Tiefling Defender Ideas?

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I'm working on creating a Defender for an all-Tiefling party; My thoughts were a Tiefling Fighter/Warfiend or a Tiefling Chaladin  Fighter/Avernian Knight. I'm not sure which route I'd like to go yet, but I'm thinking I'd like to use a 2h weapon if possible, but it's not necessary. Thoughts? Bear in mind this is a mid-level optimization group at best, more for the storyline and stuff, but I'd like to Op the Defender as best I can.

**EDIT**

The party so far:

Tiefling Psion
Tiefling Blackguard
Tiefling ResLord
Tiefling Defender (undecided)
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
Hard to go wrong with Tiefling Warfiend PP for a primary defender. 

Utilize some hybrid combo of Chaladin, Warlock, and/or Battlemind for the best Stat alignment.
Hard to go wrong with Tiefling Warfiend PP for a primary defender. 

Utilize some hybrid combo of Chaladin, Warlock, and/or Battlemind for the best Stat alignment.



What about Avernian Knight as an alternate PP idea? I'm just trying to decide which of the 2 is better.

I'm pretty sure I'll be using Fighter as the primary class, so ignore the Paladin suggestion.
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
How about Paladin|Warlock?
Doesn't make a lot of sense to use Fighter as the primary on a Tiefling. Swordmage|Warlock, Paladin|Warlock, Chaladin, all work very well. "Mid-level" optimization, by CharOp's definition at least, still needs an 18 stat. I'd only play a 16 stat in a very low-op game, which I would then never play, because that isn't 4e's strength as a system imo.

If you like the Avernian Knight PP, Paladin|Warlock/Fighter/Avernian Knight is an awesome build and very durable (Con/Cha).
That's one area I'm extremely non-versed in, Hybrids. Alcestis, if you'd be willing to work on something like that with me, then by all means I'd be interested in finally trying one.
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
I am playing a swordmage tiefling in a game this weekend.  At low levels, there isnt much you can do to differentiate between one build or another, but I have plans for later
How far is the game going to go, that could have some bearing on your options.  If you're going epic, really paladin/hospitaler/whatever is your best option to be a useful defender.
Level 4 right now, going to Paragon if anything; I'm thinking once we get there or at least into paragon somewhere, we'll be optimizing by normal CharOp standards and I'll be able to rebuild.

While I've yet to play a Hybrid, the Paladin|Warlock/Fighter/Avernian Knight does sound interesting, though I'd have no clue where to begin building it.
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...

Might give you a few ideas.  Pretty much exactly what they have been talking about.  Good place to start anyhow, and change it how you see fit.

Also, how do I put a link in as hypertext so its not half a paragraph long? 
Click the little chain button after highlighting a section of text, paste the address there, and prest-o change-o you can has a hypertext! 
You can also do [*url=yourlinkhere*]text[*/url*], just remove the *'s.  Like so:

Don't open the box!

Wonder how many people actually click the link....
community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...

Might give you a few ideas.  Pretty much exactly what they have been talking about.  Good place to start anyhow, and change it how you see fit.

Also, how do I put a link in as hypertext so its not half a paragraph long? 



Ah! I knew there was a similar build around, I just couldn't remember the name of it, thanks!

It looks pretty much to be exactly what I want, though I'd need to most likely update feats and powers...

@ Celerian: I hate you....you knew I was going to click it, didn't you? Vile...


Lol!
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
I told you not to....
...Which is why I did it.

Anyways, here's my rough draft for the Crimson Legion build done by Inferenz (not so sure about gear, but other stuff looks fine) I'm taking Infernal Pact to begin, instead of Star for flavor reasons- I'll Two-Fold Pact for Star in Paragon.

level 4
Tiefling, Paladin|Warlock
Hybrid Paladin: Hybrid Paladin Reflex
Eldritch Pact (Hybrid): Infernal Pact (Hybrid)
Hybrid Warlock: Hybrid Warlock Reflex
Hybrid Talent: Paladin Armor Proficiency
Theme: Devil's Pawn
Background: Tiefling - Dark Secret (+2 to Arcana)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 19, Dex 8, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 19.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 16, Dex 8, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 16.


