4/18/2013 CT: "An Appreciation for Tokens"

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This thread is for discussion of this week's Command Tower, which goes live Thursday morning on magicthegathering.com.
I guess Emmara Tandris is only good when you are playing Momir basic.
I can't put into words how let down I am by her card. Honestly if your selling this as a commander card you have TONS of better ways to protect your field as a whole, let alone tokens. I am just so very sad....
How did a piece of garbage like Emmara make it out of R&D? There is no format I would ever conceivably play her in. Not Limited, not EDH, and CERTAINLY not Constructed. Seriously, she's as bad or worse than a lot of the terrible terrible legends from the original Legends set. She's a giant vanilla creature that potentially does nothing.  Even with tokens out, she doesn't prevent them from being destroyed.  One board sweep and you're out her and all your tokens. Why couldn't she have made them indestructible? Or do ANYTHING other than what is printed on her card. Green/White is my favorite color combination to play and we've been given absolute trash in our champion slot. One of the worst designed cards I've seen out of Wizards in years.
Wow, this is worse then Teysa and Mirko what a wasted cycle of cards.
Im seeing a LOT of big costed critters....  And I like tokens, but this card... just ug.  It might turn out okay...  trying to be positive...  I like cake!
I am severely dissapointed.
How did a piece of garbage like Emmara make it out of R&D? There is no format I would ever conceivably play her in. Not Limited, not EDH, and CERTAINLY not Constructed. Seriously, she's as bad or worse than a lot of the terrible terrible legends from the original Legends set. She's a giant vanilla creature that potentially does nothing.  Even with tokens out, she doesn't prevent them from being destroyed.  One board sweep and you're out her and all your tokens. Why couldn't she have made them indestructible? Or do ANYTHING other than what is printed on her card. Green/White is my favorite color combination to play and we've been given absolute trash in our champion slot. One of the worst designed cards I've seen out of Wizards in years.



I think this is going to be fine in limited. The card has a huge body and the second effect will be relevant, or at least can be a lot of the time. However a guild champion should be more than just passable in limited.

Wow, this is worse then Teysa and Mirko what a wasted cycle of cards.



At least Teysa is a powerful clock and Mirko works for Dimir. I love G/W and am a fan of commander and I do not like anything about this card.

Wow. She's not even going in my G/W token deck, let alone beating Rhys and Tolsimir for the position of Commander.


At least the new Teysa no longer seems so disappointing by comparisson.

Cyclonic Rift will still mess up a token deck pretty handily.
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This card does nothing an EDH token deck wants to do.
I love tokens, big creatures, EDH and Selesnya. I AM the target audience for this card. It sucks. It doesn't impress me at all.
Wow! I'm amazed!

Amazed how this got past any quality control. If a competitor for "the great designer search" would submit this card as "a legendary creature presenting the color pair green & white" I think they would outright be kicked from  the contest.

This card is an utter mess.

There are clearly Voice of Resurgence Tokens in the Art - but none on the card effect-wise.
The Art depicts a slim Elf-humanoid. The card gives her the body of Hexplate Golem.
The Card is a matter of too little too late. She is very narrow in what she does. And in the end there are several Cards that play with token theme better than Emmara. Especially Avacyn, Angel of Hope comes to Mind. She protects your tokens as well - and every other permanent, and oh wow she protects herself.

I feel a bit sorry for Adam Styborski because he needed to write this article. It's like describing why Kemba's Legion is a great card and totally awesome for Commander while... it's just a limited card, and a very bad one at that. That brings me to another point.
She's even bad in limited. I would rather play Axebane Stag instead of her - of course both just if I don't get the chance to play anything worthwhile.

I don't know when was the last time we got such bad legendary creatures. I got my Hope up because every Legendary from the recent sets was at least fringe playable in Standard at worst AND was at least a nice twist for commander.

