Brutal Barrage and damage bonuses

16 posts / 0 new
Last post
My character has Brutal Barrage, which states that damage per hit is equal to my CON bonus. Do I get to add the usual bonuses from Magical Weapons or Feats or anything like that? It seems like a no-brainer, but the character sheet does not add any bonuses.

Also, if there's a power in effect that grants bonus damage to any damage roll, can I add it to Brutal Barrage, since there's no actual die roll?
Brutal Barrage has no damage roll, so you don't get to add anything that is a bonus to damage rolls. It's very common for damage bonuses to apply only to damage rolls (magic weapon enhancement bonus, Iron Armbands of Power, etc).

Things like Headman's Chop or Vulnerability still work.

This might be of interest: community.wizards.com/charop/wiki/Altern...
The important distinction to remember is between Bonuses, which only add to rolls, and Extra Damage which is added to whatever.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
One trick : if the extra damage includes a roll, then you get to include the bonuses because you now have a damage roll..
  For example, a Protector Shaman has the oppurtunity attack Spirit's Shield which normally just does Wis modifier damage.  With the feat Protector's Shield it gets 1d8 extra damage.  There's now a damage roll, so Implement and other bonuses now apply.
The important distinction to remember is between Bonuses, which only add to rolls, and Extra Damage which is added to whatever.

Er?  "Bonuses to damage rolls" only add to rolls... but that's not because they're bonuses, it's because they are bonses to damage rolls.  Were there any game elements that gave a "+3 bonus to damage", and did not go on to say "rolls", then I'd expect them to qualify for Brutal Barrage.  (To the best of my knowledge, there are no such game elements)
 

"Nice assumptions. Completely wrong assumptions, but by jove if being incorrect stopped people from making idiotic statements, we wouldn't have modern internet subculture." Kerrus
Practical gameplay runs by neither RAW or RAI, but rather "A Compromise Between The Gist Of The Rule As I Recall Getting The Impression Of It That One Time I Read It And What Jerry Says He Remembers, Whatever, We'll Look It Up Later If Any Of Us Still Give A Damn." Erachima

The important distinction to remember is between Bonuses, which only add to rolls, and Extra Damage which is added to whatever.

Er?  "Bonuses to damage rolls" only add to rolls... but that's not because they're bonuses, it's because they are bonses to damage rolls.  Were there any game elements that gave a "+3 bonus to damage", and did not go on to say "rolls", then I'd expect them to qualify for Brutal Barrage.  (To the best of my knowledge, there are no such game elements)
 

Radiant One, Lyrander Windrider.
Radiant One deals "extra damage".  Wind-Rider is a bonus to damage though, check.

"Nice assumptions. Completely wrong assumptions, but by jove if being incorrect stopped people from making idiotic statements, we wouldn't have modern internet subculture." Kerrus
Practical gameplay runs by neither RAW or RAI, but rather "A Compromise Between The Gist Of The Rule As I Recall Getting The Impression Of It That One Time I Read It And What Jerry Says He Remembers, Whatever, We'll Look It Up Later If Any Of Us Still Give A Damn." Erachima

Well, bonuses explicitly only apply to rolls, per the RC. But that utterly breaks bonuses to defenses and speed, so it's oft ignored.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
Well, bonuses explicitly only apply to rolls, per the RC. But that utterly breaks bonuses to defenses and speed, so it's oft ignored.

Actually defenses and speed aren't broken because they have specific rules in the RC which override the general rule for bonuses.

While the general rule for bonuses says they are added to rolls, the specific rules for defences on pp79-80 override the general rule by dictating which bonuses and penalties get added to defenses, and it lists just about everything, including a catch all "any other bonuses and penalties"

Similarly, the Determining Speed section on page 202 says "A character's speed is determined by the character's race and any bonuses or penalties."
Well, bonuses explicitly only apply to rolls, per the RC.

Cite (page), so that I may learn something today?

"Nice assumptions. Completely wrong assumptions, but by jove if being incorrect stopped people from making idiotic statements, we wouldn't have modern internet subculture." Kerrus
Practical gameplay runs by neither RAW or RAI, but rather "A Compromise Between The Gist Of The Rule As I Recall Getting The Impression Of It That One Time I Read It And What Jerry Says He Remembers, Whatever, We'll Look It Up Later If Any Of Us Still Give A Damn." Erachima

AFAIK Bonuses do not say they explicitly only apply to rolls. In fact, the RC even say bonuses can apply to a roll or score.

RC 27 Bonuses: There is one important rule for bonuses; do not combine  bonuses of the same type to the same roll or score.



Bonus definition, RC pg. 309, in the glossary. "A number added to a die roll."

That is what Zathris is refering to, anyway. The actual section on bonuses doesn't say that (as noted).
Thanks

"Nice assumptions. Completely wrong assumptions, but by jove if being incorrect stopped people from making idiotic statements, we wouldn't have modern internet subculture." Kerrus
Practical gameplay runs by neither RAW or RAI, but rather "A Compromise Between The Gist Of The Rule As I Recall Getting The Impression Of It That One Time I Read It And What Jerry Says He Remembers, Whatever, We'll Look It Up Later If Any Of Us Still Give A Damn." Erachima

One trick : if the extra damage includes a roll, then you get to include the bonuses because you now have a damage roll.



For real? I would expect bonus damage dice to be bonus damage, not a damage roll.


One trick : if the extra damage includes a roll, then you get to include the bonuses because you now have a damage roll.



For real? I would expect bonus damage dice to be bonus damage, not a damage roll.



RAW a "damage roll" is "a roll of dice to determine damage." Extra damage is part of the initial damage (because a) it says so and b) if that weren't true it wouldn't add keywords, and it does). The argument causes a great deal of vitriol, but there really isn't any argument in the rules that that is how it works.
Well, you'll get no vitriol from me, either way. I was just hoping for clarification, and hopefully one that made sense to me. Thanks a lot!
Sign In to post comments