Does anyone do hybrids?

13 posts / 0 new
Last post
Does anyone have a hybrid character, or allow hybrid characters in their game?  I'm wondering how much of a hit or miss that concept has been.  Personally, I think it is a good thing, whether you want to have two very disparate classes (ie, warlord and warlock), or two classes that share a role (fighter and paladin, both defenders), or two classes that share a power source (cleric and invoker, both divine classes), or even share both, just differently flavored (the rogue and the ranger, both martial strikers).

One of the things I have noticed in some of the later books and editions of Dragon is that there are now paragon paths for characters that take more than one class, whether via multiclass or hybrid.  The most obvious are the recent warlord paragon paths that require in inclusion of another class.

Has anyone created paragon paths that are strictly for hybrids?  I have a few that I am willing to share, if there is any interest.  I will share one as a demonstration:


Arcane Mentalist

Prerequisite: Any hybrid arcane and hybrid psionic combination

I see patterns in the world, the ebb and flow of energy; I can control a part of that flow, either with words of power, or with my thoughts.”

The combination of psionics and magic is a potent one. On the one hand, your powers of the mind can cause you to shatter stone walls or steel armor; your arcane power can unleash fire or cold or corrosion upon your enemies. Now as you reach the paragon tier, you see that you can combine them to devastating effect, whether or destroy your enemies or protect yourself and your allies.

Arcane Mentalist Action (11th level): When you spend an action point to take another action, choose an effect: 1) all enemies within 5 squares of you take damage equal to your highest ability modifier; 2) all allies within 5 squares of you gain temporary hit points equal to your highest ability modifier.

Language is No Barrier (11th level): You gain Linguist as a bonus feat. You also gain a +5 power bonus to Diplomacy, Bluff, and Intimidate skill checks when using any language you have learned.

Power Point Bonus (11th level): If your hybrid psionic class uses power points, you gain 2 power points. If it does not use power points, you do not gain this bonus.

Rituals (16th level): Choose three rituals of your level or below. You can now cast those rituals as if you had the Ritual Caster feat. If you already have the Ritual Caster feat, you gain those three rituals in addition to any that you might gain. Once per day, you can cast one of your rituals without cost.

Mind Blast Arcane Mentalist Attack 11

Encounter * Arcane, Psionic, Implement

Standard Action Area burst 2 within 10

Target: All creatures in the area

Attack: Highest ability vs. Will

Hit: 3d6 + highest ability modifier psychic damage, and the targets are stunned until the end of your next turn (save ends).

Instant Armor Arcane Mentalist Utility 12

Encounter * Arcane, Psionic

Immediate Interrupt

Target: You or one ally

Trigger: You or the target take damage

Effect: The damage taken the attack is reduced to 0, and the target gains a +4 power bonus to all defenses until the end of your next turn.

Fury Unleashed Arcane Mentalist Attack 20

Daily * Arcane, Psionic, Implement

Standard Action Close blast 5

Target: All enemies in the blast

Attack: Highest ability vs. Will

Hit: 3d8 + highest ability modifier psychic damage, and the target is pushed a number of squares equal to your highest ability modifer.

Miss: Half damage, and the target is pushed 1 square.


Questions? Comments?  Jokes?
I don't generally play hybrids, but I do on occasion. In general I'm not high on them, but only because it can lead to people making poor characters. Also, the essential hybrid classes turn my stomach.

I haven't made any paragon paths myself though I have done a few themes. I am more into primal and martial classes and would love to see any hybrids for that.

Reality Refracted: Social Contracts

My blog of Random Stuff 

Dreaming the Impossible Dream
Imagine a world where the first-time D&D player rolls stats, picks a race, picks a class, picks an alignment, and buys gear to create a character. Imagine if an experienced player, maybe the person helping our theoretical player learn the ropes, could also make a character by rolling ability scores and picking a race, class, feat, skills, class features, spells or powers, and so on. Those two players used different paths to build characters, but the system design allows them to play at the same table. -Mearl

"It is a general popular error to suppose the loudest complainers for the publick to be the most anxious for its welfare." - Edmund Burke

Back to Product and General D&D Discussions -- because the mobile site is bad. (Fixed!)

Interesting that you have made themes....I hadn't thought about that, really (shades of Evil the Cat!!).

In any case, I posted one of my hybrid paragon paths above.  I'm interested in what you think about it.  (BTW, all hybrid paragon paths get the hybrid talent option as a bonus feat).
I usually let experienced Players run Hybrids.
Well-built Hybrids are very, very solid characters.