Worst designed card in recent time. 
How about "creature tokens are indestructable and cannot be returned to your hand".  For a 7 mana legendary creature I'm still not sure that is good enough, but at least it would be exciting and new.  While I can't see how that would be too good, I could see how someone might think it is too unfun.  If so, though, the entire idea of the card needed to be replaced.
I want another article on Emmara explaining how anyone thought this was a good idea. It's been years since I posted on this board. You guys print some crap from time to time, and some stellar stuff at other times. I've been content to leave well enough alone. How is this a guild champion? Trostani's Summoner does more of what token decks want doing. She could have at least also given them +1/+1 or Hexproof or something.

You guys remember Avacyn, Angel of Hope? Yes, she was Mythic, but for only one more mana, she's +3/+1, flying, vigilant, and uses actual indestructibility and not just damage prevention. On top of affecting all your permanents, to boot.

I'm not saying she had to be constructed playable, but this isn't even very good in limited until if and when you can get a couple of flying tokens out too. Heck, she doesn't even populate or make a 1/1 token when she comes into play! You may end up dropping her onto a board with no tokens on it.

What's even worse is she doesn't do a single thing to help tokens where they're more vulnerable than creature cards - they still die to bounce. Heck, how is she even considered a healer? She doesn't heal anything, she prevents! Nevermind effects which say damage cannot be prevented. Yes, those are fairly rare, but it's galling to think she could entirely fail to function at the one thing she does at all and be a Legendary Hexplate Golem. You had one job, Emmara. ONE JOB!

This was a complete and total failure from top to bottom, guys. How about you guys have a do-over, re-imagine this card, and offer to send new copies to anyone who mails in copies of the original?

How about

Emmara Tandris   5GW
Legendary Creature - Elf Shaman   Rare
Creature tokens you control get +0/+2 and cannot be returned to your hand or library.
Prevent all damage that would be dealt to creature tokens you control.
5/7?

If, for some reason, "cannot be returned to your hand or library" wouldn't work within the rules and you don't feel like writing a rule to make it work, "Protection from Blue instants and sorceries" would cover it, albeit less elegantly as Blue is allied with White. The +0/+2 simiulates healing, she still has her original abilities. She's not undercosted, still would not see Standard play, but at least she'd do something for tokens that covers a major weakness of their, and more importantly for a Legendary creature - much less a guild champion - she does something which hasn't been done before. You could make EDH token decks around her because she'd offer them something they didn't have before. True, Rhys the Redeemed would probably still be competitively better, but at least Emmara would still exist as a unique option.

This was inexcusable. You owe an apology to anyone who opens this, particularly at the pre-release. 

Wizards: If it isn't game design, we can't do it right. Frankly, we're kind of shaky on the game design sometimes too.

At least the new Teysa no longer seems so disappointing by comparisson.



Yeah, this is about the only positive thing I could think of as well: my disappointment in Emmara dwarfs my disappointment with Teysa. Like in, hey, they could have conceivably made Teysa as bad as Emmara, but instead they, well, made Teysa "only" really bad.

Edit: Actually, let me correct that: This is so bad it is funny. I've noticed I've been giggling for the last ten minutes, imagining the process that lead this card to be printed, and not only that, but then to be chosen as a preview card. Thus it's not all bad. There is humour value here.

The idea has been proposed that this and voice of resurgence swapped bodies (abilities, power, toughness, etc), and she lost some abilities in the mythic to rare drop. It seemed to hold some water, considering the elemental that voice makes is clearly in the background of Emmara, but I'd like the official story on it.
At least the new Teysa no longer seems so disappointing by comparisson.



Yeah, this is about the only positive thing I could think of as well: my disappointment in Emmara dwarfs my disappointment with Teysa. Like in, hey, they could have conceivably made Teysa as bad as Emmara, but instead they, well, made it only really bad.

Edit: Actually, let me correct that: This is so bad it is funny. I've noticed I've been giggling for the last ten minutes, imagining the process that lead this card to be printed, and not only that, but then to be chosen as a preview card. Thus it's not all bad. There is humour value here.




