warlord vs fighter, in pictures.

[sblock warlord (left), fighter (right)]
[/sblock]

[sblock  fighter (left), warlord (right)]
[/sblock]

[sblock fighter (left), warlord (right)]
[/sblock]

[sblock fighter (back), warlord (front)]
[/sblock]

Feel free to add more.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

LOL - these are great!
Two things.

1) That's pretty cute   However, I'm not sure who the third picture is?

2) With the exception of the third picture (because I don't know who it is), what I'm seeing is that a warlord is a former fighter who has gotten old.  Ergo...a levelled, experienced fighter.  This actually fits well with what the phrase 'warlord' means; are you thinking a prestige class (or something similar)?

"Lightning...it flashes bright, then fades away.  It can't protect, it can only destroy."

Two things.

1) That's pretty cute   However, I'm not sure who the third picture is?

2) With the exception of the third picture (because I don't know who it is), what I'm seeing is that a warlord is a former fighter who has gotten old.  Ergo...a levelled, experienced fighter.  This actually fits well with what the phrase 'warlord' means; are you thinking a prestige class (or something similar)?



they are from the TV series based on the gong of ice and fire book series called game of thrones.

the small one is Tyrion lanester who is described as:
While not physically powerful, Tyrion has a cunning mind and often uses to his advantage the fact that others constantly underestimate him.
Trough his cunning he becomes a major power in the capial city
He plans the defence of the capital in the book series When the city's defenders morale drops after Joffrey ( the young king) abandons them, Tyrion rallies the men and leads a surprise counterattack against the besiegers.

the tall one is Bronn
Bronn is a sell-sword with a sardonic sense of humor, and a retainer to Tyrion Lannister. After their arrival in King's Landing, Bronn's service to Tyrion earns him a position as Commander of the City Watch.
You need a photo of Liam Neeson as Ra's al Ghul alongside the decoy Ra's from Batman Begins.
In a lot of these examples, the Warlord is just a retired fighter that's using his experience to help younger fighters. This hints more at a prestige class.

Edit: Looks like anjelika beat me to everything I had to say, lol. 
My two copper.
Not really, you could make the arguement for Kitiara though.

  

 Fear is the Mind Killer

 

I guess my problem with all of those examples is that not a single one of those warlords heals.  Perhaps this says more about the 4e warlord class than it does the archetype. 
Actually I don't like those examples too much. The warlord is only slightly weaker than the fighter.

The football one is all wrong. The coach is not the warlord. The Warlord is the QB or LB. Everyone else is fighters.

Orzel, Halfelven son of Zel, Mystic Ranger, Bane to Dragons, Death to Undeath, Killer of Abyssals, King of the Wilds. Constitution Based Class for Next!

I still think those are just good examples of why Fighters ought to have abilities beyond simply fighting.

Once again we see the trend of 'any fighter archetype that actually has skills gets shunted off and made into a new class.'

Which is why people think 'fighter's shouldn't have skills'.

Carl
The best warlord I've ever seen was Ciaphas Cain, with Ferik Jurgen as his personal fighter. Of course, Cain is a remarkable fighter in his own right, but his ability to inspire others is even more impressive.

The metagame is not the game.

The best warlord I've ever seen was Ciaphas Cain, with Ferik Jurgen as his personal fighter. Of course, Cain is a remarkable fighter in his own right, but his ability to inspire others is even more impressive.



Remarkable at fighting to save his own tail!   I love Ciaphas Cain.  But to be completely fair, a lot of the respect accorded him is due to a misinterpretation of his intentions (although Amberly Vail safely contends perhaps that is just Cain rationalizing his otherwise-remarkable courage).

Great example, now that I think more on it!

"Lightning...it flashes bright, then fades away.  It can't protect, it can only destroy."

@CarlT

Exactly. The differences between the warlord-warrior and the fighter-style warrior could be handled by a single class feature but it would require more work and content. Open the scope of big smash lug or thin pokey lug. A correct picture of warlord vs fighter would be:

(Insert pic of Leonardo and Raphael for TMNT here).

Cartoon versions.

Raph is the more skilled warrior but lacks leadership ability, is poor with noninstinctual tactics, and prefers to solo. Leo is not only a better leader but often coordinates group strikes and combonation attacks with his brothers.

Orzel, Halfelven son of Zel, Mystic Ranger, Bane to Dragons, Death to Undeath, Killer of Abyssals, King of the Wilds. Constitution Based Class for Next!

Sokka for another example, let's face it he was barely a factor in direct combat for most of the show, but his plans and ability to open up opportunities for the rest of the gAang have always been his primary contribution, even after taking a level in bad ass. 