That said, I've been experimenting with the following
- Multiclasses with inbuilt Power Swaps (ie with 1 feat you can swap any of your 3 types of Powers)
- transferrable" Class Features with Multiclass feats
- Stat Switching so more effective Multiclass and Hybrids are available
- Separating Classes (and Class Features) from Roles so players can mix and match
Even relatively inexperienced players, with a little guidance, can turn out some lethal power selections and mixes.

One of my side aims is to see if a semi-Classless system might be balanced, where powers are selected by Source instead of by Class, or perhaps (thematically unhinging) simply powers are denoted by Levels and separate from Class.

The results have been very encouraging, but be prepared to run a more challenging game than what is in the modules. Assuming the Players who Hybrid know what they're doing, and they do so to optimise, the overall capability of the party improves, but that can leave "Stragglers" that aren't optimised, so be prepared to sit down with those who with less effective characters to understand if they're getting what they want from the game, and provide guidance if they want their Characters to become comparable with the rest.

I am Blue/White

Thank you!  Much more helpful here than in other threads.
Edit: Fixed the errors. Seems the stupid forum codes messed up my post real bad :/

PP Powers

Instant Armor is good. It looks a lot like Shield. I think with +4 power bonus to Defense there is no need to add Damage is reduced to 0, since it makes it a bit redundant.
You can also add : If the Attack still hits you, you can Augment 1 to cancel the Armor and regain the use of it.
I'm trying to add more Augments since IMO this is really a Psionic thing (Monks aside)

Mind Blast with Stunned (Save Ends) (not sure if that is a typo) is waay too powerful for an Encounter Power, most of which have effects lasting until ENT.
If it is Stunned until ENT, that is cool, but Area Burst 2 is still huge, and stunned is a relatively strong effect.

In comparison, Fury Unleashed is weak for a lv 20 daily. If anything, this should be an Encounter Power, perhaps using Sec Stat (ie Second highest Stat) for distance.
If it remains a Daily, make it a slide, it would be a lot more useful ; and on a miss, it also slides 2 (a lot more useful than slide 1).

You might wish to switch them though, since they're both nice on their own.
Fury Unleashed can be the Lv 11 Encounter with a Blast 5 push on Second Highest Ability Mod, no effect on a miss (for Encounter Power, Push is more appropriate I think, Slide is too powerful)
Mind Blast can be the Lv 20 Daily with a Burst 2 Stunned (SE). On a miss, Target takes half damage and is Dazed until ENT.


PP Features
Maybe I'm too used to optimising, but what I see are 2 out of 4 Features are Fluff.

For most of the Psionic Classes, they simply use this notation for Power Points.
Paragon Power Points (11th level): You gain 2 additional power points.

Arcane Mentalist Action is nice. You might want to consider what is the typical role of a Psionic and/or Arcane Character. They're typically Striker or Controller/Defender. The Damage part is great, the THP part might be changed perhaps to slid squares equal to half your Highest Ability Mod. This fits Controller well, especially imagining a Psionic fellow sending out waves of Horror (Arcane) from his mind to those all around. That said, this is only a Flavor Recommendation and not at all important, feel free to ignore my note.

Language is no Barrier does not make much flavor sense to me. Many Arcane / Psionic Characters might not even have high Charisma, or be trained in Diplomacy, etc. It does not seem related, or it could be just the optimiser within me protesting (yeah, so reason to ignore this note as well, lol).
Further, +5 bonus is a lot. Assuming the Character has half-decent CHA and is trained in Diplomacy, it will likely equal or exceed medium DC, and pass Hard DC on a 5+. You might want to do a Skill DC check to see if my comments are accurate. I suggest just a +2 bonus works.

Alternatively, replace Language is no Barrier with something more characteristic of Psionics and Arcane.
Augmented Arcane : When you use any At Will or Encounter Arcane Power, you can spend 1 Power Point to deal additional Psychic damage equal to your Second Highest Ability Mod.

Rituals (16th level):
Many Arcane Classes have this, notably mention Wizards. This is a weak Lv 16 Class feature, unless it is for fluff. If you want to be Ritual focused, you might want to replace it with something funkier if you like
Battle Ritualist, where you can spend 4 PP and use a Standard Action to cast a Rituals with a Standard Action in an Encounter. This applies only if the Ritual does not affect the Enemy.

Alternatively, you can consider...
Between Arcane and Psionics (16th Level) As a Minor Action once per Encounter, you can either spend 2 Power Points to regain an expended Encounter Attack Power that is under Level 10, or you can expend an Encounter Attack Power to regain 2 Power Points.