It's so funny that the article's author was laughing too hard to actually talk about the card; note he spends 75% of the article just talking about different ways to make tokens. You know, like this champion card doesn't do. In the token-making guild. Hopefully Monday we'll see some kind of apology article for this disaster of a card. Poor author should have been given something else to preview; previews are to drum up sales. Who is going to see this card and go "Well NOW I want a box of DGM!"?

So many bad decisions with this card. 

Wizards: If it isn't game design, we can't do it right. Frankly, we're kind of shaky on the game design sometimes too.

Sorry, me again. God of Atheism already made a comparison how much more you get for one mana more with Avacyn, Angel of Hope.

But I have another point of comparison: how much better Vigor is at one six (instead of seven) mana. Almost any deck that would play Emmara would be improved by swapping it out for Vigor, for one mana less to boot. Ok, triple green, but... come on!

[And who in their right minds would bother going through the trouble of reanimating Emmara? Living Death is the only thing I can think of that would make you rather have Emmara than Vigor, and even then, not really worth it by that time. You should have better things to do with Living Death.]
OMG!

Why didn't they just make a card that completely DESTROYS any other Legend every printed? What about MY feelings? Did Wizards not think that I would want a Legend that was one mana, make a token for three mana, and made them completely bonkers? Or maybe One where, if my Legend died, he killed all tokens he made before? What about a Legend that had to copy a token already made? How could I possibly use that!? But this thing? This thing is so horrible! You have to use OTHER CARDS to make some of these cards work! That's just boring?! And who would ever pay more than 2-3 mana for a Legend? Are you STUPID?!!!!

Why couldn't they just make it make your tokens INDESTRUCTIBLE, so sweepers are useless against your giant token swarm?! Or how about how they can't have their toughness reduced, so that stupid Mutilate doesn't just SLAUGHTER them!! What about Bounce? It just DESTROYS token decks! SO HORRIBLE!!!! We all know that DAMAGE is meaningless in decks everywhere!!!

Who is the HORRIBLE person who designed this dreck?! I want to congratulate them for the brown smear that everyone has an issue with because it doesn't make a token deck that just WRECKS every strategy bent to find those decks! I mean, sure, it does MORE to protect its tokens than ANY OTHER Token-Centric General EVER PRINTED, but that's not ENOUGH, right? How about how much more effective this THING is in dealing combat damage to an opponent than ANY OTHER Token-Centric General EVER PRINTED?! No, not enough! It must blow the **** of any other Token General out of the water as if hit by a Planetellicite Shell! (AND THAT'S F**KING FINAL).
"Possibilities abound, too numerous to count." "Innocent, unbiased observation is a myth." --- P.B. Medawar (1969) "Ever since man first left his cave and met a stranger with a different language and a new way of looking at things, the human race has had a dream: to kill him, so we don't have to learn his language or his new way of looking at things." --- Zapp Brannigan (Beast With a Billion Backs)
Surely Wizards you are not kidding yourself that this is anything less than terrible design. This would not be acceptable in an abandoned YMTC thread, let alone as a spotlight card and guild champion. Ask yourself, would you really run this in a token deck? I wouldn't. It isn't what a token deck needs at 7 mana. I would much rather run collective blessing for less. For entirely missing the point of a token deck it deserves the boos it is getting in this thread.

I'm also not wild about the 5/7 stats for such a slim looking humanoid - that may seem picky but following the same complaint about Tesya 2.0 it seems you have taken a very lazy approach to these kind of details.

I have to include myself as one of those who thinks the voice of resurgence casting cost, stats and abilities were at some point swapped with this card... consider the following

she looks like a 2/2
she's not a warrior elf or anything else that explains her power
other legendary elves are 2/2 for two mana, I'd almost say it was the default
a legendary 2/2 for  with a cool ability has the right kind of precedent
she's sitting on top of the art for the token that the VOR abilties generate
she's a shaman - creating a token is a shaman thing, creating a protective bubble is a cleric thing*
I'll say again, she looks like a 2/2

*if you gatherer search "shamans" which have token generation abilities you get 24 returns, if you search "shamans" which have "prevent" and "damage" in their text you get zero returns
 
By comparison, the VOR looks like a stag, which in this block we know to be big butted fatties.   
 
