What's good about Spikeshot Elder

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So wat is gd about Spikeshot Elder? He's included in many goblin decks but I don't see the potential in it. Pls clarify!

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I was browsing through some cards in gatherer and I noticed something really odd - the transforming cards from Innistrad like Mayor of Avabruck have separate comments and ratings for each side. Isn't that totally stupid? It feels as senseless as having two different pages for each side of a split card or having different pages for Nimble Mongoose with and without threshold.

56965528 wrote:
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NON-AGGRO, NON-MONO RED deck (Not getting very far with it though)

Standard mono red deck for FNM next Friday

You can activate his ability as many times as you can afford, and you can increase the damage by buffing Spikeshot Elder's power.
It's also a mana sink on a 1-drop that gets played in decks that usually empty their hands quickly and have no use for late-game mana.

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192884403 wrote:
surely one can't say complex conditional passive language is bad grammar ?
Add Claws of Valakut and suddenly he's pretty dangerous.
Add Illusionist's Bracers and now it happens twice per activation.
There are a number of ways to abuse the ability.
It's a card that is good turn one, and late game. Not alot of cards do that.

Level 1 Judge

These days, there are a few decent one drop goblins. Spikeshot Elder is one of these - a 1/1 of the right type. At worst, it can ping at a rate of 3 mana: 1 damage. Throw in some buffs like Goblin Chieftain, Quest for the Goblin Lord and Goblin King, and you can get some really good rates on the damage. Even with just a Goblin Chieftain, 3 mana and no cards for 2 damage is a pretty good exchange, and pretty much what people pay for the Punishing Fire/Grove of the Burnwillows interaction.
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He is repeatable - instant timing - removal and burn in a deck that is notorious for running out of gas.

He works well with Teetering Peaks, , Goblin Bushwhacker etc - all cards that you would already be running.

He doesnt even need to tap to use his ability, so he can use it while "summoning Sick" and he can still attack if he isnt and still kill a potential blocker or increase the damage to the opponent.   

~ Tim 
I am Blue/White Reached DCI Rating 1800 on 28/10/11. :D
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56287226 wrote:
190106923 wrote:
Not bad. But what happens flavor wise when one kamahl kills the other one?
Zis iz a sign uf deep psychological troma, buried in zer subconscious mind. By keelink himzelf, Kamahl iz physically expressink hiz feelinks uf self-disgust ova hiz desire for hiz muzzer. [/GermanPsychologistVoice]
56957928 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
That makes no sense to me. If they spelled the ability out on the card in full then it would not be allowed in a mono-black Commander deck, but because they used a keyword to save space it is allowed? ~ Tim
Yup, just like you can have Birds of paradise in a mono green deck but not Noble Hierarch. YAY COLOR IDENTITY
56287226 wrote:
56888618 wrote:
Is algebra really that difficult?
Survey says yes.
56883218 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
You want to make a milky drink. You squeeze a cow.
I love this description. Like the cows are sponges filled with milk. I can see it all Nick Parks claymation-style with the cow's eyes bugging out momentarily as a giant farmer squeezes it like a squeaky dog toy, and milk shoots out of it.
56287226 wrote:
56735468 wrote:
And no judge will ever give you a game loss for playing snow covered lands.
I now have a new goal in life. ;)

What isn't good about him? He's an efficiently costed creature of a relevant creature type with a relevant and repeatable game-ending ability.


The only problem is he's not quite good ENOUGH in the grand scheme. He's a little too weak, slow and on the vanilla side for an aggressive goblin deck and if you focus too hard on building to his ability then you end up with a combo deck that may as well be built around a "real" combo. It's great in a more burn oriented deck because they need everything they can get to squeeze out a little bit more damage when they run out of cards but in that application it's sort of a late game card in disguise and you really don't want to see a lot of him (and something like Grim Lavamancer or Cursed Scroll is usually a lot better at that point, anyway.)

Cards like Braid of Fire can abuse him well.

