Shadow Dancers + O'ssassins.

I like them.  

And they easily combine into the same class.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

I don´t like the shadow like.... a mystic sun of necrotic energy. I would like imagine the shadow like a element withouth obligatory link with death and necrotic energy, a dark, almost tainted power, yeah, but necromancers can´t be only generals of armies of ghost pokemons. We need more variety. 

I would rather imagine the shadow like the hidden secret mystic element, like dark matter from modern Sciencie, like a special ectoplasm what can by used the spellcasters by means of secret procedures. 



I imagine the shadow magic is special because it is like a interference for other powers. More difficoult to be found or detected, but easier to counter-spell. A magic without verbal component. 

I imagine the necromancer like the defilers from Dark Sun, or the prestige class bligther from "the complete divine". And I miss the sanguinomancer, a true blood mage with powers like vampire disciples from World of Darkness rpg. 

The necromancers who only use necrotic energy are boring.. what if I wish create a good umthakathi (=witch doctor) who summons deathless (undead creatures healed by positive energy and hurt by necrotic energy)?

"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)

 

Book 13 Anaclet 23 Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"

 

"In a country well governed, poverty is something to be ashamed of. In a country badly governed, wealth is something to be ashamed of." - Confucius 

At one point there was positive, negative, holy, unholy, radiant, and necrotic.  But i agree, shadow magic should not be death magic.


I can also imagine a shadow defender build.  Turning an enemy sword insubstantial so it doesn't bite as hard, absorbing a dragons breath in shadows, or teleporting an arrow in mid flight.

[sblock A shadow dancer due-jour][/sblock]

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

The shadow defender would be the hexblade



It could be a hybrid class, martial + arcane + shadow.. 

"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)

 

Book 13 Anaclet 23 Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"

 

"In a country well governed, poverty is something to be ashamed of. In a country badly governed, wealth is something to be ashamed of." - Confucius 

I like them.  

And they easily combine into the same class.




+1 for the ossassin. my dream would be a comboination of the ossassin and the swordsage from ToB.  

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/23.jpg)

Posted this on another thread but it seems more appropriate here.

Assasins are trained be be seen, while unseen, and would focus on face changing, disguise, and to be the everyman to gain access into close knit groups, clans or organizations to take out a target. They would be a martial class steeped on ritual use to appear as any class or person. Alchemy is the preferred tool of the trade.
I like them.  

And they easily combine into the same class.




+1 for the ossassin. my dream would be a comboination of the ossassin and the swordsage from ToB.  




Ossassin + Swordsage... mmmm..... It might actually make the Ossassin good at assassinating. That was it's only weakness, lol. Shadow Hand ftw.

I liked being able to play shadow dancer as a class from level 1. The assassin gave me that. I found it silly that the shadow assassin was a rogue paragon, while the assassin who actually used shadows wasn't...
Anyway, yeah mellored. I dig it.
"What's stupid is when people decide that X is true - even when it is demonstrable untrue or 100% against what we've said - and run around complaining about that. That's just a breakdown of basic human reasoning." -Mike Mearls
Posted this on another thread but it seems more appropriate here.

Assasins are trained be be seen, while unseen, and would focus on face changing, disguise, and to be the everyman to gain access into close knit groups, clans or organizations to take out a target. They would be a martial class steeped on ritual use to appear as any class or person. Alchemy is the preferred tool of the trade.

For a martial type assassin sure.  But that can be folded into the rouge.

But the o'ssassin was very shadow-magicy assassin.  You had at-will shadow teleport, could turn insubstantial, and hide in any shadow (which shadow dancers do).  There was even a shadow coffin, where you could hide corpses in objects to dispose of later.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

I had an 8th level Tiefling hybrid Ossassin|Rogue that used two weapons.......and it was awesome. Pretty much Azazel from X-Men: Origins except I couldn't teleport 50+ feet in the air and drop people (shame) but still, loads of fun. Shroud + Cruel Shroud and Sneak Attack was a cool trick through Heroic Tier. 