AC: 23 Fort: 17 Reflex: 18 Will: 17
HP: 47 Surges: 12 Surge Value: 11

TRAINED SKILLS
Streetwise +11, Bluff +13, Arcana +10

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics -3, Diplomacy +6, Dungeoneering +3, Endurance +2, Heal +3, History +3, Insight +3, Intimidate +6, Nature +3, Perception +4, Religion +3, Stealth -1, Thievery -3, Athletics -2

FEATS
Level 1: Hybrid Talent
Level 2: Imperious Majesty
Level 4: Wrath of the Crimson Legion

POWERS
Hybrid at-will 1: Enfeebling Strike
Hybrid at-will 1: Dire Radiance
Hybrid encounter 1: Valorous Smite
Hybrid daily 1: Majestic Halo
Hybrid utility 2: Charm of Hearts
Hybrid encounter 3: Lure of Minauros

ITEMS
Adventurer's Kit, Sunblade Longsword +1, Rod of Corruption +1, Ornament of Alertness +1, Shared Suffering Plate Armor +1, Heavy Shield
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
WotCL is probably not worth taking at that level, you have TWO cha-based MBA options already (although you want Ardent, rather than Virtuous, Strike, so)...  It's nice having a burst 5 sanction (VERY nice) but feat space is limited so if you;re not also fixing your MBA (which you don't need to because Eldritch Strike exists) it's probably not an autopick early on.  i'd take expertise over it, for instance, or superior will.

Wait, Dire Radiance and Enfeebling Strike wut?  I can see Dire Radiance for catch-22ing, but you definitely want Virtuous if you're not taking Eldritch.  But Eldritch/Ardent seems the way to go for at-wills for my money.
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
I just followed the original build; I'll edit when I get home from the damn VA hospital lol!
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
Swapped out those powers for the ones you mentioned, Space- Which Expertise should I swap for WotCL? I'd like to still grab that later though...and how about my gear? I wasn't totally sure what to grab. While I know I can't use the Rod/Heavy Shield simultaneously, I figured I'd pick up both on the off chance that one was needed more than the other...and if I'm using (for example, a Sunblade or Holy Avenger) which count as a weapon/implement, do I need the Rod? The bit of THP is nice, but I don't see it as super necessary...
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
Not sure how many Paladin attacks are going to end up with the weapon keyword but it may be worth it to do Versatile Expertise?  Heavy Blades and Rods or something?  That way you're buffing implement and weapon +hit... Kinda newer to the forums so it may not be the correct choice
Here's what I've got at the moment, not sure if the gear selection is the best though:

Show

level 4
Tiefling, Paladin|Warlock
Hybrid Paladin: Hybrid Paladin Reflex
Eldritch Pact (Hybrid): Infernal Pact (Hybrid)
Eldritch Strike: Eldritch Strike Charisma
Hybrid Warlock: Hybrid Warlock Reflex
Hybrid Talent: Paladin Armor Proficiency
Background: Tiefling - Infernal Nightmares (+2 to Bluff)
Theme: Devil's Pawn

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 19, Dex 8, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 19.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 16, Dex 8, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 16.


AC: 23 Fort: 17 Reflex: 18 Will: 17
HP: 47 Surges: 12 Surge Value: 11

TRAINED SKILLS
Streetwise +11, Bluff +15, Arcana +8

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics -3, Diplomacy +6, Dungeoneering +3, Endurance +2, Heal +3, History +3, Insight +3, Intimidate +6, Nature +3, Perception +4, Religion +3, Stealth -1, Thievery -3, Athletics -2

FEATS
Level 1: Hybrid Talent
Level 2: Imperious Majesty
Level 4: Devout Protector Expertise

POWERS
Hybrid at-will 1: Eldritch Strike
Hybrid at-will 1: Ardent Strike
Hybrid encounter 1: Valorous Smite
Hybrid daily 1: Majestic Halo
Hybrid utility 2: Charm of Hearts
Hybrid encounter 3: Lure of Minauros

ITEMS
Adventurer's Kit, Sunblade Longsword +1, Ornament of Alertness +1, Shared Suffering Plate Armor +1, Heavy Shield
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
Not sure how many Paladin attacks are going to end up with the weapon keyword but it may be worth it to do Versatile Expertise?  Heavy Blades and Rods or something?  That way you're buffing implement and weapon +hit... Kinda newer to the forums so it may not be the correct choice

Eldritch Strike is a weapon attack and is your MBA, you can't just skip it.