I personally have a couple of him in my infinite-mana deck for multiplayer. 
I generate infinite mana and kill the whole table as an alternate win, if I can't attack with creatures due to some Moat-style effect.  
Add Claws of Valakut and suddenly he's pretty dangerous.
Add Illusionist's Bracers and now it happens twice per activation.
There are a number of ways to abuse the ability.

Illusionist's Bracers wouldn't work, Spikeshot Elder's ability is a mana ability.
Add Claws of Valakut and suddenly he's pretty dangerous. Add Illusionist's Bracers and now it happens twice per activation. There are a number of ways to abuse the ability.

Illusionist's Bracers wouldn't work, Spikeshot Elder's ability is a mana ability.


That is soooo not true. Mana abilities produce mana. An ability that costs mana is not a mana ability unless it also produces mana.
You're right! Me and my friends have been playing wrong for a while! Forgive my stupidity 
It's a Kumano, Master Yamabushi for one mana, that isn't Legendary and happens to be a goblin...
Blah, nvm.

I do like this card though.  Nice for early and end game.
It's a Kumano, Master Yamabushi for one mana, that isn't Legendary and happens to be a goblin...

Also the ability is priced differently and is lacking an important effect, also the power and toughness are much different. Other than that the similarities are uncanny. It's like I've been saying for years, Squire is an Ancestral Recall that is a creature, is white, is a human soldier, costs one more mana and doesn't draw cards. Other than that they are exactly the same.
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It's a Kumano, Master Yamabushi for one mana, that isn't Legendary and happens to be a goblin...

Also the ability is priced differently and is lacking an important effect, also the power and toughness are much different. Other than that the similarities are uncanny. It's like I've been saying for years, Squire is an Ancestral Recall that is a creature, is white, is a human soldier, costs one more mana and doesn't draw cards. Other than that they are exactly the same.


oh man

if only analogies could communicate ideas without being perfect comparisons

 

120.6. Some effects replace card draws.

 

why are you here when NGA exists and is just better

It's a Kumano, Master Yamabushi for one mana, that isn't Legendary and happens to be a goblin...

Also the ability is priced differently and is lacking an important effect, also the power and toughness are much different. Other than that the similarities are uncanny. It's like I've been saying for years, Squire is an Ancestral Recall that is a creature, is white, is a human soldier, costs one more mana and doesn't draw cards. Other than that they are exactly the same.



The point is that both have continual damage potential mitigated only by available mana, a trait that not many cards have. 

I'm having trouble effectively defining the search terms on Gatherer, but it seems like similar effects are only found on...

Arc-Slogger
Brothers of Fire
Falkenrath Exterminator
Kumano, Master Yamabushi
Niv-Mizzet, Dracogenius
Reckless Embermage
Shivan Hellkite 

To the best of the knowledge that several minutes using Gatherer has imparted upon me, these are the only other creatures in the game with on-demand damage to creatures or players that doesn't involve sacrifice or tapping.  Of them, only Kumano, Niv-Mizzet, and the Shivan Hellkite don't also have other restrictions on their activated ability. There weren't many better comparisons to Spikeshot Elder than Kumano.

Bro, do you even Autocard?

Autocarding: [c]Cryptic Command[/c] = Cryptic Command

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It's a Kumano, Master Yamabushi for one mana, that isn't Legendary and happens to be a goblin...

Also the ability is priced differently and is lacking an important effect, also the power and toughness are much different. Other than that the similarities are uncanny. It's like I've been saying for years, Squire is an Ancestral Recall that is a creature, is white, is a human soldier, costs one more mana and doesn't draw cards. Other than that they are exactly the same.


oh man

if only analogies could communicate ideas without being perfect comparisons


It would have been fine if he didn't say "here's a matching thing" and proceed to point out every single way they are different. "It's a cheaper X" would have sufficed. Why would you make a comparison and then, in the same sentence, talk me out of the two things being similar?

Sorry, I guess I'm just a writing critic that likes to riff.

So wat is gd about Spikeshot Elder? He's included in many goblin decks but I don't see the potential in it. Pls clarify!



sadistic glee ?