But yeah, I definitly think the Ossassin needs to be mechanically represented in D&D:Next. A multiclass Rogue/Wiz or Sor just doesn't fit the bill and neither does a Rogue + Specialty either. Actually, I think the Shroud mechanic might even work fairly well in D&D:Next as is (probably a bit OP).  
I think shroud as a replacement for mdd could work. I just really dig their style. My favorite D&D moment as a PC was playing a changeling assassin. You can imagine the crowning moment of awesome (which became an awesome moment of crowning).
"What's stupid is when people decide that X is true - even when it is demonstrable untrue or 100% against what we've said - and run around complaining about that. That's just a breakdown of basic human reasoning." -Mike Mearls
Shrouds where fail in 4e, and will fail even harder in 5e because things don't last long enough.  90% of the time, shrouds where wasted, and it was a big part of your damage to loose like that.

Of course, there are adjustments that could be made.  Hybrids did better with them, since you could sneak attack while you where building shrouds, so sneak attack and shouds together might work.

Or Like if each shroud increases your crit range and you had good base damage.  Then you wouldn't be quite as dependant on them.  And starting a battle with a crit, is a very good way to be an assassin.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

I think shroud as a replacement for mdd could work.


The problem with shrouds is, even in 4e, they were never worth it, ebcause by the time you built up enough shrouds on a target, he should either be almost dead, and they took too long to set up for the damage bonus to be really be worth it. It's even less worth it in 5e at the moment since few enemies will last beyond round 2.
Shrouds where fail in 4e, and will fail even harder in 5e because things don't last long enough.  90% of the time, shrouds where wasted, and it was a big part of your damage to loose like that.

Of course, there are adjustments that could be made.  Hybrids did better with them, since you could sneak attack while you where building shrouds, so sneak attack and shouds together might work.

Or Like if each shroud increases your crit range and you had good base damage.  Then you wouldn't be quite as dependant on them.  And starting a battle with a crit, is a very good way to be an assassin.



I think shrouds would need to be completely re-imagined, or dropped. It's the stuff like the shadow form, shadow step, and all of their utility stuff that was a lot of fun. The damage needed a lot of work.
I preferred the feats which allowed me to layer shrouds on a target unawares. Then after several rounds of study start combat w/ a big hit. But, shrouds in combat were lacking. The crit range bonus is a nifty idea, but you guys are right. Building up to a big hit which never comes isn't any fun at all.
"What's stupid is when people decide that X is true - even when it is demonstrable untrue or 100% against what we've said - and run around complaining about that. That's just a breakdown of basic human reasoning." -Mike Mearls
I preferred the feats which allowed me to layer shrouds on a target unawares. Then after several rounds of study start combat w/ a big hit. But, shrouds in combat were lacking. The crit range bonus is a nifty idea, but you guys are right. Building up to a big hit which never comes isn't any fun at all.



They were kinda feat taxes, though. I mean, it shouldn't have been needed in the first place. The class definitely had a lot of problems, but it had the potential to be really awesome. That potential was just never realized, unfortunately. Now I'm afraid the entire concept may be dead.
I'd hold out a little hope. That shadow utility stuff is really fun/cool. It's what I liked first about the class. I think we'll see it as a prestige class again, but a (it came up in that other thread) generic Shadowblade could work. Wdd, a single target massive hit (or improved critability), and sweet sweet shadow utility... I'd be sold.
"What's stupid is when people decide that X is true - even when it is demonstrable untrue or 100% against what we've said - and run around complaining about that. That's just a breakdown of basic human reasoning." -Mike Mearls
Shrouds were an interesting idea, but not exactly the crowning achievement of 4e Striker mechanics. Wasn't really a fan of how they were set up in such a way that the rest of the party almost had to go out of their way to let the assassin be cool.

