What to play for this party?

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What should I play?


Hello all, I am joining a new game starting soon, but we just lost the intended DM and have to switch things around.


Had intended to play a Gensai Wizard, but not sure that would be best now.


Party is –


* Defender (dwarf weaponmaster)


*striker-controller (sorccer/warlock hybrid)


*Leader (dragonborn warlord)


So Defender/ Leader/ Striker Controller.


Do you think me playing straight controller would still work; or giving the party compensation should I mix it up?

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/1.jpg)

Play a striker.  Preferably something with a good BA for the warlord.
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out here
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Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running? Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with? Check out the Pregen thread here If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
Needs moar damage.  Melee Ranger or Ranger|Cleric.  Could also do with moar INT, because you're going to suck at INT skills as a party, which is going to be a bit of an issue to tie up with more damage.
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
Melee Striker it is, preferably one with high nova potential. Ranger, Barbarian, Rogue or some hybrid including one of these comes to mind. The Sorc|Warlock won't be able to deal enough damage alone. In fact, it is a very mediocre hybrid choice.
What level?

Genasi blaster wizard (Str/Int, elemental empowerment as your first feat), will work just fine.
Or Perhaps Seeker, as a striker/controler who has ranged basic attacks for your warlord to use.

But really, play what you want.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

I'd go with a forced/restrict movement/high init controller myself. Bunch targets up so the Fighter can lock 'em all down with Come And Get It and other burst 1 options and the Sorcerer can burst them. With 3 characters presumably with AoE encounter powers, that should really do a lot to encounters.

Especially if the Sorcerer picks up Flame Spiral - you slide targets to the Sorcerer(or away and then back) to trigger the extra damage on your turn. 

 


Thanks for the quick responses everyone


@mellored – It will be starting at 1st level


The wizard was an arcaneist charm used (voidsoul Gensai) so not in the blaster range at all.


@ Mommy- That’s almost what I have with the above mentioned Gensai wizard (lots of charms which move things around and attack)


So sounds like I have three options


1-      Keep the high forced movement controller (hypnotism/charms) to line the battlefield for party


2-      Switch to a blaster version of my wizard (could I do blaster/charmer?)


3-      Switch to a striker or striker hybrid (all though I am always weary of hybrids)


Thanks everyone, I’ll be pouring over the Optimization builds today looking at all the options; please keep the input coming.

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/1.jpg)

Because i don't see people recommend them a ton, and maybe they suck?, but how about a Unity Avenger WIS/INT. Covers alot of the skills missing from the group and they can be quite durable. Power of skill give you a great BA and this group will be formation fighting alot so you should get good use from the Unity riders. That party would be burst/blast bait so build to compensate for those instances.

Outside of that maybe a dedicated controller. Genasi Blaster Wizard?
3-      Switch to a striker or striker hybrid (all though I am always weary of hybrids)

I am weary of all the hybrids too, but I think you mean leery.

Your party is missing Wis, and possibly Int (assuming Dragonborn Warlord is going Str/Cha). So Unity Avenger is not a bad idea. You'll have a good accurate basic for the Warlord, and between the sorcerer, fighter, and dragonborn they should be able to keep minions off you, so you can do your job.  And they will likely all want to be adjacent to enemies, so your unity bonuses should come into play reasonably well.

A controller like Wizard or Invoker should work fine too and can cover the same two stats, but my vote would be for someone with a good melee basic, so the warlord has options. Fighter is always a decent option, but fighters can get disabled a lot as they draw a lot of enemy fire, so a resilient and accurate striker is always a good weapon for a warlord.
I think he means 'wary' - as in distrustful.
Back to Basics - A Guide to Basic Attacks You might be playing DnD wrong if... "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
High WIS for a good perception to find that lost Dungeon Master...
Sorc|Warlock is pretty horrid, pretty much throwing feat slots away with that, so I'd really second the "Striker with Int" which pretty much boils down to a Wis/Int Avenger or some sort of smart Barbarian
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
If not an Avenger, consider a straight Warlock.  Take the Eldritch Strike option to get a nice melee basic attack (makes the warlord happy) with forced movement (which will make the fighter and possibly sorcerer happy).  Bonus - depending on that other striker's build, you'll get to to spread around curses with extra efficiency.  While your pact boon only triggers when your curse target dies, you get your extra damage on any cursed target.

 


Thanks for the quick responses everyone


@mellored – It will be starting at 1st level


The wizard was an arcaneist charm used (voidsoul Gensai) so not in the blaster range at all.


@ Mommy- That’s almost what I have with the above mentioned Gensai wizard (lots of charms which move things around and attack)


So sounds like I have three options


1-      Keep the high forced movement controller (hypnotism/charms) to line the battlefield for party


2-      Switch to a blaster version of my wizard (could I do blaster/charmer?)


3-      Switch to a striker or striker hybrid (all though I am always weary of hybrids)


Thanks everyone, I’ll be pouring over the Optimization builds today looking at all the options; please keep the input coming.




Honestly looking at your party it seems like you need the following:
More striker power
Wis/Int Primary
A Decent MBA

With that in mind it seems Avenger, Mage and Druid are the only really solid obvious options I can see. You could always do the Bookish Barb build Zathris linked, but it doesn't get interesting (imo) until paragon.  Even an artificer could work, although that leaves you a bit thin on the strikery side (But the artificer could get Int/Wis).

