Stalling

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Recently I made an Eldrazi deck and I found out that I have in said deck a method for infinite mana. While discussing infinites in Magic a thought occurred.
I know that infinite Life, Damage and Turns can be win conditions though what about stalling the game forever?
In the deck the infinite combo is 1x spawnsire of ulamog and 2x parallel lives. I can have Spawnspire make infinite tokens, though what if I just have one Parallel Lives out and keep making 4 Eldrazi tokens over and over again. Could this be a win condition?
Something in the back of my head says that this is just rude and so I was wondering would stalling be a lose condition? Since its not exactly infinite turns though you do keep your opponent from playing anything. 
Stalling I'm pretty sure can get you a penalty. I'm not a tournament player though.
Cannot be relied upon^
you simply pick a number of how many eldrazi tokens you want, and then you "magically" have them
after that the game moves on
proud member of the 2011 community team
Stalling I'm pretty sure can get you a penalty. I'm not a tournament player though.

This is just for giggles with friends. Though I would like to know if i win or lose with this tactic also what would a penalty imply? I don't follow the tournaments.
you simply pick a number of how many eldrazi tokens you want, and then you "magically" have them
after that the game moves on

I mean with only one Parallel Lives. I can keep making the exact same 4 tokens. I would make four sacrafice those same four and have four once again. If I kept having this resolve forever would I win or lose?
in that case you'll get a warning for slow play
if you keep doing that you get a disqualificiation for stalling
proud member of the 2011 community team
You cannot force a win/lose/draw with this, since it is a loop of non-mandatory actions. You have to decide on a number of iterations for performing the loop. The game will advance to that point and then you have to make a different choice.
in that case you'll get a warning for slow play
if you keep doing that you get a disqualificiation for stalling

Ok thank you.
You cannot force a win/lose/draw with this, since it is a loop of non-mandatory actions. You have to decide on a number of iterations for performing the loop. The game will advance to that point and then you have to make a different choice.

Since your a rule advisor one last quick question. With Awakening Zone and Eldrazi Monument. Can I choose which one resolves first and If I have only one Awakening Zone can I choose to just not make a token as I would have to sacrafice it for the Monument? Or would they Resolve in the order that they were played?
if triggers trigger at the same time and you control them all you can choose in what order they go on the stack
they resolve in reverse order
proud member of the 2011 community team
if triggers trigger at the same time and you control them all you can choose in what order they go on the stack
they resolve in reverse order

Thank you once again Enigma. I recently got back into Magic and am a bit rusty. 
Awakening Zone and Eldrazi Monument trigger at the same time. Since you control both, you choose the order the triggers are put on the stack, and they will resolve in the reverse order. You do not have a choice for either trigger to happen or not, both effects will happen, but you can choose not to create a token as per the Zone's instruction.
This is just for giggles with friends. Though I would like to know if i win or lose with this tactic also what would a penalty imply? I don't follow the tournaments.



If it's a casual game, you could do that as long as you wanted.  Theoretically, you could do it until your opponent conceeded, but I would hope you wouldn't do that to your friends.  Merely executing the loop doesn't cause a win or loss though.
This is just for giggles with friends. Though I would like to know if i win or lose with this tactic also what would a penalty imply? I don't follow the tournaments.



If it's a casual game, you could do that as long as you wanted.  Theoretically, you could do it until your opponent conceeded, but I would hope you wouldn't do that to your friends.  Merely executing the loop doesn't cause a win or loss though.

Well I had a feeling it wasn't going to work and now I know. I might end up doing it though If i'm at like 1 life. 
When a loop occurs, if it is a mandatory loop, the game will end in a draw unless a player wishes to take an action to interrupt the loop.
eg. three looping Oblivion Rings with no other legal target to exile
Ring A exiles Ring B returning Ring C which exiles A returning B which exiles C returning A repeat ad infinitum

However, if it is an optional loop with clear predictable intermediary game states, the player decides to run the loop an arbitrary number of times and they arrive at the specified game state and the loop must end by choosing an option to end it. Choosing not to end it is stalling and can be penalized.

If it is an optional loop, but without clear predictable intermediary game states, it is stalling and can be penalized.

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This is just for giggles with friends. Though I would like to know if i win or lose with this tactic also what would a penalty imply? I don't follow the tournaments.



If it's a casual game, you could do that as long as you wanted.  Theoretically, you could do it until your opponent conceeded, but I would hope you wouldn't do that to your friends.  Merely executing the loop doesn't cause a win or loss though.

Well I had a feeling it wasn't going to work and now I know. I might end up doing it though If i'm at like 1 life. 


I simply wouldn't play with someone who did this.  Your friends may see it differently.  It is up to you to assess your group's tolerance for this type of behavior.
Cannot be relied upon^
We enjoy messing around with each other. No one in our group has ever done anything out of spite. I understand how that may have come of as rude and childish though believe me when i say i meant it in a purely comedic way. 
We enjoy messing around with each other. No one in our group has ever done anything out of spite. I understand how that may have come of as rude and childish though believe me when i say i meant it in a purely comedic way. 



It's hilarious; but your in the rules QA forum ,so eveyrone has their serious game face on and nit picks over every iteration of the rules for the sake of clarity Wink


I'd mess right back.

"I'm gonna go get a drink. Give me a shout when you're ready to finish losing."
We enjoy messing around with each other. No one in our group has ever done anything out of spite. I understand how that may have come of as rude and childish though believe me when i say i meant it in a purely comedic way. 