I'd like to put Assassins kind of on the same scale where I'd like to put Barbarians and Monks, where some of them are merely pressing against the limits of what's physically possible and some of them are honed past that into clearly supernatural territory, and there's room for interpretation on various abilities whether the assassin actually did something magical to move through the shadows like that or whether he's just that good. Of course, there can be abilities that are probably just regular skill on most assassins (like a basic attack) and abilities that are hard to explain with any level of nonmagical skills, but I love the idea of characters that are so good at what they do that they're basically breaking the rules of what's possible... but whether it's magic is ambiguous (on some of them; the overt commander-of-shadows is a cool guy too.)
Dwarves invented beer so they could toast to their axes. Dwarves invented axes to kill people and take their beer. Swanmay Syndrome: Despite the percentages given in the Monster Manual, in reality 100% of groups of swans contain a Swanmay, because otherwise the DM would not have put any swans in the game.
Posted this on another thread but it seems more appropriate here.

Assasins are trained be be seen, while unseen, and would focus on face changing, disguise, and to be the everyman to gain access into close knit groups, clans or organizations to take out a target. They would be a martial class steeped on ritual use to appear as any class or person. Alchemy is the preferred tool of the trade.

For a martial type assassin sure.  But that can be folded into the rouge.

But the o'ssassin was very shadow-magicy assassin.  You had at-will shadow teleport, could turn insubstantial, and hide in any shadow (which shadow dancers do).  There was even a shadow coffin, where you could hide corpses in objects to dispose of later.


Not completely martial as they would learn ritual magic and alchemy. They need to blend in so they would not want to show a strong magical presence, and rituals they learn would be tied into a secret language using hand and body movement as memorization techniques Thus they may carry the name of shadow dancer.
I really hope they don't fold the Assassin (and by extention, Shadow Dancer) into Prestige Classes. I really hate having to slog through X-levels to get to the concept you want to play.

The Shroud mechanic wansn't very good (coupled with SA, it was OK but that's another story) so perhaps they'd need to rework that aspect from the ground up. Other things, stuff samrin mentioned, like Shadow Step, Shadow Coffin, Garotte usage, poison crafting, throwing bolts/shards of shadow like daggers and the like are things I don't think the Rogue can mimmic by Multiclass. This sort of stuff needs it's own mechanics and class to be functional at 1st level.
Shrouds where fail in 4e, and will fail even harder in 5e because things don't last long enough.  90% of the time, shrouds where wasted, and it was a big part of your damage to loose like that.

Of course, there are adjustments that could be made.  Hybrids did better with them, since you could sneak attack while you where building shrouds, so sneak attack and shouds together might work.

Or Like if each shroud increases your crit range and you had good base damage.  Then you wouldn't be quite as dependant on them.  And starting a battle with a crit, is a very good way to be an assassin.



Easiest fix would be to have a free two shroud placement trigger on rolling initiative.
I imagine assasin with a alternative background, a little touch from "Assasin´s Creed" saga but more like sicarii, like the Maccabees from Bible. Do you rebember the Slayer of Damiel prestige class from "Book of Exalted Deeds"? Blade, the vampire hunter would be a "sicarii" by the way I imagine D&D assasin.



 
About shadow dancer, I imagine the class battle dancer or wardancer like a swashbuckler with two weapons, and background like Praegenarii (fake gladiators who roleplaying mock fights)

"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)

 

Book 13 Anaclet 23 Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"

 

"In a country well governed, poverty is something to be ashamed of. In a country badly governed, wealth is something to be ashamed of." - Confucius 

The 4e shadow assassin was a full class, even excluding the pure martial executioner.  There's no reason it couldn't be a full class in 5e.  Especially if you add shadow dancer stuff in too.

Weapons: martial
Armor: Light
HP: 1d6

Level 1:  Shadowstep (10'), Stealth, Darkvision, Shadow Power.
Level 2:  Shadowstep (15'), Shadow Coffin (20 lbs)
Level 3:  Shadowstep (20'), Shadow Power.
Level 4:  Shadowstep (25'), Shadow Coffin (40 lbs).
Level 5:  Shadowstep (30'), Shadow Power
...

Shadowstep.  Teleport from one shadow to another.  No greater then 10' apart.  This increases as you level.