I think its time to fess up. You swapped this because she was too good to be a mere rare, and you didn't want to pass up the opportunity to create another godforsaken chase mythic. You and your damn mythics.
OMG!

Why didn't they just make a card that completely DESTROYS any other Legend every printed? What about MY feelings? Did Wizards not think that I would want a Legend that was one mana, make a token for three mana, and made them completely bonkers? Or maybe One where, if my Legend died, he killed all tokens he made before? What about a Legend that had to copy a token already made? How could I possibly use that!? But this thing? This thing is so horrible! You have to use OTHER CARDS to make some of these cards work! That's just boring?! And who would ever pay more than 2-3 mana for a Legend? Are you STUPID?!!!!

Why couldn't they just make it make your tokens INDESTRUCTIBLE, so sweepers are useless against your giant token swarm?! Or how about how they can't have their toughness reduced, so that stupid Mutilate doesn't just SLAUGHTER them!! What about Bounce? It just DESTROYS token decks! SO HORRIBLE!!!! We all know that DAMAGE is meaningless in decks everywhere!!!

Who is the HORRIBLE person who designed this dreck?! I want to congratulate them for the brown smear that everyone has an issue with because it doesn't make a token deck that just WRECKS every strategy bent to find those decks! I mean, sure, it does MORE to protect its tokens than ANY OTHER Token-Centric General EVER PRINTED, but that's not ENOUGH, right? How about how much more effective this THING is in dealing combat damage to an opponent than ANY OTHER Token-Centric General EVER PRINTED?! No, not enough! It must blow the **** of any other Token General out of the water as if hit by a Planetellicite Shell! (AND THAT'S F**KING FINAL).


This is one of the dumbest posts I've ever read on these boards.

IMAGE(http://i1.minus.com/jbcBXM4z66fMtK.jpg)

192884403 wrote:
surely one can't say complex conditional passive language is bad grammar ?
No, not enough! It must blow the **** of any other Token General out of the water as if hit by a Planetellicite Shell!



Or alternatively, it would be enough if it was a playable token general. It doesn't need to be better than any of the ones that already exist. Simply being playable (in casual formats, not talking of constructed) would be enough.

OMG!

Why didn't they just make a card that completely DESTROYS any other Legend every printed? What about MY feelings? Did Wizards not think that I would want a Legend that was one mana, make a token for three mana, and made them completely bonkers? Or maybe One where, if my Legend died, he killed all tokens he made before? What about a Legend that had to copy a token already made? How could I possibly use that!? But this thing? This thing is so horrible! You have to use OTHER CARDS to make some of these cards work! That's just boring?! And who would ever pay more than 2-3 mana for a Legend? Are you STUPID?!!!!

Why couldn't they just make it make your tokens INDESTRUCTIBLE, so sweepers are useless against your giant token swarm?! Or how about how they can't have their toughness reduced, so that stupid Mutilate doesn't just SLAUGHTER them!! What about Bounce? It just DESTROYS token decks! SO HORRIBLE!!!! We all know that DAMAGE is meaningless in decks everywhere!!!

Who is the HORRIBLE person who designed this dreck?! I want to congratulate them for the brown smear that everyone has an issue with because it doesn't make a token deck that just WRECKS every strategy bent to find those decks! I mean, sure, it does MORE to protect its tokens than ANY OTHER Token-Centric General EVER PRINTED, but that's not ENOUGH, right? How about how much more effective this THING is in dealing combat damage to an opponent than ANY OTHER Token-Centric General EVER PRINTED?! No, not enough! It must blow the **** of any other Token General out of the water as if hit by a Planetellicite Shell! (AND THAT'S F**KING FINAL).