[sblock fighter(left) warlord(right)][/sblock]
I wouldn't be surprised if the warlord ends up being a prestige class that leads a mercenary company.

 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warlord

 
[sblock warlord(left) fighter(right)][/sblock]
[sblock warlord(left) fighter(right)][/sblock]
 Warlord in training (a natural born)  and Warlord (raised to be one). Yes in D&D Warlord/Monks.
  Creative Character Build Collection and The Magic of King's and Heros  also Can Martial Characters Fly? 

Improvisation in 4e: Fave 4E Improvisations - also Wrecans Guides to improvisation beyond page 42
The Non-combatant Adventurer (aka Princess build Warlord or LazyLord)
Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness
Reflavoring the Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage - Creative Character Collection: Bloodwright (Darksun Character) 

At full hit points and still wounded to incapacitation? you are playing 1e.
By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one
"Wizards and Warriors need abilities with explicit effects for opposite reasons. With the wizard its because you need to create artificial limits on them, they have no natural ones and for the Warrior you need to grant permission to do awesome."

 

[sblock fighter(left) warlord(right)][/sblock]
The football one is all wrong. The coach is not the warlord. The Warlord is the QB or LB. Everyone else is fighters.

Coaches are lazylords.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

I guess my problem with all of those examples is that not a single one of those warlords heals.  Perhaps this says more about the 4e warlord class than it does the archetype. 

Not even kinda accurate, unless you assume heals are purely physical (a contested and unresolvable discussion). Most of those can boost morale and turn a "defeated" ally back to battle-ready with some well chosen words. A great example IMO would be Kermit

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The football one is all wrong. The coach is not the warlord. The Warlord is the QB or LB. Everyone else is fighters.

Coaches are lazylords.




Lazylords are game manager QBs. Trent Difler.
Bravuras are Grossman.


Orzel, Halfelven son of Zel, Mystic Ranger, Bane to Dragons, Death to Undeath, Killer of Abyssals, King of the Wilds. Constitution Based Class for Next!

[sblock warlord(top) fighter(bottom)][/sblock]
I like all the examples so far. Here's mine:

[sblock warlord (left), fighter (right)]
[/sblock]

[sblock  fighter (left), warlord (right)]
[/sblock]

______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

There is a nice little self created divide here. Shame there can't be more acceptance instead. I feel that is where the future of the game should be.

All this vitriol, pushing away, retroactive retaliation, and preemptive striking needs to stop.

I keep trying but some won't let things go. Will you?

 

Because you like something, it does not mean it is good. Because you dislike something, it does not mean it is bad. Because it is your opinion, it does not make it everyone's opinion. Because it is your opinion, it does not make it truth. Because it is your opinion, it does not make it the general consensus. Whatever side you want to take, at least remember these things.


Mal and Jayne

Warlord, Inspiring Word (left), Fighter, Marksman Style (right)

Before posting, why not ask yourself, What Would Wrecan Say?

IMAGE(http://images.onesite.com/community.wizards.com/user/marandahir/thumb/9ac5d970f3a59330212c73baffe4c556.png?v=90000)

A great man once said "If WotC put out boxes full of free money there'd still be people complaining about how it's folded." – Boraxe

I like all the examples so far. Here's mine:

[sblock warlord (left), fighter (right)]
[/sblock]

[sblock  fighter (left), warlord (right)]
[/sblock]




John Criton isn't a warlord he is a frickin scientist, and later a fighter (they called it something else in the farscape book but its the fighter for that game its in fact the same clas dargo has if I'm remembering correctly).  he most definitely doesn't tell dargo what to do, especially in combat considering dargo has more experience at best jhon criton is the psychopath they go to because he comes up with good, albeit completely insane, plans...That's a dude with an int score not a battlefield commander.  In the thick of it no one runs the crew they just all know what to do.  so to reiterate Jhon Criton is a scientist not a hardened battle commander.
 
If you either know the reference or you don't.

I like all the examples so far. Here's mine:

[sblock warlord (left), fighter (right)]
[/sblock]

[sblock  fighter (left), warlord (right)]
[/sblock]




John Criton isn't a warlord he is a frickin scientist 
 


And scientists are a form of wizard  he is a scientist who contributes big tricks to accomplish things others didnt think possible...  
His adversary/rival is an "Warlord" but not necessarily a D&D warlord.
  Creative Character Build Collection and The Magic of King's and Heros  also Can Martial Characters Fly? 