In a party of 4 your stats are always spread kinda thin, so I wouldn't double up on the Cha (or triple up, since you have a Dborn Warlord) by going Warlock.

The only things I would try to do that were not Wis/Int primary are ones with strong Wis/Int Secondaries.  Bard with Int secondary, Ranger|Cleric with more Wis than usual (Or a lot of the Str classes |Cleric can work as well and you can put more wis into them than is normal).
 
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out here
Show
Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running? Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with? Check out the Pregen thread here If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
Technically things don't get really interesting paragon...Notably melee strikers. But your point is valid, its a paragon+ build.
10/10 Would Flame Again: An Elite Paladin|Warlock The Elemental Man (or Woman): A Genasi Handbook The Warlord, Or How to Wield a Barbarian One-Handed The Bookish Barbarian Fardiz: RAI is fairly clear, but RAZ is different That's right. Rules According to Zelink!
I've personally been a big fan of barbarians.  I would recommend the latest version of them from the "Heroes of the Feywild" Berserker Barbarian, but honestly, most of the builds are pretty badass.  They can do good damage as a striker, and can act as a good offtank as they don't drop all that easy.  Only draw back is you don't use INT at all (but I don't think that is all that bad in the big picture of things).
I've personally been a big fan of barbarians.  I would recommend the latest version of them from the "Heroes of the Feywild" Berserker Barbarian, but honestly, most of the builds are pretty badass.  They can do good damage as a striker, and can act as a good offtank as they don't drop all that easy.  Only draw back is you don't use INT at all (but I don't think that is all that bad in the big picture of things).



No.
I've personally been a big fan of barbarians.  I would recommend the latest version of them from the "Heroes of the Feywild" Berserker Barbarian, but honestly, most of the builds are pretty badass.  They can do good damage as a striker, and can act as a good offtank as they don't drop all that easy.  Only draw back is you don't use INT at all (but I don't think that is all that bad in the big picture of things).



No.



Was is the recommendation of the Berzerker?
Or the "good damage" bit?
Or the "most builds are badass"? 
Or the "offtank" bit?
Or the "Don't drop easy" bit? 
10/10 Would Flame Again: An Elite Paladin|Warlock The Elemental Man (or Woman): A Genasi Handbook The Warlord, Or How to Wield a Barbarian One-Handed The Bookish Barbarian Fardiz: RAI is fairly clear, but RAZ is different That's right. Rules According to Zelink!
I've personally been a big fan of barbarians.  I would recommend the latest version of them from the "Heroes of the Feywild" Berserker Barbarian, but honestly, most of the builds are pretty badass.  They can do good damage as a striker, and can act as a good offtank as they don't drop all that easy.  Only draw back is you don't use INT at all (but I don't think that is all that bad in the big picture of things).



No.



Was is the recommendation of the Berzerker?
Or the "good damage" bit?
Or the "most builds are badass"? 
Or the "offtank" bit?
Or the "Don't drop easy" bit? 



Yes.
Maybe.

Though I really should just have used this tool

www.facade.com/yesno/

It has floaty things. And Miracles. 
10/10 Would Flame Again: An Elite Paladin|Warlock The Elemental Man (or Woman): A Genasi Handbook The Warlord, Or How to Wield a Barbarian One-Handed The Bookish Barbarian Fardiz: RAI is fairly clear, but RAZ is different That's right. Rules According to Zelink!
I've personally been a big fan of barbarians.  I would recommend the latest version of them from the "Heroes of the Feywild" Berserker Barbarian, but honestly, most of the builds are pretty badass.  They can do good damage as a striker, and can act as a good offtank as they don't drop all that easy.  Only draw back is you don't use INT at all (but I don't think that is all that bad in the big picture of things).



No.



Was is the recommendation of the Berzerker?
Or the "good damage" bit?
Or the "most builds are badass"? 
Or the "offtank" bit?
Or the "Don't drop easy" bit? 



Yes.

I think that may have been a "XOR," rather than an "OR."  Though I'm guessing that was meant to be an "all of the above" yes.

How much XP do I get for killing the joke?

It was a grey mob, you don't even get the 2 copper it would have dropped.
It was a grey mob, you don't even get the 2 copper it would have dropped.

Says a lot about the quality of the joke.

I suppose it could have been worse, it could have been a basic circuitry joke.
I suppose it could have been worse, it could have been a basic circuitry joke.



That would have been shockingly bad.
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out here
Show
Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running? Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with? Check out the Pregen thread here If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
I suppose it could have been worse, it could have been a basic circuitry joke.



That would have been shockingly bad.

But the reactions could be electrifying.

I suppose it could have been worse, it could have been a basic circuitry joke.



That would have been shockingly bad.

But the reactions could be electrifying.




No reactions could ever interrupt this party...
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out here
Show
Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running? Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with? Check out the Pregen thread here If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
I suppose it could have been worse, it could have been a basic circuitry joke.



That would have been shockingly bad.

But the reactions could be electrifying.




No reactions could ever interrupt this party...

But we need to get things started immediately.