Shadow Coffin.  As an action, you can store objects and dead creatures in your shadow coffin upto the weight limit.  If you kill a creature with a melee attack, you can immidiatly put him in your coffin.

Shadow Powers:
Summon Shadow:  Your shadow goes off on it's own to do your bidding.
Shadow Weapon:  You can make weapons out of shadows that deal +1d6 shadow damage.
Shroud: When you take another actoin, you can gather shadows around vulnerable points on an enemy, leaving a hole in his defenses.  Each shroud increases your chance to crit by 1, with a maximum equal to your level.
Shadow Illusion:  As an action, you can create a silent and indistint illusion.
Darkness:  You remove light from an area.
Shade Weapon:  Target weapon's damage is reduced by half.
Drawn Shadow:  You can use your shadow powers as long as there are shadows withing 20' of you. 



Plenty for a class. 

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

I like them.  

And they easily combine into the same class.



I don't like assassin as a class - much prefer it as a kit/background/theme or whatever BUT if you want to say shadowdancer deserves a spot at the table I'd be ok with that.  Roll the 4e assassin into it to flesh it out as a base class rather than a PrC like in 3e and I'd be perfectly happy BUT i'd prefer that be an optional future class not a PHB1 class


The 4e shadow assassin was a full class, even excluding the pure martial executioner.  There's no reason it couldn't be a full class in 5e.  Especially if you add shadow dancer stuff in too.

Weapons: martial
Armor: Light
HP: 1d6

Level 1:  Shadowstep (10'), Stealth, Darkvision, Shadow Power.
Level 2:  Shadowstep (15'), Shadow Coffin (20 lbs)
Level 3:  Shadowstep (20'), Shadow Power.
Level 4:  Shadowstep (25'), Shadow Coffin (40 lbs).
Level 5:  Shadowstep (30'), Shadow Power
...

Shadowstep.  Teleport from one shadow to another.  No greater then 10' apart.  This increases as you level.

Shadow Coffin.  As an action, you can store objects and dead creatures in your shadow coffin upto the weight limit.  If you kill a creature with a melee attack, you can immidiatly put him in your coffin.

Shadow Powers:
Summon Shadow:  Your shadow goes off on it's own to do your bidding.
Shadow Weapon:  You can make weapons out of shadows that deal +1d6 shadow damage.
Shroud: When you take another actoin, you can gather shadows around vulnerable points on an enemy, leaving a hole in his defenses.  Each shroud increases your chance to crit by 1, with a maximum equal to your level.
Shadow Illusion:  As an action, you can create a silent and indistint illusion.
Darkness:  You remove light from an area.
Shade Weapon:  Target weapon's damage is reduced by half.
Drawn Shadow:  You can use your shadow powers as long as there are shadows withing 20' of you. 



Plenty for a class. 



Eh, shadow coffin is cool, but not enough to stand on its own as the only thing it gets at a certain level.

I agree, though. It's probably the coolest "assassin" we've ever had in D&D, as a concept. It just needed tweaking. 
I don't like assassin as a class - much prefer it as a kit/background/theme or whatever BUT if you want to say shadowdancer deserves a spot at the table I'd be ok with that.  Roll the 4e assassin into it to flesh it out as a base class rather than a PrC like in 3e and I'd be perfectly happy BUT i'd prefer that be an optional future class not a PHB1 class

Given the amount they need to put in the PHB1 to keep their vauge "promisies" (every class in every PHB1), i really doupt there will be any room.

But hopefully in an early splat book.

Eh, shadow coffin is cool, but not enough to stand on its own as the only thing it gets at a certain level.

I agree, though. It's probably the coolest "assassin" we've ever had in D&D, as a concept. It just needed tweaking. 

My quick build has less dead levels then some of the current classes.  