Your magic weapon kind of needs to be one of the 10 or so that also counts as a Holy Symbol if you want to use Devout Protector, otherwise you are indeed stuck with Versatile. Once you get to mid-Paragon and Weapon of Summer opens up, I'd take that+Hellfire Blood+Infernal Prince. +2 to hit and the Fire keyword on everything.

Your encounter powers should probably be the two Warlock Immediates (Delbans and Touch) at 3 and 7, which means you are taking the mass sanction E1 for the Paladin. The dailies are a debatable lot, but remember you are very minor action starved between Curse+Challenge+utilities. Dailies that enable mobility (Ooze Incarnate) or ones that can be used at range so you don't need to use your move action to engage have a special advantage for you. On the same note, don't take anything that is sustain minor.

Take Sorc King Pact initially+Mindbite Scorn+Crimson Fire. Having 2d10 for Curse in Heroic is just fun, Two-fold into Infernal as your 11 feat and retrain into Battle Awareness as well, allowing you to pick up the PP.

Hybrid NADs should both be to will. Frankly getting hit in the Ref is the best NAD to be weak in, no reason to lose a Will point for it.

Utilities are a pain. You have to question if they are good enough to use a minor on if they aren't free or interrupts. Mass marks? Yes. Things you can use out of combat? Yep. Which means you should take Virtue and Call of Challenge. Yes, those are both Paladin U2 powers. Take one at 2 and one at 10. Virtue works because you can use it after a short rest and start every fight with THP, THP don't dissapear till you rest. On the other hand, you have to be careful not to load up on too many immediates (you already have 3-4, which is pushing it for normal combats).

Just remember you are minor-action starved. Another good reason to have Eldritch Strike, actually. Charging.
You're mentioning 3 different Pacts (Infernal, Star, SK)...I'm beginning to wonder if the build is worth it, if there's so many different things that need to be done to make it decent; and if I should just go with something else...
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
You're mentioning 3 different Pacts (Infernal, Star, SK)...I'm beginning to wonder if the build is worth it, if there's so many different things that need to be done to make it decent; and if I should just go with a Hexblade or something...

I never mentioned Star. Actually only person in this thread that did was you, so that is pretty crazy for you to say.
You said to take Delbans as one of the Encounters, hence the Star reference.

Still, apparently the build's not going to be what I wanted it to be anyways, so I'm going to look into other options.
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..
You said to take Delbans as one of the Encounters, hence the Star reference.

Still, apparently the build's not going to be what I wanted it to be anyways, so I'm going to look into other options.

Taking an encounter power that has a specific rider is in no way an indication that you need the rider, the power works fine without the rider. That is just nonsense talking.
The point is to take Immediates so you use ES for your standard.  Riders are irrelevant.
That Binder rider on Touch of Command, for example.  Totally useless, but Touch of Command is still sky blue, bordering on gold.

Bargle wrote:
This is CharOp. We not only assume block-of-tofu monsters, but also block-of-tofu DMs.
 

Zelink wrote:
You're already refluffing, why not refluff to something that doesn't suck?
I see so much advice going against a brick wall...
10/10 Would Flame Again: An Elite Paladin|Warlock The Elemental Man (or Woman): A Genasi Handbook The Warlord, Or How to Wield a Barbarian One-Handed The Bookish Barbarian Fardiz: RAI is fairly clear, but RAZ is different That's right. Rules According to Zelink!
Not sure how many Paladin attacks are going to end up with the weapon keyword but it may be worth it to do Versatile Expertise?  Heavy Blades and Rods or something?  That way you're buffing implement and weapon +hit... Kinda newer to the forums so it may not be the correct choice

Eldritch Strike is a weapon attack and is your MBA, you can't just skip it.

