?
bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
Actually you could have a good PW junk control deck. Let me give it a whirl lol. Hopefully niche or shadowchu can pop in and help polish this list up some more. I'd like to maybe fit in some more card draw and/or obzedat's aid.

Creatures-13 
4x sin collector
4x restoration angel
3x thragtusk
2x obzedat, ghost council

Spells
3x liliana of the veil
3x putrefy
3x abrupt decay
4x mutilate
2x vraska the unseen
4x lingering souls
2x underworld connections

Lands
4x overgrown tomb
4x godless shrine
4x woodland cemetery
4x isolated chapel
9x swamp
Actually you could have a good PW junk control deck. Let me give it a whirl lol. Hopefully niche or shadowchu can pop in and help polish this list up some more. I'd like to maybe fit in some more card draw and/or obzedat's aid.

Creatures-13 
4x sin collector
4x restoration angel
3x thragtusk
2x obzedat, ghost council

Spells
3x liliana of the veil
3x putrefy
3x abrupt decay
4x mutilate
2x vraska the unseen
4x lingering souls
2x underworld connections

Lands
4x overgrown tomb
4x godless shrine
4x woodland cemetery
4x isolated chapel
9x swamp



Looks interesting! I feel Garruk, Primal Hunter should be involved and maybe only 2xLiliana of the Veil.

How about sideboard?
bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
I feel like this deck needs farseek as well.

We don't have any turn one plays and barely anything we'd want to use on turn two.

The white fixing is a bit scary.



bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
I ended up making a Junk Planeswalkers deck and went 5-1 at GP Beijing Super Sunday Standard.

I was surprisingly fine against net deck Reanimator and crushed 2 wicked Geist of Saint Traft decks.

Destroyed a R/W humans deck

Got mana screwed against a RDW though which was the only bump in the road.

I'll post the deck, it wa pretty fun.

Killed three times with Vraska's deathtouch tokens and beat 3 decks that had top 8 this season!
bulletd Guidelines: 5.0: I will take this card no matter what. Creature 1 or playable 1 or hate 1.Archangel of Thune 4.5: Bomb and splashable. Creature 1-2, playable 1-2, removal 1. Jace, Memory Adept 4.0: Excellent first pick first pack, will sway me into same colors. Creatures 1-4, removal 1. Haunted Plate Mail 3.5: Excellent first pack pick two, will confirm colors or possibly sway into second color. Doom Blade 3.0: Good in-color addition, or splashable removal/creature. Creatures 3-9, removal 1-3. wall of Frost 2.5: Solid pick in-color; creatures 5-12, removal 3-5. Dark Favor 2.0: Creatures 10-16; removal 6-7. Elvish Mystic 1.5: My 23rd or 22nd card, depending on removal. Act of Treason 1.0: 23rd card if I don't maindeck an additional land. Lay of the Land 0.5: This card will sometimes be sideboarded in. Brave the Elements 0.0: I will shred this card for counters. Darksteel Forge
plez post the deck
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