But yea.  Great concept, plenty to work with (including stuff from past editions), needs a good bit of tweaking.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

I don't like assassin as a class - much prefer it as a kit/background/theme or whatever BUT if you want to say shadowdancer deserves a spot at the table I'd be ok with that.  Roll the 4e assassin into it to flesh it out as a base class rather than a PrC like in 3e and I'd be perfectly happy BUT i'd prefer that be an optional future class not a PHB1 class

Given the amount they need to put in the PHB1 to keep their vauge "promisies" (every class in every PHB1), i really doupt there will be any room.

But hopefully in an early splat book.

Eh, shadow coffin is cool, but not enough to stand on its own as the only thing it gets at a certain level.

I agree, though. It's probably the coolest "assassin" we've ever had in D&D, as a concept. It just needed tweaking. 

My quick build has less dead levels then some of the current classes.  

But yea.  Great concept, plenty to work with (including stuff from past editions), needs a good bit of tweaking.



I would hate to see it abandoned, especially considering Mearls designed it.
I would like the cosmology about shadow was more.. "gray", more morality ambigous, a dangerous power, but not necessarily evil. Mabye only linked to the "shadow of the soul", the sheut, the contained feelings, the Freud´s Id

 
Obsidian, DC comics.
(Why are you gay, has anybody just told you a good new?)

 
powerlisting.wikia.com/wiki/Darkness_Man...

Erebokinesis, I like that name. 

 http://powerlisting.wikia.com/wiki/Shadow_Generation

 http://powerlisting.wikia.com/wiki/Animated_Shadow

 http://powerlisting.wikia.com/wiki/Darkforce_Manipulation

The darkness is the symbol of the sin, and the dark (anti-)hero is the sinner who looks for redemption. The darkness is too the lost prestige, and the dark one is somebody who people don´t trust. The darkness is the hidden feat, the mistrust, maybe a "dark" hero is pure-heart, only loyal to a dinasty with bad fame of being too cruel generations ago and now try prove they aren´t tyrans anymore.

"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)

 

Book 13 Anaclet 23 Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"

 

"In a country well governed, poverty is something to be ashamed of. In a country badly governed, wealth is something to be ashamed of." - Confucius 

I'd prefer shadow-magic to be associated with the void.  With nothingness.  A fading of reality itself.

You can go though a wall because there's not enough of you that exsist to stop.  There is a danger that if you will fade too far, there will not be enough of you to come back.

And while a blade shattered by a fighter can be reforged.  A blade shattered by shadow will always be missing a piece.  A soul killed by magic will move on, a soul killed by shadow will be gone.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

Throw in the 3e swordsage (reflavor desert winds fire damage to "shadow" damage) and you've got a pretty awesome class.

P.S. I think damage types should be combined overall to reduce bloat. Somethign like this:
Fire, Frost (cold + water), Storm (thunder and lightning), Nature (acid, poison, plant, earth), Shadow (shadow + necrotic), Radiant (holy + lazers!), Psychic, and Force.
While I prefer my assassins to more closely resembe (using cinematic references) Bernie Rose (Drive), Aaran Hallam (The Hunted), Donovan "Red" Grant (From Russia With Love), Yo Hinumura (Crying Freeman, Mark Dascascos version) and Ogami Itto (various movies, Shogun Assassin probably best known) I do think there is a place for the shadow manipulator like Jackie Estacado (and his family), some versions of The Shadow, Durzo Bunt (sp?, from the Night Angel trilogy along with the other wetboys) and you could take a skewed view of the Right Hand of the Jhereg (especially Mario Greymist and Vlad Taltos).
I think shadow coffin as proposed works as a useful trick. But, one of my fave 4e utilities was the ability to help a whole team of people stealth by pulling shadows. Perhaps we can pull from the Tome of Magic and give the Assassin greater and lesser shadow talents? Some are at-will, while other ones could be encounter (or daily... whatevs)?
And I do love me some ToB Swordsage. I recall a lot of shadow and fire in those guys.
"What's stupid is when people decide that X is true - even when it is demonstrable untrue or 100% against what we've said - and run around complaining about that. That's just a breakdown of basic human reasoning." -Mike Mearls
I think shadow coffin as proposed works as a useful trick. But, one of my fave 4e utilities was the ability to help a whole team of people stealth by pulling shadows. Perhaps we can pull from the Tome of Magic and give the Assassin greater and lesser shadow talents? Some are at-will, while other ones could be encounter (or daily... whatevs)? And I do love me some ToB Swordsage. I recall a lot of shadow and fire in those guys.