A more OP but just as sensible version would be.
Between Arcane and Psionics (16th Level) As a Minor Action once per Encounter, you can either spend Power Points to regain an expended Encounter Attack Power, or you can expend an Encounter Attack Power to regain Power Points. An Encounter Attack Power is worth 2 Power Points per Tier.

Hope this helps. I enjoy designing Paragon Paths Albeit, from an PowerGamer's POV.

I am Blue/White

fixed the formatting error. bleagh.

I am Blue/White

"Has anyone created paragon paths that are strictly for hybrids?"

Erm, no. I wouldn't suggest that either, you can always list it as
Prerequisite: Warlord, Fighter
Prerequisite: Arcane Power Source, Psionic Power Source, Psionic Augmentation Class Feature

This way multiclasses can get it.

I've been working on Role-specific Paragon Paths.
I try to use the following 4E Examples would be references the following very useful Paragon Paths
- Son of Mercy (Defender role) : this PP is unique in how it can Slow, proc World Serpent's Grasp and Headsman's Chop, and easily provide CA. It works well with a Twin Strike on a Defender.
- Champion of Order / Hospitaler : two famously broken Defender PPs
- Lyrandar Wind-rider : open to all, screams Striker / Controller
- Morninglord : open to all, screams Striker / Controller, maybe even Leader
- Stormwarden : arguably one of the few Striker PPs that grants a Highest Stat Mod bonus to damage, almost unconditional, and at Level 11 (not 16)
- Student of Caiphon / Daggermaster/ Resurgent Wilder : PPs with 18-20 crit range. Can be adapted, but generally Striker role
- Warforged Lifeseeker : Leader role
- Miracle Worker : another leader PP

I am Blue/White

Thank you for your ideas.  I appreciate the way you have thought this out and actually come up with something constructive.   Someone in another thread is really indulging their Arrogance skill check...must have dumped their Diplomacy skill, lol.

I shall look into making the changes, including making them available for multiclassers as well.

Again, thank you.
Glad to be of useful input ^^;

As I mentioned before though, I'm a Power Gamer and I run games for Power Gamers. So most of my input and work are mechanical / combat based.

Depending on what sort of games you run, this may not be at all appropriate for you and your group.

I am Blue/White

Interestingly I love hybrids probably for the opposite reason... not being a powergamer although I pay some attention to effectiveness, the thing about hybrids which attracts me is the flavor freedom... your Paladin/Lock might have neither Religion or Arcana on their skill list ... or my hybrid of two divine classes (invoker/clerc) which I used to create a Vampiric Bloodwright.

of note while she has a mace its pretty rarely used ;p


  Creative Character Build Collection and The Magic of King's and Heros  also Can Martial Characters Fly? 

Improvisation in 4e: Fave 4E Improvisations - also Wrecans Guides to improvisation beyond page 42
The Non-combatant Adventurer (aka Princess build Warlord or LazyLord)
Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness
Reflavoring the Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage - Creative Character Collection: Bloodwright (Darksun Character) 

At full hit points and still wounded to incapacitation? you are playing 1e.
By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one
"Wizards and Warriors need abilities with explicit effects for opposite reasons. With the wizard its because you need to create artificial limits on them, they have no natural ones and for the Warrior you need to grant permission to do awesome."


I play Hybrids all the time. I might be one of the few in my gaming group that does.


Hybrids are a wild animal to tame but in the hands of an expert player, you can get some really cool things done.

As such, I all but forbid new players to try making a Hybrid. You don't want to leave them without any of the failsafes the system has built in.


I'm currently playing an Avenger|Druid hybrid for a Polearm Momentum build and it's working out beautifully.


Now, to address some of your questions:


Does anyone have a hybrid character, or allow hybrid characters in their game?

Yes, I play and allow them in my games, but only by experienced players who know the system well enough to actually make a viable hybrid.



I'm wondering how much of a hit or miss that concept has been.

I also think it's a good thing, though obviously you have to tread carefully. I've used it to combine different play-styles into a more versatile class. My Blackguard|Sorcerer was one hell of a "mage in plate armor" and along with the Templar theme, I was a Defender, Striker, and Leader all at the same time.

I love builds that give me lots of things to do from both melee and ranged distances.


Has anyone created paragon paths that are strictly for hybrids?

I wouldn't recommend something so specific. As others said before, it would be better to just make the Path something that requires two classes, or two power sources or something like that, without it being strictly for Hybrids only.

      Sure, I've played several hybreds.  The prime one was a sorcerer-cleric who has reached 14th.  I understand this is not a top choice, but I like strikers, sorcerers in particular, and that extra head is useful.

Sign In to post comments