Your mockery would work better if anyone were suggesting these ridiculous measures you are exaggerating them in to. No one said this needed to be the best card ever. We just wanted something that wasn't insulting. It is a failure, plain and simple. She is not good from a power perspective - she's a 5/7 for 7 with no combat abilities. She's not good from a flavour perspective; she's a healer who doesn't heal. Prevention is similar, but that's not what she actually does in the story.

Yes, she protects tokens. As has been pointed out in this thread before it's even gotten to its second page, there's at least two better ways do so - Avacyn and Vigour. They're not even specific to tokens. They had a chance to do something unique here and they blew it. True, only one of them can be used as a general in EDH, but nothing is perfect. As two people have pointed out, the true weakness of tokens isn't that they take damage, it's that bounce kills them. If you ever played during the days of UG Madness, you'd know that.

For the record, I don't like token decks. I don't play them. They're not my style. They tend to either flop terribly or overkill, with little middle ground. Not to mention as soon as most tables figure out you're playing tokens, you generally paint a huge target on yourself unless there's an obvious combo player who needs to be taken out first. So this isn't some kind of personal bias driving me to complain about something that affects me personally. It's me saying that people who do enjoy those sorts of decks deserved better of Wizards.

As for the one actual point you did attempt to make drowned in that mass of bile, that Emmara "does more to protect its tokens than any other token-centric general ever printed," I could make arguments against that, depending on what we're willing to consider token-centric. Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite doesn't specifically mention tokens, but the more creatures you have, the better off the bonus is. Sure, a 4/4 disparity between your creatures and opposing creatures won't stop Blasphemous Act, but for most combat situations, it will do as good or better than Emmara. On top of acting as mass removal. For the same cost and only one power less - which she gets Vigilance in exchange for.

Kamahl, Fist of Krosa has similar uses. Tolsimir Wolfblood offers a general boost, can keep making a token any time it dies (although being fair, anything that could kill the token can probably kill him as well) and is also in the same colours as Emmara. Raksha Golden Cub also provides a nice mass boost to help tokens out. Mind you, I'm only looking at White and Green cards here, because most likely those are the colours one would want for a token deck (although I could present arguments for any colour, particularly if we're willing to be tribal.)

But here's the real kicker; Rune-Tail, Kitsune Ascendant's flip Rune-Tail's Essence does exactly what she does, better (by not limiting it to tokens), for four less mana, and if you're using it as an EDH general, until you lose eleven or more life, he's going to auto-flip. The only drawback is not being GW.

Wizards: If it isn't game design, we can't do it right. Frankly, we're kind of shaky on the game design sometimes too.

I mean, sure, it does MORE to protect its tokens than ANY OTHER Token-Centric General EVER PRINTED, but that's not ENOUGH, right?

Faint praise given that it's the ONLY token-centric commander ever printed that attempts to protect tokens in any way. (I suppose one could make a case for Ghave, which IS pretty good at "protecting" tokens through recycling them into other tokens.) Emmara is pretty bad at protecting tokens, even compared to several non-token-centric cards, and is vastly inferior to Ghave, Guru of Spores, Rhys the Redeemed, Tolsimir Wolfblood and Trostani, Selesnya's Voice if you just want a good W/G token-centric commander.

I've noticed I've been giggling for the last ten minutes, imagining the process that lead this card to be printed, and not only that, but then to be chosen as a preview card.

Poor author should have been given something else to preview; previews are to drum up sales. Who is going to see this card and go "Well NOW I want a box of DGM!"?

They kind of have their hands tied there. No matter how bad the card is, they can't NOT make a preview article around all ten of the showcase maze-running legends. Nor can they admit their mistake and appologize for the awful design (which, credit where it's due, MtG designers tend to actually do) until a while after set release.
This card is really bad.  Not in a 'this won't see constructed play' way.  In a 'this will barely see any casual play' way.  

If you couldn't have made her good, you could have at least made her mediocre, if you couldn't have made her mediocre, at least you could have made her interesting.  
This is one of the dumbest posts I've ever read on these boards.