That was another good one.

Shade Army:  Your allies gain advantage on stealth checks as long as they remain within 20' of you.


Swordsage used at-will stances and encounter manuvers.  And where more about versitility.  But there are definalty a few nice shadow moves that could be poached. in.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

Throw in the 3e swordsage (reflavor desert winds fire damage to "shadow" damage) and you've got a pretty awesome class. 

P.S. I think damage types should be combined overall to reduce bloat. Somethign like this:
Fire, Frost (cold + water), Storm (thunder and lightning), Nature (acid, poison, plant, earth), Shadow (shadow + necrotic), Radiant (holy + lazers!), Psychic, and Force.



Desert Wind + Shadow Hand always made an awesome "Assassin"
I would like the cosmology about shadow was more.. "gray", more morality ambigous, a dangerous power, but not necessarily evil.



the 4e Shadow Power Source isn't evil. It's morally ambiguous and dangerous.

Anyway, there's plenty in the 4e assassin and executioner to make a full class with a half dozen fighting styles.

I'd consider making shadow weapons a class feature, along with either the abillity to turn the shadow into a companion, or making oneself harder to see and hit by gathering shadows. Basically, the class uses shadows for it's armor and weapons, would be a really cool way to make it stand out and be fun to play.
In this context, the “Shadow” of the Shadow Dancer involves tropes that organize solidly within the magic of Lifeforce.

This kind of Shadow really refers to an aspect of the spirit world, whence the ghostliness: spiritualizing, teleporting, fading, invisibility. However, it doesnt necessarily involve “death”, this spirit world is just as easily the realm of nature spirits or the celestial realm of angels.

This kind of ghostliness corresponds to semi-real objective illusion. Different from imaginary subjective “hallucenation”, this partially real illusion is the interface between this world and the spirit world that lies behind the “veil”. As manifestations of the spirit world, it is unclear whether the illusion is real or unreal because it is both. Potentiality and realization intermingle.

This kind of interaction with the spirit world, resembles shamanic spirit journeys that also accompany real objective effects. This connection with shamanic traditions links it with Lifeforce magic.

This kind of entry into the spirit world, thereby achieving vanishing and teleportation, represents a moment where mind and matter are the same thing. The physical body is wherever the mind imagines. This fusion of mind-and-matter is the essence of the soul, thus links it with Lifeforce magic.

The quasi-real quality of these fleeting illusions involves the same kind of magic as the summoning of avatars from the spirit worlds. These avatars manifest physically from the spiritual world into the material world, similar to the way ghosts do. But these avatars are not ghosts. They are angels, animal spirits, and so on across the chain of being of living beings. In this way too, this kind of semi-real manifestation of spirit relates Lifeforce magic.

Finally, undeathly necromancy is also an aspect of Lifeforce magic, albeit a negative one. The bodily zombie is a dead body that uses magic to mindlessly animate it. Oppositely a ghostly shade is a dead mind that uses magic to insubstantially animate it. Where Lifeforce magic is the blend of both mind and body, negative necromancy is the sickening rotting oblivious lurching of one aspect being dead because of the absence of the other.

That said, there might be necromantic Shadow Dancers who achieve their magic precisely by entering the undeathly worlds of shades. But perhaps most Shadow Dancers have nothing to do with undeath.

Ultimately, illusion and teleportation are a manifestation of the lifeforce - the soul - whether personal or collective.
Interesting.

I rather like the idea of a Shadow Dancer/Shadow Assassin which can comunicate with spirits, both dead spirits and nature spirits (I also like worlds wherein it's hard to tell the difference/sometimes there isn't any real difference), walk in the spirit world/otherworld/etc, etc.