Improvisation in 4e: Fave 4E Improvisations - also Wrecans Guides to improvisation beyond page 42
The Non-combatant Adventurer (aka Princess build Warlord or LazyLord)
Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness
Reflavoring the Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage - Creative Character Collection: Bloodwright (Darksun Character) 

At full hit points and still wounded to incapacitation? you are playing 1e.
By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one
"Wizards and Warriors need abilities with explicit effects for opposite reasons. With the wizard its because you need to create artificial limits on them, they have no natural ones and for the Warrior you need to grant permission to do awesome."

 

Perhaps the ultimate warlord, and the best cinematic example of martial healing.



Even death can't stop this warlord.

There are a great many problems that can be circumvented by players and DMs having a mature discussion about what the game is going to be like before they ever sit down together to play.

 

The answer really does lie in more options, not in confining and segregating certain options.

 

You really shouldn't speak for others.  You can't hear what someone else is saying when you try to put your words in their mouth.

 

Fencing & Swashbuckling as Armor.

D20 Modern Toon PC Race.

Mecha Pilot's Skill Challenge Emporium.

 

#BoobsNotBlood

It is kind of funy to see people projecting the warlord class on any leader type, military officer, or intelligent fighter in previous editions.

 The class was created in 4th ed to fill a niche (martial leader/healer) and now the leader role is gone along with martial healing the warlord is really a weak concept outside of a 4th ed game. It could make a better prestige class than a class like the assassin in 3rd ed.

 It also doesn't really have a strong presence in fantasy literature as martial leader types are really intellignet fighters or fighters with knowledge:tactics. The class was good, the concept is weak. 

 Fear is the Mind Killer

 

It also doesn't really have a strong presence in fantasy literature as martial leader types are really intellignet fighters or fighters with knowledge:tactics. The class was good, the concept is weak. 


Because everyone knows people like inspirational leaders aren't a fantasy archtype or anything. Nope, not at all.

On the topic...

Fighter|Warlord Hybrid(or Warlord multiclass Fighter) with his party
The reason the archetype is under represented in fantasy is because DnD never did it well. So most of the fantasy authors never encountered a fantasy warlord, at least not as the good guy, David Xanatos comes to mind.

As for fantasy warlords that are most certainly warlords.

King Obould many-arrows, Cairne blood-hoof of the tauren,  

The reason so many fantasy generals and such are fighters and the like is because Warlord was never a freaking option. 

Martial healing is every time the hero gets up and walks away from a hit that should have killed them, a last ditch adrenaline rush that gets the dying on their feet to keep fighting, or even a freaking second wind, or when some lets out a battle cry and the half-defeated soldiers rally to their comrade with renewed vigor ready to not only win the day but live to see the new tomorrow they forge. 
What would people describe Anasimbor Kellhus from the Prince of Nothing series as? He's strongly Warlordish, with some Psionic Warrior elements but not really.
Race for the Iron Throne - political and historical analysis of A Song of Ice and Fire.

Left = Warlord. Right = Not Warlord


"The world is indeed comic, but the joke is on mankind." - H.P. Lovecraft
I think the Warlord should exist as a fighter build based on feat selection. Isn't that what feats are for? To  take a general class and give it a specific role?
No, that was one of the failures of 3e.

Since the classes were designed without specific purposes in mind we ended up with classes that ranged from Artificer to swashbuckler, in terms of power and versatility. While a bit of baked in versatility is a good idea, the class needs to have a purpose so the people designing the class have performance benchmarks of some sort. Just slapping cool thematic abilities together gets you into trouble. Like 3e druid trouble.

NOw that said classes can fill multiple roles but they should make a conscious decision and pay opportunity costs to do so. So a Cleric shouldn't be able to melee, spell blast, heal, and control, he should have to choose from these options via in-class builds and feature options. 
Jeez, people....can we have ONE thread not swirl down the "X-edition-fails" toilet? Just one?
"The world is indeed comic, but the joke is on mankind." - H.P. Lovecraft
Jeez, people....can we have ONE thread not swirl down the "X-edition-fails" toilet? Just one?


Nope.  Sorry, everyone is looking to 5e to prove who won the edition wars.
Seriously, though, you should check out the PbP Haven. You might also like Real Adventures, IF you're cool.
Knights of W.T.F.- Silver Spur Winner
4enclave, a place where 4e fans can talk 4e in peace.
Jeez, people....can we have ONE thread not swirl down the "X-edition-fails" toilet? Just one?


Nope.  Sorry, everyone is looking to 5e to prove who won the edition wars.



Nah it's pretty obvious 4e lost the edition wars 
The dev's are determined to get rid of all badwrong4efun.
 
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