Well, it is a white-knighting post. And this thing is kinda hard to white-knight. I'd give him a gold star for trying.
They kind of have their hands tied there. No matter how bad the card is, they can't NOT make a preview article around all ten of the showcase maze-running legends.



Good point. But if these maze-running legends are supposed to be the showcases of the set, you would think they would have put a little more effort into designing them, no? And not give us complete garbage like Teysa 2.0 or Emmara?

The sad part is that they aren't even garbage from a purely constructed point of view. They are garbage from a casual point of view too. And that might still be forgivable if they had good flavour or interesting mechanics. But they are also garbage from a flavour-perspective and garbage from a mechanics-perspective.

In short, they are pure garbage all-around.

Teysa 2.0 isn't actually all that horrible. She's a 4/4 with 4 abilities for 7 - that would have been 9 mana back in the day. No, she won't be Standard playable unless she's reanimated out - and that's not entirely impossible, either. She's not bad for EDH though - even though I would have preferred her at 5 or 6 mana with just the Vigilance and Pro-Creatures. Maybe Extort, or "Extort costs cost you () less to pay." Just her first two abilities are a good combination; she can block most creatures fearlessly and still swing for a not-insignificant amount of damage unblockably. The other two abilities do work well with her guild; a No Mercy effect works well with lifegain, and she does generate good chump blockers off it as well.

For that matter, she's not bad with Heartless Summoning. Sure, you lose the tokens, but then you still have a 3/3 Vigilance/Pro-Dudes/No Mercy for 5.

She's not perfect, but she's not bad, and she's miles better than Emmara - which now that I think about it, is an anagram of "Am Mare." Most horses are a deal less ugly, though. Actually, "Emmara Tandris" anagrams into "I am rant's dream."

Maybe she's not such a flavour failure after all...

Wizards: If it isn't game design, we can't do it right. Frankly, we're kind of shaky on the game design sometimes too.

I love how a card that is god-awful in Commander was previewed in the Commander column.

This card isn't just terrible from a power perspective, it's terrible from a fun perspective. Imagine little Timmy opens this in a pack. He's looking at a fatty that doesn't have Haste, Trample, Vigilance, Flying, Lifelink, First Strike, nope, naddah. He is looking at a fattie that will get walled. And that's the worst kind of fatty for little Timmy, because poor Timmy is crying and wondering why he put this pile in his deck instead of some cool card like Teysa (heh) that can actually hit the opponent.
I love how a card that is god-awful in Commander was previewed in the Commander column.



Being fair, it's god-awful in everything and apparently they had to preview it somewhere.

Wizards: If it isn't game design, we can't do it right. Frankly, we're kind of shaky on the game design sometimes too.

As much as I want to stand up for this card, I have to agree with everyone when I say I am stumped, the only way I can consieve of being able to play this card is if I have utopia sprawl, and other mana ramp cards. However in limited I wouldn't use her as it's a turn 7 card or 6 if you play a mana ramp spell.

In EDH she's too focused on tokens yet is too expencive to summon early to benefit them and doesn't protect the from area effect spells which there are alot of in EDH.

I think they should bring down her cost to 5 mana and her stats to 1/5. That way she benefits tokens and isn't to hard to play. The only time I would pay 7 mana is for a card that will make me win or a card that will give me a clear advantage over my opponent. Not one that will protect my tokens, individually.

That being said I am interested if anyone has any ideas on how to build a deck with her? I think I'd play GW, using utopia sprawl, and parralel lives, incorporating call of the conclave and ichron scepter.
IMAGE(http://i1287.photobucket.com/albums/a637/Duke-Daemon/impurple_zps3e279094.jpg)
Also am I the only one here who would love to see some cheap green or white mana ramp in Dragon's Maze? Clue stones are not cheap for three mana....
IMAGE(http://i1287.photobucket.com/albums/a637/Duke-Daemon/impurple_zps3e279094.jpg)
Man, this card is garbage. I was hoping that when someone spoiled it last night that it was fake.