I think if you combine shadow dancer abillities, 4e shadow assassin(and some executioner) class features (and some notable powers, like shadow jack) and just a dash of shaman type stuff, you could have a really cool class, with some really cool traditions/fighting styles/whateveryouwanttocallthem.

So, shadow walk (multiple abillities involvingteleporting and/or increased movement, acrobatics and athletics and increased stealth and partial and/or full insubstantial status), spirit talking, shadow/spirit weapons and spell like attacks which sap the strength with attacks, and perhaps the option of a spirit or shadow companion, you'd have my new favorite class.
A shadow magic can be a game mechanic for different power source.

One is like black ectromplasm like a extra element (together water, air, fir, earth, metal and wood). It would the material the shadow plane is made.

I don´t like the plane of shadow like a photographic negative version of material plane, because it is boring, it would rather something like the Umbra (old World of Darkness), the Underworld (old WoD too) and the fay Winter kingdom, with a litte piece of Neitherworld (Bettlejuice cartoon show).. 

I imagine my shadow plane like a gray place, almost white-and-black, where souls (petitioners and incorporeal undead) usually fight against the fay winter court. 

Other is linked to ether, askash or void. The shadow like this is like a hollow, a empty space what absorbs the magic energy. That is the reason to be forbidden, because it would be like stealing from mistic ley lane. A game mechanic could be the power to steal magic by spellthief class (complete adventurer). 

Maybe the void has got a little relation with cosmic beings and the far realm. 



The third option is linked to death and necrotic energy. I don´t like it very much. A necromancer can be a cool enemy boss, but a boring PCs, the dark PCs should be different. If the shadow is the power source used by necromancer... how are animated the deathless creatures? 

Fourth one: The shadow of soul, the id, the Egyptian sheut, the part of soul linked to bad vibes, passion, wishes and negative feelings. That it the reason we need learn self control. Something like the wraith´s soul from the old World of Darkness rpg.

Five: Linked to the dark powers (demiplane of dread, Ravenloft). A shadow (anti-)hero would be a server of dark powers who use the shadow to catch evil creatures to be caged by dark powers. Let´s imagine a litle franchise of lots of pocket universes, a mini-clones of demiplane of dread, but softer. 

----

A assasin almost without magic is possible using a little variant class. Only one powers and class features would be replaced with other easily. 

* I would like the idea of a retcon of Sluagh from Birthright, a dark fay, necrotouched but not really undead, something like the Tim Burton´s Coprse Bride. (I admit the rpg Challening the dreaming is too great influence). 

"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)

 

Book 13 Anaclet 23 Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"

 

"In a country well governed, poverty is something to be ashamed of. In a country badly governed, wealth is something to be ashamed of." - Confucius 

Yes, a shadow hero can be possible.



 

 

"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)

 

Book 13 Anaclet 23 Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"

 

"In a country well governed, poverty is something to be ashamed of. In a country badly governed, wealth is something to be ashamed of." - Confucius 

I was about to ask Zeratul. The GF is super into Starcraft, so I mostly glean its lore from her.

Weather Report, I agree. I think releasing the essentials shadow book was kinda sad. I tried really hard to like essentials, but never could. A hexblade defender would be totally cool in 4e. It could probably work in dndn pretty well (assuming curses have defendery properties).
"What's stupid is when people decide that X is true - even when it is demonstrable untrue or 100% against what we've said - and run around complaining about that. That's just a breakdown of basic human reasoning." -Mike Mearls
Illusionist magic is light, color, the opposite to the shadow.

* What if a gamer uses shadow magic mechanic for other type of magic with different background, like elemental or esoteric? 

"Say me what you're showing off for, and I'll say you what you lack!" (Spanish saying)

 

Book 13 Anaclet 23 Confucius said: "The Superior Man is in harmony but does not follow the crowd. The inferior man follows the crowd, but is not in harmony"

 

"In a country well governed, poverty is something to be ashamed of. In a country badly governed, wealth is something to be ashamed of." - Confucius