Your magic weapon kind of needs to be one of the 10 or so that also counts as a Holy Symbol if you want to use Devout Protector, otherwise you are indeed stuck with Versatile. Once you get to mid-Paragon and Weapon of Summer opens up, I'd take that+Hellfire Blood+Infernal Prince. +2 to hit and the Fire keyword on everything.

Your encounter powers should probably be the two Warlock Immediates (Delbans and Touch) at 3 and 7, which means you are taking the mass sanction E1 for the Paladin. The dailies are a debatable lot, but remember you are very minor action starved between Curse+Challenge+utilities. Dailies that enable mobility (Ooze Incarnate) or ones that can be used at range so you don't need to use your move action to engage have a special advantage for you. On the same note, don't take anything that is sustain minor.

Take Sorc King Pact initially+Mindbite Scorn+Crimson Fire. Having 2d10 for Curse in Heroic is just fun, Two-fold into Infernal as your 11 feat and retrain into Battle Awareness as well, allowing you to pick up the PP.

Hybrid NADs should both be to will. Frankly getting hit in the Ref is the best NAD to be weak in, no reason to lose a Will point for it.

Utilities are a pain. You have to question if they are good enough to use a minor on if they aren't free or interrupts. Mass marks? Yes. Things you can use out of combat? Yep. Which means you should take Virtue and Call of Challenge. Yes, those are both Paladin U2 powers. Take one at 2 and one at 10. Virtue works because you can use it after a short rest and start every fight with THP, THP don't dissapear till you rest. On the other hand, you have to be careful not to load up on too many immediates (you already have 3-4, which is pushing it for normal combats).

Just remember you are minor-action starved. Another good reason to have Eldritch Strike, actually. Charging.


I didn't get to finish my post because I had to run off to work, and then hit the bar afterward, but this was pretty much the extent of what I was going to post. Only things I'd like to add are a Claw type familiar for Corruption swapping, and Fortune Binding is nice to have in a pinch if you don't have an amazing save granting ally.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
I guess I am at a loss why no one has mentioned Tiefling Battlemind. CON/CHA and plenty of options, plus, Lightning Rush is coming shortly. Tieflings also have a lot of psychic and fear support and there are several powers of both in Battlemind.

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/20.jpg)

I guess I am at a loss why no one has mentioned Tiefling Battlemind. CON/CHA and plenty of options, plus, Lightning Rush is coming shortly. Tieflings also have a lot of psychic and fear support and there are several powers of both in Battlemind.


Battleminds are not very good defenders, Lightning Rush is a striker power.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
There is probably a better place to argue that point, however, Battleminds make great secondary defenders in my mind. Perma-marking 2 creatures at the beginning of each fight seems good to me. Also, powers like Cast the Net (PsP 3) allow for manipulation of a third creature. There are several ways a Battlemind can manipulate the battlefeild.

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/20.jpg)

There is literally no difference in function between "Melee Striker" and "Secondary Defender" or "Off-Tank" on the optimized level. At lower optimization, the former is used to describe glass chin strikers, while the later two are used to describe higher defense but much lower damage characters. Because of the need to focus fire, all Secondary Defender really means is you have 2 IAs that trigger off of someone else being hit. Woo.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
Actually, I do like the battle mind idea; never played one, always wanted to. I'll try my hand at making one later tonight or tomorrow- kind of a family emergency thing going on hence why I've been so scatterbrained lately.
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
Funny Forum Quotes
[quote author=82733368 post=532127449]
58115148 wrote:
"You notice a large piece of mold clinging to your toothbrush. What do you do?" "I cast Fireball." "I run like hell!
63797881 wrote:
The standard d4 is somewhat (SOMEWHAT) rounded on the top, the older models are even flat. The Lego is shaped in such a way that in an emergency, you can use one as a makeshift surgical knife.
147742801 wrote:
57457938 wrote:
My wife asked me if her pants made her look fat. What do you think I said?
Wife: Do these pants make me look fat? RedSiegfried: I just killed a bunch of orc women and children.
63797881 wrote:
82733368 wrote:
28.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character (Monk or otherwise) does not require my character to be completely shitfaced, no matter what the name (and fun interpretation) implies.
29.) Making a "Drunken Master" style character does not require ME to be completely tanked, no matter how "in-character" I want to be..