Seriously, how can you EVER play this in commander? It doesn't even give your tokens indestructible. Damage Prevention might as well not exist with the number of sweepers in EDH.

Not to mention that this card is a 110% flavor fail. Emmara's abilities don't line up AT ALL with what she does in the flavor (healer and elemental summoner) and seriously- who thought it was a good idea to have a elf with a huge power and toughness?

This (and the other champions) might be the most dissapointing cycle of spoilers ever. 

(at)MrEnglish22

I would really like to know the reason for this disaster. There is no way anyone creating magic cards for a living is looking at this card an thinking "yeah I like that card, we did a good job". I think every Wizards employe could come up with a better card in mere 5 minutes. So why is she such a mess?

Emmara Tandris 

Legendary Creature — Elf Shaman 2/2

: Regenerate another target creature.

, , Discard a land card: Put an 8/8 green and white Elemental creature token with vigilance onto the battlefield. 

That would have been logical, flavorful, balanced and yet playable.

More in line with the art?

Show
Emmara Tandris Legendary Creature — Elf Shaman 2/2 , , Put a green and white Elemental creature token with "This creatures power and toughness are each equal to the number of creatures you control" on the battlefield.

If they really wanted to make her cmc  and only a silly Token buff, why not like this?
 

Show
Emmara Tandris Legendary Creature — Elf Shaman 5/7 Creature tokens you control are indestructible and get +2/+2, vigilance and trample.


At least a tiny incentive to play her (would still dislike that design)



The printed version is the worst legendary creature since  [C]Nagao, Bound by Honor[/c] long ago in Kamigawa.
And that card was unimportant storywise, just an uncommon AND STILL NOT AS BAD AS EMMARA!

And this is just how this card feels like. An uninspired uncommon limited filler card with the name and art of one flagship card for Magic & Dragons Maze. 
A 4 mana card that makes French Vanilla 8/8s for two mana a pop (even with the discard) would be a little too good, though. That would easily be Mythic if it saw print at all. 

Wizards: If it isn't game design, we can't do it right. Frankly, we're kind of shaky on the game design sometimes too.

So, I did a gatherer search for elves with power > 3. There are 15.  4 of those have 5 power. 3 of them are mutants.
There are 25 3 power elves.
There are 226 with power of 1, 2, or *
The largest Elf before Emmara was a 6/6 Elf Mutant in the block all about big dudes.

WHY IS EMMARA A 5/7? 

(at)MrEnglish22

This is one of the dumbest posts I've ever read on these boards.



Well, it is a white-knighting post. And this thing is kinda hard to white-knight. I'd give him a gold star for trying.



Understand that I have no strong feelings about this card, merely responding to stupid, idiotic arguments from various players; rather specific arguments made are, by themselves, bothersome as everything used mentioned to "protect tokens" that was suggested as better than this card is not a general.

In specific, I used the format of incredulous rhetoric to parody the mockery being given. Go ahead, try it out: Think as though this card is useful: Try and find a method by which you might use it. I am not saying that you SHOULD, merely stop the idiotic comments about "worst designed card." I mean, really, from an R&D standpoint, you have no idea what a poorly-designed card looks like -- a look at the card submissions for the YMTC in the current thread should give you an idea of really poorly designed cards, often little more than masturbatory wetdreams.

Someone mentioned Ghave, but the problem with Ghave is that he doesn't protect a darn thing: Imagine, if you will, that were a burn spell pointed at your Centaur, and along comes this fungus chanting a spell and voila! he EATS THE CENTAUR -- pretty bad job at protection it, I'd say, especially given that Ghave is generally used in sac engines, with Grave Pact. Avacyn stops destruction and damage from mattering, yes, and she's often quite the super-protector, but as a General you can't use Green -- not the most comparable, they work in different decks, and for the most part Avacyn is there so you can wipe the entire board yourself, not stop someone from doing so. These are at complete odds with this current card. Hell, I think Avacyn borders on an R&D wetdream, right after JtMS, given that it's got not much but a big F & U on it.