It's hilarious; but your in the rules QA forum ,so eveyrone has their serious game face on and nit picks over every iteration of the rules for the sake of clarity





Lesson Learned. Thank you. and I would Love to play with Bowshewicz just for being so clever with that tactic.
I just thought of this.. you can't let any of the triggers resolve without me passing priority.  So if I see you're stalling, I might just stall right back and hold priority :P
Cannot be relied upon^
I just thought of this.. you can't let any of the triggers resolve without me passing priority.  So if I see you're stalling, I might just stall right back and hold priority :P


Its been a long time since I was any good at the terms and all. Could you explain Priority? 
I just thought of this.. you can't let any of the triggers resolve without me passing priority.  So if I see you're stalling, I might just stall right back and hold priority :P


Its been a long time since I was any good at the terms and all. Could you explain Priority? 


Sure.  Priority it what allows you to cast spells.  If it's your turn, when can I cast spells?  Can I do them before you get to act?

Casually, priority takes a back seat because it's the rigid model the game sits on, while actual play is more or less fluid.

So let's say it's your turn.  You received priority at the beginning of each step/phase after the game executes whatever actions it needs to (called State-Based Actions).  So then you can cast a Giant Growth and put it on the stack.  I can't do anything until you're done making your decisions.  Before that step can end or your spell can resolve, however, I must gain "Priority," which gives me an opportunity to respond to a spell you've cast or cast one of my own if you haven't done anything.

In order for the Giant Growth to resolve, and actually do its thing, I have to pass priority (i.e., state I am doing nothing and allow it to resolve).

I'm sure someone else can explain it more technically, but it is basically how we decide who gets to do what first.
Cannot be relied upon^
Basically, you and your opponent share a baton, which you pass back and forth as you play (and sometimes you give it to the game itself, while things are happening). In order to perform a game action, you need to be the one holding the baton (i.e. it must be your turn to do something). So if your opponent wanted to fight fire with fire, they could just say "Wait, Im thinking..." and then sit there for an hour or two, and you wouldnt be able to do anything until they told you that you could. ;)

~ Tim 
I am Blue/White Reached DCI Rating 1800 on 28/10/11. :D
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56287226 wrote:
190106923 wrote:
Not bad. But what happens flavor wise when one kamahl kills the other one?
Zis iz a sign uf deep psychological troma, buried in zer subconscious mind. By keelink himzelf, Kamahl iz physically expressink hiz feelinks uf self-disgust ova hiz desire for hiz muzzer. [/GermanPsychologistVoice]
56957928 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
That makes no sense to me. If they spelled the ability out on the card in full then it would not be allowed in a mono-black Commander deck, but because they used a keyword to save space it is allowed? ~ Tim
Yup, just like you can have Birds of paradise in a mono green deck but not Noble Hierarch. YAY COLOR IDENTITY
56287226 wrote:
56888618 wrote:
Is algebra really that difficult?
Survey says yes.
56883218 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
You want to make a milky drink. You squeeze a cow.
I love this description. Like the cows are sponges filled with milk. I can see it all Nick Parks claymation-style with the cow's eyes bugging out momentarily as a giant farmer squeezes it like a squeaky dog toy, and milk shoots out of it.
56287226 wrote:
56735468 wrote:
And no judge will ever give you a game loss for playing snow covered lands.
I now have a new goal in life. ;)
Basically, you and your opponent share a baton, which you pass back and forth as you play (and sometimes you give it to the game itself, while things are happening). In order to perform a game action, you need to be the one holding the baton (i.e. it must be your turn to do something). So if your opponent wanted to fight fire with fire, they could just say "Wait, Im thinking..." and then sit there for an hour or two, and you wouldnt be able to do anything until they told you that you could. ;)

~ Tim 

That is so dirty. I didn't even know that. Well thank you all for your help. We can put this to rest.
That is so dirty. I didn't even know that. Well thank you all for your help. We can put this to rest.


Suffice to say there are rules in place (and judges) to stop that working in tournaments. And in casual play people just slap you. ;)

~ Tim 
I am Blue/White Reached DCI Rating 1800 on 28/10/11. :D
Sig
56287226 wrote:
190106923 wrote:
Not bad. But what happens flavor wise when one kamahl kills the other one?
Zis iz a sign uf deep psychological troma, buried in zer subconscious mind. By keelink himzelf, Kamahl iz physically expressink hiz feelinks uf self-disgust ova hiz desire for hiz muzzer. [/GermanPsychologistVoice]
56957928 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
That makes no sense to me. If they spelled the ability out on the card in full then it would not be allowed in a mono-black Commander deck, but because they used a keyword to save space it is allowed? ~ Tim
Yup, just like you can have Birds of paradise in a mono green deck but not Noble Hierarch. YAY COLOR IDENTITY
56287226 wrote:
56888618 wrote:
Is algebra really that difficult?
Survey says yes.
56883218 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
You want to make a milky drink. You squeeze a cow.
I love this description. Like the cows are sponges filled with milk. I can see it all Nick Parks claymation-style with the cow's eyes bugging out momentarily as a giant farmer squeezes it like a squeaky dog toy, and milk shoots out of it.
56287226 wrote:
56735468 wrote:
And no judge will ever give you a game loss for playing snow covered lands.
I now have a new goal in life. ;)