There are always strategies that work against almost any general, and there are always going to be "weak" generals. yes, I think this card represents the latter kind, closer to some of the wonkier ones from Legends, comparable to weird stuff like Nebuchadnezzar than to Hazezon Tamar, or perhaps even to Stangg. But there will always be these kinds of cards, much like Mirko Vosk, who may serve best as back-up generals, or enablers for other Generals, subcommanders to guys like Lazav or Tolsimir. There may even be strategies that work with this card AS a general that do not occur to other token generals, ones in which they intend to enable by touching on generalspace that hasn't been before. One would note, for example, that Red and Green have fewer options to deal with this general than the other colors do (they don't lack 'em, but they have fewer). Use of Vigor (no U) in EDH refers to a distinct need or purpose for its existence, and fear of its persistance on the board, at which point having a general that does half of what IT does becomes somewhat relevant. Yes, Vigor does it better, but Vigor does it differently, just as Ghave is no defense to token kill, and my Kamahl, Fist of Krosa is itself a perfect deterrent to sweepers.
"Possibilities abound, too numerous to count." "Innocent, unbiased observation is a myth." --- P.B. Medawar (1969) "Ever since man first left his cave and met a stranger with a different language and a new way of looking at things, the human race has had a dream: to kill him, so we don't have to learn his language or his new way of looking at things." --- Zapp Brannigan (Beast With a Billion Backs)

Wow. She's not even going in my G/W token deck, let alone beating Rhys and Tolsimir for the position of Commander.


At least the new Teysa no longer seems so disappointing by comparisson.




This. I was so pumped for her to be spoiled, especially after the prospect of her making tokens, but this is a massive let down... Most of my tokens die to Wraths or Mutilate type effects and this does nothing to help that. Not to mention she's overcosted for what she does, even for my elf-tribal driven mana engine, she just doesn't justify having a spot. I woulda been fine with her being a 7 drop if she had the ability to make tokens without tapping like Nemata, Grove Guardian or even something like the Selesnya Guildmage. Avacyn is so much better at what Emmara is supposed to be doing for only 1 more. /smh

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Created with Rum and Monkey's Personality Test Generator.

 

I am both orderly and instinctive. I value community and group identity, defining myself by the social group I am a part of. At best, I'm selfless and strong-willed; at worst, I'm unoriginal and mindless.

My Current EDH Decks: Rhys the Redeemed Token Elves | Wort, Boggart Auntie R/B Goblins | Brion Stoutarm | Rakdos, Lord of Riots | Tajic, Weapon with Mass Destruction | Jor-Kadeen the Prevailer | Melek, Izzet Paragon | Heliod Enchantments | Prossh Tokens and Sac | Captain Sisay Legendary Toolbox Beatdown | Marath Beast Tribal | Marath Token Combos | Horde of Notions Elemental Tribal | Zirilian Mono Red Dragon Tribal

Yes... I have 14 built decks used regularly, including 3 Boros Colored Decks. Don't judge me. =P

The problem I have with Emmara isn't that she's 5/7, or her ability to prevent damage to tokens, but the fact they decided that both of these needed to be on one card.

When a card costs more then 5 or 6 mana to cast, you better have a reason to put it out. It should either be an amazing bruiser or amazing support, Emmara tries to do both and fails misserably at doing either. I'm sorry but if a creature doesnt have any evasion at 7 mana, no matter the format,  it's not worth the effort when your opponent could be holding cards that destroy or sac it for half the cost.

I'm just glad Avacyn and Sigarda were in the Innistrad block, at least they're on color and are actually playable in a G/W Seleysna style deck.
Heck, how is she even considered a healer? She doesn't heal anything, she prevents!  



Damage prevention has long been the mechanical reflection of things that would be considered healing flavour wise.  

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